New Year’s Resolutions For Climate Scientists

[daveman]

Arctic Sea Ice Gone in Summer Within Five Years?

Just last year two top scientists surprised their colleagues by projecting that the Arctic sea ice was melting so rapidly that it could disappear entirely by the summer of 2040.

This week, after reviewing his own new data, NASA climate scientist Jay Zwally said: "At this rate, the Arctic Ocean could be nearly ice-free at the end of summer by 2012, much faster than previous predictions."

So scientists in recent days have been asking themselves these questions: Was the record melt seen all over the Arctic in 2007 a blip amid relentless and steady warming? Or has everything sped up to a new climate cycle that goes beyond the worst case scenarios presented by computer models?

"The Arctic is often cited as the canary in the coal mine for climate warming," said Zwally, who as a teenager hauled coal. "Now as a sign of climate warming, the canary has died. It is time to start getting out of the coal mines."

Fear-monger much?

 

[RollingThunder]

Here's the raw satellite data that shows no warming in the Arctic for the last seven years. It's basically flatlined. I suggest you take it up with them.

This is typical of the level of "logic" employed by CON$. The Arctic is now the whole globe if it supports global cooling. But the Arctic will not be the globe if it shows warming.

ClimateWatch Magazine » Arctic Warming Exceeds Global Average

This past year (October 2010-September 2011), surface temperatures in the Arctic were 1.5 degrees Celsius warmer than average. The image above shows where average air temperatures were up to 3 degrees Celsius above (red) or below (blue) the long-term average (1981-2010).

The Arctic’s 1.5-degree surface temperature anomaly was larger than the global average anomaly. This difference confirms what global climate models were projecting as far back as thirty years ago: that the Arctic region would warm faster than the rest of the planet due to long-term climate change.

The past six years in the northern polar region (above 60°N in the Northern Hemisphere) have been the warmest in the historical record. The city of Barrow, located in the northernmost region of Alaska, had a record summer run of 86 consecutive days with minimum temperatures at or above freezing beginning on June 30. The previous record was 68 days set in 2009. The city of Fairbanks may be experiencing record-breaking frigid temperatures in recent weeks, but last year, the city experienced its first fall freeze more than two weeks later than its long-term average—for the sixth consecutive year.

Ummmm, I hate to point out a fact to one such as you...but it is YOUR side that claims the Arctic is the "canary in the coal mine".

Take it up with your high priests.

"Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine
By Stephen Leahy

QUEBEC CITY, Canada, Dec 12, 2008 (IPS) - Nearly 1,000 scientists and representatives of indigenous peoples from 16 countries have braved a major winter storm to share their findings and concerns about the rapidly warming Arctic region at the International Arctic Change conference in Quebec City.

The Arctic is "ground zero" for climate change, with temperatures rising far faster than anywhere else on the planet. Some predict an ice-free summer Arctic in less than five to 10 years - the first time the Arctic Ocean will be exposed to the sun in many hundreds of thousands of years.

The speed of change has scientists scrambling to understand the impacts on indigenous people, wildlife and ecology.

"The Arctic will be full of future surprises," said David Carlson, an oceanographer and director of the International Polar Year programme office.

"Protected by its cover of sea ice, the Arctic Ocean is the last unblemished ocean on the planet," Carlson told IPS."

CLIMATE CHANGE: Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine - IPS ipsnews.net

LOLOLOL....oh, walleyed, the one time you post some accurate information, you're too retarded to believe that it is accurate, you poor boob. You wouldn't understand "raw data" if it bit you. The ice itself is the best 'thermometer' and the ice is melting and the melting is accelerating. The ice extent is already far below the historical minimums for the last many thousands of years and the ice cover is far thinner and more vulnerable to summer melting. Did you already 'forget' the graph I posted in post #60 that demolished your previous idiotic claims about the Arctic ice? Do you need to look at it again? Perhaps you should watch various prominent scientists and Navy Admirals explain what is going on in the Arctic in this video.

Monthly Deviations of Sea Ice Area in the Arctic from merged SMMR and SSMI Data (NORSEX algorithm) (Copyright: NERSC and NIERSC)
Arctic Regional Ocean Observing System

(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wbzK4v7GsM&feature=player_embedded]Watts Up with Sea Ice? - YouTube[/ame]

 

[westwall]

This is typical of the level of "logic" employed by CON$. The Arctic is now the whole globe if it supports global cooling. But the Arctic will not be the globe if it shows warming.

ClimateWatch Magazine » Arctic Warming Exceeds Global Average

This past year (October 2010-September 2011), surface temperatures in the Arctic were 1.5 degrees Celsius warmer than average. The image above shows where average air temperatures were up to 3 degrees Celsius above (red) or below (blue) the long-term average (1981-2010).

The Arctic’s 1.5-degree surface temperature anomaly was larger than the global average anomaly. This difference confirms what global climate models were projecting as far back as thirty years ago: that the Arctic region would warm faster than the rest of the planet due to long-term climate change.

The past six years in the northern polar region (above 60°N in the Northern Hemisphere) have been the warmest in the historical record. The city of Barrow, located in the northernmost region of Alaska, had a record summer run of 86 consecutive days with minimum temperatures at or above freezing beginning on June 30. The previous record was 68 days set in 2009. The city of Fairbanks may be experiencing record-breaking frigid temperatures in recent weeks, but last year, the city experienced its first fall freeze more than two weeks later than its long-term average—for the sixth consecutive year.

Ummmm, I hate to point out a fact to one such as you...but it is YOUR side that claims the Arctic is the "canary in the coal mine".

Take it up with your high priests.

"Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine
By Stephen Leahy

QUEBEC CITY, Canada, Dec 12, 2008 (IPS) - Nearly 1,000 scientists and representatives of indigenous peoples from 16 countries have braved a major winter storm to share their findings and concerns about the rapidly warming Arctic region at the International Arctic Change conference in Quebec City.

The Arctic is "ground zero" for climate change, with temperatures rising far faster than anywhere else on the planet. Some predict an ice-free summer Arctic in less than five to 10 years - the first time the Arctic Ocean will be exposed to the sun in many hundreds of thousands of years.

The speed of change has scientists scrambling to understand the impacts on indigenous people, wildlife and ecology.

"The Arctic will be full of future surprises," said David Carlson, an oceanographer and director of the International Polar Year programme office.

"Protected by its cover of sea ice, the Arctic Ocean is the last unblemished ocean on the planet," Carlson told IPS."

CLIMATE CHANGE: Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine - IPS ipsnews.net

LOLOLOL....oh, walleyed, the one time you post some accurate information, you're too retarded to believe that it is accurate, you poor boob. You wouldn't understand "raw data" if it bit you. The ice itself is the best 'thermometer' and the ice is melting and the melting is accelerating. The ice extent is already far below the historical minimums for the last many thousands of years and the ice cover is far thinner and more vulnerable to summer melting. Did you already 'forget' the graph I posted in post #60 that demolished your previous idiotic claims about the Arctic ice? Do you need to look at it again? Perhaps you should watch various prominent scientists and Navy Admirals explain what is going on in the Arctic in this video.

Monthly Deviations of Sea Ice Area in the Arctic from merged SMMR and SSMI Data (NORSEX algorithm) (Copyright: NERSC and NIERSC)
Arctic Regional Ocean Observing System

(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wbzK4v7GsM&feature=player_embedded]Watts Up with Sea Ice? - YouTube[/ame]

Sure thing silly person. Here's the current arctic ice extent. The winter has barely begun.
You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting reading.

 

[RollingThunder]

Ummmm, I hate to point out a fact to one such as you...but it is YOUR side that claims the Arctic is the "canary in the coal mine".

Take it up with your high priests.

"Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine
By Stephen Leahy

QUEBEC CITY, Canada, Dec 12, 2008 (IPS) - Nearly 1,000 scientists and representatives of indigenous peoples from 16 countries have braved a major winter storm to share their findings and concerns about the rapidly warming Arctic region at the International Arctic Change conference in Quebec City.

The Arctic is "ground zero" for climate change, with temperatures rising far faster than anywhere else on the planet. Some predict an ice-free summer Arctic in less than five to 10 years - the first time the Arctic Ocean will be exposed to the sun in many hundreds of thousands of years.

The speed of change has scientists scrambling to understand the impacts on indigenous people, wildlife and ecology.

"The Arctic will be full of future surprises," said David Carlson, an oceanographer and director of the International Polar Year programme office.

"Protected by its cover of sea ice, the Arctic Ocean is the last unblemished ocean on the planet," Carlson told IPS."

CLIMATE CHANGE: Arctic Is the Canary in the Coalmine - IPS ipsnews.net

LOLOLOL....oh, walleyed, the one time you post some accurate information, you're too retarded to believe that it is accurate, you poor boob. You wouldn't understand "raw data" if it bit you. The ice itself is the best 'thermometer' and the ice is melting and the melting is accelerating. The ice extent is already far below the historical minimums for the last many thousands of years and the ice cover is far thinner and more vulnerable to summer melting. Did you already 'forget' the graph I posted in post #60 that demolished your previous idiotic claims about the Arctic ice? Do you need to look at it again? Perhaps you should watch various prominent scientists and Navy Admirals explain what is going on in the Arctic in this video.

Monthly Deviations of Sea Ice Area in the Arctic from merged SMMR and SSMI Data (NORSEX algorithm) (Copyright: NERSC and NIERSC)
Arctic Regional Ocean Observing System

(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wbzK4v7GsM&feature=player_embedded]Watts Up with Sea Ice? - YouTube[/ame]

Sure thing silly person.

"Sure thing" what, nitwit? We both know you're too lost in your cultic delusions and myths to have actually watched that video without your head exploding so.....

Here's the current arctic ice extent. The winter has barely begun.

LOLOLOL....wow.....Arctic ice grows in the winter....big news there....better tell the scientists who've studied the Arctic for decades, walleyed. The ice grows in the winter months and melts back in the summer. Every summer for the last four decades or so, it has been melting more and more. What about all that escapes you? Everything, I suppose, given how extremely clueless you are.

Here's the actual current state of the Arctic from the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center, whose graph you used without any understanding of what it means.

Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis
Wednesday 4th January 2012

Overview of conditions

Average ice extent for November 2011 was 10.01 million square kilometers (3.86 million square miles), 1.30 million square kilometers (502,000 square miles) below the 1979 to 2000 average. This was 170,000 square kilometers (66,000 square miles) above the average for November 2006, the lowest extent recorded for that month in the satellite data record.

At the end of November, ice extent remained below the 1979 to 2000 average in the Chukchi, Barents and Kara seas, and Hudson Bay was still nearly ice free. Ice extent was near average in the East Greenland and the Bering seas. These ice conditions may be connected to a strong positive phase of the Arctic Oscillation, which began during the last week of November. A positive Arctic Oscillation tends to help move ice out of Fram Strait and into the North Atlantic.

Conditions in context

The Arctic sea ice cover grew at an average pace through November, despite a brief slowdown early in the month. However, the ice extent remained far below average. Overall, the Arctic gained 2.36 million square kilometers (911,000 square miles) of ice during the month, which was slightly more than the average ice gain for November of 2.13 million square kilometers (822,000 square miles). On November 30, Arctic sea ice extent was 10.85 million square kilometers (4.19 million square miles), 625,000 square kilometers (241,000 square miles) more than the ice extent on November 30, 2006, the lowest extent on November 30 in the satellite record.

November 2011 compared to past years

Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010. The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average.

Figure 3. Monthly November ice extent for 1979 to 2011 shows a decline of 4.7% per decade. (—Credit: National Snow and Ice Data Center)

You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting(sic) reading.

If the ice is melting and it is, then I don't "have to explain" squat, moron. Reality is what it is and it doesn't require us to understand it or explain it for it to happen anyway. Our understanding of the world is shaped by the reality of it, not the other way around, as you seem to idiotically imagine. Since the Arctic ice cap is floating sea ice and the ocean temperatures are also increasing, along with the atmospheric temperatures, it is hardly surprising that there is increasing ice melt. But the myths of your cult probably won't let you understand that.

 

[bripat9643]

Home

Real scientists with real concerns, not internet wannabees.

So ocean inundation of the clathrates 8000 years ago is causing massive outgassing at just the time that the sea ice is disappearing at present. We have good record of the amount of CH4 in the atmosphere for the last 8000 years and it has never been above 1000 ppb, let alone 1800 ppb. And rising more rapidly now.

What instruments did we have available to measure CH4 8000 years ago?

 

[bripat9643]

Arctic Sea Ice Gone in Summer Within Five Years?

Just last year two top scientists surprised their colleagues by projecting that the Arctic sea ice was melting so rapidly that it could disappear entirely by the summer of 2040.

Yeah, I remember when Algore said all the sea ice would be gone by 2014. These hysterical warnings aren't fooling anyone.

This week, after reviewing his own new data, NASA climate scientist Jay Zwally said: "At this rate, the Arctic Ocean could be nearly ice-free at the end of summer by 2012, much faster than previous predictions."

That's this summer. What are the odds, do you suppose, of this hysteria coming true?

So scientists in recent days have been asking themselves these questions: Was the record melt seen all over the Arctic in 2007 a blip amid relentless and steady warming? Or has everything sped up to a new climate cycle that goes beyond the worst case scenarios presented by computer models?

"The Arctic is often cited as the canary in the coal mine for climate warming," said Zwally, who as a teenager hauled coal. "Now as a sign of climate warming, the canary has died. It is time to start getting out of the coal mines."

More hysteria.

 

[bripat9643]

Sure thing silly person. Here's the current arctic ice extent. The winter has barely begun.
You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting reading.

Notice that he claims they have 8000 years of data, but he never posts more than the last 30 years.

 

[IanC]

I will admit that warming has been much slower than we expected obviously true
I will admit that recent sea level rise is nothing unusual or threatening tide gauges at 2mm/yr, satellites (measuring previously unmeasured open ocean) holding steady at 3mm/yr since they started, no catastrophic rise
I will admit that our forecasts of declining snow cover were wrong exaggerated claims of snow being relegated to history books has been proven false
I will admit that Arctic temperatures are cyclical, and that we have no idea what will happen to Arctic ice over the next 50 years unproven either way but there sure has been a lot of unsubstantiated speculation
I will admit that our forecasts of Antarctic warming have been a total failure. it realy pisses me off that the latest IPCC report is referencing Steig's Nature paper on Antarctica but ignoring the O'Donnell rebuttal paper
I will admit that Polar Bear populations are not threatened repeating the lie over and over again doesnt make it true
I will admit that climate models have demonstrated no skill, and are nothing more than research projects it is incredible that climate models were considered reliable predictors in the IPCC reports
I will admit there was a Medieval Warm Period how did one distorted and dishonest paper overturn written history?
I will admit that that there was a Little Ice Age see above
I will stop pretending that we don&#8217;t have climate records prior to 1970 ?? presumably directed at claims for <warmest, worst, etc> ever, that only use recent data
I will admit that the surface temperature record has been manipulated and is contaminated by UHIobviously true that the data sets have been manipulated, obviously true that UHI and imperious surfaces affect temps, not obvious what the real corrections should be
I will stop making up data where none exists could be many things but I think this pertains to infilling and averaging temps for unmeasured grid cells. the numerous and precise temperature readings in the continental US count the same as the practically unmeasured and imprecisely averaged and infilled grid cells in the Arctic and other parts of the world
I will honestly face skeptics in open debate. that would be interesting and informative
I will quit trying to stop skeptics from being published this really is one of the most dispicable components of the climategate emails. it is one thing to have a different viewpoint, it is another thing altogether to use dirty tricks to stifle and silence those that you disagree with
I will admit that glaciers have been disappearing for hundreds or thousands of years obviously true just by reading newspaper accounts for the last 150 years
I will stop telling people that the climate is getting more extreme, without producing any evidence global warming morphed into climate change and now anything anywhere is considered 'evidence' to support mankind's evil destruction of the world
I will admit that hurricanes are on the decline contrary to what Al Gore says
I will admit that severe tornadoes are on the decline it was a bad year in 2011 but overall it would appear that really destructive ones are declining. of course Doppler radar can pad the numbers any way you want
I will admit that droughts were much worse in the past how soon before we get a paper saying that the Dust Bowl was only caused by bad farming practises and that there was no drought?
I will admit that efforts to shut down power plants have potentially very serious consequences for the future ??
I will pay for my own tickets to tropical climate boondoggles like Cancun, rather than improperly using taxpayer money for political activism not the first, or the worst
I will admit that there is no missing heat interesting topic, it is looking more and more like there are serious problems with the energy budgets and climate sensitivities
I will admit that temperatures have been cooling for at least the last decade I think only the RSS data show cooling but all the data sets are very flat. and yet we still hear about 'accelerating warming'
I will publish the raw data and not lose it. poor incompetent Jones didnt realize that his work would ever become important so he didnt put much effort into doing it thoroughly. more upsetting is the obfuscation of the updates to paleo data sets that show different results to the previous ones, verging on criminal


climate science is not settled. maybe we are somewhat close to understanding it, perhaps we are way off. time and a free discussion of causes and effects will bring us closer. but that time is not now

 

[westwall]

LOLOLOL....oh, walleyed, the one time you post some accurate information, you're too retarded to believe that it is accurate, you poor boob. You wouldn't understand "raw data" if it bit you. The ice itself is the best 'thermometer' and the ice is melting and the melting is accelerating. The ice extent is already far below the historical minimums for the last many thousands of years and the ice cover is far thinner and more vulnerable to summer melting. Did you already 'forget' the graph I posted in post #60 that demolished your previous idiotic claims about the Arctic ice? Do you need to look at it again? Perhaps you should watch various prominent scientists and Navy Admirals explain what is going on in the Arctic in this video.

Monthly Deviations of Sea Ice Area in the Arctic from merged SMMR and SSMI Data (NORSEX algorithm) (Copyright: NERSC and NIERSC)
Arctic Regional Ocean Observing System

(In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes.)


Watts Up with Sea Ice? - YouTube

Sure thing silly person.

"Sure thing" what, nitwit? We both know you're too lost in your cultic delusions and myths to have actually watched that video without your head exploding so.....

Here's the current arctic ice extent. The winter has barely begun.

LOLOLOL....wow.....Arctic ice grows in the winter....big news there....better tell the scientists who've studied the Arctic for decades, walleyed. The ice grows in the winter months and melts back in the summer. Every summer for the last four decades or so. it has been melting more and more. What about all that escapes you? Everything, I suppose, given how extremely clueless you are.

Here's the actual current state of the Arctic from the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center, whose graph you used without any understanding of what it means.

Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis
Wednesday 4th January 2012

Overview of conditions

Average ice extent for November 2011 was 10.01 million square kilometers (3.86 million square miles), 1.30 million square kilometers (502,000 square miles) below the 1979 to 2000 average. This was 170,000 square kilometers (66,000 square miles) above the average for November 2006, the lowest extent recorded for that month in the satellite data record.

At the end of November, ice extent remained below the 1979 to 2000 average in the Chukchi, Barents and Kara seas, and Hudson Bay was still nearly ice free. Ice extent was near average in the East Greenland and the Bering seas. These ice conditions may be connected to a strong positive phase of the Arctic Oscillation, which began during the last week of November. A positive Arctic Oscillation tends to help move ice out of Fram Strait and into the North Atlantic.

Conditions in context

The Arctic sea ice cover grew at an average pace through November, despite a brief slowdown early in the month. However, the ice extent remained far below average. Overall, the Arctic gained 2.36 million square kilometers (911,000 square miles) of ice during the month, which was slightly more than the average ice gain for November of 2.13 million square kilometers (822,000 square miles). On November 30, Arctic sea ice extent was 10.85 million square kilometers (4.19 million square miles), 625,000 square kilometers (241,000 square miles) more than the ice extent on November 30, 2006, the lowest extent on November 30 in the satellite record.

November 2011 compared to past years

Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010. The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average.

Figure 3. Monthly November ice extent for 1979 to 2011 shows a decline of 4.7% per decade. (—Credit: National Snow and Ice Data Center)

You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting(sic) reading.

If the ice is melting and it is, then I don't "have to explain" squat, moron. Reality is what it is and it doesn't require us to understand it or explain it for it to happen anyway. Our understanding of the world is shaped by the reality of it, not the other way around, as you seem to idiotically imagine. Since the Arctic ice cap is floating sea ice and the ocean temperatures are also increasing, along with the atmospheric temperatures, it is hardly surprising that there is increasing ice melt. But the myths of your cult probably won't let you understand that.

The ice is at a larger extent then it has been in 6 years. 2007 was the bottom of the cycle. This year it will be greater, and the next year it will be greater, and you'll be sitting at the computer with a stupid look on your face saying "but the ice is melting"

And you say I'm a cultist?

 

[westwall]

Sure thing silly person. Here's the current arctic ice extent. The winter has barely begun.
You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting reading.

Notice that he claims they have 8000 years of data, but he never posts more than the last 30 years.

Actually, I am the one that posted the 8,000 year figure. The scientists, who's study is being misrepresented to support the methane hysteria, are quite clear that the methane has nothing to do with AGW as the venting began 8,000 years ago because of sea water intrusion.

 

[RollingThunder]

Sure thing silly person.

"Sure thing" what, nitwit? We both know you're too lost in your cultic delusions and myths to have actually watched that video without your head exploding so.....


LOLOLOL....wow.....Arctic ice grows in the winter....big news there....better tell the scientists who've studied the Arctic for decades, walleyed. The ice grows in the winter months and melts back in the summer. Every summer for the last four decades or so. it has been melting more and more. What about all that escapes you? Everything, I suppose, given how extremely clueless you are.

Here's the actual current state of the Arctic from the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center, whose graph you used without any understanding of what it means.

Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis
Wednesday 4th January 2012

Overview of conditions

Average ice extent for November 2011 was 10.01 million square kilometers (3.86 million square miles), 1.30 million square kilometers (502,000 square miles) below the 1979 to 2000 average. This was 170,000 square kilometers (66,000 square miles) above the average for November 2006, the lowest extent recorded for that month in the satellite data record.

At the end of November, ice extent remained below the 1979 to 2000 average in the Chukchi, Barents and Kara seas, and Hudson Bay was still nearly ice free. Ice extent was near average in the East Greenland and the Bering seas. These ice conditions may be connected to a strong positive phase of the Arctic Oscillation, which began during the last week of November. A positive Arctic Oscillation tends to help move ice out of Fram Strait and into the North Atlantic.

Conditions in context

The Arctic sea ice cover grew at an average pace through November, despite a brief slowdown early in the month. However, the ice extent remained far below average. Overall, the Arctic gained 2.36 million square kilometers (911,000 square miles) of ice during the month, which was slightly more than the average ice gain for November of 2.13 million square kilometers (822,000 square miles). On November 30, Arctic sea ice extent was 10.85 million square kilometers (4.19 million square miles), 625,000 square kilometers (241,000 square miles) more than the ice extent on November 30, 2006, the lowest extent on November 30 in the satellite record.

November 2011 compared to past years

Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010. The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average.

Figure 3. Monthly November ice extent for 1979 to 2011 shows a decline of 4.7% per decade. (&#8212;Credit: National Snow and Ice Data Center)

You'll have to explain how ice can melt when the temperature is 0C or less. That should make some intersting(sic) reading.

If the ice is melting and it is, then I don't "have to explain" squat, moron. Reality is what it is and it doesn't require us to understand it or explain it for it to happen anyway. Our understanding of the world is shaped by the reality of it, not the other way around, as you seem to idiotically imagine. Since the Arctic ice cap is floating sea ice and the ocean temperatures are also increasing, along with the atmospheric temperatures, it is hardly surprising that there is increasing ice melt. But the myths of your cult probably won't let you understand that.

The ice is at a larger extent then it has been in 6 years.

No it is not, you blind fool. I just showed you the report from the NSIDC that said:
"Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010."

Moreover, the ice is thinning rapidly so the total volume is already much lower than in previous years.

Thinning of Arctic sea ice 1990-2010 as observed by upward looking sonars - or why the Arctic Ocean could be ice free in summer in less than ten years
Norwegian Polar Institute

2007 was the bottom of the cycle.

What cycle would that be, Mr. Retardo? As the scientists at the NSIDC just reported:
"The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average."
No "cycles" here, you poor deluded reality-denier. Just an ongoing and increasing decline in the area and thickness of the sea ice, which will almost certainly lead to a complete disappearance of the Arctic sea ice in the summer months within a decade or two.

This year it will be greater, and the next year it will be greater, and you'll be sitting at the computer with a stupid look on your face saying "but the ice is melting"

LOLOLOLOL....you do love 'dem old denier cult myths, don't you boy. Your ability to ignore reality is amazing....amazingly retarded, that is. You're already sitting at your computer with your usual stupid look on your face saying "but the ice can't be melting even though all the evidence says it is".

And you say I'm a cultist?

Yup!!! No doubt about it. You're a rightwingnut reality-denying cultist without a clue.

 

[westwall]

"Sure thing" what, nitwit? We both know you're too lost in your cultic delusions and myths to have actually watched that video without your head exploding so.....


LOLOLOL....wow.....Arctic ice grows in the winter....big news there....better tell the scientists who've studied the Arctic for decades, walleyed. The ice grows in the winter months and melts back in the summer. Every summer for the last four decades or so. it has been melting more and more. What about all that escapes you? Everything, I suppose, given how extremely clueless you are.

Here's the actual current state of the Arctic from the experts at the National Snow and Ice Data Center, whose graph you used without any understanding of what it means.

Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis
Wednesday 4th January 2012

Overview of conditions

Average ice extent for November 2011 was 10.01 million square kilometers (3.86 million square miles), 1.30 million square kilometers (502,000 square miles) below the 1979 to 2000 average. This was 170,000 square kilometers (66,000 square miles) above the average for November 2006, the lowest extent recorded for that month in the satellite data record.

At the end of November, ice extent remained below the 1979 to 2000 average in the Chukchi, Barents and Kara seas, and Hudson Bay was still nearly ice free. Ice extent was near average in the East Greenland and the Bering seas. These ice conditions may be connected to a strong positive phase of the Arctic Oscillation, which began during the last week of November. A positive Arctic Oscillation tends to help move ice out of Fram Strait and into the North Atlantic.

Conditions in context

The Arctic sea ice cover grew at an average pace through November, despite a brief slowdown early in the month. However, the ice extent remained far below average. Overall, the Arctic gained 2.36 million square kilometers (911,000 square miles) of ice during the month, which was slightly more than the average ice gain for November of 2.13 million square kilometers (822,000 square miles). On November 30, Arctic sea ice extent was 10.85 million square kilometers (4.19 million square miles), 625,000 square kilometers (241,000 square miles) more than the ice extent on November 30, 2006, the lowest extent on November 30 in the satellite record.

November 2011 compared to past years

Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010. The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average.

Figure 3. Monthly November ice extent for 1979 to 2011 shows a decline of 4.7% per decade. (—Credit: National Snow and Ice Data Center)




If the ice is melting and it is, then I don't "have to explain" squat, moron. Reality is what it is and it doesn't require us to understand it or explain it for it to happen anyway. Our understanding of the world is shaped by the reality of it, not the other way around, as you seem to idiotically imagine. Since the Arctic ice cap is floating sea ice and the ocean temperatures are also increasing, along with the atmospheric temperatures, it is hardly surprising that there is increasing ice melt. But the myths of your cult probably won't let you understand that.

The ice is at a larger extent then it has been in 6 years.

No it is not, you blind fool. I just showed you the report from the NSIDC that said:
"Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010."

Moreover, the ice is thinning rapidly so the total volume is already much lower than in previous years.

Thinning of Arctic sea ice 1990-2010 as observed by upward looking sonars - or why the Arctic Ocean could be ice free in summer in less than ten years
Norwegian Polar Institute



What cycle would that be, Mr. Retardo? As the scientists at the NSIDC just reported:
"The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average."
No "cycles" here, you poor deluded reality-denier. Just an ongoing and increasing decline in the area and thickness of the sea ice, which will almost certainly lead to a complete disappearance of the Arctic sea ice in the summer months within a decade or two.

This year it will be greater, and the next year it will be greater, and you'll be sitting at the computer with a stupid look on your face saying "but the ice is melting"

LOLOLOLOL....you do love 'dem old denier cult myths, don't you boy. Your ability to ignore reality is amazing....amazingly retarded, that is. You're already sitting at your computer with your usual stupid look on your face saying "but the ice can't be melting even though all the evidence says it is".

And you say I'm a cultist?

Yup!!! No doubt about it. You're a rightwingnut reality-denying cultist without a clue.

Yep I sure am.....and I'm kicking your ass all over the place! How does it feel to lose to a "reality denying cultist"?

 

[daveman]

You'd think he'd be numb to it by now, it happens so regularly.

 

[westwall]

You'd think he'd be numb to it by now, it happens so regularly.

Yeah... his brain is numb so it makes sense the rest of him is too!

 

[daveman]

You'd think he'd be numb to it by now, it happens so regularly.

Yeah... his brain is numb so it makes sense the rest of him is too!

If you'd stop kicking his ass, his brain might get better.

 

[Old Rocks]

Amazing how stupid some senile old bastards are. Thunder presented evidence from real scientists and you fellows present yap-yap. Yet you are breaking your arms congratulating yourselves on "kicking ass". All you have demonstrated is what asses your really are.

 

[westwall]

Amazing how stupid some senile old bastards are. Thunder presented evidence from real scientists and you fellows present yap-yap. Yet you are breaking your arms congratulating yourselves on "kicking ass". All you have demonstrated is what asses your really are.

Blunder has presented a bunch of biased horsecrap from known websites set up solely for that fact. But thanks for playing.

 

[bripat9643]

You'd think he'd be numb to it by now, it happens so regularly.

Yeah... his brain is numb so it makes sense the rest of him is too!

Have you read Delingpole's new book "Watermelon?" It gives good insight into the psychology of theses eco-Fascist bootlickers. It also includes plenty of good ammunition to use against them.

 

[westwall]

You'd think he'd be numb to it by now, it happens so regularly.

Yeah... his brain is numb so it makes sense the rest of him is too!

Have you read Delingpole's new book "Watermelon?" It gives good insight into the psychology of theses eco-Fascist bootlickers. It also includes plenty of good ammunition to use against them.

No, I havn't picked it up yet. Of course, when this is the best they can do, the ammo supply is pretty basic.

 

[RollingThunder]

The ice is at a larger extent then it has been in 6 years.

No it is not, you blind fool. I just showed you the report from the NSIDC that said:
"Ice extent for November 2011 was the third lowest in the satellite record for the month, behind 2006 and 2010."

Moreover, the ice is thinning rapidly so the total volume is already much lower than in previous years.

Thinning of Arctic sea ice 1990-2010 as observed by upward looking sonars - or why the Arctic Ocean could be ice free in summer in less than ten years
Norwegian Polar Institute



What cycle would that be, Mr. Retardo? As the scientists at the NSIDC just reported:
"The linear rate of decline for November over the satellite record is now 53,200 square kilometers (20,500 square miles) per year, or 4.7% per decade relative to the 1979 to 2000 average."
No "cycles" here, you poor deluded reality-denier. Just an ongoing and increasing decline in the area and thickness of the sea ice, which will almost certainly lead to a complete disappearance of the Arctic sea ice in the summer months within a decade or two.



LOLOLOLOL....you do love 'dem old denier cult myths, don't you boy. Your ability to ignore reality is amazing....amazingly retarded, that is. You're already sitting at your computer with your usual stupid look on your face saying "but the ice can't be melting even though all the evidence says it is".

And you say I'm a cultist?

Yup!!! No doubt about it. You're a rightwingnut reality-denying cultist without a clue.

Yep I sure am.....

......and really retarded too. As the rest of your post demonstrates.

and I'm kicking your ass all over the place!

LOLOLOL.....another good example of your denial of reality, you poor deluded dufus. Every bit of nonsense you post (i.e. - everything you post) gets refuted by actual scientific evidence. You're just too lost in your denier cult fantasy world to realize it.

How does it feel to lose to a "reality denying cultist"?

I'll let you know if and when it ever happens, sucker. Of course, reality deniers like you never actually 'win' anything except in your own deranged hallucinations. Reality always *****-slaps you in the end.