New Generation of Men or Boys?

[dilloduck]

And claims that a lot of men are whining about it...but you could be right, the author could be full of shit.

Never can tell but women seems to be raising a lot of wimpy boys.

You're playing Halo right now, aren't you?

never heard of it.

 

[editec]

The Baby Boomers really fucked this country over.

Yes, but in our defense, we had plenty of help.

 

[Ravi]

From the beginning of time everything wrong has been blamed on mothers.

Autism...mom's fault.
Mental retardation...mom's fault.
Bi-polar disorder...mom's fault.
Criminal activity...mom's fault.

Will it ever end?

 

[Sheldon]

It's possible that women are generally more motivated. I'd have to go look the actual number up, but I'm pretty sure average uni enrollment across the country is tipping further and further in the female majority even though the demographic balance is roughly the same.

Of course it is....

When University X has two candidates with the exact same "resume", with one being of each gender, who do you think they're going to pick? They're gonna pick the girl, if for no other reason than if they don't she's more likely to sue the school for discrimination (and win) than he is.

Instead of jumping to victimization, maybe there are actually more females applying to universities than males.

 

[dilloduck]

From the beginning of time everything wrong has been blamed on mothers.

Autism...mom's fault.
Mental retardation...mom's fault.
Bi-polar disorder...mom's fault.
Criminal activity...mom's fault.

Will it ever end?

never --just own it and it won't irritate you so.

 

[Anachronism]

Instead of jumping to victimization, maybe there are actually more females applying to universities than males.

Probably true. At least in part because they know they're going to get a little bit of an edge in admissions from their gender due to our "wonderful" Affirmative Action policies throughout this country.

In the last 18 months that our Engineering Department was Non-Union we hired 11 people. Not a single white male in the group. Why? Because our company was bound and determined to improve its I&D (That's Inclusion and Diversity) rating. Of those 11 people, only 4 were actually able to do the job. 3 quit the company. The other 4 have been moved around into other positions and offices repeatedly, despite their inability to do the work, in order to keep from firing them for gross incompetence.

Of those eleven hirees, seven were female.

 

[chanel]

The ugly truth is also too few male role models - fatherless children. That's one of the reasons I am pro-Boy Scouts and pro-affirmative action in teaching. (Chanel ducks for cover) lol

 

[Anachronism]

The ugly truth is also too few male role models - fatherless children. That's one of the reasons I am pro-Boy Scouts and pro-affirmative action in teaching. (Chanel ducks for cover) lol

I'll agree with you on the role model issue. Part of that goes back to society, though. The wussification of the American Male.

I have a friend who took his 13 year old son on a weekend hunting trip last fall. To do this they took the young man out of school on Friday and Monday. When he got back on Tuesday his junior high school homeroom teacher asked what he'd done over the weekend. When the young man told her, his father got a call from the guidance counselor about "taking your child out of school to attend inappropriate, violent, and anti-conservation activities".

I have another friend whose 6 year old was misbehaving in a restaurant. When his father suggested that they might have to "go outside" if the young man didn't behave, the child responded.... "If you spank me, I'll tell my teacher and you'll go to jail." Both of his parents and I were SHOCKED at that response, and how quickly it came out of his mouth. Almost as if he were repeating something he'd been TAUGHT (which it turned out WAS exactly where he'd gotten it - from his 1st grade teacher).

I think those two anecdotes sum it up pretty well.

 

[Ravi]

The ugly truth is also too few male role models - fatherless children. That's one of the reasons I am pro-Boy Scouts and pro-affirmative action in teaching. (Chanel ducks for cover) lol

I'll agree with you on the role model issue. Part of that goes back to society, though. The wussification of the American Male.

I have a friend who took his 13 year old son on a weekend hunting trip last fall. To do this they took the young man out of school on Friday and Monday. When he got back on Tuesday his junior high school homeroom teacher asked what he'd done over the weekend. When the young man told her, his father got a call from the guidance counselor about "taking your child out of school to attend inappropriate, violent, and anti-conservation activities".

I have another friend whose 6 year old was misbehaving in a restaurant. When his father suggested that they might have to "go outside" if the young man didn't behave, the child responded.... "If you spank me, I'll tell my teacher and you'll go to jail." Both of his parents and I were SHOCKED at that response, and how quickly it came out of his mouth. Almost as if he were repeating something he'd been TAUGHT (which it turned out WAS exactly where he'd gotten it - from his 1st grade teacher).

I think those two anecdotes sum it up pretty well.

I doubt they are true.

 

[Barb]

Interesting theory, but I think there's a bit more to it.

Women are simply smarter. J/K!

Seriously though there are several factors, but I do think schooling plays a big role. Teachers naturally favor girls because they are easier to teach. And smarter. Lol

So why do smart girls chase bad boys ?

Because they're men. And women still like their men to be men.
Of course, they then proceed to screw it all up by civilizing all the excitement out of them...

I blame the schools, personally. I have a son, and complained of the same thing much of this thread does as far as that's concerned. Sheldon is correct though, about wage stats. Men with an undergraduate degree still statistically out earn most women with graduate degrees.

 

[Barb]

Okay, stop blaming the ladies for everything. A lot of us DO screw up, but a lot of us don't. Here's two quotes from the same female. Our strength does not have to emasculate any of you unless you allow it to happen:

I, with a deeper instinct, choose a man who compels my strength, who makes enormous demands on me, who does not doubt my courage or my toughness, who does not believe me naive or innocent, who has the courage to treat me like a woman.”
Anais Nin

“I do not want to be the leader. I refuse to be the leader. I want to live darkly and richly in my femaleness. I want a man lying over me, always over me. His will, his pleasure, his desire, his life, his work, his sexuality the touchstone, the command, my pivot. I don’t mind working, holding my ground intellectually, artistically; but as a woman, oh, God, as a woman I want to be dominated. I don’t mind being told to stand on my own feet, not to cling, be all that I am capable of doing, but I am going to be pursued, fucked, possessed by the will of a male at his time, his bidding.”
Anais Nin

 

[The Gadfly]

I noticed, I suppose it was about twenty years ago, a lot of single women, saying they hoped to find themselves "a sensitive, New Age Man". When I inquired as to just what that was, one female friend responded something like this, "Women are tired of you men who are insensitive, rough, uncaring brutes. We want tenderness, we want sensitivity, we want men who will talk about their feelings" So then I asked her just how it was we were supposed to be so willing to "talk about our feelings" since men didn't usually share those with each other the way women do, and probably wouldn't know how to, unless they'd been in therapy or something, and the reply was 'Typical male chauvinist posturing prick, acting like you're John Wayne! I'm so sick of you with your violence, and your beer-swilling partying, and teaching our sons to fight instead of talk things out; pigs, all of you!"

Well I figured she just had been spending too much time with guys who were gay, and I really didn't give it much thought, but a few months later she found herself one of these neutered, lapdog wonders who was straight (at least, I think he might have been) and darned if she didn't marry the sucker. She introduced him to me, a few months later, and I couldn't believe my eyes and ears, because this critter was about the sorriest excuse for a man I ever ran across. He'd cry at the drop of a hat, just like a girl; most of his conversation was some psychobabble I couldn't understand; he had this whiny voice, and all but cringed if she so much as raised her voice. He didn't watch football; said it was "too violent"; and he didn't drink beer, either; strictly wine and quiche for him. I swear, if you had shaved off his scraggly excuse for a beard, and put a ladies wig on his balding head, and put him in a damn dress, he would have looked like any ugly woman, and darned if I believe you could have told at first glance he wasn't one!

She stayed married to that poor emasculated creature for about a year, and even bragged on how "supportive" the relationship was, and how well they "communicated", until she figured out, that with him in the house, she might as well have been married to another woman, and I suppose the lesbian thing didn't appeal to her, so she gave him the boot. It was all OK though, he just went back home to live with his mama, which was where she found him.

She eventually remarried, this time a retired Marine Drill Instructor (so help me!) and that's a totally different relationship. He doesn't talk much, except to tell her to get him another beer and fix us a pizza while we watch football on TV; he packed her wimpy son off to military school for two years to make a man out of him, which I guess worked, because he's now a Marine himself. The wife is very happy; says he's the best thing that ever happened to her! I suppose she eventually figured out that a real man isn't so bad after all!

That's all well and good, but I can't help but wonder what the hell we're going to do with the rest of those feminized, simpering, sniveling crybaby excuses for males these women have created. There seems to be just about an entire generation of them, and they are a sad sight to behold; the worst part is, I don't think their condition is curable. They're the first thing I've seen that would bring tears to a real man's eyes, and that's damn pathetic.

 

[Anachronism]

Okay, stop blaming the ladies for everything..... Our strength does not have to emasculate any of you unless you allow it to happen:

I agree, the men/boys hold a lot of the responsibility for our own destruction. We need to hold ourselves responsible to act like Men and to choose not to associate with those females who choose not to act like proper women. That's a lot easier to say than it is to do in this day and age; and since most American men seem to be driven more by the head in their pants than the one on their shoulders, it becomes even more difficult.

 

[The Gadfly]

Okay, stop blaming the ladies for everything..... Our strength does not have to emasculate any of you unless you allow it to happen:

I agree, the men/boys hold a lot of the responsibility for our own destruction. We need to hold ourselves responsible to act like Men and to choose not to associate with those females who choose not to act like proper women. That's a lot easier to say than it is to do in this day and age; and since most American men seem to be driven more by the head in their pants than the one on their shoulders, it becomes even more difficult.

I think the women are beginning to see the negative side of what they've helped create; as I noted, actually having one of these crybabies is less satisfying than wanting one, for most of them. Now, if they'll quit trying to raise their sons that way, most of this will fix itself, in a generation or so.

The fact remains, that the only thing approaching a "real man" they can "convert" are the insecure ones; the rest of us are pretty much immune to this claptrap. Of course, that still leaves a generation of wusses who have been drugged into submission as boys, brainwashed, and psychologically castrated, to contend with. Unfortunately, some will marry and breed, thus perpetuating the problem. The only good news is, that there will be a bonanza of romantic opportunity for the few real men left among them, what with these being in such short supply.

Incidentally, Anachronism, Huggy and I left you some advice over in the "when men don't want..." thread that you may want to look at.

 

[Sheldon]

Okay, stop blaming the ladies for everything..... Our strength does not have to emasculate any of you unless you allow it to happen:

I agree, the men/boys hold a lot of the responsibility for our own destruction. We need to hold ourselves responsible to act like Men and to choose not to associate with those females who choose not to act like proper women. That's a lot easier to say than it is to do in this day and age; and since most American men seem to be driven more by the head in their pants than the one on their shoulders, it becomes even more difficult.

I think the women are beginning to see the negative side of what they've helped create; as I noted, actually having one of these crybabies is less satisfying than wanting one, for most of them. Now, if they'll quit trying to raise their sons that way, most of this will fix itself, in a generation or so.

The fact remains, that the only thing approaching a "real man" they can "convert" are the insecure ones; the rest of us are pretty much immune to this claptrap. Of course, that still leaves a generation of wusses who have been drugged into submission as boys, brainwashed, and psychologically castrated, to contend with. Unfortunately, some will marry and breed, thus perpetuating the problem. The only good news is, that there will be a bonanza of romantic opportunity for the few real men left among them, what with these being in such short supply.

Incidentally, Anachronism, Huggy and I left you some advice over in the "when men don't want..." thread that you may want to look at.

You usually write good posts from what I see, and I let the other post go because it was about anecdotes. But come on now. With this one you're really stretching the generalizations about my generation, and my gender, to the point where it can only collapse under critical thought. This is what the OP op-ed did, broadbrushing guys my age as just a bunch of wimpy lazy slobs laying in a pile of beer cans and pizza boxes, and that we're all just limp-wristed playthings for women, first for our moms and then for our girlfriends.

I realize there is some truth behind these stereotypes. I even know a few guys similar to what you're talking about. But by saying this is a whole generation like that with just a few exception, is just so misleading to the effect that it's wrong.

Just as there are some lazy douches that live in mom's basement and play video games with their equally lazy douche peers, there are girls my age who are still playing their drama games that we're supposed to be grown out of after high school and who still live, literally, off dad's credit card. I know this is a stereotype too, and it also has some truth in it. Again I know and have known a few girls like that.

I'm in this generation you guys are talking about. I've grown up through high school and into college and then now. You really are over-stating how many of these wimpy over-grown mama boys there are. I really don't know how else to explain it, because if you don't live it now you don't really get it, as condescending as that sounds.

 

[Big Fitz]

The ugly truth is also too few male role models - fatherless children. That's one of the reasons I am pro-Boy Scouts and pro-affirmative action in teaching. (Chanel ducks for cover) lol

I'll agree with you on the role model issue. Part of that goes back to society, though. The wussification of the American Male.

I have a friend who took his 13 year old son on a weekend hunting trip last fall. To do this they took the young man out of school on Friday and Monday. When he got back on Tuesday his junior high school homeroom teacher asked what he'd done over the weekend. When the young man told her, his father got a call from the guidance counselor about "taking your child out of school to attend inappropriate, violent, and anti-conservation activities".

I have another friend whose 6 year old was misbehaving in a restaurant. When his father suggested that they might have to "go outside" if the young man didn't behave, the child responded.... "If you spank me, I'll tell my teacher and you'll go to jail." Both of his parents and I were SHOCKED at that response, and how quickly it came out of his mouth. Almost as if he were repeating something he'd been TAUGHT (which it turned out WAS exactly where he'd gotten it - from his 1st grade teacher).

I think those two anecdotes sum it up pretty well.

In example two, I'd teach the kid what Foster Care was and teachers lie.

 

[Anachronism]

I think the women are beginning to see the negative side of what they've helped create; as I noted, actually having one of these crybabies is less satisfying than wanting one, for most of them. Now, if they'll quit trying to raise their sons that way, most of this will fix itself, in a generation or so.

Some women are, and many are not seeing the negative side. I can tell you that the married couple I live with definitely does not see his total impotence and lack of any masculinity as a bad thing. She walks all over him like the worthless POS that he is.

The schools and society have now taken up teaching the metrosexual style of life, so it's going to take some active deterent to stop this decline.

The fact remains, that the only thing approaching a "real man" they can "convert" are the insecure ones; the rest of us are pretty much immune to this claptrap. Of course, that still leaves a generation of wusses who have been drugged into submission as boys, brainwashed, and psychologically castrated, to contend with. Unfortunately, some will marry and breed, thus perpetuating the problem. The only good news is, that there will be a bonanza of romantic opportunity for the few real men left among them, what with these being in such short supply.

Maybe, maybe not. Trust me, as someone who is definitely not going to be turned into a boy-toy, I do not find a whole lot of women out there who are even remotely interested in maintaining a traditional style of relationship. Society and marketing are perpetuating this problem asa much as anything else.

Incidentally, Anachronism, Huggy and I left you some advice over in the "when men don't want..." thread that you may want to look at.

Thanks. I'll take a look shortly.

 

[Anachronism]

I think those two anecdotes sum it up pretty well.

In example two, I'd teach the kid what Foster Care was and teachers lie.[/QUOTE]

The parents had a LONG discussion with the school on Monday morning.

 

[Big Fitz]

I think those two anecdotes sum it up pretty well.

In example two, I'd teach the kid what Foster Care was and teachers lie.

The parents had a LONG discussion with the school on Monday morning.[/QUOTE]
How'd THAT conversation turn out? That's what I want to know.

 

[Anachronism]

How'd THAT conversation turn out? That's what I want to know.

It turned out with the child being moved to the other classroom/teacher for his grade level, and a standing requirement that ANY "unusual" topics to be discussed in the classroom had to be cleared with his parents before the lesson was carried out. They got weekly lesson plan updates sent home the week before, for their review, for the rest of that school year. They also got to be known as the parents you didn't want to mess with by the school administration.