Ok in a global marketplace how does the USA compete with offshore wages?

[uscitizen]

discuss.

Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

It's the American consumer who has caused this and it's the American consumer who can fix it.

the avg American consumer has lost that capability. It has been programmed out of them.

 

[editec]

discuss.

Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

Tarriffs, same way we did while we were becoming the greatest industrial nation in the world.

You know, exactly the way the Founding Fathers envisioned we do it?

 

[expat_panama]

discuss. Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

Tarriffs, same way we did while we were becoming the greatest industrial nation in the world. You know, exactly the way the Founding Fathers envisioned we do it?

Those of us that know who are fathers are can tell you that the American Revolution was preceeded by a strong anti-tariff sentiment, most famously at the Boston Tea Party. We can also tell you that the bulk of American labor went into manufacturing only as federal revenue dropped from tariffs and came from excise and income taxes.

 

[editec]

discuss. Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

Tarriffs, same way we did while we were becoming the greatest industrial nation in the world. You know, exactly the way the Founding Fathers envisioned we do it?

Those of us that know who are fathers are can tell you that the American Revolution was preceeded by a strong anti-tariff sentiment, most famously at the Boston Tea Party. We can also tell you that the bulk of American labor went into manufacturing only as federal revenue dropped from tariffs and came from excise and income taxes.

And yet the first thing that the NEWLY formed US government did?

Impose strict tarriffs to insure that US industry would grow.

And those tariffs were the primary source of US government reveue right up until the Civil War.

Much of the complaint of the colonialists was NOT the tax on tea, but rather the fact that it was not LEGAL for the colonialist to manufacture things here in the colonies.

YOu need to understand how the British empires mercantilist economic syustem worked.

Clearly you don't have the whole story and have been expose4d only to the items that support a POV which distorts history to serve a theory that is not true.

Again, this nation had had protective tariffs (just incidently as Adam Smith advised nations to do) to promote industrialization in THIS nation.

It worked and thanks to that this nation became the economic powerhouse that is now dying on the alter of FREE TRADE

 

[Douger]

The corporations profits skyrocket under free trade. Your masters own stock in those corporations. Those corporations have 535 prostitutes in the US. Shuddup and pay your taxes.

 

[Neubarth]

What you need to understand is that when you have a minimum wage of say $10, people who have skills worth less than that become unemployed. If a company hires 10 people who are making $5 an hour, and then minimum wage becomes $10, half the people will be laid off. Minimum wage results in the unemployment of unskilled workers, who resort to welfare. This becomes a drain on productivity. Without minimum wage, they would receive money, and they would gain valuable work experience allowing them to move up. Jobs with low wages would not be lifetime jobs, and would be best for those getting their foot in the door. This is how Chinese Americans went from being impoverished to more wealthy than whites.

The faulty premise of minimum wage is that it raises wages for everyone. It does not. It simply makes people who are unskilled unemployable. Supporters of minimum wage laws do not realize that prior to minimum wage laws the national unemployment rate did fall well below 5%. According to the US Census, national unemployment rates were 3.3% in 1927, 1.8% in 1926, 3.2% in 1925, 2.4% in 1923, 1.4% in 1919 and 1918, 2.8% in 1907, 1.7% in 1906, and 3.7% in 1902.
Mythology of the Minimum Wage - D.W. MacKenzie - Mises Daily

The alleged moral case for a living wage ignores the fact that minimum wage increases adversely affect the very people whom advocates of living wages intend to help. It makes poor and unskilled workers even worse off.

Horribly misleading information.

From 1870 to 1940 there was a gradual change from Farming being the major employer in the United States to manufacturing. Any data used from that period to compare to the present is not valid in that our economy is now predominantly Service Sector. The Majority of Americans are working in producing services for other Americans, be it Doctors, Nurses, Educators, shoe salesmen or McDonalds employees.

We are still the leading manufacturing country in the world, but Manufacturing is a small percentage of the overall economy. Trying to effect solutions to a slight decrease in the economy by talking about creating manufacturing jobs is silly.

Remember, since the Federal Government is not really paying interest to the FED on any bonds and notes that the FED holds, money is effectively free for the Federal Government. Somebody needs to step forward and create more service sector jobs.

 

[expat_panama]

...the first thing that the NEWLY formed US government did? Impose strict tarriffs to insure that US industry would grow...

Opinions are one thing, facts are another. From this report from the Natl. Bureau of Economic Research and from this page of the Census Bur. archives:

Year_____Manufacturing Employment__% Revenue from Tariffs
1810______________75K____________________91%
1860___________1,530K_____________________47%
1920__________11,190K______________________5%

Tariffs halt manufacturing growth, so trade agreements were worked out beginning with the Washington administration. They even wanted trade with China back then. By the end of the 1800's with tariffs replaced with other revenue and manufacturing enabled the US enter the world stage.

Freedom makes Americans powerful, not big government taxes.

 

[Anachronism]

Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

YES. Isolationism. Nothing IN, Nothing OUT. American Products made by American Workers Employed by American Companies for American Consumers. PERIOD. FULL STOP.

 

[Supposn]

discuss.

Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

Tarriffs, same way we did while we were becoming the greatest industrial nation in the world.
You know, exactly the way the Founding Fathers envisioned we do it?

Editec, you write fondly of tariffs.
The transferable Import Certificates, (ICs) proposal has what I believe to be significant advantages to tariffs:

Tariffs provide additional government revenue; the IC proposal acts as an export subsidy that would be (in my opinion) would be of greater economic benefit.

Government determined tariff rates or the global markets’ determined price of transferable Import Certificates would both determine increased prices of imported goods due to the trade policies within their respective environments.

Within an IC trade policy (Unlike tariffs), regardless of how small of addition to import prices due to IC’s, USA’s adjusted assessment of imported goods could not exceed our assessed exports; but for fixed government tariffs to accomplish the same extent of trade deficit reduction, IC’s would almost always be less than tariff rates.

Refer to:
the web site of USA-Trade-Deficit.Blogspot.com
or the topic: " Warren Buffett's concept to significantly reduce USA's trade deficit "
or Google: wikipedia, import certificates.

Respectfully, Supposn

 

[Supposn]

Any ideas aside from dropping our wages to match theirs?

YES. Isolationism. Nothing IN, Nothing OUT. American Products made by American Workers Employed by American Companies for American Consumers. PERIOD. FULL STOP.

Anachronism, we can have it all, increased GDP, jobs, median wage, sum of our aggregate imports plus exports, and cheaper, but not the absolute cheapest priced imports.

Refer to:
the web site of USA-Trade-Deficit.Blogspot.com
or the topic: " Warren Buffett's concept to significantly reduce USA's trade deficit "
or Google: wikipedia, import certificates.

Respectfully, Supposn

 

[Anachronism]

Supposn, I thank you for your thought out and polite reply. I truly do. However, I am a NATIONALIST and an ISOLATIONIST. I do not believe that there is anything outside our borders that we NEED here in the US. I doubt that is ever going to change in my mind.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Well, time to irritate Conservs, Libs and Libertarians all at once

Unions. Once upon a time we had child labor, unsafe working conditions and you could get fired for not giving your boss sex on demand. The original purpose of unions was to eliminate those kinds of wrongdoings. But they have long since exceeded those purposes and have turned into the proverbial dragon that has been let out of the cave. I'm from Detroit and I remember the ubiquitous phrase "Let em try an fire me, I got seniority!" from people who actually took pride in doing poor work. So we can't demand good work from our workers. My sister used to joke about her job. In 1992, she was paid $60K plus benies to inspect piston rings. She would just look at them and make sure the inside was round. Oooh. $60K for that. And we're supposed to compete? A longshoreman who has three weeks training on a tallboy crane gets six figures. Used to be, you had to work hard and go through college for that kind of money. And the Teamsters? Please. Unions were slapped with some humble pie when the economy tanked but every time it improves, what do they want? More. No wonder execs are shipping jobs overseas.
Minimum Wage. Well we could eliminate it. Works great for China! Of course they have more people living on under $1 / day than we have adults. That's not what I want for America and eliminating minimum wage would make that the eventual outcome.
Financial Regulations. It amazes me when people say eliminating them would make things better. Regardless of whether you're a Dem or Repub, Conserv or Lib, facts are facts. EVERY time we've deregulated a major financial instrument, we've experienced a Depression or Recession within 2 - 4 years. Stocks were deregulated in the 20's. Junk Bonds and the Thrift & Loan industry were both deregluated in the 80's. Commercial Mortgage Backed Securities were deregualted in the 2000's. MCI? Enron? No need for financial regulations? I beg to differ.
Patents China buys our bonds largely with money they get from pirating U.S. technology. I've actually heard people say they would do away with the patent office. WTF? Intellectual property is worth more than tangible property. But we need to protect ours. If we catch a country systematically stealing our property, we impose heavy penalites. Wanna bring that doll in from China? It will cost $70 by the time it gets to market. Or you can quit stealing Windows...
Trade Cost Inequity This one is simple. Whatever your country charges, we do. There are a dozen countries out there that make it almost prohibitive to buy an American product because of tarrifs. What do we charge them? Zero.
Outsourcing Remember about 10 years ago when you suddenly started hearing Raja on the phone at Tech Support?In 2001, the penalties for shipping white collar jobs overseas was eliminated. Bring it back. Eliminate all deductions associated with the cost of closing an American plant and opening a new one abroad.
Public Option Health Care Oooh. Time to PO the Conservs, Repubs and Libertarians. Guess how many people in this country can't start a new business because they are slaves to corporations, due to their health coverage? If this weren't a consideration, literally thousands of new businesses would be started every year, that are not otherwise started. No I'm not saying to eliminate the private option but rather just give an additional option. Make it minimal coverage but enough for entreprenaurs to at least have options - especially if, as in the case of a friend of mine, their wife has a serious pre-existing condition. If those who claim The Market will always support the best value for a product or service are correct, then very few people will sign up because the private sector will do such a superior job! If that's not the case, then all the rhetoric about The Market is BS.
Tax Breaks and Subsidies. Take them away from Big Oil, MNE's etc... and flood that money into business that hire 100% American and pay their taxes 100% in America. Those defending the government help given to British Petroleum, for example, obviously don't understand how we're screwing our own people. We're taking tax dollars from Americans and just plain shipping them overseas. Are these companies creating new American jobs? Nope. New technology that will benefit America and Ameica only? Nope. Do they provide America the revenues they should? Anyone who's familiar with MNE financing, knows the shell game they play. We are getting a very neagtive return on our buck for the money you and I are giving them. Eliminate 100% of those tax breaks and subsidies - that's hundred of billions of dollars. Then put 10% of that back into subsidies and tax breaks to help small to medium sized companies that hire only American and pay taxes only in America. Employment? Will rise. Revenues? Will rise.
Just a few thoughts.
Bring forth the slings and arrows!