No Special Master As DOJ Drops Bombshell 40 Page Ruling Obstruction By Trump Team

[bodecea]

It's too bad President Trump didn't know someone that could have declassified those documents.

Ya know, I think the shit-eating rodents got him this time. Something about the 3,612th time... I was dreading it.

YOU.STUPID.FUCKING.SHEEP™

DJT is playing 4D chess while you slimy fucks are playing "wrong hole!" with each other. Enjoy the game.

5th Ave. Syndrome.

 

[bodecea]

It’s declassified.

Sure he does. Or, at least that’s what he did. I’m sure your objection is duly noted … somewhere.

So you think. But, try to follow along here: you’re wrong.

So our maintain. But your notion doesn’t make it a fact.

Once again for you libtard cultists; if you were to limit your commentary to saying how it should be done, you’d have a point. But you seem to instead imagine that your baseless declarations somehow convert what Trump did into something he couldn’t do. You remain wrong.

What he did was Sloppy practice. That I grant. But so what? He still did it.

More 5th Ave Syndrome

 

[Harpy Eagle]

The stuff was declassified, there is evidence for that assertion,

Can you provide that evidence?

and it was claimed long before the raid.

But was it claimed prior to leaving the White House?

 

[Seymour Flops]

No, the Security of the Country takes precedence. Illegally handling Classified Material is a threat to the Nation's Safety. The Freedom of Speech is no way threatend, nor is what happened at Shit-A-Lago Freedom of Speech Issue.

The USSC disagrees with you.

 

[BackAgain]

Yes, there has to be some record of it.

Nope. It just has to have been declassified. And there is evidence of that which was known to the FBI and the DOJ long before the raid.

If not then what is the point even?

To declassify it.

How is anyone supposed to know if something is declassified or not?

Normally? Or just in this instance? Normally, you’d be right. That’s why ordinarily there is a procedure for noting such declassification. But in this case, the President made his determination. That’s what’s controlling. Who cares if you know it or not?

I spent many a year working with classified document, to include being a Secondary Control Point Custodian for the 1st Marine Aircraft Wing. I know the rules and the procedures. The president is not above the law, he is not a god.

I’m happy for you. But you’re still ignorant. He need not be above the law. When the President declassifies a document, it’s declassified. The rest is ministerial. He can issue or cause to be issued specific procedures in the normal course of business for such things. Those are for his subordinates. He remains free and authorized to declassify such documents as he sees fit regardless of such procedure.

 

[BackAgain]

Can you provide that evidence?

I did previously. Kash Patel said so. And the DOJ acknowledged as much before the raid.

But was it claimed prior to leaving the White House?

Irrelevant. What is relevant was the declassification before his term ended.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Can you first show me in the US Constitution where it talks about classified documents?

It was the USSC who said it.

Navy vs. Egan (1988)

 

[Marener]

Wrong. He unilaterally can declare a classified document “declassified,” and this imposes on him no duty to release anything.

If the information is “declassified” then the government (which Trump was in charge of) had a duty to release that information to the public under the law.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

I did previously. Kash Patel said so. And the DOJ acknowledged as much before re raid.

He did not say so till after the search. He spoke of a policy that nobody else in the White House knew about and that did not become public till after the search.

What is relevant was the declassification before his term ended.

That is the claim, to which there is no evidence...thus the quandary we are now in.

 

[Harpy Eagle]

It was the USSC who said it.

Navy vs. Egan (1988)

Thanks!

 

[postman]

When a top secret set of papers is first MARKED as classified, it gets so marked and those cool file folder covers are used.

In this case, when the President declassified them, those markings and cool file folder covers didn’t magically get changed. That doesn’t determine if they were still classified, though. What does is the Presidential direction that they are now declassified.

The DOJ is blowing smoke.

Actually NO. they don't become declassified until they're marked declassified.

It's like a birth certificate. Until the bureau of vital records gets the certificate of live birth from the hospital (or midwife, etc) the birth isn't official. It's not official until a birth certificate is issued.

Certificate of Live Birth vs. Birth Certificate | Difference - Lesson | Study.com

Discover the differences between a certificate of live birth and a birth certificate. Learn whether or not a hospital birth certificate is a legal...

study.com

 

[postman]

Wrong. You CHOOSE not to believe it. And I understand that. But your disbelief doesn’t control. The stuff was declassified, there is evidence for that assertion, and it was claimed long before the raid.

This is where the problem begins. Trump said that documents removed from the Oval Office to the White House residence, were automatically declassified. (assume this is true)

Trump also did this, in order to catch up on work (aka homework) of things he didn't finish.

Here's the problem

The documents Trump took back to the residence, were because he didn't have time to read them in the oval office. And taking them to the residence, means he declassified documents he never even read, or even knew about.

Trump having a policy of declassification of documents BEFORE he even reads them can't be a legal policy.

 

[rightwinger]

It’s declassified.

Sure he does. Or, at least that’s what he did. I’m sure your objection is duly noted … somewhere.

So you think. But, try to follow along here: you’re wrong.

So our maintain. But your notion doesn’t make it a fact.

Once again for you libtard cultists; if you were to limit your commentary to saying how it should be done, you’d have a point. But you seem to instead imagine that your baseless declarations somehow convert what Trump did into something he couldn’t do. You remain wrong.

What he did was Sloppy practice. That I grant. But so what? He still did it.

You show no understanding of how our Classification system works
It is a detailed process to classify and declassify information.
It is the informations that is Classified, not the document.

For Trump to declassify information from Top Secret to unclassified is unprecedented and cannot be done lightly

It has Nationwide security implications

 

[toobfreak]

Trump team may have hidden, moved​

Hey Dodo, MAY have moved, hidden? You mean they don't even know for sure and couldn't tell?

Among the most incriminating details in the government filing is a photograph, showing a number of files labeled “Top Secret”

Seems rather odd doesn't it that the FBI should stop to lay out all these important top secret documents on Trump's bedroom floor to take a picture of them? Ever see that done before? How did these agents have the necessary clearance to see and photograph top secrets? Seems rather staged and contrived to me.

Those files were found inside a container in Trump’s office, according to the court filing.

Trump must have left them there while out of town, eh? Too bad, there was no one else in the house to tell us what really happened! The way handled, the FBI could have brought a half-eaten Entenmanns coffee cake there and said Donald stole that too.

A close examination of one of the cover sheets in the photo shows a marking for “HCS,” a government acronym for systems used to protect intelligence gathered from secret human sources.

Do you have a high resolution blow up that we can all see?

The 36-page filing also reveals, for the first time, the text of a written assurance given to the Justice Department by Trump’s “custodian of records” on June 3. It says Trump’s team had done a thorough search for any classified material in response to a subpoena and had turned over any relevant documents.

So then either the stuff wasn't there or the FBI needs to talk to this custodian.

 

[Seymour Flops]

If the information is “declassified” then the government (which Trump was in charge of) had a duty to release that information to the public under the law.

In one of the frequent congressional grillingss of Rod Rosenstein he was asked whether he would release Russia investigation documents if the president declassified them and ordered their release.

He said there still would be law enforcement concerns and would not commit to following the president's directive.

Trump should have fired him that afternoon

 

[Marener]

I'm again impressed that you offer a real argument. Golfing Gator this is how you yourself used to debate before Trump Derangement got the better of you. I hope you'll snap out of it soon.

Two answers:

1) Trump would not have to prove he declassified the documents. He would only need to raise reasonable doubt that they were still classified.

2) that assumes there would ever be a trial. I doubt the DOJ wants a trial. They're not that stupid. I believe that their goal is for Garland to pull a well-timed Comey on Trump by announcing announcing no prosecution after a lengthy recitation of his supposed crimes. That way they can assassinate his character without his having a chance to defend himself.

It was foul when Comey did that to Hillary and Trump was right to fire him for it.

That's their position but I doubt it is what they believe. To a lawyer, that isn't lying, its advocating.

I don't know if reasonable doubt can be reached merely by Trump saying he did so. I don't think it's particularly reasonable to think that he actually wanted all those documents he had squirreled away to become public information, which is what declassification would actually mean. These were top secret government documents including human sources and spy satellite data. Disclosure of the information in these documents (which seems most likely to be contemporary information, not historical) would be basically unprecedented. Doing so without notification of anyone until after the raid seems a little too convenient to be true.

The DoJ filing last night indicates Trump and his lawyers did not tell anyone that these were declassified documents. Not when they sent them to NARA. Not when Jay Bratt picked them up in June. As far as I can tell, Trump has not submitted to any actual authority that these documents were at all declassified.

But as others have pointed out, even if we accept they were declassified, that still does not get Trump out of trouble. The laws that the DoJ cited as justification for the search do not require classified data. Trump still was given a subpoena for all documents bearing classified markings and failed to produce all these documents. That's a pretty significant legal problem.

 

[Marener]

So then either the stuff wasn't there or the FBI needs to talk to this custodian.

That would be Christina Bobb, Trump's lawyer.

Trump's lawyers are going to need lawyers.

 

[Seymour Flops]

You show no understanding of how our Classification system works
It is a detailed process to classify and declassify information.
It is the informations that is Classified, not the document.

For Trump to declassify information from Top Secret to unclassified is unprecedented and cannot be done lightly

It has Nationwide security implications

Just show us the process in the law or the regulations.

 

[BackAgain]

He did not say so till after the search.

Wrong. He said it back in May. And the DOJ acknowledged having heard that contention in their application for the search warrant. I’ve previously listed proof of both of those points.

He spoke of a policy that nobody else in the White House knew about

You don’t know who else knew of it.

and that did not become public till after the search.

Again, you’re are clearly wrong. Even the DOJ told the judge about it before getting the search warrant signed.

That is the claim, to which there is no evidence...thus the quandary we are now in.

Wrong again. You don’t care for the FACT that evidence existed prior to the raid. You may disbelieve Patel. But your assertions are nevertheless demonstrably false. Again.

 

[HaShev]

Among the most incriminating details in the government filing is a photograph, showing a number of files labeled “Top Secret” with bright red or yellow cover sheets, spread out over a carpet. Those files were found inside a container in Trump’s office, according to the court filing. A close examination of one of the cover sheets in the photo shows a marking for “HCS,” a government acronym for systems used to protect intelligence gathered from secret human sources.


The 36-page filing also reveals, for the first time, the text of a written assurance given to the Justice Department by Trump’s “custodian of records” on June 3. It says Trump’s team had done a thorough search for any classified material in response to a subpoena and had turned over any relevant documents.

Trump team may have hidden, moved classified papers, Justice Dept. says — The Washington Post

In response to the Justice Department filing, lawyers for Donald Trump say prosecutors “significantly mischaracterized” some of their interactions with Trump’s representatives.

apple.news

So basically the DOJ claims itself left documents there making themselves guilty of the fake charges they are displacing . BECAUSE THEY HAD EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO RETRIEVE THE DOCUMENTS WHEN THEY WERE THERE, their leaving them makes them guilty-oops.
Ironically the President can leave them in his offices as his privilege, but the DOJ can not
The only obstruction is the DOJ and certain specific bad actors in the FBI covering their hide for their crimes in burying the Joe and Hunter Biden corruption and treason case.
The DOJ and those criminal elements in the FBI used intimidation in retaliation of pursuits on Hunter which will lead to Joe, which is the clear definition of obstruction.
This will just bring more people who left corrupt fascist run countries, over to the party to make sure they don't have to go through that again.