One topic never discussed

[bigdaddygtr]

It absolutely amazes me that in every Presidential election I've seen, the one thing that rarely ever gets talked about is Education. For all of you out there who don't know this, our K-12 education ranks 76th in the WORLD. 76th!!!! Our society is getting less and less educated by the generation while other countries have more people and are getting smarter and smarter(aka CHINA). You know who's number 1? FINLAND, and they have no where near the resources we have. The reason for this is that the US dept of Education has been the first, consistently, to get its funding cut. It only spends 57 billion a year on education across the nation which we spend in 5 months in Iraq. They are also over there building schools! BUILDING SCHOOLS in IRAQ???? For the cost of this war we could have built 31,000 new schools and that was back in 2007. We could of also made a serious increase in teacher pay so that we kept the good one's where they should be, in the classroom

If you know your history, then you know that at their peak nobody thought the empires of Egypt, Greece, and Rome would ever fall. You know why they all fell? Too many wars and they stopped being the leader in education/modern technologies. We lose the best teachers to college or another profession because we as a society refuse to put in the necessary funds to actually provide our kids with the 1 thing they desperately need, a good education. Some really good teacher taught Bill Gates in 6th grade about the basic principles of math or taught Warren Buffett Economic theory which has allowed them to become so successful yet we don't fund that person? People, we are going down as a country EXACTLY the same way that those 3 empires went down except we are going down much faster than they did. If you don't believe in substantially increasing the funding for education, then you truly don't care about the future of the country.

As part of a question and answer portion of the 2007 Miss Teen USA pageant, Upton was asked by the questioner Aimee Teegarden, "Recent polls have shown a fifth of Americans can't locate the U.S. on a world map. Why do you think this is?"
Upton responded:[1]
I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable to do so because, uh, some, people out there in our nation don't have maps and, uh, I believe that our, uh, education like such as, uh, South Africa and, uh, the Iraq, everywhere like such as, and, I believe that they should, our education over here in the U.S. should help the U.S., uh, or, uh, should help South Africa and should help the Iraq and the Asian countries, so we will be able to build up our future, for our [children].[8][9]

Case and point, and she was in the top percent of her high school class along with the point we seem to miss and thats the 20% of people who can't point out the US on a map. TWENTY PERCENT! News Flash - we desperately need to become a more intellectual society before its too late. China/India have a 1/3rd of the world's population and the only way that 300 million in the US can compete is if we are smarter and better which currently we are not. And McCain wants to privatize education, and if he does that and you can kiss America (as you know it) goodbye

Educators are the true patriots in our society along with the women/men who serve in our military.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

It is NOT a Federal responsibility. More importantly by giving the power illegally to the fed WE are the reason our education is tanking even more. We are a HUGE Country, with millions of schools. The Federal Government can NOT know what is best everywhere and has proven it sucks at the job.

LOCAL and State elections should be about education NOT Federal.

 

[bigdaddygtr]

It is NOT a Federal responsibility. More importantly by giving the power illegally to the fed WE are the reason our education is tanking even more. We are a HUGE Country, with millions of schools. The Federal Government can NOT know what is best everywhere and has proven it sucks at the job.

LOCAL and State elections should be about education NOT Federal.

Wow, I know you Cons are about having just about no government at all, but why is it that all of the countries who rate the highest in Education all have serious federal budgets funding it? You know why? Because this is the MOST IMPORTANT thing in their society and they do whatever it takes at the federal, state, and local levels to keep it at its best. Honestly, Cons have been exactly the problem with why our education system sucks because they just keep cutting it and cutting it and cutting it, but you sure have no problem building schools in Iraq do you?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Wow, I know you Cons are about having just about no government at all, but why is it that all of the countries who rate the highest in Education all have serious federal budgets funding it? You know why? Because this is the MOST IMPORTANT thing in their society and they do whatever it takes at the federal, state, and local levels to keep it at its best. Honestly, Cons have been exactly the problem with why our education system sucks because they just keep cutting it and cutting it and cutting it, but you sure have no problem building schools in Iraq do you?

Absolutely MORONIC drivel from an idiot. Our education started taking a nose dive when the Federal Government began usurping State and Local Governments power. And it has been down hill ever since. Billions dumped in education have caused more rot not less. We have fewer teachers because of the growing need for MORE administrators to run all the "helping" Government programs. Teachers that no longer teach because they have to fill out paper work.

Then there are the Unions, they create a situation that is beyond stupid, Unions see to it that incompetent teachers never get fired. Hell the only way to lose jobs as teachers in some places is to break the law and be convicted. And even then you get to appeal for your credentials back, backed by the local Union.

The Federal Government has NO business in education, They have no legal authority to be in it. You want them to run education? Do it legally, get an amendment created and passed giving them the power.

 

[bigdaddygtr]

Absolutely MORONIC drivel from an idiot. Our education started taking a nose dive when the Federal Government began usurping State and Local Governments power. And it has been down hill ever since. Billions dumped in education have caused more rot not less. We have fewer teachers because of the growing need for MORE administrators to run all the "helping" Government programs. Teachers that no longer teach because they have to fill out paper work.

Then there are the Unions, they create a situation that is beyond stupid, Unions see to it that incompetent teachers never get fired. Hell the only way to lose jobs as teachers in some places is to break the law and be convicted. And even then you get to appeal for your credentials back, backed by the local Union.

The Federal Government has NO business in education, They have no legal authority to be in it. You want them to run education? Do it legally, get an amendment created and passed giving them the power.

I love how I'm the moron yet you've never taught before and I have, though not surprising from a Con who think's he knows everything because he was in the military

Secondly, I don't want the federal government involved in education, I want the FUNDING and thats it. We wouldn't have any need for unions if the FUNDING was there. So, for the obviously slow military man, its about one word - F-U-N-D-I-N-G. That slow enough for you? Or do you need to continue getting dumber and dumber while the rest of the world gets smarter and smarter? But no, you're right, lets not do it like those systems that have worked in other countries, lets do it like the Retired General says cause we should just forget what's worked many other places. Good call

And I'm the idiot, hilarious

 

[dilloduck]

I love how I'm the moron yet you've never taught before and I have, though not surprising from a Con who think's he knows everything because he was in the military

Secondly, I don't want the federal government involved in education, I want the FUNDING and thats it. We wouldn't have any need for unions if the FUNDING was there. So, for the obviously slow military man, its about one word - F-U-N-D-I-N-G. That slow enough for you? Or do you need to continue getting dumber and dumber while the rest of the world gets smarter and smarter? But no, you're right, lets not do it like those systems that have worked in other countries, lets do it like the Retired General says cause we should just forget what's worked many other places. Good call

And I'm the idiot, hilarious

no, sorry--you are the idiot----you don't get government funding without goverment regulation coming along with it. ( Unless your a banker of course )

 

[chloe]

I have heard Biden talk a little bit about education, but not really much from Obama or McCain/Palin, but the websites give information on what there plans are on education. It is a good point I just think because of the Economy people don't really want to focus on education. Suze Orman (Financial Advisor) tells young people the best investment right now is in your education.

here's a little from McCain:
John McCain Will Allocate $250 Million Through A Competitive Grant Program To Support States That Commit To Expanding Online Education Opportunities. States can use these funds to build virtual math and science academies to help expand the availability of AP Math, Science, and Computer Sciences courses, online tutoring support for students in traditional schools, and foreign language courses.

John McCain Will Offer $250 Million For Digital Passport Scholarships To Help Students Pay For Online Tutors Or Enroll In Virtual Schools. Low-income students will be eligible to receive up to $4,000 to enroll in an online course, SAT/ACT prep course, credit recovery or tutoring services offered by a virtual provider. Providers could range from other public schools, virtual charter schools, home school parents utilizing virtual schooling resources or district or state sponsored virtual schools. The Department of Education would competitively award the funds to a national scholarship administrator who would manage the student applications, monitoring, and evaluation of providers.

JohnMcCain.com - McCain-Palin 2008



Heres a little from Obama:
Create the American Opportunity Tax Credit: Obama and Biden will make college affordable for all Americans by creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This universal and fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000 of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the average public college or university and make community college tuition completely free for most students. Recipients of the credit will be required to conduct 100 hours of community service.
Simplify the Application Process for Financial Aid: Obama and Biden will streamline the financial aid process by eliminating the current federal financial aid application and enabling families to apply simply by checking a box on their tax form, authorizing their tax information to be used, and eliminating the need for a separate application.

Welcome to Obama for America

 

[bigdaddygtr]

no, sorry--you are the idiot----you don't get government funding without goverment regulation coming along with it. ( Unless your a banker of course )

My father writes grants for a living and constantly gets federal money without any oversight.

Got an idea for you, please read my sig cause you're embarrassing my mother right now(just like Sara Palin)

 

[Navy1960]

The U.S. Constitution leaves the responsibility for public K-12 education with the states.

The responsibility for K-12 education rests with the states under the Constitution. There is also a compelling national interest in the quality of the nation's public schools. Therefore, the federal government, through the legislative process, provides assistance to the states and schools in an effort to supplement, not supplant, state support. The primary source of federal K-12 support began in 1965 with the enactment of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act (ESEA).

Archived: 10 Fact About K-12 Education Funding

big, while it is a given that the responsibility especially the education of K-12 is the states responsibiliy and even more so a local one. Are you proposing larger ESEA grants for school constuction, books , etc. and teacher hires? If you are, then just new hires, and new schools does not solve the issue of HOW our children are being educated. To effect a change in that, you need to start on the local level, but then you will have to deal with the NEA most likely and its draconian process of protecting teachers at all costs at the expense of children. I have one daughter who started college this year and can tell you if we as her parents had not taken it upon ourselves to do everything to prepare her for entry into college, such as SAT prep, etc. then she would not have gotten into college, as her high school was too busy pumping out diplomas and not worried at all about teaching these children. A simple influx of cash into these school districts will NOT change the policies on how our children are educated. So if your proposals have some sort of suggestions as to how to change this locked in system as it sits now on the local level then I am all for it.

 

[bigdaddygtr]

The U.S. Constitution leaves the responsibility for public K-12 education with the states.

The responsibility for K-12 education rests with the states under the Constitution. There is also a compelling national interest in the quality of the nation's public schools. Therefore, the federal government, through the legislative process, provides assistance to the states and schools in an effort to supplement, not supplant, state support. The primary source of federal K-12 support began in 1965 with the enactment of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act (ESEA).

Archived: 10 Fact About K-12 Education Funding

big, while it is a given that the responsibility especially the education of K-12 is the states responsibiliy and even more so a local one. Are you proposing larger ESEA grants for school constuction, books , etc. and teacher hires? If you are, then just new hires, and new schools does not solve the issue of HOW our children are being educated. To effect a change in that, you need to start on the local level, but then you will have to deal with the NEA most likely and its draconian process of protecting teachers at all costs at the expense of children. I have one daughter who started college this year and can tell you if we as her parents had not taken it upon ourselves to do everything to prepare her for entry into college, such as SAT prep, etc. then she would not have gotten into college, as her high school was too busy pumping out diplomas and not worried at all about teaching these children. A simple influx of cash into these school districts will NOT change the policies on how our children are educated. So if your proposals have some sort of suggestions as to how to change this locked in system as it sits now on the local level then I am all for it.

More money for salaries= better teachers. New Jersey is the #1 rated state in the country for public education and you know what's funny? They also have the highest teacher salaries and most resources, given by the Fed's, used toward salaries and resources. This really isn't e=mc squared

 

[jillian]

More money for salaries= better teachers. New Jersey is the #1 rated state in the country for public education and you know what's funny? They also have the highest teacher salaries and most resources, given by the Fed's, used toward salaries and resources. This really isn't e=mc squared

Actually, Vermont is number one, I believe. New Jerseyis number four; New York is number 10.

StateMaster - Best Educated Index (most recent) by state

 

[dilloduck]

My father writes grants for a living and constantly gets federal money without any oversight.

Got an idea for you, please read my sig cause you're embarrassing my mother right now(just like Sara Palin)

So schools get federal money with no strings attached ? That's funny.

 

[bigdaddygtr]

Actually, Vermont is number one, I believe. New Jerseyis number four; New York is number 10.

StateMaster - Best Educated Index (most recent) by state

I was basing my ratings on 2006 cause that was the last year I saw them. But noticeably, those states all reside in the NE where they fund it.

Vermont is almost a socialist country, so not surprising they are number 1

 

[editec]

Until teachers have absolute control over what happens in their classrooms, education is bound to continue its decline into worse than mediocrity, folks.

What serious scholar is going to put up with the total crap imposed on k-12 educators?

If anyone thinks editec is going to let a school board dictate to me what I am supposed to teach or how, or dictate to me what is acceptable or not acceptable behavior of my students in MY classrooms, they're nuts.

Johnny cannot read because k-12 teachers with balls are treated like servants instead of professionals.

And teachers are treated like servants because most of them really are nice people who are completely lacking the balls to take charge of their classrooms.

And those willing to climb out on that limb and take charge of their curriculums and classrooms like the professionals they are?

They're driven from edcuation by the pandering nitwits who runs schools.

The whole system is nuts, frankly.

What other profession would allow itself to be completely dominated by people who are not OF that profession?

When was the last time, for example, you heard of FASB being dominated by people who were not accountants?

How would you lawyers feel if your profession was dominated by non-lawyers?

How many of you engineers would continue to be if you every decision had to pass muster with a committee of non-engineers?

Well, look at the composition of most local school boards sometime.

Real estate agents, retired bank clerks, bus drivers and people whose sole mission is to " keep the cost of education down" or "make sure family values are taught to our children". Morons in other words.

Education will continue to decline because educators are wimps, folks.

They may mostly be liberals, but they're socially-speaking the most conforming people and the most easily cowed profession in America.

Their unions are a joke, too.

 

[Caligirl]

It absolutely amazes me that in every Presidential election I've seen, the one thing that rarely ever gets talked about is Education. For all of you out there who don't know this, our K-12 education ranks 76th in the WORLD. 76th!!!! Our society is getting less and less educated by the generation while other countries have more people and are getting smarter and smarter(aka CHINA). You know who's number 1? FINLAND, and they have no where near the resources we have. The reason for this is that the US dept of Education has been the first, consistently, to get its funding cut. It only spends 57 billion a year on education across the nation which we spend in 5 months in Iraq. They are also over there building schools! BUILDING SCHOOLS in IRAQ???? For the cost of this war we could have built 31,000 new schools and that was back in 2007. We could of also made a serious increase in teacher pay so that we kept the good one's where they should be, in the classroom

If you know your history, then you know that at their peak nobody thought the empires of Egypt, Greece, and Rome would ever fall. You know why they all fell? Too many wars and they stopped being the leader in education/modern technologies. We lose the best teachers to college or another profession because we as a society refuse to put in the necessary funds to actually provide our kids with the 1 thing they desperately need, a good education. Some really good teacher taught Bill Gates in 6th grade about the basic principles of math or taught Warren Buffett Economic theory which has allowed them to become so successful yet we don't fund that person? People, we are going down as a country EXACTLY the same way that those 3 empires went down except we are going down much faster than they did. If you don't believe in substantially increasing the funding for education, then you truly don't care about the future of the country.

As part of a question and answer portion of the 2007 Miss Teen USA pageant, Upton was asked by the questioner Aimee Teegarden, "Recent polls have shown a fifth of Americans can't locate the U.S. on a world map. Why do you think this is?"
Upton responded:[1]
I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable to do so because, uh, some, people out there in our nation don't have maps and, uh, I believe that our, uh, education like such as, uh, South Africa and, uh, the Iraq, everywhere like such as, and, I believe that they should, our education over here in the U.S. should help the U.S., uh, or, uh, should help South Africa and should help the Iraq and the Asian countries, so we will be able to build up our future, for our [children].[8][9]

Case and point, and she was in the top percent of her high school class along with the point we seem to miss and thats the 20% of people who can't point out the US on a map. TWENTY PERCENT! News Flash - we desperately need to become a more intellectual society before its too late. China/India have a 1/3rd of the world's population and the only way that 300 million in the US can compete is if we are smarter and better which currently we are not. And McCain wants to privatize education, and if he does that and you can kiss America (as you know it) goodbye

Educators are the true patriots in our society along with the women/men who serve in our military.

What specifics would you suggest to improve our education, and what factors do you think might contribute to our poor showing?

 

[Navy1960]

More money for salaries= better teachers. New Jersey is the #1 rated state in the country for public education and you know what's funny? They also have the highest teacher salaries and most resources, given by the Fed's, used toward salaries and resources. This really isn't e=mc squared

The most recent report included a list of teacher salaries by state. The state with the highest average teacher salary was Connecticut, at $57,760. California was a very close second, where the average teacher salary is $57,604. New Jersey teachers make approximately $56,635 per year. Rounding out the top five were Illinois and Rhode Island, with the average teacher salary at $56,494 and $56,432, respectively. The state with the lowest average teacher salary was South Dakota, at $34,039.

Teacher Salaries by State | Employment Spot

Not that I disagree that a higher salary for a teacher would tend to draw more talanted people to the profession, it does however not address the issue of what is taught in the classroom. A simple raise in salaries does not always constitue an automatic uptick in performance.

Rank School Name and Location College
Readiness Quality-adjusted Exams
per Test Taker
1 Thomas Jefferson High School
Fairfax County, Alexandria, Virginia 100.0 6.5
2 Pacific Collegiate Charter
Santa Cruz County, Santa Cruz, California 100.0 4.9
3 International Baccalaureate Program
Polk County, Bartow, Florida 100.0 4.3
4 Oxford Academy
Orange County, Cypress, California 100.0 3.8
5 International School
King County, Bellevue, Washington 100.0 2.8
6 Pine View School for Gifted
Sarasota County, Osprey, Florida 99.3 4.7
7 High Technology High School
Monmouth County, Lincroft, New Jersey 98.8 2.9
8 Design & Architectural Senior High
Miami-Dade County, Miami, Florida 98.1 2.3
9 Stanton College Preparatory
Duval County, Jacksonville, Florida 96.2 4.4
10 Preuss School Ucsd
San Diego County, La Jolla, California 95.8 2.3
Gold Medal Schools - US News and World Report

 

[del]

Actually, Vermont is number one, I believe. New Jerseyis number four; New York is number 10.

StateMaster - Best Educated Index (most recent) by state

well, hell, there's only 17 kids in the whole state

 

[jillian]

well, hell, there's only 17 kids in the whole state

lol.. true. they don't exactly have to deal with urban public schools.

 

[del]

lol.. true. they don't exactly have to deal with urban public schools.

yeah, you don't hear much about tough street kids from bennington.

 

[Navy1960]

well, hell, there's only 17 kids in the whole state

You do see on that list you provided why I have little faith in a public school system that is totally focused on things other than educating our children don't you? Look who is bringing up the rear on that list, is it any wonder why my wife and I needed to do what the school could not to get our daughter into college.