New Website on the American Civil War

[ding]

When you can't answer the questions, you don't know what you're talking about.

1.) If you're talking about Lincoln's supply ships, those were a Navy assault flotilla fitted with troop transports and warships. They were sent 'supposedly to provision the fort with food only, but that was just more of Lincoln's lies. South Carolina learned about the lies and the ships coming to reinforce Sumter. Thus the need to fire on Sumter now before the ships arrived. Which they did.

The ships were under a Captain Fox, who was bold when he and Lincoln discussed this plan. But once he got to Charleston Harbor, the firing on Sumter had already begun. And he got cold feet and refused to go in and mix it up in the battle...to everyone's surprise.

Thus these ships sent by Lincoln didn't get fired upon. The battle of Sumter was already underway.

2.) If you're talking about Buchannan sending the 'Star Of The West', that was also done deceptively, portraying itself with food only. Which was more Yankee bullshit. The South learned it was picking up troops also to land at Sumter. It was a deceptive ship, and would fly a deceptive flag in hopes of fooling the Southernors.

"The plan called for utmost secrecy. The ship would depart from New York as if on one of its regular voyages but would pick up two hundred well-armed U.S. Army regulars at Governor's Island in New York Harbor before heading south. Telegrams were to be avoided for fear of interception, with all telegraphy between Governor's Island and surrounding cities suspended for the duration of the voyage.

"Whenever the ship came in sight of another vessel, the soldiers were to go below decks; they would hide there as well when the ship approached Charleston. The plan was kept secret even from Interior Secretary Thompson out of the quite reasonable concern that he would reveal it to his Carolina contracts." (The Demon Of Unrest, Erik Larson, Crown Publishing Group, 2024, p. 181)

Thus the deceptively disguised vessel was fired upon because it was coming not to provide food for Sumter, but troop reinforcements. The lies of the Yankees just don't stop. The plan went to hell and the Southernors fired warning shot first, but then when that was ignored they fired on the ship itself.

None of this caused Anderson at Sumter to fire at the South Carolina land batteries. Which meant they didn't fire on Sumter, thus the war would not start due to this debacle of a mission. 'The Star Of The West' turned back.

So, you see? Probably not. Your statement, 'they did attack the resupply vessel', as though that meant something, meant nothing. No matter which administration it was done under. All was deceit.

Quantrill

I do know what I am talking about. It's common knowledge.

Yes, on January 9, 1861, the Union merchant ship "Star of the West" was fired upon by South Carolina militia/cadets from The Citadel while attempting to deliver supplies and reinforcements to Fort Sumter. The ship was hit, forced to turn back, and the incident is often considered an unofficial opening act of the Civil War.
Key details regarding the incident:

• The Ship: Star of the West, an unarmed civilian merchant vessel, was chartered by the U.S. government.
• The Attackers: Cadets from The Citadel and militia stationed at Morris Island fired on the ship.
• The Outcome: The ship was struck multiple times but not severely damaged. It withdrew without successfully delivering supplies to Major Robert Anderson at Fort Sumter.
• Significance: While this event occurred months before the official start of the Civil War at Fort Sumter in April 1861, it was the first time shots were exchanged in the crisis.

 

[ding]

When you can't answer the questions, you don't know what you're talking about.

1.) If you're talking about Lincoln's supply ships, those were a Navy assault flotilla fitted with troop transports and warships. They were sent 'supposedly to provision the fort with food only, but that was just more of Lincoln's lies. South Carolina learned about the lies and the ships coming to reinforce Sumter. Thus the need to fire on Sumter now before the ships arrived. Which they did.

The ships were under a Captain Fox, who was bold when he and Lincoln discussed this plan. But once he got to Charleston Harbor, the firing on Sumter had already begun. And he got cold feet and refused to go in and mix it up in the battle...to everyone's surprise.

Thus these ships sent by Lincoln didn't get fired upon. The battle of Sumter was already underway.

2.) If you're talking about Buchannan sending the 'Star Of The West', that was also done deceptively, portraying itself with food only. Which was more Yankee bullshit. The South learned it was picking up troops also to land at Sumter. It was a deceptive ship, and would fly a deceptive flag in hopes of fooling the Southernors.

"The plan called for utmost secrecy. The ship would depart from New York as if on one of its regular voyages but would pick up two hundred well-armed U.S. Army regulars at Governor's Island in New York Harbor before heading south. Telegrams were to be avoided for fear of interception, with all telegraphy between Governor's Island and surrounding cities suspended for the duration of the voyage.

"Whenever the ship came in sight of another vessel, the soldiers were to go below decks; they would hide there as well when the ship approached Charleston. The plan was kept secret even from Interior Secretary Thompson out of the quite reasonable concern that he would reveal it to his Carolina contracts." (The Demon Of Unrest, Erik Larson, Crown Publishing Group, 2024, p. 181)

Thus the deceptively disguised vessel was fired upon because it was coming not to provide food for Sumter, but troop reinforcements. The lies of the Yankees just don't stop. The plan went to hell and the Southernors fired warning shot first, but then when that was ignored they fired on the ship itself.

None of this caused Anderson at Sumter to fire at the South Carolina land batteries. Which meant they didn't fire on Sumter, thus the war would not start due to this debacle of a mission. 'The Star Of The West' turned back.

So, you see? Probably not. Your statement, 'they did attack the resupply vessel', as though that meant something, meant nothing. No matter which administration it was done under. All was deceit.

Quantrill

Historical archives extensively record that a supply ship was fired upon in a pivotal incident, most notably the Union merchant ship Star of the West, which was fired upon on January 9, 1861, in Charleston Harbor.

• The Star of the West Incident (1861): Records from the National Archives, South Carolina Department of Archives and History, and the Naval History and Heritage Command confirm this unarmed civilian vessel, chartered by the U.S. War Department to supply Fort Sumter, was fired upon by South Carolina militia cadets from The Citadel.
• Details of the Attack: The ship was struck three times by cannon fire on January 9, 1861, forced to turn back, and failed to deliver its supplies, a moment often cited as a precursor to the American Civil War.

 

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"The plan called for utmost secrecy. The ship would depart from New York as if on one of its regular voyages but would pick up two hundred well-armed U.S. Army regulars at Governor's Island in New York Harbor before heading south. Telegrams were to be avoided for fear of interception, with all telegraphy between Governor's Island and surrounding cities suspended for the duration of the voyage.

President Lincoln informed South Carolina Governor Francis W. Pickens on April 6, 1861, that he was sending a supply ship to Fort Sumter. Lincoln’s message stipulated that the effort was to supply provisions only, not men, arms, or ammunition, unless the attempt was resisted.
Key details regarding this event include:

• Purpose: The goal was to avoid initiating violence while maintaining a federal presence.
• The Message: Tulane University reported that the message sent warned the South to "expect an attempt... to supply Fort Sumter with provisions only".
• Reaction: This move placed the responsibility of starting the conflict on the Confederacy, leading to their demand for immediate surrender.
• Result: Despite knowing supplies were merely food, Confederate forces under orders from Jefferson Davis fired upon Fort Sumter on April 12, 1861, beginning the Civil War.

The notification was designed to be transparent about the intention to feed, not arm, the fort.

 

[ding]

Thus these ships sent by Lincoln didn't get fired upon. The battle of Sumter was already underway.

The resupply of Fort Sumter became the first crisis of the administration of U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, inaugurated March 4, 1861, following his victory in the election of November 6, 1860. He notified the Governor of South Carolina, Francis Wilkinson Pickens, that he was sending supply ships, which resulted in an ultimatum from the Confederate government for the immediate evacuation of Fort Sumter, which Major Anderson refused. Beginning at 4:30 a.m. on April 12, the Confederates bombarded the fort from artillery batteries surrounding the harbor. Although the Union garrison returned fire, they were significantly outgunned and, after 34 hours, Major Anderson agreed to evacuate. There were no deaths on either side as a direct result of this engagement, although a gun explosion during the surrender ceremonies on April 14 caused the death of two U.S. Army soldiers. The event often regarded as the "First Bloodshed of the Civil War" was the Baltimore riot of 1861, one week later.

 

[mikegriffith1]

Yes, I am aware he is full of shit. But he chooses to be ignorant and to believe the lies. Which makes him a liar. And I Iike to turn over the rocks and watch the vermin run.

Quantrill

Oh, yes, he most certainly is a liar. He purposely distorts and twists people's views and comments to deflect attention from his obscene, nutty statements and positions.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, yes, he most certainly is a liar. He purposely distorts and twists people's views and comments to deflect attention from his obscene, nutty statements and positions.

They guy who mocked Iris Chang's suicide and tried to claim that that the Rape of Nanking wasn't that bad has no business talking about "Obscene"

 

[JoeB131]

What I learned in 4th grade

LIncoln was our greatest President
The Civil War was about slavery
The South started the war by attacking Ft Sumter

Nothing has changed

The thing is, scratch a Confederate Apologist, find a racist. Every time.

These people are sad that slavey ended.

 

[Quantrill]

President Lincoln informed South Carolina Governor Francis W. Pickens on April 6, 1861, that he was sending a supply ship to Fort Sumter. Lincoln’s message stipulated that the effort was to supply provisions only, not men, arms, or ammunition, unless the attempt was resisted.
Key details regarding this event include:

• Purpose: The goal was to avoid initiating violence while maintaining a federal presence.
• The Message: Tulane University reported that the message sent warned the South to "expect an attempt... to supply Fort Sumter with provisions only".
• Reaction: This move placed the responsibility of starting the conflict on the Confederacy, leading to their demand for immediate surrender.
• Result: Despite knowing supplies were merely food, Confederate forces under orders from Jefferson Davis fired upon Fort Sumter on April 12, 1861, beginning the Civil War.

The notification was designed to be transparent about the intention to feed, not arm, the fort.

Lincoln lied. He was sending troops, and munitions, and a Navy flotilla with warships.

No, the goal was to force the resupply of Sumter with warships. South Carolina had proof of that in letters from Lincoln to Anderson.

You say 'unless the attempt was resisted'. Well, the bombardment of Sumter occurred before the ships got there because of the deception of Lincoln. So, what happened? Why didn't the ships engage? Yankee cowards?

Plus you forget, if you ever knew, the bombardment of Fort Sumter didn't start the War. The movement of troops from Moultrie to Sumter started the War. That was a breach of promise under the negotiations agreement. That was an act of war. If Lincoln wanted peace all he had to do is vacate Sumter. And Lincoln through Seward kept promising that Sumter would be vacated all the while planning the attack with Capt. Fox.

Plus, Anderson attacked the workers at Sumter to take it over. That was an act of war. Plus Anderson destroyed much that was in Fort Moultrie. He spiked the cannons left behind. You don't do that unless you mean war.

Both attempts to resupply Sumter with troops and munitions were done deceptively. Through lies. And you perpetrate their lies.

Quantrill

 

[ding]

Lincoln lied. He was sending troops, and munitions, and a Navy flotilla with warships.

No, he sent a supply ship with a military escort. He was very upfront about his intentions. He told them exactly what the plan was. He was going to resupply the fort and if they fired on the supply ship like they did in January, the military escort was going to fire back. Learn some history.

Besides you can't blame the resupply efforts for the attack. Because it didn't arrive before the attack began on Ft. Sumter.

On April 6, 1861 Lincoln informed South Carolina Governor Francis W. Pickens that he was sending a supply ship. Which resulted in an ultimatum from the Confederate government for the immediate evacuation of Fort Sumter, which was refused. On April 12, 1861 the Confederates bombarded the fort from artillery batteries surrounding the harbor which was six days after Pickens was informed.

President Abraham Lincoln's relief expedition to resupply Fort Sumter, intended to arrive around April 11–12, 1861, did not successfully land supplies before Confederate forces began bombarding the fort on April 12, 1861. The ships were delayed by storms, and the fort surrendered shortly after the bombardment began.

 

[rightwinger]

On April 6, 1861 Lincoln informed South Carolina Governor Francis W. Pickens that he was sending a supply ship. Which resulted in an ultimatum from the Confederate government for the immediate evacuation of Fort Sumter, which was refused. On April 12, 1861 the Confederates bombarded the fort from artillery batteries surrounding the harbor which was six days after Pickens was informed.

President Abraham Lincoln's relief expedition to resupply Fort Sumter, intended to arrive around April 11–12, 1861, did not successfully land supplies before Confederate forces began bombarding the fort on April 12, 1861. The ships were delayed by storms, and the fort surrendered shortly after the bombardment began.

The South should have supplied the fort with supplies while they negotiated its turnover to the Confederacy

They were not at war and it would have been a sign of good faith

Instead, they forced Lincoln to go to war

 

[ding]

The South should have supplied the fort with supplies while they negotiated its turnover to the Confederacy

They were not at war and it would have been a sign of good faith

Instead, they forced Lincoln to go to war

You'll never convince racists of that fact.

 

[Quantrill]

No, he sent a supply ship with a military escort. He was very upfront about his intentions. He told them exactly what the plan was. He was going to resupply the fort and if they fired on the supply ship like they did in January, the military escort was going to fire back. Learn some history.

Besides you can't blame the resupply efforts for the attack. Because it didn't arrive before the attack began on Ft. Sumter.

On April 6, 1861 Lincoln informed South Carolina Governor Francis W. Pickens that he was sending a supply ship. Which resulted in an ultimatum from the Confederate government for the immediate evacuation of Fort Sumter, which was refused. On April 12, 1861 the Confederates bombarded the fort from artillery batteries surrounding the harbor which was six days after Pickens was informed.

President Abraham Lincoln's relief expedition to resupply Fort Sumter, intended to arrive around April 11–12, 1861, did not successfully land supplies before Confederate forces began bombarding the fort on April 12, 1861. The ships were delayed by storms, and the fort surrendered shortly after the bombardment began.

Lies. If your information comes from the National Achieves, who do you think put that information in there? The Lincoln liars.

No, Lincoln lied through his teeth through the whole Sumter event. Lincoln's informing the Governor of South Carolina was just another lie. Lincoln's intention was to reinforce Sumter with troops and munitions. And behind that, hoping to provoke the South into firing.

Lincoln liked Fox's plan to reinforce Sumter. "Fox arrived the next morning and went at once with Blair to explain the plan to Lincoln and the military officers. at lengthy cabinet meetings on the 14th Blair used the plan as part of an appeal to reinforce rather than withdraw the garrison. Fox's plan intrigued Lincoln but lacked broad support. " (Days of Defiance, Maury Klein, Alfred A. Knopf Publisher, 1997, p. 331)

What was Fox's plan. "Scott received a plan from former naval officer Gustavus V. Fox calling for a commercial steamer, escorted by two light tugboats and two warships, to carry the troops and supplies." (Klein, p. 283) Fox devised this plan under the Buchannan administration, but it was rejected. He then brought it forth under the Lincoln administration though he added some to it. The point here is that Lincoln is looking for ways to reinforce Sumter while all the while telling the South Carolinians that they plan to evacuate Sumter. Deception.

Supreme Court justice John Cambell of Alabama tried to mediate between Seward and the Southern Commissioners. "Cambell offered to mollify the commissioners and write Jefferson Davis as well. What shall I say on the subject of Fort Sumter? he asked Seward. You may say to him, replied Seward, that before that letter reaches him...the telegraph will have informed him that Sumter will have been evacuated." (Klein p. 334)

"This action put Seward in a dilemma. He understood that the issue of secession had turned into one of recognition and that no hint of recognition could be given. ...For two days he stalled, saying a reply was being prepared. Instead he created a memorandum for the files to clarify his position and protect himself from any appearance of granting recognition. Lincoln approved the document." (Klein p. 329)

Lincoln and Seward are working together to create a facade around their real purpose. There was never anything 'upfront' with the Yankee duo. They lied their ass off from the start.

Why can't you blame the Yankee flotilla under Fox. Lincoln said nothing would be done unless the attempt to reinforce Sumter was resisted. The reason Sumter was being bombarded was because the fleet was being resisted. And they, those brave Yankees, sat off the coast and watched Sumter get blown to hell.

Quantrill

 

[ding]

Lies. If your information comes from the National Achieves, who do you think put that information in there? The Lincoln liars.

No, Lincoln lied through his teeth through the whole Sumter event. Lincoln's informing the Governor of South Carolina was just another lie. Lincoln's intention was to reinforce Sumter with troops and munitions. And behind that, hoping to provoke the South into firing.

Lincoln liked Fox's plan to reinforce Sumter. "Fox arrived the next morning and went at once with Blair to explain the plan to Lincoln and the military officers. at lengthy cabinet meetings on the 14th Blair used the plan as part of an appeal to reinforce rather than withdraw the garrison. Fox's plan intrigued Lincoln but lacked broad support. " (Days of Defiance, Maury Klein, Alfred A. Knopf Publisher, 1997, p. 331)

What was Fox's plan. "Scott received a plan from former naval officer Gustavus V. Fox calling for a commercial steamer, escorted by two light tugboats and two warships, to carry the troops and supplies." (Klein, p. 283) Fox devised this plan under the Buchannan administration, but it was rejected. He then brought it forth under the Lincoln administration though he added some to it. The point here is that Lincoln is looking for ways to reinforce Sumter while all the while telling the South Carolinians that they plan to evacuate Sumter. Deception.

Supreme Court justice John Cambell of Alabama tried to mediate between Seward and the Southern Commissioners. "Cambell offered to mollify the commissioners and write Jefferson Davis as well. What shall I say on the subject of Fort Sumter? he asked Seward. You may say to him, replied Seward, that before that letter reaches him...the telegraph will have informed him that Sumter will have been evacuated." (Klein p. 334)

"This action put Seward in a dilemma. He understood that the issue of secession had turned into one of recognition and that no hint of recognition could be given. ...For two days he stalled, saying a reply was being prepared. Instead he created a memorandum for the files to clarify his position and protect himself from any appearance of granting recognition. Lincoln approved the document." (Klein p. 329)

Lincoln and Seward are working together to create a facade around their real purpose. There was never anything 'upfront' with the Yankee duo. They lied their ass off from the start.

Why can't you blame the Yankee flotilla under Fox. Lincoln said nothing would be done unless the attempt to reinforce Sumter was resisted. The reason Sumter was being bombarded was because the fleet was being resisted. And they, those brave Yankees, sat off the coast and watched Sumter get blown to hell.

Quantrill

Incorrect.

Maybe stop getting your history from white supremacists websites.

 

[Quantrill]

I do know what I am talking about. It's common knowledge.

Yes, on January 9, 1861, the Union merchant ship "Star of the West" was fired upon by South Carolina militia/cadets from The Citadel while attempting to deliver supplies and reinforcements to Fort Sumter. The ship was hit, forced to turn back, and the incident is often considered an unofficial opening act of the Civil War.
Key details regarding the incident:

• Significance: While this event occurred months before the official start of the Civil War at Fort Sumter in April 1861, it was the first time shots were exchanged in the crisis.

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

 

[rightwinger]

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

Moving troops to safety is not an act of war

The South screwed up and provoked a war they had no chance of winning

 

[frigidweirdo]

I have finally created a new website on the American Civil War. My site presents a view of the Civil War that is rarely discussed in our history books, a view that steers a middle course between the pro-Southern Lost Cause narrative and the standard pro-Northern narrative that dominates our history books.

The American Civil War: An Alternative View

Is that it?

There's no evidence presented at all.

 

[ding]

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

John Brown's raid on Harpers Ferry in October 1859 is widely considered a major catalyst that accelerated the start of the American Civil War, though the official war began later in 1861 at Fort Sumter. The 1859 raid significantly intensified sectional tensions, making violent conflict almost inevitable.
Key Details on the Raid and its Role:

• The Event: Abolitionist John Brown and 21 followers seized the federal armory in Harpers Ferry, Virginia (now West Virginia), attempting to spark a slave revolt.
• Impact on the Nation: While many Northerners condemned the raid, the South viewed it as proof that Northerners intended to destroy their way of life, drastically increasing fear and animosity.
• A "Precipitating Incident": Many historians view the raid as the point where tensions became unstoppable, with some arguing the conflict essentially began in 1859 rather than 1861.
• Strategic Importance: Following the 1859 raid, Harpers Ferry remained a critical location, changing hands multiple times during the Civil War, including during the Battle of Harpers Ferry in 1862.

While not the literal first shot of the Civil War, John Brown's raid at Harpers Ferry acted as the spark that ignited the final march to war.

 

[ding]

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

John Brown was not acting on behalf of the United States government or the formal Union army; he was a radical abolitionist leading a private, militant attempt to destroy slavery. His 1859 raid on Harpers Ferry was an independent initiative aimed at starting a slave insurrection, not a government-sanctioned operation.
Key Details on John Brown's Actions:

• Independent Action: Brown acted with a small band of followers, not as an agent of the federal government or any state government.
• Motives: His goal was to overthrow the institution of slavery, which he viewed as a sin, believing that only violent action, not political debate, would end it.
• Perception: While seen as a criminal and traitor by the South (and many in the North at the time), he was viewed as a martyr by some abolitionists.
• Impact: Though his raid failed and he was executed for treason against the state of Virginia, his actions accelerated the tensions leading to the Civil War.

While Brown was acting in what he believed to be the long-term, moral interest of the Union (by removing slavery), he was not acting on behalf of it.

 

[ding]

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

Abraham Lincoln did not support John Brown or his violent tactics, despite sharing the belief that slavery was an evil institution. Lincoln condemned the 1859 Harpers Ferry raid as lawless, treasonous, and harmful to the anti-slavery cause, instead advocating for legal, constitutional methods to end slavery.
Key Points on Lincoln's Position:

• Condemnation of Violence: Lincoln criticized Brown as a "dangerous radical" and stated that his execution for treason was appropriate,The Conversation.
• Distancing the Party: Lincoln and the Republican Party worked to distance themselves from Brown, aiming to present a moderate, legal approach to abolition rather than an armed revolt.
• Different Approaches: While both opposed slavery, Lincoln favored constitutional, gradual change, whereas Brown believed in armed insurrection.
• Long-term Impact: While Lincoln condemned the actions, some historians argue that both men shared a similar moral imperative against slavery, with Brown acting as a precursor to the violent, unavoidable end of the institution.

 

[ding]

The first time shots were exchanged in the crisis was at Harpers Ferry, Oct. 16-18, 1859.

The first act of war between the North and South Carolina was when Anderson moved troops and arms to Sumter. Dec. 26, 1860. This was a violation of the negotiation agreement.

Quantrill

Abraham Lincoln and John Brown never met or had any direct personal contact. Although they both opposed slavery, they operated in different spheres—Lincoln through legal and political means, and Brown through violent abolitionism—with Lincoln even describing Brown as “insane” following his 1859 raid on Harpers Ferry.
Key Details Regarding Their Lack of Interaction:

• No Known Meetings: There is no evidence or historical record of any meeting between the two men.
• Public Opinion: In his 1860 Cooper Union speech, Lincoln referred to Brown as an "enthusiast" whose actions resulted in little more than his own execution.
• Different Approaches: Lincoln sought to end slavery through legal and constitutional, often cautious, means, while Brown sought to end it immediately through armed insurrection.
• Views on the Raid: While Lincoln recognized Brown's "rare unselfishness" and "courage," he strongly condemned the 1859 raid on Harpers Ferry as a criminal act.