Ohio police shot black man 60 times

[miketx]

Post it idiot.

Now the racist begs for truths he will deny with another lie.

 

[Ralph Norton]

Wrong, it applies all the time until you are proven guilty.




Elijah McClain was not a criminal. Antonio Smith was not a criminal. Andre Hill was not a criminal.

"Wrong, it applies all the time until you are proven guilty."
Really? Please educate us as to when "innocent until proven guilty" ever comes into play before being charged.
EVER.
I'm not sure where you think you amassed your voluminous knowledge of the legal system but you will need some remedial coursework.

 

[pknopp]

Only when it comes to prosecution. We're not even there yet. Suspicious until investigation leads elsewhere.

You MUST stop your backwards thinking on this issue.

I don't have to do squat. Are the cops that killed Elijah McClain being prosecuted? Maybe it's those who don't want to see cops get prosecuted that need to rethink things.

Maybe it's those who get tired of paying out millions and millions and millions of dollars to those who have had their rights violated that need to rethink things.

Maybe it's those who pretend to support the Constitution but don't actually that need to rethink things.

If police are asking questions, they are not doing so for their health. Why do police ask questions? If you are not the person they are after, help them clear you of suspicion so they can apprehend the real perp.

YOUR method is to cause MORE suspicion and turn their attention toward YOU, rather than lead them to the right person.

I have NO idea why they felt a need to ask Elijah McClain anything.

 

[miketx]

"Wrong, it applies all the time until you are proven guilty."
Really? Please educate us as to when "innocent until proven guilty" ever comes into play before being charged.
EVER.
I'm not sure where you think you amassed your voluminous knowledge of the legal system but you will need some remedial coursework.

Jail house lawyer

 

[pknopp]

"Wrong, it applies all the time until you are proven guilty."
Really? Please educate us as to when "innocent until proven guilty" ever comes into play before being charged.
EVER.

Even when charged you are still innocent until a court through due process proves you guilty.

I'm not sure where you think you amassed your voluminous knowledge of the legal system but you will need some remedial coursework.

It's basic Constitution 101.

 

[miketx]

Even when charged you are still innocent until a court through due process proves you guilty

Omg! That's what he just said!

 

[pknopp]

Omg! That's what he just said!

It applies even AFTER being charged which is not what was said.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

I don't have to do squat.

Fine, then DON'T DO SQUAT when they start arresting you.

And, if you think I am somebody who is against police accountability, you are seriously mistaken.

I have NO idea why they felt a need to ask Elijah McClain anything.

Well, let's look at it, shall we?

On the evening of August 24, 2019, an Aurora civilian called 9-1-1 after seeing a male around Billings Street and Evergreen Avenue walking south on Billings Street wearing a ski mask and flailing his arms. The caller affirmed during the call that he did not believe the person was armed and that he did not believe that anyone was in immediate danger.[4] Friends of McClain interviewed after the incident speculated that this arm-flailing was most likely just dancing, as he is believed to have been listening to music at the time of the call.[17] McClain was dressed warmly and was wearing a ski mask because he had a blood circulation disorder that caused him to chill easily.[18]

According to the police report, McClain resisted when confronted by the responding police officers, and Officers Woodyard and Rosenblatt heard Officer Roedema shout "he is going for your gun". An attorney representing McClain's family said the officers involved slammed McClain into a wall immediately after apprehending him.[19][20] Roedema said that McClain "reached for and grabbed the grip of Rosenblatt's gun that was holstered".[21] There are conflicting accounts about the officer's report that McClain had tried to grab his gun. Later accounts offered differing reports on whose gun McClain had tried to grab. There was no visual body-camera footage of McClain's alleged reach for the gun, which the officers explained by stating that all of their cameras had fallen off. However, a news source states, "But if you watch the video from about the 15-minute mark (warning: It contains violent and upsetting content), you'll see someone pick up the body camera and point it toward McClain and one of the officers before dropping it back into the grass. Around 15:34, one of the officers seems to say, 'Leave your camera there.'"[22]

Death of Elijah McClain - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Does that sound like police are investigating a complaint?

Does that behavior sound like someone who may be a danger to himself or others?

It sounds like he tried to grab somebody's gun, and with the way he is described, I wouldn't doubt it.

Now, are you saying that McClain had no duty to help officers end their investigation and clear him of being a looney murderous fruitcake?

 

[Ralph Norton]

Even when charged you are still innocent until a court through due process proves you guilty.



It's basic Constitution 101.

"Even when charged you are still innocent until a court through due process proves you guilty."
No shit - that's exactly what I said. It does not apply BEFORE you are charged.

"It's basic Constitution 101"
Then why are you ALWAYS wrong?

 

[miketx]

It applies even AFTER being charged which is not what was said.

What jail house did you get your degree from?

 

[Ralph Norton]

It applies even AFTER being charged which is not what was said.

That's EXACTLY what I said.
Please see post # 595 and read again. Slowly if necessary.

 

[pknopp]

Fine, then DON'T DO SQUAT when they start arresting you.

And, if you think I am somebody who is against police accountability, you are seriously mistaken.

No I'm not.

Well, let's look at it, shall we?

On the evening of August 24, 2019, an Aurora civilian called 9-1-1 after seeing a male around Billings Street and Evergreen Avenue walking south on Billings Street wearing a ski mask and flailing his arms. The caller affirmed during the call that he did not believe the person was armed and that he did not believe that anyone was in immediate danger.[4] Friends of McClain interviewed after the incident speculated that this arm-flailing was most likely just dancing, as he is believed to have been listening to music at the time of the call.[17] McClain was dressed warmly and was wearing a ski mask because he had a blood circulation disorder that caused him to chill easily.[18]

According to the police report, McClain resisted when confronted by the responding police officers, and Officers Woodyard and Rosenblatt heard Officer Roedema shout "he is going for your gun". An attorney representing McClain's family said the officers involved slammed McClain into a wall immediately after apprehending him.[19][20] Roedema said that McClain "reached for and grabbed the grip of Rosenblatt's gun that was holstered".[21] There are conflicting accounts about the officer's report that McClain had tried to grab his gun. Later accounts offered differing reports on whose gun McClain had tried to grab. There was no visual body-camera footage of McClain's alleged reach for the gun, which the officers explained by stating that all of their cameras had fallen off. However, a news source states, "But if you watch the video from about the 15-minute mark (warning: It contains violent and upsetting content), you'll see someone pick up the body camera and point it toward McClain and one of the officers before dropping it back into the grass. Around 15:34, one of the officers seems to say, 'Leave your camera there.'"[22]

Death of Elijah McClain - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Does that sound like police are investigating a complaint?

Does that behavior sound like someone who may be a danger to himself or others?

It sounds like he tried to grab somebody's gun, and with the way he is described, I wouldn't doubt it.

Now, are you saying that McClain had no duty to help officers end their investigation and clear him of being a looney murderous fruitcake?

The person who called it in is the one who should have been arrested. She saw a black guy walking on the street not dressed in a manner that suited her and she called the cops. I hope she can no longer sleep at night.

When they asked him if he was alright and he tells them he is just walking home from the store and he is fine, investigation over.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

The person who called it in is the one who should have been arrested. She saw a black guy walking on the street not dressed in a manner that suited her and she called the cops.

And, the cops went to investigate what might have been a dangerous person (you know...their fucking job) and he ended up being a dangerous person. Imagine that?

WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF POLICE????

Answer that question before anything else. Because it sounds like you believe they should not exist.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

When they asked him if he was alright and he tells them he is just walking home from the store and he is fine, investigation over.

No, not "investigation over." A dude tripping out on narcotics or having a bout with psychosis is NOT fine.

WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF POLICE???

 

[pknopp]

And, the cops went to investigate what might have been a dangerous person (you know...their fucking job) and he ended up being a dangerous person. Imagine that?

WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF POLICE????

Answer that question before anything else. Because it sounds like you believe they should not exist.

Your words undercut your claims. You are trying to create some straw man to justify your hypocrisy.

 

[pknopp]

No, not "investigation over." A dude tripping out on narcotics or having a bout with psychosis is NOT fine.

WHAT IS THE PURPOSE OF POLICE???

He answered he was fine and clearly explained what he was doing. Time to move on.

Why do you feel the cops are facing criminal charges?

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Your words undercut your claims. You are trying to create some straw man to justify your hypocrisy.

I can clear up any inconsistencies if you would simply answer the fundamental question about the purpose of police.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

The person who called it in is the one who should have been arrested. She saw a black guy walking on the street not dressed in a manner that suited her and she called the cops. I hope she can no longer sleep at night.

Really? Our police department encourages it. They tell us citizens to call them for any reason we feel something may be amiss. It doesn't mean they are going to arrest anybody, it means they will check out our concerns.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

He answered he was fine and clearly explained what he was doing. Time to move on.

Oh, that's it? They get a 911 call about a dude tripping with a ski mask on and "I'm fine" is all they need to hear?

WRONG.

That is dereliction. They have a duty to take a closer look.

When he start grabbing for guns, "I'm fine" is no longer a true statement or confirmed to be false.

Why do you feel the cops are facing criminal charges?

I have no idea, but innocent until proven guilty, right?

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

The three police officers held McClain on the ground for 15 minutes. McClain was clearly in distress while restrained, sobbing and repeatedly saying "I can't breathe". He vomited several times, for which he apologized, saying: "I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to do that, I can't breathe correctly."[23] While McClain's arms were handcuffed behind his back, Woodyard applied a carotid control hold, which intentionally cuts off blood flow to the brain by compressing the carotid arteries in the neck, rendering McClain briefly unconscious. One officer threatened he would have his police dog bite McClain as he lay handcuffed and pinned to the ground.[24]

After McClain was restrained, more officers arrived and audio of the conversation records them saying that McClain was "acting crazy", that he was "definitely on something", and that he had attacked them with "incredible, crazy strength" when they tried to restrain him. They also said that, at one point, three officers were on top of McClain, who was 5 feet 6 inches (1.68 m) tall and weighed 140 pounds (64 kg).[23] Without speaking with or touching him, paramedics injected him with 500 mg of ketamine, a dose that would have been too much for a 200 pound person, as a sedative for a condition called excited delirium.[25] McClain was then transferred to the ambulance. The medic who had administered ketamine noticed McClain's chest "was not rising on its own, and he did not have a pulse."[26] He was pronounced brain dead on August 27 and died three days later, on August 30, 2019.[10] [17]

"I'm fine" is clearly not the case.