Movie 'Concussion' Was Excellent

[JimBowie1958]

Some thoughts on the topic of NFL concusions;

1. the root of the problem is the 'safety' equipment; the pads helmets etc that make the player think that they are safe when they run into a guy at full sprint. Rugby doe snot have such injuries and I think it is due to the lack of safety equipment forcing players to moderate their speed and brace with their arms more.

2. Major subplot to the movie was the power for abuse that corporations have. FBI interference with bogus criminal charges,e tc to silence the doctors was classic. We need to tame our corporations badly.

3. We really dont know that much about how the brain works when the NFL can easily dismiss the science of concussions so handily. I wonder how many other sports and professions have a high rate of brain injury similar to the NFL.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Not a single player is forced to choose football. Occupational hazard, play at your own risk.
The helmets are required to have a safety warning sticker on the back. Been that way for decades.
The only way to reduce injuries is to prevent players from becoming superficially/artificially large. The force of collisions is way greater than it was just thirty years ago.

 

[PredFan]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Not interested in the least. The players know the risks & opt for the big payday.

Cry to someone who cares & keep your propaganda to yourself

 

[pwjohn]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

With high school aged players dropping dead on the field in large numbers, I have to wonder just how informed their consent was.

 

[AvgGuyIA]

Shut up and play for us.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

With high school aged players dropping dead on the field in large numbers, I have to wonder just how informed their consent was.

Completely different dynamic. They must have parental consent and schools can use discretion in denying participation.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Not interested in the least. The players know the risks & opt for the big payday.

Cry to someone who cares & keep your propaganda to yourself

Actually, no, the players did not know the risks, people didnt even understand the disease.

Way to snap your heels and be loyal to the corporate power structure, Gramps.

 

[JimBowie1958]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

You assert...

1. First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true.

Then you say...
2.This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

If the doctors the NFL had disagreed, then they denied the one doctors assertions, no? And if the NFL went with the denying doctors, then the NFL too was in effect denying the one doctors assertions, as well.

 

[Blackrook]

If you want to know how it works you need to follow the money.

 

[JimBowie1958]

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

Wow, so we should just not do anything to help these people who have developed brain injuries? There is no doubt that they are getting injuries, but thats OK as long as the NFL admits there are problems?

You like gladiatorial sports as well? Fight to the death in arenas, etc?

Come on dude, we can improve the sport and not have so many of our athletic heroes killing themselves from depression, walking around like drooling idiots later in life and actually enjoying their retirement.

What would be the big deal if the various football sports organizations ruled out using pads and helmets? Went with the rugby approach?

Would that desecrate the religion of football so horribly that you couldnt enjoy watching our gladiators try to kill each other on the field otherwise?

 

[JimBowie1958]

Completely different dynamic. They must have parental consent and schools can use discretion in denying participation.

But there is no way to discern who is having these problems develop until they are in advanced age, usually retirement. The cause of the injuries starts with Pee Wee football, but the symptoms remain cloaked until they are out of the game.

Why cant we have healthy retired gridiron heroes across the board instead of nearly one third of them turn into drooling morons?

 

[pwjohn]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

With high school aged players dropping dead on the field in large numbers, I have to wonder just how informed their consent was.

Completely different dynamic. They must have parental consent and schools can use discretion in denying participation.

Completely different ? I seriously doubt that. The nfl per team has just as much discretion if not more in denial of play

 

[JimBowie1958]

Wikipedia cites as the only significant controversy regarding the facts of the movie, the following:??
"On December 21, 2015 Slate writer Daniel Engber published an article critical of the over-dramatization by the film, citing in particular a 2012 National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health study [22] indicating that football players, on average compared to the population as a whole, live longer lives, though the study also indicates, as Enberg points out, that former football players are also more likely to suffer, and die, from neurodegenerative disease."

Even NFL suckups acknowledge the degenerative effects of a life-long football career.

As to the matter of concussion related injuries in the NFL...
"There has been a problem for about 20 years regarding the longterm damage of repeated concussions among National Football League (NFL) players, often as a result of contradicting study results published by the NFL. However, by 2010, the NFL finally acknowledged that many of its ex-players were suffering from chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE).[1]

On September 30, 2014, it was announced that 76 of the 79 brains of former NFL players studied by Dr. Ann McKee and her colleagues tested positive for CTE. The study conducted was the largest brain bank study to date and was a twofold increase in the number of confirmed cases of CTE.[2]...

A 2004 doctoral dissertation by Don Brady examined NFL Players' knowledge of concussions, studying both active and retired National Football League Players' knowledge of concussions. Dr. Brady's findings concluded: that many NFL players lacked accurate and essential knowledge pertaining to various aspects of a concussion; that the preponderance of credible experimental and clinical evidence pertaining to the adverse effects of concussion indicates that the brain is injured as a result of a concussion; that the altered cell functioning and cell death along with subtle to more visible neurological, neurocognitive, psychological, and other medical problems reflect a diverse range of lifelong negative consequences of a concussion / brain injury; and that sports team health-care personnel need to focus primarily on the athletes’ health and well-being, and not minimize an injury or primarily concentrate on the players’ capacity to perform on the field. This expanded focus of health care is necessary in order to avoid any real or perceived conflicts of interest emerging in the concussion research, concussion management and related return to play decision-making process.[9]

During November 2014 Don Brady filed objections to the proposed NFL concussion settlement offer. Dr. Brady sent a cover letter and detailed objections on behalf of NFL retired players to the presiding US district court judge, Anita Brody.[10]...

Kevin Guskiewicz, Director of the Center for the Study of Retired Athletes in the Department of Exercise and Sport Science at the University of North Carolina, analyzed data from a 2007 study of nearly 2,500 former NFL players. He found about 11 percent of the study participants suffered from clinical depression, with a threefold increased risk in former players who had a history of three or four concussions.[11] The following year, the NFL commissioned the University of Michigan Institute for Social Research to conduct a study involving more than 1,000 former NFL players. The results reported that Alzheimer's disease or similar diseases appear to have been diagnosed in former NFL players vastly more often than in the general population at a rate of 19 times the normal rate for men ages 30 through 49....

Concussions in American football - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A list of NFL players thought to have CTE:
Concussions in American football - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Why cant we just remove the pads and helmets and let nature protect these players via their own natural instincts to protect themselves with their arms and hands?

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

I've heard the the movie tells a lot of lies.

First and foremost is the the NFL tried to deny there was a problem. That just isn't true. This doctor was saying things that no other doctor was saying. The NFL had entire teams of doctors threat didn't agree with this one doctors findings. The NFL went with what their doctors were telling them and not with what this one doctor was saying.

There apparently are other lies too, but that one is the most important.

NFL denial is basically moot. Athletes who sustained repeated concussions were referred to as 'punch drunk', a boxing term that explains itself.
More recent research suggests that Lou Gherig's disease results from repeated concussions. Players need to know the risks before choosing but the choice is exclusively theirs and the NFL should have no culpability.
Just another group of attempted victims.

With high school aged players dropping dead on the field in large numbers, I have to wonder just how informed their consent was.

Completely different dynamic. They must have parental consent and schools can use discretion in denying participation.

Completely different ? I seriously doubt that. The nfl per team has just as much discretion if not more in denial of play

Pro football entails way more severe collisions due to the size and speed of players.
Youth football has way more stringent safety rules. Completely different dynamic.
Back when players were country big and helmets consisted of one pad at the crown and one pad per ear, the rest being a hat of straps, leading with the head and blocking face-first were not only legal but were coached as techniques. Still, fewer catastrophic injuries.
It's the increase in size and speed that has compounded injuries. That is most prevalent at the pro level. And that is completely the choice of the player. Buyer beware.

 

[JimBowie1958]

While the subject of concussions in football is interesting and the primary focus of the discussion so far, the two other lines of thought I think are also worth tossing around. Dr Omalu also has found similar symptoms among war veterans. Bennet Omalu - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It would be nice if some of his research could bennefit veterans who have served our country as well as sports entertainment figures.

Also, no one comments much on the NFLs influence to try to suppress Omalu's research for about 7 years. The NFL also has complete exemption from monopoly laws by legal edict from Congress.

Wow, nice racket if you have that much money running around.

 

[JimBowie1958]

Pro football entails way more severe collisions due to the size and speed of players.
Youth football has way more stringent safety rules. Completely different dynamic.
Back when players were country big and helmets consisted of one pad at the crown and one pad per ear, the rest being a hat of straps, leading with the head and blocking face-first were not only legal but were coached as techniques. Still, fewer catastrophic injuries.
It's the increase in size and speed that has compounded injuries. That is most prevalent at the pro level. And that is completely the choice of the player. Buyer beware.

How can the buyer beware if the NFL is suppressing and denying the research for decades?

And while size and speed have an impact, obviously, the safety equipment itself is also a problem and a contributing factor, obviously. What other sport allows players to hit each other at a full run? Hockey? Are there higher rates of CTE among hockey players?

Why not ditch the safety equipment and let Nature take its course? We have evolved to adjust to normal impacts, but not to impacts like we see where players are encased in this cocoon of armor that gives them a false sense of security.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Pro football entails way more severe collisions due to the size and speed of players.
Youth football has way more stringent safety rules. Completely different dynamic.
Back when players were country big and helmets consisted of one pad at the crown and one pad per ear, the rest being a hat of straps, leading with the head and blocking face-first were not only legal but were coached as techniques. Still, fewer catastrophic injuries.
It's the increase in size and speed that has compounded injuries. That is most prevalent at the pro level. And that is completely the choice of the player. Buyer beware.

How can the buyer beware if the NFL is suppressing and denying the research for decades?

And while size and speed have an impact, obviously, the safety equipment itself is also a problem and a contributing factor, obviously. What other sport allows players to hit each other at a full run? Hockey? Are there higher rates of CTE among hockey players?

Why not ditch the safety equipment and let Nature take its course? We have evolved to adjust to normal impacts, but not to impacts like we see where players are encased in this cocoon of armor that gives them a false sense of security.

If someone chooses to play pro football and does not recognize the risk then they are stupid enough to deserve the consequences.
Studies about CTE, etc., are redundant to say the least.

 

[turzovka]

It's the increase in size and speed that has compounded injuries. That is most prevalent at the pro level

Yes, I think that is the largest factor. What I would like to know is are players getting away with steroids or other ways of enhancing muscle development? That subject is muted in football. Even at the college level the size of so many players, not just linemen, is striking. Also, does not steroids (or whatever supplement) increase speed as well as size?