On the Ban a thought:

[Iceweasel]

Its still a ban whether it be a week or a year

Yep, but a temporary ban because they don't believe the policy in place is adequate. We've seen what can go wrong in Europe but unfortunately liberals are incapable of learning. Following marching orders is all they can do.

Why is a ban needed in the first place? How many refugees who have entered the US have done any damage? These people are vetted before ever coming here

I just explained it in the post you responded to. If you don't read the posts why go out of your way to look stupid?

 

[Iceweasel]

If Muslims would behave this wouldn't be necessary. But again, and all throughout history, they've struggled to do that

Once again you blame an entire religion, over a billion people, for the actions of a few.

A very few and the penalty is being placed the wrong nations. It's even being generous to intimate that a nation state focused approach is in any way a rational approach to ensuring U.S. citizens' safety from terrorists.

So no problems from those countries in Europe huh?

 

[brummelben]

Its still a ban whether it be a week or a year

Nope.

Donald Trump says CIA warned George W. Bush of Sept. 11 attacks

and they probably warned him about 20 other possible attacks. Again, you are using hindsight as a political weapon, and that's just stupid.

So Trump lies again?

No, they probably did warn him about an increased risk, but there were probably also other warnings about other possible attacks.

Word of advice, you aren't smart enough to get me in an actual "gotcha situation", so stop trying.

My, how history can change in the blink of an eye. Next you will tell us that invading Iraq was a prudent decision

 

[CowboyTed]

President Harry Truman did nothing about the Jewish Holocaust victims floating around on ships going nowhere except to pressure England to allow Jews to enter the God forsaken desert that nobody wanted in what was called "Palestine".

What kind of revisionist history texts have you been reading?

• President Truman Statement and Directive on Displaced Persons (December 1945)
  
• United States Policy Toward Jewish Refugees, 1941–1952
  
• http://www.annefrankguide.net/en-US/bronnenbank.asp?oid=19221
  
• Truman Directive of 1945 - Wikipedia

LAds can I point out that ye are talking about post WW2 and I was pointing to Pre WW2...

 

[Iceweasel]

Nope.

Donald Trump says CIA warned George W. Bush of Sept. 11 attacks

and they probably warned him about 20 other possible attacks. Again, you are using hindsight as a political weapon, and that's just stupid.

So Trump lies again?

No, they probably did warn him about an increased risk, but there were probably also other warnings about other possible attacks.

Word of advice, you aren't smart enough to get me in an actual "gotcha situation", so stop trying.

My, how history can change in the blink of an eye. Next you will tell us that invading Iraq was a prudent decision

When are you going to support your assertion that Bush was informed prior to 9/11? You keep dancing around like a little princess hoping we'd forget what you said.

 

[usmbguest5318]

A thought I have about the ban is that individuals who aim to commit acts of terrorism in the U.S. are laughing their asses off because unlike Trump, they know (1) they aren't now and never have been from the banned countries and (2) the would be perpetrators of U.S. terrorism who happen to be from those countries weren't ever in a position of being able to get to the U.S. to commit their deeds.

 

[CowboyTed]

If Muslims would behave this wouldn't be necessary. But again, and all throughout history, they've struggled to do that

Once again you blame an entire religion, over a billion people, for the actions of a few.

A very few and the penalty is being placed the wrong nations. It's even being generous to intimate that a nation state focused approach is in any way a rational approach to ensuring U.S. citizens' safety from terrorists.

So no problems from those countries in Europe huh?

Actually Europe has bigger problems from countries that are more homogeneous than Syria. Syria was a fairly secular country, a bit like Lebanon..

Countries that have major cultural gaps are

Nigeria : They are mainly Christian and far higher numbers than Syria
Eritrea : 50% Christian and are the second highest refugee count into Europe
Pakistan, African countries cause way more problems than Arab immigrants...

The Arabs are usually educated and have plenty of exposure to Western culture... The funny thing is a lot of them would be the more secular Arabs, they would skip mosque and just get on with life.. They would drink and date Europeans... Arabs integrate far quicker than Africans.

 

[martybegan]

Nope.

Donald Trump says CIA warned George W. Bush of Sept. 11 attacks

and they probably warned him about 20 other possible attacks. Again, you are using hindsight as a political weapon, and that's just stupid.

So Trump lies again?

No, they probably did warn him about an increased risk, but there were probably also other warnings about other possible attacks.

Word of advice, you aren't smart enough to get me in an actual "gotcha situation", so stop trying.

My, how history can change in the blink of an eye. Next you will tell us that invading Iraq was a prudent decision

That is more a matter of opinion. What you are doing is pure hindsight without any links to back you up. You are the one trying to rewrite history.

 

[boedicca]

We should let in the Christians.

They will be proud Americans who will fight with us and be grateful to be here.

As a child, some of my best friends were Lebanese, and they were the greatest people imaginable. They left Lebanon because of the same shit -- the Muslims taking over their Christian country. Heck, Beirut was once called the Paris of the Middle East before the scourge of Islam destroyed it.

I am 100% behind letting in the true victims of Islam, here. Let the Muslims stay behind and fight it out.

56 of the 10,000 Syrian Refugees allowed into the U.S. last year were Chrstians....about 1/2 of 1 percent. Considering that Christians are 10% of the Syrian population, it appears that Obama systematically denied them the ability to escape Syria.

And that is the past... Trump is in charge now... What do you consider an acceptable number of Christians or Muslims, you set a target...

Trump set a number: 50,000 per year. And now, his administration needs to set up the criteria by which that amount is allotted. One thing is for sure, we should not classify as refugees weaponized young men who have been schooled as terrorists and are intent on destroying our civilization.

 

[boedicca]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Fair enough... So what number of Refugees do you think is would be acceptable for the US to take for 2017, 2018....

I being fair... If he feels he needs to increase the security and needs do that fair enough...

Can I also point out that that terrorist attacks on US Soil(mainland) have not come these countries and why didn't they target where the number one provider country to terrorist attacks in USA, Saudi Arabia...

By the way I think banning Saudi Arabia is counter productive... While Saudis are the number supplier they are also one of the highest defenders against terrorism as well.. But Saudi is very complicated and a different discussion...

The difference is the Saudis now are much more investigative of their own radicals, and have tighter border controls than any of the countries as part of the moratorium (which is what it is, not a ban).

What exactly is the difference between a moratorium and a ban?

What's the difference between a suspension and a permaban on a message board?

 

[SassyIrishLass]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Fair enough... So what number of Refugees do you think is would be acceptable for the US to take for 2017, 2018....

I being fair... If he feels he needs to increase the security and needs do that fair enough...

Can I also point out that that terrorist attacks on US Soil(mainland) have not come these countries and why didn't they target where the number one provider country to terrorist attacks in USA, Saudi Arabia...

By the way I think banning Saudi Arabia is counter productive... While Saudis are the number supplier they are also one of the highest defenders against terrorism as well.. But Saudi is very complicated and a different discussion...

The difference is the Saudis now are much more investigative of their own radicals, and have tighter border controls than any of the countries as part of the moratorium (which is what it is, not a ban).

What exactly is the difference between a moratorium and a ban?

What's the difference between a suspension and a permaban on a message board?

Well done.

 

[yiostheoy]

Every year the Holocaust is remembered like it was on Friday. The Trump administration faced criticism on Friday to actually failing to mention Jews in their message...

But what they also failed to mention is how countries all over the world refused Jewish refugees... As the Jewish people were desperate to leave an evil regime who wanted to ethnic cleanse them from the earth many nations (including the US) refused many thousands entry.

How America’s rejection of Jews fleeing Nazi Germany haunts our refugee policy today
The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies | History | Smithsonian

Why?
"FDR claimed that Jewish immigrants could threaten national security.."

What is the saying about the holocaust we say: Never Again.

Now lets bring ourselves to modern times:
It was in the News this weekend that Assad Forces backed by Russian Troops and equipment are Ethnic Cleansing massive areas of Syria after the fall of Aleppo. The message is run or die...
Syrian regime accused of ethnic cleansing

Syria was 10% Christian but they are the ones fleeing quickest... They are targeted for special punishment..
Syria's beleaguered Christians - BBC News

Many of the neighbouring countries have taken Millions of Refugees and looking to have the load shared with other countries.
Syrian refugees in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon face an uncertain 2017

Lets make it clear the US has to take some responsibility for destabilizing the region...

Lets be clear out of the 8,000 refugees US has taken so far 78% have been women and children...
Most Syrian refugees coming to U.S. are women, children

There could have a simple test for christianity and accept christians for now? There is an estimated 1 million to choose from.

But lets get back to the statement said on Friday across the world 'Never Again', Are we using our simple prejudices like was used against the Jews in 1930s. Is this fear justified any more than the fear of the Jew in 1930s.
The facts are simple how many Syrian Refugees have killed US Citizens?


P.S. The talk of relaxing sanctions on the Russians should look at what Putin has ordered and done in the conflict. He has deliberately attacked civilian targets... He is a war criminal and should not be appeased...

And incredibly long rant.

Do you have an executive summary in 2 or 3 sentences ???

 

[boedicca]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

 

[yiostheoy]

Pres DJ Trump has the right idea about Islam.

It is a plague.

 

[brummelben]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

Totally different situation, its apples and oranges

 

[boedicca]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

Totally different situation, its apples and oranges

No, it's not.

Obama put accepting Iraqi refugees on hold for six months in 2011.

Trump has put accepting refugees from seven countries (SELECTED BY OBAMA IN 2015 for visa restrictions) on hold for 90 to 120 days in order to revise the program for evaluating those accepted for immigration to the U.S.

Pretty much the same intent, although Trump is more serious about making the program effective.

 

[brummelben]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

Totally different situation, its apples and oranges

No, it's not.

Obama put accepting Iraqi refugees on hold for six months in 2011.

Trump has put accepting refugees from seven countries (SELECTED BY OBAMA IN 2015 for visa restrictions) on hold for 90 to 120 days in order to revise the program for evaluating those accepted for immigration to the U.S.

Pretty much the same intent, although Trump is more serious about making the program effective.

Did Obama place a 120 day ban on Muslims from these countries, or was that Trumps idea

 

[NoNukes]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

When you stoop to insult, you let yourself and your point down.

 

[CowboyTed]

Every year the Holocaust is remembered like it was on Friday. The Trump administration faced criticism on Friday to actually failing to mention Jews in their message...

But what they also failed to mention is how countries all over the world refused Jewish refugees... As the Jewish people were desperate to leave an evil regime who wanted to ethnic cleanse them from the earth many nations (including the US) refused many thousands entry.

How America’s rejection of Jews fleeing Nazi Germany haunts our refugee policy today
The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies | History | Smithsonian

Why?
"FDR claimed that Jewish immigrants could threaten national security.."

What is the saying about the holocaust we say: Never Again.

Now lets bring ourselves to modern times:
It was in the News this weekend that Assad Forces backed by Russian Troops and equipment are Ethnic Cleansing massive areas of Syria after the fall of Aleppo. The message is run or die...
Syrian regime accused of ethnic cleansing

Syria was 10% Christian but they are the ones fleeing quickest... They are targeted for special punishment..
Syria's beleaguered Christians - BBC News

Many of the neighbouring countries have taken Millions of Refugees and looking to have the load shared with other countries.
Syrian refugees in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon face an uncertain 2017

Lets make it clear the US has to take some responsibility for destabilizing the region...

Lets be clear out of the 8,000 refugees US has taken so far 78% have been women and children...
Most Syrian refugees coming to U.S. are women, children

There could have a simple test for christianity and accept christians for now? There is an estimated 1 million to choose from.

But lets get back to the statement said on Friday across the world 'Never Again', Are we using our simple prejudices like was used against the Jews in 1930s. Is this fear justified any more than the fear of the Jew in 1930s.
The facts are simple how many Syrian Refugees have killed US Citizens?


P.S. The talk of relaxing sanctions on the Russians should look at what Putin has ordered and done in the conflict. He has deliberately attacked civilian targets... He is a war criminal and should not be appeased...

And incredibly long rant.

Do you have an executive summary in 2 or 3 sentences ???

It is called reading...

But the basic message is Trump shows signs of ethnic cleansing facilitator... But reading it will see the proof

 

[CowboyTed]

The OP is making a fallacious characterization. It's not a ban, it's a suspension for a few months while processes are evaluated to ensure that proper vetting takes place. Obabble did the same thing for Iraqi refugees in 2011.

Is this an alternative fact?

Obama put allowing refugees from Iraq into the U.S. for 6 months in 2011.

It's history. You could learn about it all by yourself if you had the intellectual capacity to do so.

Totally different situation, its apples and oranges

No, it's not.

Obama put accepting Iraqi refugees on hold for six months in 2011.

Trump has put accepting refugees from seven countries (SELECTED BY OBAMA IN 2015 for visa restrictions) on hold for 90 to 120 days in order to revise the program for evaluating those accepted for immigration to the U.S.

Pretty much the same intent, although Trump is more serious about making the program effective.

Vastly different and you know it... Being wilfully ignorant is not a defense...