News Flash: 100% of Americans, every single one, recieves govt assistance.

[bucs90]

So basically, when you all say "takers", you are only referring to welfare, food stamps and unemployment........since I've shown that we ALL benefit from all other government services (give or take a few of course).

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Nope, you can go float that pile of horseshit over in Sweden or some other socialist utopia. It's my tax dollars that are paying for roads and highways. And those firefighters and cops salaries are being paid with my tax dollars. So, in essence, I'm assisting the government. And before you bring up tax credits, it was my money anyway before the govt decided to start parsing it out for their coffers.

Ok. So you think your precious tax dollars aren't giving you more in return?

How much would it cost you to hire your own private police and firemen to protect you and your home, and ONLY you and your home? And to build and maintain roads to your job, school, restaurants, etc, only for you to drive on?

You are getting WAY MORE in return for your tax dollars.

You brought up the argument that we're all receiving govt assistance. I pay them for their services. You would have a point if they were all volunteering at no charge. I would then be indebted to them.

 

[Foxfyre]

Nope, you can go float that pile of horseshit over in Sweden or some other socialist utopia. It's my tax dollars that are paying for roads and highways. And those firefighters and cops salaries are being paid with my tax dollars. So, in essence, I'm assisting the government. And before you bring up tax credits, it was my money anyway before the govt decided to start parsing it out for their coffers.

Ok. So you think your precious tax dollars aren't giving you more in return?

How much would it cost you to hire your own private police and firemen to protect you and your home, and ONLY you and your home? And to build and maintain roads to your job, school, restaurants, etc, only for you to drive on?

You are getting WAY MORE in return for your tax dollars.

When a community starts forming, there is no private police or firemen, no public schools, no water or sewer system, no government organization of any kind. At some point however, when there is sufficient population, the community may vote to share in the cost of a firetruck that is parked in somebody's barn until it is needed. And as the community grows some more, they may vote to put it in a firehouse and train some firemen to use it as a means of reducing their fire insurance premiums. The higher rating of the fire department in your area, the lower your premiums are going to be.

And in time, to protect everybody's water supply, they may vote to install a community water and sewer system, hire a police officer to look after everybody's property, etc. And in time, as the population continues to grow, they may vote to incorporate and form a government to oversee and administrate all these different things so they don't have to take time out of their busy day to do it themselves. They may start a school district or vote to have another district expand into their area so they don't have to homeschool their kids or bus them long distances.

At every step of the way, however, it is a mutually agreed social contract with everybody invested in the cost and the benefits. This is how a free people voluntarily shares burdens and organizes the sort of society they wish to have. And the federal government does not need to be involved in any of the process.

THAT is the difference between people who are governing themselves and a federal government who interferes and attempts to dictate to them HOW they must govern themselves. The federal government, when it oversteps its constitutional boundaries, inevitably begins to be much more focused on sustaining itself than it is focused on producing any measurable results. And in the process will begin to absorb more and more of the money that it pretends to collect for the benefit of all.

 

[Oddball]

Nope, you can go float that pile of horseshit over in Sweden or some other socialist utopia. It's my tax dollars that are paying for roads and highways. And those firefighters and cops salaries are being paid with my tax dollars. So, in essence, I'm assisting the government. And before you bring up tax credits, it was my money anyway before the govt decided to start parsing it out for their coffers.

Ok. So you think your precious tax dollars aren't giving you more in return?

How much would it cost you to hire your own private police and firemen to protect you and your home, and ONLY you and your home? And to build and maintain roads to your job, school, restaurants, etc, only for you to drive on?

You are getting WAY MORE in return for your tax dollars.

I'm paying for gubmint schools and have no children...I'm getting zilch for my "investment".

And don't try to slide that "we all benefit from an education population" chickenshit by me...When I hand a cashier $5.07 for something that costs $4.32 and their eyes glaze over and smoke blows out their ears, it's arguable as to whether the populace is educated.

 

[Rozman]

Government gets money from the people.
The people who pay taxes build the roads and such....

I'm gonna go back to my dinner now...
Must have been a big government Obama supporter that started this topic...

 

[g5000]

We had a balanced federal budget not too long ago.

This means that those people who pay federal taxes were paying not only for their own services, but also paying for the federal services provided to people who pay no federal taxes.

The taxpayers are paying more than their fair share.

QED.

.

 

[WillowTree]

First of all, a national defense is a proper and constitutionally provided federal function...Your nutty opinion that the only thing keeping ravenous hordes from invading America is merely because of the military is so absurd that it deserves no further mention.

Fire and police are locally provided services that are presumably equally available to all....Moreover, police and fire services are a collectivized expression of the individual right to be free from criminal aggression and to safeguard my property should my neighbor's catch fire....The notion that the only thing keeping marauding hordes for burning, looting, pillaging and raping is the existence of police is an equally laughable as your preposterous assertion about the military.

Roads are equally available to all and paid for by fuel taxes and registration fees of those who use them, not as an appendage of the socialistic welfare/redistributionist state.

I have no choice as to whether or not I pay for the monopoly of gubmint schools....They are a defacto welfare program for the middle class....And, like all other welfare programs, they are wasteful, inefficient and fall far short of their promises to deliver the goods...It's amusing that you'd try to bring them up.

Now, you'd better get to cleaning all them red herrings, before they get to smellin' too bad.

Are there any other kind of schools besides "gubmint" schools for the average family? Do any other major nations have other than public schools for their people?

No. He'd rather just say "Fuck poor people" and only have private schools. If they cant afford it...fuck 'em. ALTHOUGH.....it was the precious founders who started the idea of a community school. Those damn commies!!!!!

Hey asshole. The Republican are all for the voucher program which would allow poor children access to private or charter schools the democrats are against it. Know why? FUCKING TEACHERS UNIONS THAT'S WHY. NOW STICK YOU HEAD BACK UP YOUR ASS.

 

[bucs90]

My whole point was...we all benefit in some way from the government. That is unquestioned.

It seems the "makers" vs "takers" are pissed about basically: Welfare, unemployment, food stamps, free govt housing (except for the military).

So, how would you all suggest we fix this problem? Rather than bitch on USMB about "makers vs takers"?

That was the point of my OP. And I didn't realize how ingrained the bitterness and stupidity was.

 

[WillowTree]

So basically, when you all say "takers", you are only referring to welfare, food stamps and unemployment........since I've shown that we ALL benefit from all other government services (give or take a few of course).

free phones, free rent, etc etc etc.

 

[Ernie S.]

Im so sick of this shit: "Makers" vs "Takers". People need to check their ego and realize they aren't some Knight of The Taxpayers Order or anything special.

Here is what EVERY American recieves from the government, aka, government assistance:

- You werent/aren't being invaded/attacked by The Soviet Union, Nazis, Cuba, China, North Korea because of the Federal Military's protection. Thats government workers, assisting you in your comfortable life.

- You aren't being murdered/raped/robbed, and neither is your family or your home, because there are Federal, State and City cops protecting you 24/7. Theres a reason the Bloods, Crips and OWS'ers aren't storming the gates of the local gated country club to steal your shit and rape your women. Cuz govt workers are there to stop them, arrest them.

- Your home's insurance rates are lower...and home is safer...because of a local fire department. If the Fire Department recieves the highest class rating (Class 3 I believe) then YOUR home insurance rates go down. Not to mention ALL full time fire depts have paramedics on staff, who provide on-scene first medical care, and if you dont need to be transported, it saves you a trip to the ER (and thus, a hit on your insurance). So when the rich lady in the pearly gates of Flowing Meadows Country Club has chest pain, the local FD arrives, determines it's not serious, and she gets off with no medical bill. Same for poor folk.


- You drive to work on safe roads. The goods your business ships in or out do so on safe roads. Thats because of cops and work crews. Unless you own a road building/paving company, you are getting assistance from the government.

- You have public schools to send your brats to. That saves you a shit load of money from not having to pay for private school. AND...it allows you to hire workers with education. Your family and business benefit from the existence of government schools.

- You enjoy a safety net should you fail in your business. Heck, just the idea that failing means bankruptcy and a safety net (rather than starvation and despair) means you can take a few more risks than people in...say...countries without a safety net. Even if you never use that safety net, its there, and your peace of mind in knowing it's there causes you less stress, and probably is why some take more business risks here. Failing in America means an apartment and a Hyundai, not starvation and a cardboard box.




All you holier-than-thou motherfuckers bitching about "Theres only makers and takers" need to shut the f**k up, spoiled assholes.

Yup we all get that, but only some, don't have to pay fot it.
I don't get section 8 housing, food stamps, free dairy products, school or an EBT card. I just pay through the nose so you can have those things.

 

[WillowTree]

My whole point was...we all benefit in some way from the government. That is unquestioned.

It seems the "makers" vs "takers" are pissed about basically: Welfare, unemployment, food stamps, free govt housing (except for the military).

So, how would you all suggest we fix this problem? Rather than bitch on USMB about "makers vs takers"?

That was the point of my OP. And I didn't realize how ingrained the bitterness and stupidity was.

fair flat tax, no exemptions, no exceptions, no excuses. end all class, race and economic warfare.

 

[Stephanie]

Nope, you can go float that pile of horseshit over in Sweden or some other socialist utopia. It's my tax dollars that are paying for roads and highways. And those firefighters and cops salaries are being paid with my tax dollars. So, in essence, I'm assisting the government. And before you bring up tax credits, it was my money anyway before the govt decided to start parsing it out for their coffers.

Ok. So you think your precious tax dollars aren't giving you more in return?

How much would it cost you to hire your own private police and firemen to protect you and your home, and ONLY you and your home? And to build and maintain roads to your job, school, restaurants, etc, only for you to drive on?

You are getting WAY MORE in return for your tax dollars.

I'm paying for gubmint schools and have no children...I'm getting zilch for my "investment".

And don't try to slide that "we all benefit from an education population" chickenshit by me...When I hand a cashier $5.07 for something that costs $4.32 and their eyes glaze over and smoke blows out their ears, it's arguable as to whether the populace is educated.

 

[Freewill]

Im so sick of this shit: "Makers" vs "Takers". People need to check their ego and realize they aren't some Knight of The Taxpayers Order or anything special.

Here is what EVERY American recieves from the government, aka, government assistance:

- You werent/aren't being invaded/attacked by The Soviet Union, Nazis, Cuba, China, North Korea because of the Federal Military's protection. Thats government workers, assisting you in your comfortable life.

- You aren't being murdered/raped/robbed, and neither is your family or your home, because there are Federal, State and City cops protecting you 24/7. Theres a reason the Bloods, Crips and OWS'ers aren't storming the gates of the local gated country club to steal your shit and rape your women. Cuz govt workers are there to stop them, arrest them.

- Your home's insurance rates are lower...and home is safer...because of a local fire department. If the Fire Department recieves the highest class rating (Class 3 I believe) then YOUR home insurance rates go down. Not to mention ALL full time fire depts have paramedics on staff, who provide on-scene first medical care, and if you dont need to be transported, it saves you a trip to the ER (and thus, a hit on your insurance). So when the rich lady in the pearly gates of Flowing Meadows Country Club has chest pain, the local FD arrives, determines it's not serious, and she gets off with no medical bill. Same for poor folk.


- You drive to work on safe roads. The goods your business ships in or out do so on safe roads. Thats because of cops and work crews. Unless you own a road building/paving company, you are getting assistance from the government.

- You have public schools to send your brats to. That saves you a shit load of money from not having to pay for private school. AND...it allows you to hire workers with education. Your family and business benefit from the existence of government schools.

- You enjoy a safety net should you fail in your business. Heck, just the idea that failing means bankruptcy and a safety net (rather than starvation and despair) means you can take a few more risks than people in...say...countries without a safety net. Even if you never use that safety net, its there, and your peace of mind in knowing it's there causes you less stress, and probably is why some take more business risks here. Failing in America means an apartment and a Hyundai, not starvation and a cardboard box.




All you holier-than-thou motherfuckers bitching about "Theres only makers and takers" need to shut the f**k up, spoiled assholes.

If you are serious you are obviously a taker not a maker. All of what you spew above I paid for. Not one of those things did I get free. You are definitely warped if you think you get shit for free. Of course being a taker you probably do get shit for free I DON'T. So stop with you high and mighty BS as if the government isn't dependent on what the MAKERS pay into it or debt heaped upon your grandchildren. So you shut the F...K up you woohsey moocher. Nothing is free moocher the government got the money from someone, just not from the takers.

 

[bucs90]

Are there any other kind of schools besides "gubmint" schools for the average family? Do any other major nations have other than public schools for their people?

No. He'd rather just say "Fuck poor people" and only have private schools. If they cant afford it...fuck 'em. ALTHOUGH.....it was the precious founders who started the idea of a community school. Those damn commies!!!!!

Hey asshole. The Republican are all for the voucher program which would allow poor children access to private or charter schools the democrats are against it. Know why? FUCKING TEACHERS UNIONS THAT'S WHY. NOW STICK YOU HEAD BACK UP YOUR ASS.

Well...the only problem is....those kids in the ghettos are probably there because they have shitty, lazy, stupid thug parents who are irresponsible. And you wanna put a voucher in their hands to determine that kids future?

The welfare state wont be solved with handouts, or by taking them away. Only a generational culture and parenting change will. You all are looking in the roof to find a way to fix the plumbing.

 

[jasonnfree]

Im so sick of this shit: "Makers" vs "Takers". People need to check their ego and realize they aren't some Knight of The Taxpayers Order or anything special.

Here is what EVERY American recieves from the government, aka, government assistance:

- You werent/aren't being invaded/attacked by The Soviet Union, Nazis, Cuba, China, North Korea because of the Federal Military's protection. Thats government workers, assisting you in your comfortable life.

- You aren't being murdered/raped/robbed, and neither is your family or your home, because there are Federal, State and City cops protecting you 24/7. Theres a reason the Bloods, Crips and OWS'ers aren't storming the gates of the local gated country club to steal your shit and rape your women. Cuz govt workers are there to stop them, arrest them.

- Your home's insurance rates are lower...and home is safer...because of a local fire department. If the Fire Department recieves the highest class rating (Class 3 I believe) then YOUR home insurance rates go down. Not to mention ALL full time fire depts have paramedics on staff, who provide on-scene first medical care, and if you dont need to be transported, it saves you a trip to the ER (and thus, a hit on your insurance). So when the rich lady in the pearly gates of Flowing Meadows Country Club has chest pain, the local FD arrives, determines it's not serious, and she gets off with no medical bill. Same for poor folk.


- You drive to work on safe roads. The goods your business ships in or out do so on safe roads. Thats because of cops and work crews. Unless you own a road building/paving company, you are getting assistance from the government.

- You have public schools to send your brats to. That saves you a shit load of money from not having to pay for private school. AND...it allows you to hire workers with education. Your family and business benefit from the existence of government schools.

- You enjoy a safety net should you fail in your business. Heck, just the idea that failing means bankruptcy and a safety net (rather than starvation and despair) means you can take a few more risks than people in...say...countries without a safety net. Even if you never use that safety net, its there, and your peace of mind in knowing it's there causes you less stress, and probably is why some take more business risks here. Failing in America means an apartment and a Hyundai, not starvation and a cardboard box.




All you holier-than-thou motherfuckers bitching about "Theres only makers and takers" need to shut the f**k up, spoiled assholes.

I pay for those services. Too many Americans do not.

Understand now, dipshit?

I also served in the military for 20 years, so I am the reason you have not been invaded by the USSR.

.

Every American who makes 1 purchase a year pays sales tax. Most municipal services are paid for through sales tax, property tax, hospitality tax. Sure...the people living in rat infested shitholes with no joy, like the Atlanta ghettos, dont pay much. Do you envy them?

I served as a cop in ATL in those ghettos. The rich folks and middle class folks in the Buckead area and other suburbs weren't raped, robbed, murdered by those animals because of the PD.

The USSR was a thread. Ghetto thugs are a threat. There are layers of govt for the different layers of threats.

BTW, nice arrogant attitude with "I am the reason" we weren't invaded. Sure, whatever Rambo. Im sure you and you alone stopped the USSR.

What you may not know...and any cop who has worked in a major city will agree....is that the welfare and food stamps...aren't for helping those people. Its to prevent mass violence. Government contains those people in their neighborhoods, gives enough handouts to simply keep them civil enough not to threaten the suburbs with mass violence. Fair? No. Effective? Well, yeah. Unless you have a better plan. Sure..."Lead a horse to water". Sounds great. Spend a few days working those neighborhoods, and you'll see the truth reality, up close, after dark. I'd love to see the culture changes where they can be led to water. But it aint happening for DECADES. Its too ingrained. Cutoff the welfare shit, and we'll have mass violence, sadly. I dont have a better answer. Do you? Or are you too busy single handedly stopping China from invading us?

The welfare and food stamps and section 8 etc. also help the young children who had no choice where they were born. The majority of them turn out good thanks to government assistance. People should travel and see some of the real ghettos in other countries where kids have no opportunities like this. I'd rather pay for welfare, food stamps etc. because I think it gives kids a chance. Also it's cheaper and safer (and humane) than having kids end up in the detention system where it costs more per prison than the cost of welfare. In California the cost per prisoner is over $40k per year.

 

[Oddball]

My whole point was...we all benefit in some way from the government. That is unquestioned.

It seems the "makers" vs "takers" are pissed about basically: Welfare, unemployment, food stamps, free govt housing (except for the military).

So, how would you all suggest we fix this problem? Rather than bitch on USMB about "makers vs takers"?

That was the point of my OP. And I didn't realize how ingrained the bitterness and stupidity was.

There's a difference between services that are equally paid for and available to all, and confiscation and redistribution.

Your OP had no point....It's just a meltdown of preposterous chickenshit red herrings that lolberals toss around to pretend that they have a point.

 

[OKTexas]

You just run on over to Chicago and tell the folks that are being killed there every day how well they are being protected...............oh wait,....................you can't............they're freaking dead. Ain't it great how effective government is?

You will never grasp the reality of neighborhood like that. You've never spent time in them.

The govt (cops) job in those places is NOT to protect those people from each other. Thats a lost cause without generational parenting changes.

Their job is to protect YOU from those people. To contain it. And drop enough handouts to keep the violence contained in those areas.

Why do you think the social engineers warehouse the poor in areas like the neighborhoods you describe. It's all about control, there won't be a major parenting change because the educational systems are vested in maintaing the status quo. Do you really think the major populations centers voting the way they did was an accident. Concentrating poverty in dense areas was and is continuing for a reason, and unfortuanately it's working. If you look at the long term plans of the left, further concentration of the population is their intention. If they get their way we will all be living in population centers while the powerful lives on estates away form the unwashed masses. So keep drinking the kool aid of the central planners and you will have the well structured life you seem to aspire to, just like the folks in any prision.

 

[bucs90]

Im so sick of this shit: "Makers" vs "Takers". People need to check their ego and realize they aren't some Knight of The Taxpayers Order or anything special.

Here is what EVERY American recieves from the government, aka, government assistance:

- You werent/aren't being invaded/attacked by The Soviet Union, Nazis, Cuba, China, North Korea because of the Federal Military's protection. Thats government workers, assisting you in your comfortable life.

- You aren't being murdered/raped/robbed, and neither is your family or your home, because there are Federal, State and City cops protecting you 24/7. Theres a reason the Bloods, Crips and OWS'ers aren't storming the gates of the local gated country club to steal your shit and rape your women. Cuz govt workers are there to stop them, arrest them.

- Your home's insurance rates are lower...and home is safer...because of a local fire department. If the Fire Department recieves the highest class rating (Class 3 I believe) then YOUR home insurance rates go down. Not to mention ALL full time fire depts have paramedics on staff, who provide on-scene first medical care, and if you dont need to be transported, it saves you a trip to the ER (and thus, a hit on your insurance). So when the rich lady in the pearly gates of Flowing Meadows Country Club has chest pain, the local FD arrives, determines it's not serious, and she gets off with no medical bill. Same for poor folk.


- You drive to work on safe roads. The goods your business ships in or out do so on safe roads. Thats because of cops and work crews. Unless you own a road building/paving company, you are getting assistance from the government.

- You have public schools to send your brats to. That saves you a shit load of money from not having to pay for private school. AND...it allows you to hire workers with education. Your family and business benefit from the existence of government schools.

- You enjoy a safety net should you fail in your business. Heck, just the idea that failing means bankruptcy and a safety net (rather than starvation and despair) means you can take a few more risks than people in...say...countries without a safety net. Even if you never use that safety net, its there, and your peace of mind in knowing it's there causes you less stress, and probably is why some take more business risks here. Failing in America means an apartment and a Hyundai, not starvation and a cardboard box.




All you holier-than-thou motherfuckers bitching about "Theres only makers and takers" need to shut the f**k up, spoiled assholes.

If you are serious you are obviously a taker not a maker. All of what you spew above I paid for. Not one of those things did I get free. You are definitely warped if you think you get shit for free. Of course being a taker you probably do get shit for free I DON'T. So stop with you high and mighty BS as if the government isn't dependent on what the MAKERS pay into it or debt heaped upon your grandchildren. So you shut the F...K up you woohsey moocher. Nothing is free moocher the government got the money from someone, just not from the takers.

I am serious. And my point was there isn't a "makers" vs "takers" divide. People are so intent on dividing our population into groups to hate each other. We ALL give and take, to different extents. We should root out fraud from the system, no doubt.

Im just sick of the bitterness and hateful attitudes from people who are on a soap box and think anyone who makes less money than they do is some sort of subhuman parasite.

But of course...that attitude just lost an election.

 

[shintao]

How many people don't pay for what services? Huh dumbass?

Thank gawd you served. Did you get free meals, clothes, a roof over your head, etc. from the government. You know you could have went AWOL like Bush and refused those government handouts, but no, you chose to take them as long as they were free.

Wow. The retardation is deep around here.

The housing and food were part of the compensation for serving, dipshit. It wasn't free.

So if you want to make welfare recipients serve on the line for all the free shit they get, I'm all for it!


.


.

Did you pay for it? NO? Then it wasn't free dumbass. Welfare? Lets start with Wall Street & bankers & CEOs, you know, the BIG MOOCHERS first dude. Kind of Prioritize before we send the welfare children & Ryan overseas. OK?

 

[WillowTree]

No. He'd rather just say "Fuck poor people" and only have private schools. If they cant afford it...fuck 'em. ALTHOUGH.....it was the precious founders who started the idea of a community school. Those damn commies!!!!!

Hey asshole. The Republican are all for the voucher program which would allow poor children access to private or charter schools the democrats are against it. Know why? FUCKING TEACHERS UNIONS THAT'S WHY. NOW STICK YOU HEAD BACK UP YOUR ASS.

Well...the only problem is....those kids in the ghettos are probably there because they have shitty, lazy, stupid thug parents who are irresponsible. And you wanna put a voucher in their hands to determine that kids future?

The welfare state wont be solved with handouts, or by taking them away. Only a generational culture and parenting change will. You all are looking in the roof to find a way to fix the plumbing.

I don't want to fix the stupid problem. Let the asshole who are rotten fucking parents grow the fuck up and fix their own damn problems.