Obama Administration to Ban Asthma Inhalers Over Environmental Concerns

[skookerasbil]

Soon enough, you're going to see the human racists get behind new bans. Gonna go to the beach soon and see, "NO BREATHING" signs. In New York, they are considering a $50 surcharge if you drive into the city instead of taking mass transit. More human racism.

 

[skookerasbil]

By the way, the way you've written your whine, it very much sounds as if you are accusing BriPat1234 of getting hysterical and going full blown mental. You might want to adjust those opening lines before he comes after you with a big shillelagh. He's got quite the temper.

Nah s0n......we just cant stand limpwristers ( ie those who have embraced the feminized male concept hook, line and stinker ). Panty waist men have the effect of creating more social oddballs among us. The numbers have grown significantly in the past 4 decades.....the society is becomming a Jonestown.

 

[bripat9643]

Tolerance of bigotry is not a virtue, asshole.

No, it's a fundamental requirement of freedom, asshole.

Not for the people whose rights you're violating.

No one has a right to be served on someone else's private property.

 

[bripat9643]

Tolerance of bigotry is not a virtue, asshole.

No, it's a fundamental requirement of freedom, asshole.

Bri.....guy is part of that crowd who throws themselves off a 100 foot cliff before they'd slightly hurt somebody's feelings. Get hysterical about everything......go full blown mental case over a word or two stated on an internet message board. FCUK......how do these people navigate in the real world? Imagine working around people like this? I do.....they are the typical shit stirer problem employees that fcuk things up for everybody else with their thin skin. Deal with them all the time.....part of this new culture of hyper-sensitivity brought on by the PC whores, effectively ruining the workplace for everybody else. If you embrace anything traditional and publically state it, they loath you. You become a target. Its becoming an epidemic in my field......human services......these people are social oddballs who were irrelevant growing up and had to embrace this alternative social dynamic so they could feel relevant. Mental cases........

I'm familiar with the attitude. It's more of a propaganda technique, actually. H.L. Mencken summed it up nicely as follows:

Syllogisms à la Mode — If you are against labor racketeers, then you are against the working man. If you are against demagogues, then you are against democracy. If you are against Christianity, then you are against God. If you are against trying a can of old Dr. Quack's Cancer Salve, then you are in favor of letting Uncle Julius die.​

 

[bripat9643]

Nitrogen is the most common gas on the planet. How the **** is it that you believe it is more expensive than a banned, manmade chlorofluorocarbon gas? Did someone drop you on your head as a child? Jeez.

Nitrogen has a boiling point of -320 degrees Fahrenheit. Freon has a boiling point of -21 degrees Fahrenheit. That means the later requires much less energy to condense into a liquid for use as a propellant in aerosol cans. It also means the pressure exerted by evaporating liquid Nitrogen is much greater then the pressure exerted by liquid Freon, which means a can using the former has to be much stronger.

see, the difference between you and I is that I actually know a few things about physics and economics. Whereas you are a total ******* ignoramus who spouts of the first idiocy that pops into your head.

Which is completely irrelevant since no asthma inhaler on the market uses a liquid propellant.

Freon is a liquid propellent, numskull.

 

[bripat9643]

Mine has a tiny pump in it that is charged when you turn the top of the container. Then you push a button to release a dose. It doesn't get any simpler or safer than that.

Of course, the droplets produced by a pump spray are much larger than the droplets produced by an aerosol can. In other words, the result is much inferior to what an aerosol can gives.

The size of the droplets are a product of the design of the venturi used to deliver the medication, not a function of any propellant used.

Right, that's why they use pumps for spray paint. The venturi solely determines droplet size only among pump sprays.

Argue this all you want, but I've used just about every inhaler on the market, and the one I currently use works just fine. So the argument that is being made that Obama is jeopardizing the health of asthma sufferers is simply right wing bullshite, nothing more.

You're basing your claims on your expert medical credentials, right?

I think we should leave these decisions to doctors, not you or EPA bureaucrats, don't you?

 

[SSDD]

chlorofluorocarbons which were banned when?

Chlorofluorocarbons have been banned since 1996 because they destroy the ozone layer. Chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs) are a group of manufactured chemical compounds that contain chlorine, fluorine, and carbon. This group includes CFC-11, CFC-12, CFC-113, CFC-114, CFC-115, and many forms of Freon.

toxtown.nlm.nih.gov/.../chem..
So let us destroy the ozone because it's all Oblama fault for not letting us do it. But which would you like to have, an ozone or chlorofluorocarbons ?

You couldn't destroy the ozone if you tried. The ozone is constantly replenished by UV radiation from the sun. Ozone has a half life in the atmosphere that is measured in minutes as it is so unstable. Aside from that, it is O2 that really protects us from UV. The dissipation of energy required to break an O2 molecule into two O molecules is why we aren't burned up by UV... Ozone is a result, not a cause.

 

[SSDD]

there are alternatives, but depleting the ozone layer, not so much...

The ozone layer regenerates on a constant basis.

You really have no idea what you are blabbering about, do you?

Yes, do you? The ozone can't regenerate at a rate sustainable when being bombarded with corrosive chemicals..

Clearly, you don't have a clue. Ozone has a half life of minutes. It is highly unstable and decays almost as fast as it is created. If ozone actually stuck around for any period of time, it would be well mixed within the stratosphere where it is created. It isn't. It is concentrated where it is created because it doesn't last long enough as a molecule to go anywhere.

Don't worry though, it is just one more hoax in a long line of hoaxes you libs have fallen for.

 

[SSDD]

As though some asthma inhalers are going to destroy the ozone layer. Either that or you are being facetious.

So, you are either unfunny or just callous.

Why then was the chemical banned in 1996? Because it was not a hazard to the environment which we as humans depend upon or are you into self destruction?

It was banned because the EPA is under the control of an out-of-control gang of commies.

It was banned because 3M was one of algore's biggest financial contributors and they just happened to have an expensive and less effective replacement for freon. The ozone hole was a hoax fabricated just for that political payback.

The ozone hole exists over the poles due to a lack of UV radiation, not because of CFC's.

 

[RollingThunder]

The ozone layer regenerates on a constant basis.

You really have no idea what you are blabbering about, do you?

Yes, do you? The ozone can't regenerate at a rate sustainable when being bombarded with corrosive chemicals..

Clearly, you don't have a clue. Ozone has a half life of minutes. It is highly unstable and decays almost as fast as it is created.

And here's some more of SSooooDDuuumb's pseudo-science bullshit to debunk.

Ozone
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Ozone is a powerful oxidizing agent, far stronger than O2. It is also unstable at high concentrations, decaying to ordinary diatomic oxygen. It has a varying length half-life (meaning half as concentrated, or half-depleted), depending upon atmospheric conditions (temperature, humidity, and air movement). In a sealed chamber, with fan moving the gas, ozone has a half-life of approximately a day at room temperature[13]

 

[Crick]

That's right. And as the same article, immediately afterwards states "This reaction proceeds more rapidly with increasing temperature and increased pressure." Thus it will certainly NOT take place in less than half a day in stratosphere save where UVC has gotten strong enough to break it down. The concentrations of ozone by altitude in the stratosphere are precisely as described. The loss of ozone due to CFCs in the atmosphere and it's recovery since their ban is all exceedingly well documented.

Is there no mindless conspiracy theory on which you won't bite?

 

[Crick]

I can't believe this thread is still carrying on.

 

[waltky]

Granny says...

... "Somebody smack dat cheeky lil' British brat...

... a-fore he grows up to be a hooligan."

 

[SSDD]

Yes, do you? The ozone can't regenerate at a rate sustainable when being bombarded with corrosive chemicals..

Clearly, you don't have a clue. Ozone has a half life of minutes. It is highly unstable and decays almost as fast as it is created.

And here's some more of SSooooDDuuumb's pseudo-science bullshit to debunk.

Ozone
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Ozone is a powerful oxidizing agent, far stronger than O2. It is also unstable at high concentrations, decaying to ordinary diatomic oxygen. It has a varying length half-life (meaning half as concentrated, or half-depleted), depending upon atmospheric conditions (temperature, humidity, and air movement). In a sealed chamber, with fan moving the gas, ozone has a half-life of approximately a day at room temperature[13]

Yeah, and out in the wild its half life is measured in minutes....of course you fell for the hoax....you have a big hoax me birthmark in the center of your forehead.

 

[SSDD]

That's right. And as the same article, immediately afterwards states "This reaction proceeds more rapidly with increasing temperature and increased pressure." Thus it will certainly NOT take place in less than half a day in stratosphere save where UVC has gotten strong enough to break it down. The concentrations of ozone by altitude in the stratosphere are precisely as described. The loss of ozone due to CFCs in the atmosphere and it's recovery since their ban is all exceedingly well documented.

Is there no mindless conspiracy theory on which you won't bite?

Again, if it has such a long half life, why is it not well mixed within the stratosphere? We both know that it is because it decays so quickly. Of course, being a congenital liar, you can't bring yourself to admit it.

And the loss of O3 due to CFC's is well documented like it is also well documented that a whisp of CO2 added to the atmosphere will cause warming. Of course when one asks for proof, the shucking and jiving begins.

 

[RollingThunder]

Clearly, you don't have a clue. Ozone has a half life of minutes. It is highly unstable and decays almost as fast as it is created.

And here's some more of SSooooDDuuumb's pseudo-science bullshit to debunk.

Ozone
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Ozone is a powerful oxidizing agent, far stronger than O2. It is also unstable at high concentrations, decaying to ordinary diatomic oxygen. It has a varying length half-life (meaning half as concentrated, or half-depleted), depending upon atmospheric conditions (temperature, humidity, and air movement). In a sealed chamber, with fan moving the gas, ozone has a half-life of approximately a day at room temperature[13]

Yeah, and out in the wild its half life is measured in minutes....of course you fell for the hoax....you have a big hoax me birthmark in the center of your forehead.

Oh, SSooooDDuuumb, you are such a clueless retard, just making up your bogus "facts" as you go along.

There is no evidence that ozone behaves the way you claim and lots of evidence indicating a much longer residency time in the atmosphere.

You never even try to back up your insane anti-science claptrap with any evidence.

 

[RollingThunder]

That's right. And as the same article, immediately afterwards states "This reaction proceeds more rapidly with increasing temperature and increased pressure." Thus it will certainly NOT take place in less than half a day in stratosphere save where UVC has gotten strong enough to break it down. The concentrations of ozone by altitude in the stratosphere are precisely as described. The loss of ozone due to CFCs in the atmosphere and it's recovery since their ban is all exceedingly well documented.

Is there no mindless conspiracy theory on which you won't bite?

Again, if it has such a long half life, why is it not well mixed within the stratosphere?

Ozone is, in fact, generally well mixed in the stratosphere. However, because the CFCs have been destroying the ozone for many decades, there are now thin spots in the ozone layer over the poles, so some denier cult propaganda meister spun up the difference between the lower concentrations over the poles and the (well-mixed) higher concentrations over the lower latitudes, into this bogus nonsense about ozone not being "well mixed". And then the scientifically ignorant and severely restarted troll called SSoooDDuuumb was gullible enough to fall for this hokum.

 

[orogenicman]

Of course, the droplets produced by a pump spray are much larger than the droplets produced by an aerosol can. In other words, the result is much inferior to what an aerosol can gives.

The size of the droplets are a product of the design of the venturi used to deliver the medication, not a function of any propellant used.

Right, that's why they use pumps for spray paint. The venturi solely determines droplet size only among pump sprays.

Argue this all you want, but I've used just about every inhaler on the market, and the one I currently use works just fine. So the argument that is being made that Obama is jeopardizing the health of asthma sufferers is simply right wing bullshite, nothing more.

You're basing your claims on your expert medical credentials, right?

I think we should leave these decisions to doctors, not you or EPA bureaucrats, don't you?

Do give us the name of a doctor who says that asthma medication is best delivered using cfcs instead of the kind of pumping system I use. Right. You won't find one of those because they know that the best delivery system for asthma medication is a respironic air pump nebulizer, not a cfc gas.

MiniElite - Philips

 

[flacaltenn]

Of course, the droplets produced by a pump spray are much larger than the droplets produced by an aerosol can. In other words, the result is much inferior to what an aerosol can gives.

The size of the droplets are a product of the design of the venturi used to deliver the medication, not a function of any propellant used.

Right, that's why they use pumps for spray paint. The venturi solely determines droplet size only among pump sprays.

Argue this all you want, but I've used just about every inhaler on the market, and the one I currently use works just fine. So the argument that is being made that Obama is jeopardizing the health of asthma sufferers is simply right wing bullshite, nothing more.

You're basing your claims on your expert medical credentials, right?

I think we should leave these decisions to doctors, not you or EPA bureaucrats, don't you?

Yep.. EPA shouldn't be making decisions on inhaler/nebulizer designs. PERIOD..
I led a team designing a nebulizer for CF medication. With a nebulizer, the droplet size is EXCEEDINGLY small and uniform. And this is used in high end (mostly clinical, not home use) drug delivery. Cost of these delivery systems is HIGH because of govt mandated reimbursements -- not cost of manufacture. Our nebulizer had no cost controls because it was designed to admin CF drugs at HOME rather than as out-patient. And therefore the govt reimbursement would be the SAME AMOUNT even if the patient didn't have to sit in a clinic for administration. THUS -- the govt took the efficiency improvement right OUT of the cost equation. Which is why -- costs for common techniques never go down no matter what technical innovations or cost savings are applied...

 

[orogenicman]

The size of the droplets are a product of the design of the venturi used to deliver the medication, not a function of any propellant used.

Right, that's why they use pumps for spray paint. The venturi solely determines droplet size only among pump sprays.

Argue this all you want, but I've used just about every inhaler on the market, and the one I currently use works just fine. So the argument that is being made that Obama is jeopardizing the health of asthma sufferers is simply right wing bullshite, nothing more.

You're basing your claims on your expert medical credentials, right?

I think we should leave these decisions to doctors, not you or EPA bureaucrats, don't you?

Yep.. EPA shouldn't be making decisions on inhaler/nebulizer designs. PERIOD..

And they aren't. International law, of which we are a signatory, is.

I led a team designing a nebulizer for CF medication. With a nebulizer, the droplet size is EXCEEDINGLY small and uniform. And this is used in high end (mostly clinical, not home use) drug delivery. Cost of these delivery systems is HIGH because of govt mandated reimbursements -- not cost of manufacture. Our nebulizer had no cost controls because it was designed to admin CF drugs at HOME rather than as out-patient. And therefore the govt reimbursement would be the SAME AMOUNT even if the patient didn't have to sit in a clinic for administration. THUS -- the govt took the efficiency improvement right OUT of the cost equation. Which is why -- costs for common techniques never go down no matter what technical innovations or cost savings are applied...

I paid $70 for my nebulizer, and pay $12.00/month for the medication. Next.