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(COMMENT)Was there ever any possibility that Hamas would come to the table and ask for a realistic set of achievable goals, rather than the impossible?
I think not.
No, our dumbass Administration just had to try its hand at Israeli-Palestinian Diplomacy, just like every other dumbass Administration before it.
So, the Israelis - having long-since mastered this 'wait-out the dumbass American rookies' game - played along.
The Israelis turned-loose a bunch of Palestinian prisoners, and came to the table, and waited for the dumbass Hamas negotiators to go all Intransigent on them again.
This way, when Hamas walks away, the Israelis can say to the dumbass Americans...
"See? We told you this was going to happen. But, did you believe us? No. We've been down this road before. You're new at this, and haven't got a fucking clue. Now, get off our backs, eh? We tried it your way. Your way doesn't work. Now grow up and grow a pair and shut the fuck up already."
Excuse the street-vernacular, but it adds a little spice to the point being made, in this case...
I don't think anyone in the world is expecting any progress in these fake peace talks.
P F Tinmore, et al,
I was not aware that the strategies for negotiation had been released to the public (open domain). I was unaware that the demands for each side had been made know?
(COMMENT)John Kerry is a dumbfuck.
The Palestinians are not asking for any more than they are legally entitled to get.
- How do you know what the Palestinians are asking for in the negotiations?
- What are these terms you are claiming as an entitlement?
- Who guaranteed the entitlement?
The Palestinians are always claiming that they have some right or entitlement for which they use to justify the armed struggle against the UN Recommendation for the establishment of the Jewish State.
Most Respectfully,
R
End the occupation and blockade, that will end the violence.Israel should sterilize Gaza. That's the only way this can end.
That was funny!
Because before the blockade and 'occupation', we were BFF?
(COMMENT)Two-state solution unilaterally imposed by Israel.
No right of return.
Jerusalem Jewish, no division, and capital of Israel.
No negotiation.
So does Israel and you agree with that.Niether do we.
They need to change their leadership.
You don't like the Likud Party any more than I do.
Then die.Two-state solution unilaterally imposed by Israel.
No right of return.
Jerusalem Jewish, no division, and capital of Israel.
No negotiation.
It maintains "effective control" over the area, which satisfies the definition of an "occupation".Israel does not occupy Gaza. Israel left Gaza in August 2005.
An occupation, is not a war.The blockade is legal because Israel and Gaza are at war.
Israel was never at war with the Palestinian's, so why would there be a peace treaty?
Wrong. Israeli tanks rolled into Egypt. That's not a defensive act. That's an offensive act.
And conquer by conquest, has been illegal since the end of WWII.
How many fucking times do I have to correct you on this, before you have the ethical integrity to accept the truth?
Repeating the same garbage lies, will not make this go away.
Alright, fine.
Not all of it. And that's according to the Mandate as well.
Actually, I was referring to your bullshit response.
This isn't about jews.
Israel has occupied the West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem and the Golan Heights, for the last 47 years.
The indigenous arabs jewish terrorists drove out of the area in 1948.
After a half-century, no one on the planet recognizes Israel's right to that land.
Catch the fucking clue!
BTW, Israel's apartheid, is worse than South Africa's was.
Your post. Your claim. You provide the evidence.The Facebook page? Probably in another name although you can search for it.
And in light of all the laws Israel has broken, no one should negotiate with criminals.Hamas are a terrorist group recognized by the world as such. We do not negotiate with terrorists!
John Kerry is a dumbfuck.
The Palestinians are not asking for any more than they are legally entitled to get.
That's a mighty big "IF" there, Jake.RoccoR and Kondor3 have not the muscle nor the will to force an End Game.
If the US-supported Israel decides to end this, it is over. Period. No Arab response can change it in the least.
P F Tinmore, Kondor3, et al,
This may be true. But then, you cannot say that the State of Israel did not try to negotiate a peaceful settlement.
(COMMENT)Was there ever any possibility that Hamas would come to the table and ask for a realistic set of achievable goals, rather than the impossible?
I think not.
No, our dumbass Administration just had to try its hand at Israeli-Palestinian Diplomacy, just like every other dumbass Administration before it.
So, the Israelis - having long-since mastered this 'wait-out the dumbass American rookies' game - played along.
The Israelis turned-loose a bunch of Palestinian prisoners, and came to the table, and waited for the dumbass Hamas negotiators to go all Intransigent on them again.
This way, when Hamas walks away, the Israelis can say to the dumbass Americans...
"See? We told you this was going to happen. But, did you believe us? No. We've been down this road before. You're new at this, and haven't got a fucking clue. Now, get off our backs, eh? We tried it your way. Your way doesn't work. Now grow up and grow a pair and shut the fuck up already."
Excuse the street-vernacular, but it adds a little spice to the point being made, in this case...
I don't think anyone in the world is expecting any progress in these fake peace talks.
But then, given the solemn declaration policy of "ethnic cleansing," and a strategy of Jihad and armed struggle by the Fedayeen, under Article 6, GCIV, the Palestinian holds the key to the closure of military operations. With no negotiated settlement, failed peace talks, the Palestinians are the force behind a continuation of the Occupation.
Most Respectfully,
R
A war is between two army's or military groups, not between the most militarized country on the planet and a population that isn't even allowed to have weapons to defend themselves.Israel and Gaza are at war.
Israel is not engaged in hostilities with the entire population of Gaza, therefore, it cannot possibly be considered a war.Definition of war:
In international armed conflict, combatants are entitled to directly participate in hostilities. In other words, they are permitted to commit lawful acts of war intended to achieve a military goal in the most effective way. The principle of distinction, however, requires that such acts of war be directed only against enemy combatants and military objectives, while preventing unnecessary and excessive damage to civilians.
Did you catch those two words in "red"?Definition of an occupation:
Under IHL, there is occupation when a State exercises an unconsented-to effective control over a territory on which it has no sovereign title. Article 42 of The Hague Regulations of 1907 defines occupation as follows: “Territory is considered occupied when it is actually placed under the authority of the hostile army. The occupation extends only to the territory where such authority has been established and can be exercised.”
I've already ripped your precious Palmer Commission to shreds, so why re-live your ass-kicking?The blockade is legal.
See "effective control" above.Israel does not occupy Gaza!
I've already provided two WHO reports on the humanitarian crisis in Gaza, why do you act like I didn't?The Palestinian controlled areas and Gaza get all they need through legitimate crossings.
A decrease of 80% and you say they get all they need?According to the ICRC:
drastic restrictions on the movement of people and goods imposed by the Israeli authorities, particularly since October 2007, had led to worsening poverty, rising unemployment and deteriorating public services such as health care, water and sanitation.
...restrictions on imports are making it impossible for Gazans to rebuild their lives. The quantities of goods now entering Gaza fall well short of what is required to meet the population's needs. In May 2009, only 2,662 truckloads of goods entered Gaza from Israel, a decrease of almost 80 per cent compared to the 11,392 truckloads allowed in during April 2007, before Hamas took over the territory.
Israel attacked. Period. That started the war.You know full well that had Israel waited for Egypt to get into Israel territory, along with waiting for the other arab countries to get into Israeli territory then Israel would not be able to defend herself, therefore Israel won the war and seeing as it was a defensive war Israel can hold on to the territory captured until negotiations come to a conclusion.
Bullshit!And you would think that especially with media coverage of South Africa you would realize by now that Israel is nowhere near committing apartheid.
That's definitely apartheid!Israel/West Bank: Separate and Unequal
Israeli policies in the West Bank harshly discriminate against Palestinian residents, depriving them of basic necessities while providing lavish amenities for Jewish settlements, Human Rights Watch said in a report released today. The report identifies discriminatory practices that have no legitimate security or other justification and calls on Israel, in addition to abiding by its international legal obligation to withdraw the settlements, to end these violations of Palestinians' rights.
I'll take your word for it, on this issue.The Facebook page in question is Dr.Mousa Abumarzook د.موسى أبو مرزوق
See the rantings of that madman on there.
https://www.facebook.com/mousa.abumarzook
Stand up to what?No matter how much you try and twist and turn your arguments do not stand up.
A war is between two army's or military groups, not between the most militarized country on the planet and a population that isn't even allowed to have weapons to defend themselves.Israel and Gaza are at war.
Israel is not engaged in hostilities with the entire population of Gaza, therefore, it cannot possibly be considered a war.Definition of war:
In international armed conflict, combatants are entitled to directly participate in hostilities. In other words, they are permitted to commit lawful acts of war intended to achieve a military goal in the most effective way. The principle of distinction, however, requires that such acts of war be directed only against enemy combatants and military objectives, while preventing unnecessary and excessive damage to civilians.
It is an occupation...
Did you catch those two words in "red"?
"Effective control" does not require a physical presence to satisfy the definition of an occupation.
I've already ripped your precious Palmer Commission to shreds, so why re-live your ass-kicking?
How is the blockade "not" collective punishment?
Collective punishment is a war crime, which is way more than merely illegal.
See "effective control" above.
I've already provided two WHO reports on the humanitarian crisis in Gaza, why do you act like I didn't?
Here's what the ICRC has to say about the condition in Gaza...
A decrease of 80% and you say they get all they need?
Israel attacked. Period. That started the war.
Bullshit!
That's definitely apartheid!
I'll take your word for it, on this issue.The Facebook page in question is Dr.Mousa Abumarzook د.موسى أبو مرزوق
See the rantings of that madman on there.
https://www.facebook.com/mousa.abumarzook
Stand up to what?No matter how much you try and twist and turn your arguments do not stand up.
All you're doing is repeating the same mantra over and over and over...
That's not an argument, it's a recital!
You didn't even read what I just posted!And you are repeating the same mantra. I am right and you are wrong so we will have to agree to disagree.
You didn't even read what I just posted!And you are repeating the same mantra. I am right and you are wrong so we will have to agree to disagree.
Why are you here? Your mind is made up, so you're not here to debate anything.
All you want to do, is get on a soap box and pontificate.
How could you address them, when you didn't even read them?I addressed your points. You don't agree with them? Tough.
