Post World War II Germany built statues of those who were imprisoned in concentration camps

[Missouri_Mike]

Post World War II Germany built statues of those who were imprisoned in concentration camps.
The statues help tell the story of what happened in the concentration camps and helps make sure this chapter of their history is never repeated.
They did not build statues glorifying the soldiers and politicians of the time.

The US should learn from Germany.

How many of those statues were in East Germany?

Good point. I am not sure.

I’m going to guess none. How many would you guess?

So if we were to learn from Germany what statues would remain in the US? Who would they be and more importantly what would they mean to our history.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/29th_Infantry_Division_(United_States)
National Guard units from opposite sides of the Civil War were brought together to form the 29th Infantry Division. THAT represents the spirit of reconciliation between North and South.

Tearing down one side of it tears at the seems of that reconciliation.

To quote Sheriff Chris Mannix, in The Hateful Eight:
"We weren’t foreign barbarians pounding on the city walls. We were your brothers. We deserve dignity in defeat."

So, do we want to remain united or do the history scrubbers want to "cleanse" us of all heritage and dignity (which will not go without a response)?

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

When the Nazis were defeated, the Germans who disassociated with Nazi philosophy have been accepted by the new Germans and the world. It is the same with the confederates. The individuals are accepted if they renounce the confederacy. If they continue to believe the principles of the confederacy they are more than racists, they are traitors to the USA.

We do not have statues of English soldiers who fought us in the revolutionary war. There are many families in the US that are related to the English soldiers or supported the English in the revolution.
You fight our country and lose, do not expect statues.

Jesus. Unbelievable. You have managed to make my point for me....TWICE!!!

Germans were not asked to reconcile with OTHER GERMANS and become a RE-UNITED nation. Had Bavaria had split from the rest of Germany, resulting in a huge war, and ending with an AGREEMENT to RECONCILE as ONE NATION AGAIN, you may have had a point.

Likewise, WE were not being asked to RECONCILE with the fucking BRITS and become ONE NATION AGAIN!!!

DO YOU SEE THE FUCKING DIFFERENCE!!!

 

[Missouri_Mike]

The most important parts of Chamberlain's memoir, and the point of honoring the actual fighting men of the Confederacy (monuments/statues/etc.) are this:

"Bayonets were affixed to muskets, arms stacked, and cartridge boxes unslung and hung upon the stacks. Then, slowly and with a reluctance that was appealingly pathetic, the torn and tattered battleflags were either leaned against the stacks or laid upon the ground. The emotion of the conquered soldiery was really sad to witness. Some of the men who had carried and followed those ragged standards through the four long years of strife, rushed, regardless of all discipline, from the ranks, bent about their old flags, and pressed them to their lips with burning tears.

"And it can well be imagined, too, that there was no lack of emotion on our side, but the Union men were held steady in their lines, without the least show of demonstration by word or by motion. There was, though, a twitching of the muscles of their faces, and, be it said, their battle-bronzed cheeks were not altogether dry. Our men felt the import of the occasion, and realized fully how they would have been affected if defeat and surrender had been their lot after such a fearful struggle.

And the part about them co-mingling and becoming countrymen again.

You can't strip Southerners of their heritage and expect them to continue to have a sense of belonging to the U.S. It's done deliberately, SPECIFICALLY to invite discord and a desire to break up the Union, AGAIN.

When the Nazis were defeated, the Germans who disassociated with Nazi philosophy have been accepted by the new Germans and the world. It is the same with the confederates. The individuals are accepted if they renounce the confederacy. If they continue to believe the principles of the confederacy they are more than racists, they are traitors to the USA.

We do not have statues of English soldiers who fought us in the revolutionary war. There are many families in the US that are related to the English soldiers or supported the English in the revolution.
You fight our country and lose, do not expect statues.

I think this is a really bad example. There was reconciliation after the civil war. There was none of that in Germany. Luckily there was here.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/29th_Infantry_Division_(United_States)
National Guard units from opposite sides of the Civil War were brought together to form the 29th Infantry Division. THAT represents the spirit of reconciliation between North and South.

Tearing down one side of it tears at the seems of that reconciliation.

To quote Sheriff Chris Mannix, in The Hateful Eight:
"We weren’t foreign barbarians pounding on the city walls. We were your brothers. We deserve dignity in defeat."

So, do we want to remain united or do the history scrubbers want to "cleanse" us of all heritage and dignity (which will not go without a response)?

I think since the topic seems to be comparing East to West Germany they would preferred that over reconciliation. In which case Hitlers Germany would still exist.

 

[g5000]

Post World War II Germany built statues of those who were imprisoned in concentration camps.
The statues help tell the story of what happened in the concentration camps and helps make sure this chapter of their history is never repeated.
They did not build statues glorifying the soldiers and politicians of the time.

The US should learn from Germany.

Statues built based on lies to make a proud people The Germans feel guilt for trying to free their country from the grip of the Jew. Hopefully they get torn down

No way you are a real person. Nobody is this f##ked up for real.

Unfortunately, there are people actually that f'ed up. And they tend to gravitate to this forum where they find the waters to be warm.

 

[g5000]

America is not occupied by a foreign power and need prove nothing, and Americans are too busy with everyday life to get worked up over such bull$hit.

But, they did need to convince the South to reconcile and become part of the Union again.

Agreed. And even though I would have been a Union Man through-and-through, I respect the courage of a valiant enemy-turned-friend-once-again.

Chamberlain's rendering of 'Present Arms' while CSA units marched by to stack theirs was the opening moment of a long honorable mutual healing process.

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/last-salute-army-northern-virginia

"That night we slept as we had not slept in four years. There was, of course, a great deal of unrestrained jubilation, but it did not call for much of that to be a sufficiency, and before long the camp over which peace after strife had settled was sleeping with no fear of a night alarm. We awoke next morning to find the Confederates peering down into our faces, and involuntarily reached for our arms, but once the recollections of the previous day's stirring events came crowding back to mind, all fear fled, and the boys in blue were soon commingling freely with the boys in gray, exchanging compliments, pipes, tobacco, knives and souvenirs."

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

They were NOT asked to reconcile and become countrymen.

Your point?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

America is not occupied by a foreign power and need prove nothing, and Americans are too busy with everyday life to get worked up over such bull$hit.

But, they did need to convince the South to reconcile and become part of the Union again.

Agreed. And even though I would have been a Union Man through-and-through, I respect the courage of a valiant enemy-turned-friend-once-again.

Chamberlain's rendering of 'Present Arms' while CSA units marched by to stack theirs was the opening moment of a long honorable mutual healing process.

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/last-salute-army-northern-virginia

"That night we slept as we had not slept in four years. There was, of course, a great deal of unrestrained jubilation, but it did not call for much of that to be a sufficiency, and before long the camp over which peace after strife had settled was sleeping with no fear of a night alarm. We awoke next morning to find the Confederates peering down into our faces, and involuntarily reached for our arms, but once the recollections of the previous day's stirring events came crowding back to mind, all fear fled, and the boys in blue were soon commingling freely with the boys in gray, exchanging compliments, pipes, tobacco, knives and souvenirs."

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

You’re the one claiming the Southerners are still racist today. So what is your point?

 

[g5000]

Do you know what the South was prepared to do if Lee's terms were not agreed?

It was an unconditional surrender. Lee was not setting the terms.

Lee made requests of the victor, such as allowing the rebels to take their horses so they could go back to farming, and Grant graciously allowed it.

Lee's ass was whupped. If he had raised a finger again, he would have been buried and more rebels would have died even more disgracefully.

 

[g5000]

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

They were NOT asked to reconcile and become countrymen.

Your point?

They were asked to become ALLIES. And they did.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

It was an unconditional surrender. Lee was not setting the terms.

That's not true in the least. They wrote terms of surrender. Do you even know what they were?

Jesus. So many uneducated, misinformed IDIOTS!!!!

I am getting so GODDAMN SICK of this stupid shit!!!

 

[g5000]

America is not occupied by a foreign power and need prove nothing, and Americans are too busy with everyday life to get worked up over such bull$hit.

But, they did need to convince the South to reconcile and become part of the Union again.

Agreed. And even though I would have been a Union Man through-and-through, I respect the courage of a valiant enemy-turned-friend-once-again.

Chamberlain's rendering of 'Present Arms' while CSA units marched by to stack theirs was the opening moment of a long honorable mutual healing process.

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/last-salute-army-northern-virginia

"That night we slept as we had not slept in four years. There was, of course, a great deal of unrestrained jubilation, but it did not call for much of that to be a sufficiency, and before long the camp over which peace after strife had settled was sleeping with no fear of a night alarm. We awoke next morning to find the Confederates peering down into our faces, and involuntarily reached for our arms, but once the recollections of the previous day's stirring events came crowding back to mind, all fear fled, and the boys in blue were soon commingling freely with the boys in gray, exchanging compliments, pipes, tobacco, knives and souvenirs."

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

You’re the one claiming the Southerners are still racist today. So what is your point?

Go ahead and show my post where I said that, dipshit.

 

[g5000]

It was an unconditional surrender. Lee was not setting the terms.

That's not true in the least. They wrote terms of surrender. Do you even know what they were?

Jesus. So many uneducated, misinformed IDIOTS!!!!

I am getting so GODDAMN SICK of this stupid shit!!!

It was an unconditional surrender. Period.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

They were NOT asked to reconcile and become countrymen.

Your point?

They were asked to become ALLIES. And they did.

The were NOT asked to share a FUCKING PRESIDENT AND FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND CONSTITUTION, YOU FUCKING MORON!!!

 

[g5000]

“We will listen to no terms but that of unconditional surrender.” - General Ulysses S. Grant

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

America is not occupied by a foreign power and need prove nothing, and Americans are too busy with everyday life to get worked up over such bull$hit.

But, they did need to convince the South to reconcile and become part of the Union again.

Agreed. And even though I would have been a Union Man through-and-through, I respect the courage of a valiant enemy-turned-friend-once-again.

Chamberlain's rendering of 'Present Arms' while CSA units marched by to stack theirs was the opening moment of a long honorable mutual healing process.

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/last-salute-army-northern-virginia

"That night we slept as we had not slept in four years. There was, of course, a great deal of unrestrained jubilation, but it did not call for much of that to be a sufficiency, and before long the camp over which peace after strife had settled was sleeping with no fear of a night alarm. We awoke next morning to find the Confederates peering down into our faces, and involuntarily reached for our arms, but once the recollections of the previous day's stirring events came crowding back to mind, all fear fled, and the boys in blue were soon commingling freely with the boys in gray, exchanging compliments, pipes, tobacco, knives and souvenirs."

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

You’re the one claiming the Southerners are still racist today. So what is your point?

Go ahead and show my post where I said that, dipshit.

Shut the fuck up. Yes you are. You have always been doing that. Because you are an arrogant FUCK!!!

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

“We will listen to no terms but that of unconditional surrender.” - General Ulysses S. Grant

But, that's not what happened IS IT???

 

[g5000]

The American and German armies shared the same post-war camaraderie.

Your point?

They were NOT asked to reconcile and become countrymen.

Your point?

They were asked to become ALLIES. And they did.

The were NOT asked to share a FUCKING PRESIDENT AND FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND CONSTITUTION, YOU FUCKING MORON!!!

So?

Way to miss the point, dipshit.

The Germans got their asses kicked by America and surrendered and then were repentant. They built statues and memorials to commemorate their victims.

Big difference when compared to what happened after the rebels got their asses kicked by America.

 

[g5000]

“We will listen to no terms but that of unconditional surrender.” - General Ulysses S. Grant

But, that's not what happened IS IT???

As I said, Lee made REQUESTS which the VICTOR graciously granted.

This is what happens after every unconditional surrender, dumbass. The VICTOR sets the terms and decides what they will grant to the loser and what they won't.