No such thing as settled science or concensus

Somebody please try and refute NASA facts.

"From the unique vantage point in space, NASA collects critical long-term observations of our changing planet."



"It’s important to remember that scientists always focus on the evidence, not on opinions."

Scientific Consensus


"There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause."

Evidence

VuwfPi_7mR7FiCC0C5EhYLxqI1Qn-NGdMwts_MbgjQ_Av6p-XpxyEwN-NGLa75YyC8HVmTHrZMbnKT9MVQg
'

Why does NASA blur out images from the Moon and Mars?
 
I follow science as much as I can. I don't pretend to be educated in areas of expertise that those were call "experts" are. Otherwise I'd suffer the fate Steve Jobs did when he woke up too late and realized he should've listened to the experts.

I have no political agenda. Through the years I've rarely stepped in this forum on this stuff. But I have observed people like you pushing an ideological and political agenda on this.
What's my ideological and political agenda?
 
Somebody please try and refute NASA facts.

"From the unique vantage point in space, NASA collects critical long-term observations of our changing planet."



"It’s important to remember that scientists always focus on the evidence, not on opinions."

Scientific Consensus


"There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause."

Evidence
I've been discussing evidence. Why does NASA ignore the role the ocean plays in the planet's climate? It's only the largest feature of the planet, contains the vast majority of the planet's heat and is the world's largest collector of solar energy.
 
Somebody please try and refute NASA facts.

"From the unique vantage point in space, NASA collects critical long-term observations of our changing planet."



"It’s important to remember that scientists always focus on the evidence, not on opinions."

Scientific Consensus


"There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause."

Evidence

"There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate

Unprecedented? Never seen before in the history of the Earth?
 
"There is unequivocal evidence that Earth is warming at an unprecedented rate. Human activity is the principal cause."
Definitive proof that that claim is fraudulent.

"...the Eemian was punctuated by many short-lived cold events, as shown by variations in electrical conductivity (a proxy for windblown dust, with more dust indicating colder, more arid conditions) and stable oxygen isotopes (a proxy for air temperature) of the ice were used by these workers infer the climatic conditions during the Eemian. The cold events seemed to last a few thousand years, and the magnitude of cooling was similar to the difference between glacial and interglacial conditions; a very dramatic contrast in climate. Furthermore, the shifts between these warm and cold periods seemed to be extremely rapid, possibly occurring over a few decades or less...."

Sudden climate changes in the recent geological record
 
One of the many reasons sane, rational people reject Manmade Global Warming is that the arrogant dishonest group trying to pass it off as “fact” tells us “the science is settled”

It’s one of the most dishonest, anti- science statements anyone can make. But it does expose the fraud

Here is an article describing how Einstein’s Relativity still hadn’t reached the lofty heights of “settled science”

Study finds black holes made from light are impossible — challenging Einstein's theory of relativity
Here are a couple excerpts from the article to which you linked that appear to me to present a conflict.

'"Even though light does not have mass, it does carry energy," Polo-Gómez said, adding that, in Einstein's theory of general relativity, energy is responsible for creating curvatures in space-time that result in gravitational attractions. "Because of that, it is in principle possible for light to form black holes — if we concentrate enough of it in a small enough volume," he said.'​

This does NOT say that general relativity tells us that a black hole of light may be formed. Only that light curves space time.

"In their study, which has been accepted for publication in the journal Physical Review Letters but has not been published yet, the team calculated the rate at which electron-positron pairs produced in an electromagnetic field would deplete energy. If this rate surpasses the replenishment rate of the electromagnetic field's energy in a given region, a kugelblitz cannot form.​
The team found that, even under the most extreme circumstances, pure light could never reach the required energy threshold to form a black hole."​
This states that as EM energy is concentrated in an attempt to form a kugelblitz, the rate at which electron-positron pairs are formed increases and bleeds off energy. But it adds the qualifier "if this rate surpasses the replenishment rate". The unasked or answered question is what limits the replenishment rate?

"What we prove is that kugelblitze are impossible to form by concentrating light, either artificially in the laboratory or in naturally occurring astrophysical scenarios," study co-author Luis J. Garay, also of IPARCOS, told Live Science.​

This seems to say that the rate of energy lost to the Schwinger Effect's particle pair generation will always exceed what is needed to reach, in effect, the Chadresekhar limit for black hole formation. But IS THAT what they are saying. The following statement:

'"For instance, even if we used the most intense lasers on Earth, we would still be more than 50 orders of magnitude away from the intensity required to create a kugelblitz."'​
This statement does two things that throw some uncertainty on what has been accomplished here. By using the example of the capabilities of humans to create sufficiently intense EM, they have thrown in an artificial limit. And then the phrase "50 orders of magnitude away from the intensity required to create a kugelblitz" indicates there IS an intensity that will create a kugelblitz, but humans, at present, are not technologically capable of reaching it. To my knowledge, there is no technological control of the Schwinger effect and the effect is not mentioned in this last paragraph. They seem to simply be saying that humans cannot currently create a kugelblitz in the lab, not that it is physically impossible to do.

The other option: "in naturally occurring astrophysical scenarios" simply says that we know of no naturally occurring event that could create a kugelblitz. That has two weaknesses. Our knowledge of the universe is finite and it is entirely possible for humans to create conditions that exist - naturally - nowhere else in the universe.

And you have to admit that this article hasn't created any flood of physicists attempting to rewrite general relativity. As you may have noted in the beginning of the article, there is no problem creating a kugelblitz using classic general relativity. The supposed conflict arose when the study authors combined general relativity and quantum mechanics, a combination that decades of physicists and mathematicians have been finding impossible to do.
 
Here are a couple excerpts from the article to which you linked that appear to me to present a conflict.

'"Even though light does not have mass, it does carry energy," Polo-Gómez said, adding that, in Einstein's theory of general relativity, energy is responsible for creating curvatures in space-time that result in gravitational attractions. "Because of that, it is in principle possible for light to form black holes — if we concentrate enough of it in a small enough volume," he said.'​

This does NOT say that general relativity tells us that a black hole of light may be formed. Only that light curves space time.

"In their study, which has been accepted for publication in the journal Physical Review Letters but has not been published yet, the team calculated the rate at which electron-positron pairs produced in an electromagnetic field would deplete energy. If this rate surpasses the replenishment rate of the electromagnetic field's energy in a given region, a kugelblitz cannot form.​
The team found that, even under the most extreme circumstances, pure light could never reach the required energy threshold to form a black hole."​
This states that as EM energy is concentrated in an attempt to form a kugelblitz, the rate at which electron-positron pairs are formed increases and bleeds off energy. But it adds the qualifier "if this rate surpasses the replenishment rate". The unasked or answered question is what limits the replenishment rate?

"What we prove is that kugelblitze are impossible to form by concentrating light, either artificially in the laboratory or in naturally occurring astrophysical scenarios," study co-author Luis J. Garay, also of IPARCOS, told Live Science.​

This seems to say that the rate of energy lost to the Schwinger Effect's particle pair generation will always exceed what is needed to reach, in effect, the Chadresekhar limit for black hole formation. But IS THAT what they are saying. The following statement:

'"For instance, even if we used the most intense lasers on Earth, we would still be more than 50 orders of magnitude away from the intensity required to create a kugelblitz."'​
This statement does two things that throw some uncertainty on what has been accomplished here. By using the example of the capabilities of humans to create sufficiently intense EM, they have thrown in an artificial limit. And then the phrase "50 orders of magnitude away from the intensity required to create a kugelblitz" indicates there IS an intensity that will create a kugelblitz, but humans, at present, are not technologically capable of reaching it. To my knowledge, there is no technological control of the Schwinger effect and the effect is not mentioned in this last paragraph. They seem to simply be saying that humans cannot currently create a kugelblitz in the lab, not that it is physically impossible to do.

The other option: "in naturally occurring astrophysical scenarios" simply says that we know of no naturally occurring event that could create a kugelblitz. That has two weaknesses. Our knowledge of the universe is finite and it is entirely possible for humans to create conditions that exist - naturally - nowhere else in the universe.

And you have to admit that this article hasn't created any flood of physicists attempting to rewrite general relativity. As you may have noted in the beginning of the article, there is no problem creating a kugelblitz using classic general relativity. The supposed conflict arose when the study authors combined general relativity and quantum mechanics, a combination that decades of physicists and mathematicians have been finding impossible to do.

It means after over 100 years, we ARE STILL TESTING AND EXPERIMENTING with Relativity, when AGW cannot show us one single repeatable experiment linking 120PPM of CO2 to temperature
 
Completely stopped! You have "Consensus" and the "Science is settled" remember?
What has probably almost ceased are studies to ascertain whether or not CO2 is responsible for a significant portion of greenhouse warming, whether increased greenhouse effect is responsible for the observed warming and whether humans are responsible for the increased CO2 in the atmosphere. There seems to be plenty more that still needs looking into. If you think any of those points are still in serious question, you do not have an accurate grasp of the state of science or the world's reality.
 
What has probably almost ceased are studies to ascertain whether or not CO2 is responsible for a significant portion of greenhouse warming, whether increased greenhouse effect is responsible for the observed warming and whether humans are responsible for the increased CO2 in the atmosphere. There seems to be plenty more that still needs looking into. If you think any of those points are still in serious question, you do not have an accurate grasp of the state of science or the world's reality.

Let me fix it for you,

because we're a fraudulent Cult, "what has probably almost ceased are studies to ascertain whether or not CO2 is responsible for a significant portion of greenhouse warming"

I question the entire framework and narrative of the Fraudulent AGW Climate "science"

We see now what's at stake and why you all lie and lie, $3 Trillion annually!

That's why we're still testing Relativity, but you claim that your pseudoscience is settled
 
Let me fix it for you,

because we're a fraudulent Cult, "what has probably almost ceased are studies to ascertain whether or not CO2 is responsible for a significant portion of greenhouse warming"

I question the entire framework and narrative of the Fraudulent AGW Climate "science"

We see now what's at stake and why you all lie and lie, $3 Trillion annually!

That's why we're still testing Relativity, but you claim that your pseudoscience is settled
Frank, no one is STOPPING people from investigating whether or not AGW is valid. There's just almost no one that WANTS to waste their time (or money) doing so. You're jousting at windmills Donaldo.
 
Frank, no one is STOPPING people from investigating whether or not AGW is valid. There's just almost no one that WANTS to waste their time (or money) doing so. You're jousting at windmills Donaldo.

Exactly!

They're busy wasting their time (and our money), spreading panic so we'll fall
for more stupid green mandates and wasteful, expensive, less reliable wind and solar.

Because if we don't waste tens of trillions of dollars, harming our economy and
reducing CO2, a tiny bit, while China, India and the third world release more and more, because honestly, that's the only way to improve their lives, who will?
 
THIS Is the state of Science today.





so...suuuuuuuuuuurrre i'm gonna believe this bunch on global warming, blocking the sun, CO2, VACCINES.....right.
 
THIS Is the state of Science today.





so...suuuuuuuuuuurrre i'm gonna believe this bunch on global warming, blocking the sun, CO2, VACCINES.....right.

You believe them on a thousand other things.

Don't act like one has anything to do with the other.
 
Last edited:
You believe them on a thousand other things.

Don't act like one has anything to do with the other.
It goes to his bias which goes to his subjectivity. As near as I can tell he's your average militant atheist. You guys are the worst.
 
To poster Calypso Jones
You believe them on a thousand other things.

Don't act like one has anything to do with the other.
Could it be that your choice of when to believe and when to reject the conclusions of science is based on POLITICS?
 
To poster Calypso Jones

Could it be that your choice of when to believe and when to reject the conclusions of science is based on POLITICS?
THe IPCC report is based upon politics. That's why they don't include any dissenting opinions. So it's hypocritical for you to make that argument.

Don't reply if you agree.
 
Back
Top Bottom