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Putting things in Perspective

Flopper

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?
 
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☭proletarian☭

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?
Because Obama's a communist fascist czar-loving ****** kenyan and America is a white christian country and the gays are going to rape your children you stupid libtard
 

boedicca

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?



Because the estimates don't include the vast amount of costs that are mandated for businesses and states to absorb. And as history has proven, the actual figures will dwarf these cooked numbers.

SS & Medicare are already forecasted to be $37T in the whole. Interest rates on the Federal Debt are rising. The country is technically insolvent. We should be cutting spending - not adding to it.
 

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☭proletarian☭;2149320 said:
According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?
Because Obama's a communist fascist czar-loving ****** kenyan and America is a white christian country and the gays are going to rape your children you stupid libtard

Chicken_Little.jpg
 
OP
Flopper

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☭proletarian☭;2149320 said:
According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?
Because Obama's a communist fascist czar-loving ****** kenyan and America is a white christian country and the gays are going to rape your children you stupid libtard

Chicken_Little.jpg
Comments such as these from the right are why Republicans are not going to take control of Congress or the Presidency. Unfortunately these thoughts are becoming the standard for the Party.
 

rightwinger

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It will bankrupt the country because it SOCIALISM

Spending money on wars only helps the economy

Spending money on the American People can only bankrupt it
 

kyzr

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It will bankrupt the country because it SOCIALISM
Spending money on wars only helps the economy
Spending money on the American People can only bankrupt it

Remember when candidate Obama was campaigning and one of his biggest applause lines was "the republicans haven't learned that when you're in a hole you need to stop digging".

"President" Obama owes about $31T to seniors for SS & Medicare benefits. Then he wants to put 31,000,000 more people who can't afford health insurance on Medicare. Look at the national debt projections then you have to see what the fight is about. Obama is bankrupting the country and some people (call them Tea Party members) are saying "enough".

I hope the GOP rolls-back the new healthcare entitlement and makes SS & Medicare solvent for the long term. When Medicare goes bankrupt in 2017, the system will collapse.
 

The Rabbi

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☭proletarian☭;2149320 said:
Because Obama's a communist fascist czar-loving ****** kenyan and America is a white christian country and the gays are going to rape your children you stupid libtard

Chicken_Little.jpg
Comments such as these from the right are why Republicans are not going to take control of Congress or the Presidency. Unfortunately these thoughts are becoming the standard for the Party.

Except both of those are comments from left leaning members here.

As mentioned, we know costs will skyrocket. The lowered Medicaid payouts will be reversed when it is discovered that doctors wont work for migrant worker wages. Lower tax revenues from the mandates to insure plus higher spending equals insolvency.
 
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Flopper

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?



Because the estimates don't include the vast amount of costs that are mandated for businesses and states to absorb. And as history has proven, the actual figures will dwarf these cooked numbers.

SS & Medicare are already forecasted to be $37T in the whole. Interest rates on the Federal Debt are rising. The country is technically insolvent. We should be cutting spending - not adding to it.
Social Security and Medicare cost will rise with or without the healthcare bill. The healthcare bill actual reduces the rate of increase in Medicare spending from a 4% annually to 2%.

It is a pure supposition to state that the cost to business will rise due to the healthcare bill. Healthcare premiums should come down not go up. The size of the insurance pools will increase reducing costs. Tax credits will be available to small businesses.

Medicaid costs will rise but there are big offsets. Most importantly having healthcare for 30 million plus people means heart disease, diabetes, and other diseases can be treated in physician's offices instead of emergency rooms and hospitals. This will reduce Medicaid costs.

The most important point in the whole debate is that increased access to healthcare for millions of Americans will mean a healthier and more productive America. Unfortunately, there is no way to put a dollar figure on these savings. Yes, this is a supposition but a logical one.
 

Mr.Fitnah

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?

With this kind of track record?




Medicare (hospital insurance). In 1965, as Congress considered legislation to establish a national Medicare program, the House Ways and Means Committee estimated that the hospital insurance portion of the program, Part A, would cost about $9 billion annually by 1990.v Actual Part A spending in 1990 was $67 billion. The actuary who provided the original cost estimates acknowledged in 1994 that, even after conservatively discounting for the unexpectedly high inflation rates of the early ‘70s and other factors, “the actual [Part A] experience was 165% higher than the estimate.”

Medicare (entire program). In 1967, the House Ways and Means Committee predicted that the new Medicare program, launched the previous year, would cost about $12 billion in 1990. Actual Medicare spending in 1990 was $110 billion—off by nearly a factor of 10.

Medicaid DSH program. In 1987, Congress estimated that Medicaid’s disproportionate share hospital (DSH) payments—which states use to provide relief to hospitals that serve especially large numbers of Medicaid and uninsured patients—would cost less than $1 billion in 1992. The actual cost that year was a staggering $17 billion. Among other things, federal lawmakers had failed to detect loopholes in the legislation that enabled states to draw significantly more money from the federal treasury than they would otherwise have been entitled to claim under the program’s traditional 50-50 funding scheme.

Medicare home care benefit. When Congress debated changes to Medicare’s home care benefit in 1988, the projected 1993 cost of the benefit was $4 billion. The actual 1993 cost was more than twice that amount, $10 billion.

Medicare catastrophic coverage benefit. In 1988, Congress added a catastrophic coverage benefit to Medicare, to take effect in 1990. In July 1989, the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) doubled its cost estimate for the program, for the four-year period 1990-1993, from $5.7 billion to $11.8 billion. CBO explained that it had received newer data showing it had significantly under-estimated prescription drug cost growth, and it warned Congress that even this revised estimate might be too low. This was a principal reason Congress repealed the program before it could take effect.

SCHIP. In 1997, Congress established the State Children’s Health Insurance Program as a capped grant program to states, and appropriated $40 billion to be doled out to states over 10 years at a rate of roughly $5 billion per year, once implemented. In each year, some states exceeded their allotments, requiring shifts of funds from other states that had not done so. By 2006, unspent reserves from prior years were nearly exhausted. To avert mass disenrollments, Congress decided to appropriate an additional $283 million in FY 2006 and an additional $650 million in FY 2007.

http://jec.senate.gov/republicans/p...orm_Cost_Estimates_Reliable__July_31_2009.pdf

What could possibly go wrong?
 

boedicca

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With this kind of track record, we should expect ObamaCare costs to exceed the current estimates by a factor of 5X, at a minimum.
 

The Rabbi

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?



Because the estimates don't include the vast amount of costs that are mandated for businesses and states to absorb. And as history has proven, the actual figures will dwarf these cooked numbers.

SS & Medicare are already forecasted to be $37T in the whole. Interest rates on the Federal Debt are rising. The country is technically insolvent. We should be cutting spending - not adding to it.
Social Security and Medicare cost will rise with or without the healthcare bill. The healthcare bill actual reduces the rate of increase in Medicare spending from a 4% annually to 2%.

It is a pure supposition to state that the cost to business will rise due to the healthcare bill. Healthcare premiums should come down not go up. The size of the insurance pools will increase reducing costs. Tax credits will be available to small businesses.

Medicaid costs will rise but there are big offsets. Most importantly having healthcare for 30 million plus people means heart disease, diabetes, and other diseases can be treated in physician's offices instead of emergency rooms and hospitals. This will reduce Medicaid costs.

The most important point in the whole debate is that increased access to healthcare for millions of Americans will mean a healthier and more productive America. Unfortunately, there is no way to put a dollar figure on these savings. Yes, this is a supposition but a logical one.

Do you actually believe that crap??
The ObamaCare Writedowns - WSJ.com
 

Immanuel

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?

Cut costs?

You believe Health Care Reform is going to cut costs?

Why? Because Democrats tell you it will? How about some historical evidence to back that up.

I don't expect the costs of my health insurance to drop a dime or even slow the increases.

In fact, if employers take the cheap and easy way out, people who are not paying for their own insurance right now because the employer has been supplementing all or most of it all along are going to see big increases in their own out of pocket expenses towards health care. Big increases!

Employers with less than 50 employees are going to be stupid if they don't drop health care altogether and let the employees foot the bill for a change.

Immie
 
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It will bankrupt the country because it SOCIALISM

Spending money on wars only helps the economy

Spending money on the American People can only bankrupt it

It will bankrupt the country because it's stupid to spend more than you bring in. Obama is, apparently, not the Messiah. He cannot turn water into wine and he cannot keep spending money he doesn't have.

You do know there is no Santa Clause, right? Cuz you sound like a 5 year old who 'wants, wants, wants'. Daddy can't afford it. Go without.
 
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As an aside, why not use the fucking 'PayGo' Bill they all wanted to pass but don't want to actually use. Fucking politicians.
 

Immanuel

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?



Because the estimates don't include the vast amount of costs that are mandated for businesses and states to absorb. And as history has proven, the actual figures will dwarf these cooked numbers.

SS & Medicare are already forecasted to be $37T in the whole. Interest rates on the Federal Debt are rising. The country is technically insolvent. We should be cutting spending - not adding to it.
Social Security and Medicare cost will rise with or without the healthcare bill. The healthcare bill actual reduces the rate of increase in Medicare spending from a 4% annually to 2%.

It is a pure supposition to state that the cost to business will rise due to the healthcare bill. Healthcare premiums should come down not go up. The size of the insurance pools will increase reducing costs. Tax credits will be available to small businesses.

Medicaid costs will rise but there are big offsets. Most importantly having healthcare for 30 million plus people means heart disease, diabetes, and other diseases can be treated in physician's offices instead of emergency rooms and hospitals. This will reduce Medicaid costs.

The most important point in the whole debate is that increased access to healthcare for millions of Americans will mean a healthier and more productive America. Unfortunately, there is no way to put a dollar figure on these savings. Yes, this is a supposition but a logical one.

How much is this wonderful tax credit? If it is not 100% of the cost of the employee's health insurance, or no more than $2000/employee (the amount of the fine for not providing coverage) less than the cost of a plan, then the employer is better off letting the employee pick up the tab.

Let's see, here in Florida the cost of my last insurance plan for a family is over $1200/month. That comes to roughly $14,400 per year. Now, how much of a credit is the employer going to get? I don't know the answer to that, but do you think it is going to be $12,000/year? I highly doubt that... so, if it is say $5000/year for each employee covered, my employer is better off paying the $2,000/employee and letting me buy my own. But, hell, the employer of less than 50 employees doesn't even have to worry about the $2000/employee penalty so why on earth would such an employer spring for $14,400/employee when he doesn't have to? And now that every employee is going to have to have insurance regardless of whether or not the employer covers it, the employer isn't going to do it out of the goodness of his heart. Maybe he'll raise your salary a couple grand a year because his costs are lower, but don't think it will cover the cost of health insurance.

I'm screwed!

Immie
 
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Flopper

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?

With this kind of track record?




Medicare (hospital insurance). In 1965, as Congress considered legislation to establish a national Medicare program, the House Ways and Means Committee estimated that the hospital insurance portion of the program, Part A, would cost about $9 billion annually by 1990.v Actual Part A spending in 1990 was $67 billion. The actuary who provided the original cost estimates acknowledged in 1994 that, even after conservatively discounting for the unexpectedly high inflation rates of the early ‘70s and other factors, “the actual [Part A] experience was 165% higher than the estimate.”

Medicare (entire program). In 1967, the House Ways and Means Committee predicted that the new Medicare program, launched the previous year, would cost about $12 billion in 1990. Actual Medicare spending in 1990 was $110 billion—off by nearly a factor of 10.

Medicaid DSH program. In 1987, Congress estimated that Medicaid’s disproportionate share hospital (DSH) payments—which states use to provide relief to hospitals that serve especially large numbers of Medicaid and uninsured patients—would cost less than $1 billion in 1992. The actual cost that year was a staggering $17 billion. Among other things, federal lawmakers had failed to detect loopholes in the legislation that enabled states to draw significantly more money from the federal treasury than they would otherwise have been entitled to claim under the program’s traditional 50-50 funding scheme.

Medicare home care benefit. When Congress debated changes to Medicare’s home care benefit in 1988, the projected 1993 cost of the benefit was $4 billion. The actual 1993 cost was more than twice that amount, $10 billion.

Medicare catastrophic coverage benefit. In 1988, Congress added a catastrophic coverage benefit to Medicare, to take effect in 1990. In July 1989, the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) doubled its cost estimate for the program, for the four-year period 1990-1993, from $5.7 billion to $11.8 billion. CBO explained that it had received newer data showing it had significantly under-estimated prescription drug cost growth, and it warned Congress that even this revised estimate might be too low. This was a principal reason Congress repealed the program before it could take effect.

SCHIP. In 1997, Congress established the State Children’s Health Insurance Program as a capped grant program to states, and appropriated $40 billion to be doled out to states over 10 years at a rate of roughly $5 billion per year, once implemented. In each year, some states exceeded their allotments, requiring shifts of funds from other states that had not done so. By 2006, unspent reserves from prior years were nearly exhausted. To avert mass disenrollments, Congress decided to appropriate an additional $283 million in FY 2006 and an additional $650 million in FY 2007.

http://jec.senate.gov/republicans/p...orm_Cost_Estimates_Reliable__July_31_2009.pdf

What could possibly go wrong?
A good write-up, however if you are trying to draw a parallel between the healthcare bill and Medicare, there is a big difference. Medicare was designed strictly as a benefit for seniors with little or no effort to control the cost. It was a give away program like social security.

Much of the healthcare bill is aimed at reducing cost. If the healthcare industry had not priced themselves out of the reach of millions of Americans, then there would have been no healthcare bill.
 

boedicca

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Much of the healthcare bill is aimed at reducing cost. If the healthcare industry had not priced themselves out of the reach of millions of Americans, then there would have been no healthcare bill.


How does it reduce costs?
 

Mr.Fitnah

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According to the CBO, the new healthcare law will cost a trillion dollars over the next 10 yrs. or about 100 billion a year. Those are pretty big numbers but let’s put it in perspective. The federal budget is 3.5 trillion dollars or 3,500 billion dollars. The cost of the new healthcare law will only add about 2.85% to federal spending, all of which is covered by increases in taxes and cost cuts. Fox News, the unofficial voice of the Republican Party continues to report that the new healthcare bill, will bankrupt the country. Would anyone like to explain just how this law is going to bankrupt the country?

With this kind of track record?




Medicare (hospital insurance). In 1965, as Congress considered legislation to establish a national Medicare program, the House Ways and Means Committee estimated that the hospital insurance portion of the program, Part A, would cost about $9 billion annually by 1990.v Actual Part A spending in 1990 was $67 billion. The actuary who provided the original cost estimates acknowledged in 1994 that, even after conservatively discounting for the unexpectedly high inflation rates of the early ‘70s and other factors, “the actual [Part A] experience was 165% higher than the estimate.”

Medicare (entire program). In 1967, the House Ways and Means Committee predicted that the new Medicare program, launched the previous year, would cost about $12 billion in 1990. Actual Medicare spending in 1990 was $110 billion—off by nearly a factor of 10.

Medicaid DSH program. In 1987, Congress estimated that Medicaid’s disproportionate share hospital (DSH) payments—which states use to provide relief to hospitals that serve especially large numbers of Medicaid and uninsured patients—would cost less than $1 billion in 1992. The actual cost that year was a staggering $17 billion. Among other things, federal lawmakers had failed to detect loopholes in the legislation that enabled states to draw significantly more money from the federal treasury than they would otherwise have been entitled to claim under the program’s traditional 50-50 funding scheme.

Medicare home care benefit. When Congress debated changes to Medicare’s home care benefit in 1988, the projected 1993 cost of the benefit was $4 billion. The actual 1993 cost was more than twice that amount, $10 billion.

Medicare catastrophic coverage benefit. In 1988, Congress added a catastrophic coverage benefit to Medicare, to take effect in 1990. In July 1989, the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) doubled its cost estimate for the program, for the four-year period 1990-1993, from $5.7 billion to $11.8 billion. CBO explained that it had received newer data showing it had significantly under-estimated prescription drug cost growth, and it warned Congress that even this revised estimate might be too low. This was a principal reason Congress repealed the program before it could take effect.

SCHIP. In 1997, Congress established the State Children’s Health Insurance Program as a capped grant program to states, and appropriated $40 billion to be doled out to states over 10 years at a rate of roughly $5 billion per year, once implemented. In each year, some states exceeded their allotments, requiring shifts of funds from other states that had not done so. By 2006, unspent reserves from prior years were nearly exhausted. To avert mass disenrollments, Congress decided to appropriate an additional $283 million in FY 2006 and an additional $650 million in FY 2007.

http://jec.senate.gov/republicans/p...orm_Cost_Estimates_Reliable__July_31_2009.pdf

What could possibly go wrong?
A good write-up, however if you are trying to draw a parallel between the healthcare bill and Medicare, there is a big difference. Medicare was designed strictly as a benefit for seniors with little or no effort to control the cost. It was a give away program like social security.

Much of the healthcare bill is aimed at reducing cost. If the healthcare industry had not priced themselves out of the reach of millions of Americans, then there would have been no healthcare bill.

Can you name a government program that is under budget or within spending since the Hoover Dam?
 

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