Our founding fathers were not conservative

bigrebnc would call a police officer's order to him to put down his weapon as an "act of aggression", I would think. bigrebnc simply is ignorant, superstitious, suspicious, etc. He speaks stupidly here every day and gets mad when he is corrected.

If they are on my proprety and I tell them to leave you bet your ass it's an act of aggression and I will treat them just like I would any home invader.

Speaking of talking stupidly when are you going to stop and let truth sink in?
 
Lincoln was the aggressor?

Bhahahahahaha..

The South were all involved in treason, sedition and traitorous secession.

The were the first to fire too.

Yes he was. South Carolina told the federal government to evacuate the fort, Lincoln sent supplies and more troops yep that would be an act of aggression

South Carolina didn't have the standing to tell the Union to do shit. The United States Constitution is supreme..and they were involved in revolt. The Constitution allows for suppressing insurrection.

Sherman didn't go far enough.
You're forgetting one piece of the equation State sovereignty back then is not as it is now. South Carolina told the federal government to leave the fort Lincoln went to resupply.
 
Yes he was. South Carolina told the federal government to evacuate the fort, Lincoln sent supplies and more troops yep that would be an act of aggression

South Carolina didn't have the standing to tell the Union to do shit. The United States Constitution is supreme..and they were involved in revolt. The Constitution allows for suppressing insurrection.

Sherman didn't go far enough.
You're forgetting one piece of the equation State sovereignty back then is not as it is now. South Carolina told the federal government to leave the fort Lincoln went to resupply.

Not forgetting anything. States can't kick the Federal government out of military bases. They cannot form up with other states against the Union of states. They were completely and utterly in the wrong.
 
South Carolina didn't have the standing to tell the Union to do shit. The United States Constitution is supreme..and they were involved in revolt. The Constitution allows for suppressing insurrection.

Sherman didn't go far enough.
You're forgetting one piece of the equation State sovereignty back then is not as it is now. South Carolina told the federal government to leave the fort Lincoln went to resupply.

Not forgetting anything. States can't kick the Federal government out of military bases. They cannot form up with other states against the Union of states. They were completely and utterly in the wrong.

Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?
 
bigrebnc continues to demonstrate his ignorance about the Civil War as well as Lincoln and his racism.

The South fired on Old Glory and spit on the patriots and the martyrs of the War of Independence. Yes, Southerners were traitors against the nation. No one gives a crap today about their twisted feelings toward their states. Three million northerners had no trouble understanding that; they took up the Blue and murdered the Gray.

The South fired on Ft Sumter. The North did not fire on Charleston or South Carolina. The South started the war. Any other claim is simply a whiner's complaint.

Lincoln obviously agreed with me, bigrebnc: "What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union." Abraham Lincoln's Letter to Horace Greeley

Lincoln on the racial equality. Your quote is from 1858 and has nothing to do with how he felt about race in 1865. In fact, "In his second term as president, on April 11, 1865, Lincoln gave a speech supporting a form of limited suffrage extended to what Lincoln described as the more "intelligent" blacks and those blacks who had rendered special services to the nation.[25] In analyzing Lincoln's position historian Eugene H. Berwanger notes: During his presidency, Lincoln took a reasoned course which helped the federal government both destroy slavery and advance the cause of black suffrage. For a man who had denied both reforms four years earlier, Lincoln's change in attitude was rapid and decisive. He was both open-minded and perceptive to the needs of his nation in a postwar era. Once committed to a principle, Lincoln moved toward it with steady, determined progress. Abraham Lincoln on slavery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You continue ignorant about the very history and precedents of our culture. Until you correct that, every knowledgeable individual here will continue to pwn you., as I have here.
You're forgetting one piece of the equation State sovereignty back then is not as it is now. South Carolina told the federal government to leave the fort Lincoln went to resupply.

So jake I see your pig headness didn't even listen to what lincoln said. You failed.

Lincoln believed exactly as I said he did in 1865, beating your weak comment by seven years.

South Carolina had no right to federal property, and certainly never had any right to use force against the lawful acts of the Union.

You are an unreconstructed confederate, who certainly has a right to his wrong opinions.
 
bigrebnc would call a police officer's order to him to put down his weapon as an "act of aggression", I would think. bigrebnc simply is ignorant, superstitious, suspicious, etc. He speaks stupidly here every day and gets mad when he is corrected.

If they are on my proprety and I tell them to leave you bet your ass it's an act of aggression and I will treat them just like I would any home invader.

Speaking of talking stupidly when are you going to stop and let truth sink in?

You have pwnd yourself once again in your ignorance. When you are engaged in armed insurrection, you have no legal rights except to submit or be killed.
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.
 
bigrebnc would call a police officer's order to him to put down his weapon as an "act of aggression", I would think. bigrebnc simply is ignorant, superstitious, suspicious, etc. He speaks stupidly here every day and gets mad when he is corrected.

If they are on my proprety and I tell them to leave you bet your ass it's an act of aggression and I will treat them just like I would any home invader.

Speaking of talking stupidly when are you going to stop and let truth sink in?

You have pwnd yourself once again in your ignorance. When you are engaged in armed insurrection, you have no legal rights except to submit or be killed.

What does armed insurrection and being on my proprety have to do with each other?
Your stupidity just pawned you.
 
You're forgetting one piece of the equation State sovereignty back then is not as it is now. South Carolina told the federal government to leave the fort Lincoln went to resupply.

Not forgetting anything. States can't kick the Federal government out of military bases. They cannot form up with other states against the Union of states. They were completely and utterly in the wrong.

Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

What do you think the Whiskey Rebellion was about?
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.

Again
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?
 
Not forgetting anything. States can't kick the Federal government out of military bases. They cannot form up with other states against the Union of states. They were completely and utterly in the wrong.

Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

What do you think the Whiskey Rebellion was about?
Again
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?


Where does it say it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

Side note

The Whiskey Rebellion demonstrated that the new national government had the willingness and ability to suppress violent resistance to its laws. The whiskey excise remained difficult to collect, however. The whiskey tax was repealed after

It wasn't a true rebillion just men pissed at a tax
 
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bigrebnc would call a police officer's order to him to put down his weapon as an "act of aggression", I would think. bigrebnc simply is ignorant, superstitious, suspicious, etc. He speaks stupidly here every day and gets mad when he is corrected.

If they are on my proprety and I tell them to leave you bet your ass it's an act of aggression and I will treat them just like I would any home invader.

Speaking of talking stupidly when are you going to stop and let truth sink in?

You have pwnd yourself once again in your ignorance. When you are engaged in armed insurrection, you have no legal rights except to submit or be killed.

Ever heard of the Second Amendmet?

Ever heard of this:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. ... God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion; what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms."[/FONT] -- [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Thomas Jefferson [/FONT][FONT=Arial,Helvetica]to William Stephens Smith, 1787[/FONT]


Guess what that means...idiot?
 
Fakey would rather that the People should continue to bend over and take it up the ass from tyrants in government.

Jake? You know NOTHING of the Founders...nor true Liberty.
 
South Carolina didn't have the standing to tell the Union to do shit. The United States Constitution is supreme..and they were involved in revolt.
South Carolina seceeded from the union, and so the Constitution did not apply to her.

The Constitution allows for suppressing insurrection.
Secession and insurrection are not interchangeable terms.
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.

Again
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

Why the heck do I have to keep doing this..

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

Section 10 - Powers prohibited of States

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it's inspection Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress.

No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay.
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.

I do believe some of the State Constitutions may claim that. Our Common Wealths have that option, meaning PR, Guam, USVI. You guys are really going off on tangents here Jake. You realize Hamilton reversed himself on 3 key positions after ratification, this act can easily be interpreted as his motives being disingenuous, he pulled a bait and switch on the Continental Congress by talking circles around them. Enumerated Powers, General Welfare, and the Commerce Clause. To this day those Powers are under contention, a dark cloud.
 
15th post
South Carolina didn't have the standing to tell the Union to do shit. The United States Constitution is supreme..and they were involved in revolt.
South Carolina seceeded from the union, and so the Constitution did not apply to her.

The Constitution allows for suppressing insurrection.
Secession and insurrection are not interchangeable terms.

In this case they are..

Even if your theory were correct and a state asked to secede..the moment the Congress and/or the President said no..it's over.

If not..it's insurrection.
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.

Again
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

That has been answered satisfactorily. Nothing in the Constitution said that states could leave.
 
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

What do you think the Whiskey Rebellion was about?
Again
Can you cite or give any reference before 1865 that any state could not leave the union if it so desired? Where exactly can I find it in the Constitution dated before 1865?


Where does it say it in the Constitution dated before 1865?

Side note

The Whiskey Rebellion demonstrated that the new national government had the willingness and ability to suppress violent resistance to its laws. The whiskey excise remained difficult to collect, however. The whiskey tax was repealed after

It wasn't a true rebillion just men pissed at a tax

That has been answered satisfactorily. Nothing in the Constitution said that states could leave.
 
Where in the Constitution does it say states have the right to secede. Even in marriage, law provides for divorce. Neither the Constitution nor federal law provided for any such thing. The states are subject to the national laws on union and national sovereignty. You ***** slap yourself every time you write.

I do believe some of the State Constitutions may claim that. Our Common Wealths have that option, meaning PR, Guam, USVI. You guys are really going off on tangents here Jake. You realize Hamilton reversed himself on 3 key positions after ratification, this act can easily be interpreted as his motives being disingenuous, he pulled a bait and switch on the Continental Congress by talking circles around them. Enumerated Powers, General Welfare, and the Commerce Clause. To this day those Powers are under contention, a dark cloud.

Not at all, and who cares what Hamilton says. This has been answered satisfactorily. Nothing in the Constitution said that states could leave.
 
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