Misunderestimating Middle America

Hobbit

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2004
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Near Atlanta, GA
We've seen what has happened in the past with this. The heart and soul of America lies outside the sprawling metropolis in the suburbs, the farms, and the small communities of America. It lies in the modern Mayberries of the nation, where everybody knows everybody on a first name basis, the kids walk to school, and the only "gun violence" is against rabbits, squirrels, and deer. Across the country, millions of such people grow up in the same town for most of their lives, never approaching the overwhelmingly populated cities. Thanks to home grown values, these people are actually fairly well educated and thanks to mass media, they're pretty well informed on national and international interests. They also actually care about their country and vote in droves, as well as sign up for the military.

The left, however, doesn't see it this way. In the eyes of the left, there are 5 types of people in this country: the educated elite who know everything (themselves), impressionable students who can become educated elite, the easily led people they control, the evil conservatives, and the morons who vote for conservatives and would surely vote liberal if somebody just gave the idiots an education. In case you haven't guessed, middle America is in catagory 5. So for years, the left has been trying to 'educate' this group, so they'll see the light and vote for Democrats. During the past several years, they've seen elitist after elitist condescend to them to try to get them to see the light, all the while pushing things on them like abortion, homosexuality, and gun control. Well, many of these guys may not be the best educated in the world, but they ain't stupid. They know a scam when they see it, and as and almost exclusively church-going crowd, they think abortion is murder, homosexuality is a sin, and they'd like to keep their hunting guns, thank you very much.

Despite this, the assault continues. With movies like "The Day After Tomorrow," "Alexander," and many others espousing liberal values continue to assault the movie theaters in an attempt to 'educate the ignorant.' It's so blatant, that very few people can miss the downright assault on classical society. Even in movies not about liberal issues, a few things hold true. People are always happier with their second marriages, guns always cause problems, Christians pick on everybody, and having sex is just another part of a relationship. TV shows are no exception, either, as shows like "Will and Grace," "Friends," and "Seinfeld" are fraught with the ideas of gay culture, frivilous sex, and a dozen other liberal values. Well, no matter how it's dressed up, this tends to rub the church crowd the wrong way, since it's all in direct contradiction to Christian values, and middle America is very much the church crowd. Even as this continued, the same movies and TV shows tried to suppress the value of the Bible, painting it as a hateful, archaic document that causes normal people to turn into bigots and idiots who hate everything modern and want to kill gay people and blacks. Well, despite what the left thinks, the 'redneck hicks' of middle America aren't dumb, and they're very pround. They don't take kindly to be insulted by the stereotype of the dumb, easily led idiot.

That being the case, they've said a collective "nothin' doin'" in the past two presidential elections. They've stopped giving their money to movie theaters. They don't watch a whole lot of TV anymore, and an old Democrat ally, the rural poor, has gone turncoat, voting Republican over and over again. So, what does the left say about it? Well, it can't be their fault, they educated the savages in their ways, and anybody who knows converts to their side because they're right. So why aren't those of the country music NASCAR flooding over to the left or seeing movies and TV? Oh, it's very simple. You see, the GOP is brainwashing these people, lying to them, enticing them with tax cuts, etc. in order to keep their votes. The only way the GOP could possibly win is to cheat, right? If that's so, then why aren't the movies and TV shows working. Well, nobody sees movies because they're overpriced and movie theaters aren't very clean, right? Well, that gets disproven regularly by family movies like "The Incredibles" and Christian values movies like "The Passion." The TV shows are explained away by the 'fact' that most of rural America doesn't have sattelite or cable, a fallacy, considering the success of channels like PAX and TVLand, which show programs that actually have some values intact.

The left is so frustrated by middle America and their inability to reach them, that it's driven them over the deep end, especially with the president they hate so much, but who is almost seen as 'one of us' from the views of middle America. Bush is a down-home, traditional, gun-toting Texan, and that's something middle America can relate to. The left, however, holds up cultural elites that look down at the proud people of the country and alienate them. Well, one thing is clear. The left either has to break out of the illusion that condescention can reach middle America or they will die out. Which do you think it will be?
 
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Hobbit said:
During the past several years, they've seen elitist after elitist condescend to them to try to get them to see the light, all the while pushing things on them like abortion, homosexuality, and gun control. Well, many of these guys may not be the best educated in the world, but they ain't stupid. They know a scam when they see it, and as and almost exclusively church-going crowd, they think abortion is murder, homosexuality is a sin, and they'd like to keep their hunting guns, thank you very much.

Perhaps the problem is people who see tolerance of other people as "pushing homosexuality on them."
 
Yep, gotta love the democrates.

People from the south all marry their cousins

People from the mid-west and western states aren't educated

That just leaves the enlightened east and west coast. Except the people from Vermont and Maine (they just like to be left alone).


What they fail to realize is that a lot of mid-westerners and southerners who live in these small towns have lived in larger towns and just didn't like it or didn't want to raise their families there. It has nothing to do with being to "slow" to handle the fast pace. I've lived in New Orleans, Tampa and outside Chicago and when it came time to have my kids I moved back home to my small town.
 
Max Power said:
Perhaps the problem is people who see tolerance of other people as "pushing homosexuality on them."

Perhaps the problem is people preaching about tolerance when they only tolerate what is convenient for them.

If the gay community found reason to start voting predominately Republican, I can just imagine the "fag" jokes you would be pasting the board with.
 
Jimmyeatworld said:
Perhaps the problem is people preaching about tolerance when they only tolerate what is convenient for them.

If the gay community found reason to start voting predominately Republican, I can just imagine the "fag" jokes you would be pasting the board with.

Apparently you've never heard of the Log Cabin Republicans, or Andrew Sullivan.
 
Max Power said:
Perhaps the problem is people who see tolerance of other people as "pushing homosexuality on them."


Another typical liberal ploy. Since when do Christans go around beheading gays? Are Christans and the "far right" trying to pass laws to take away the voting rights of gays? Are they trying to deport them? Of course not, because they already "tolerate" their presense. If they were "intolerant" as liberals suggest, they would be doing what Muslims do...kill them. What you are talking about is trying to get Christans to "accept" it. To say that its "ok" to be gay, or to commit a homosexual act. That is not what Christ taught. He did not teach us that we should accept sin, he taught us to reject it outright, and not to comprimise.
 
theHawk said:
Another typical liberal ploy. Since when do Christans go around beheading gays? Are Christans and the "far right" trying to pass laws to take away the voting rights of gays? Are they trying to deport them? Of course not, because they already "tolerate" their presense. If they were "intolerant" as liberals suggest, they would be doing what Muslims do...kill them. What you are talking about is trying to get Christans to "accept" it. To say that its "ok" to be gay, or to commit a homosexual act. That is not what Christ taught. He did not teach us that we should accept sin, he taught us to reject it outright, and not to comprimise.

Christians are free to think whatever they want, to say whatever they want, but they are not free to impose their beliefs on others.

And, to be honest, the bible doesn't exactly have the most enlightened opinions on things. Not only is homosexuality not accepted, but slavery is.

Sometimes its necessary to have a higher moral standard than the bible.
 
Max Power said:
Christians are free to think whatever they want, to say whatever they want, but they are not free to impose their beliefs on others.

And, to be honest, the bible doesn't exactly have the most enlightened opinions on things. Not only is homosexuality not accepted, but slavery is.

Sometimes its necessary to have a higher moral standard than the bible.

Explain to me how christians are "imposing" their beliefs on others? They are passing laws to force people to go to church? I think we can all agree this country was founded on Christian ideals, but if our country "forces" its Christian morals on everyone then how did we have athiests, agnostics and Christian-hating liberals in our society today?

Link where Jesus says slavery is OK? Yet another typical liberal/ anti-christian ploy to take one thing out of context of the bible and say "the bible teaches ****!!!"

I forgot, the educated elite liberals have a "higher" moral standard than the bible. Although you say "sometimes", I guess that means just when it suits you.
 
theHawk said:
Explain to me how christians are "imposing" their beliefs on others? They are passing laws to force people to go to church? I think we can all agree this country was founded on Christian ideals, but if our country "forces" its Christian morals on everyone then how did we have athiests, agnostics and Christian-hating liberals in our society today?
Oh, I don't know... how about attempting to get a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage?

Link where Jesus says slavery is OK? Yet another typical liberal/ anti-christian ploy to take one thing out of context of the bible and say "the bible teaches ****!!!"
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/says_about/slavery.html
That's 12 passages from the bible.
"Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters " Eph.6:5

I forgot, the educated elite liberals have a "higher" moral standard than the bible. Although you say "sometimes", I guess that means just when it suits you.
No, just when the bible is what it is, a 2000 year old book that condones slavery, among other atrocities.
 
that max power et al always reduce the argument to "Gay Marriage" issues...the liberals always cite this as a reason to attack Christians...geez !then why do they always support the "Muslim" cause...to be honest I am really sick and tired of all this pandering to a group who wants to marry each other!
Since when does 'ultimate masturbation' qualify for marriage rights! and who gives a rusty shit anyway...just do it in the privacy of your own bedroom and quit trying to convince the rest of us to accept this behavoir! :puke3:
 
dmp said:
Care to explain how that is an advocation of Slavery?
Well, it is specifically telling slaves to obey their masters, and more specifically to obey them as they obey God.

You can't.
I just did.

Why? Because you don't understand 'context' or 'reason'.
No context is necessary.
Read the whole thing if you wish.
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/eph/6.html#5

Perhaps you could enlighten us all as to in what CONTEXT slaves obeying their masters is not slavery.
 
Max Power said:
Oh, I don't know... how about attempting to get a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage?
Oh I see, so the government not recognizing gay marriage is shoving Christian morals down your throat. The Bible also says murder is wrong, maybe our laws of banning murder is also shoving Christian morals down your throat.
Who is to say which laws in the bible should be applied to our nations laws? Oh thats right!! You elite liberals that know whats best for all! God forbid you let a democracy choose which laws it wants, in a democratic manner....not by what a few judges say!


Max Power said:
"Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters " Eph.6:5

No, just when the bible is what it is, a 2000 year old book that condones slavery, among other atrocities.

You just proved my point thanks.
 
Max Power said:
Well, it is specifically telling slaves to obey their masters, and more specifically to obey them as they obey God.


I just did.


No context is necessary.
Read the whole thing if you wish.
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/eph/6.html#5

Perhaps you could enlighten us all as to in what CONTEXT slaves obeying their masters is not slavery.


Are you REALLY that dense, brother? The bible teaches us to be subserviant to our 'masters' (leaders, bosses, those in authority). Here's what you are doing...and I'd be laughing if I wasn't so disgusted that you really think this way:

"The bible talks about Slavery. The Bible encourages those who are slaves to NOT rebel, therfore GOD LOVES and PROMOTES SLAVERY!! YEAH!"

Seriously - How can ppl debate you when you take horrible examples of your point, and try to PROVE your point with them?
 
theHawk said:
Oh I see, so the government not recognizing gay marriage is shoving Christian morals down your throat. The Bible also says murder is wrong, maybe our laws of banning murder is also shoving Christian morals down your throat.
Who is to say which laws in the bible should be applied to our nations laws? Oh thats right!! You elite liberals that know whats best for all! God forbid you let a democracy choose which laws it wants, in a democratic manner....not by what a few judges say!
Fortunately, we don't live in a democracy, we live in a constitutionally limited republic.
http://chezjacq.com/repubic.htm

Democracy amounts to little more than mob rule. Whatever the mob wants, the mob gets. To quote from the Illustrated World Encyclopedia (©1969 New York), under the title democracy, it says:

Since the people rule in a democracy, they can have the government run any way they please. If they wanted to, they could decide to take away all their freedoms. They could decide that everybody would have to go to the same church and read the same books and newspapers. They could decide that no one could criticize the government or travel from town to town without a passport or quit his job.

Pretty scary isn’t it? Sounds more like Nazi Germany than the United States. And yet you people claim you live in a democracy. Welcome to the cold hard reality of oppressive government.
 
dmp said:
Are you REALLY that dense, brother? The bible teaches us to be subserviant to our 'masters' (leaders, bosses, those in authority). Here's what you are doing...and I'd be laughing if I wasn't so disgusted that you really think this way:

"The bible talks about Slavery. The Bible encourages those who are slaves to NOT rebel, therfore GOD LOVES and PROMOTES SLAVERY!! YEAH!"

Seriously - How can ppl debate you when you take horrible examples of your point, and try to PROVE your point with them?

Yeah, the bible also refers to selling ones own daughter into servitude
Ex.21:7 "If a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant...."

But I'm sure they're just referring to leaders and bosses :Rolleyes: who are "purchasing" people.

But the ever-tolerant bible DOES place limits on slavery
Ex 21:2 If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing.

So I guess 6 years of slavery isn't so bad. :rolleyes:
 
Max Power said:
Yeah, the bible also refers to selling ones own daughter into servitude
Ex.21:7 "If a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant...."

But I'm sure they're just referring to leaders and bosses :Rolleyes: who are "purchasing" people.

But the ever-tolerant bible DOES place limits on slavery
Ex 21:2 If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing.

So I guess 6 years of slavery isn't so bad. :rolleyes:


You are unreachable. Really. Your mind is so clouded with hatred you cannot see truth or context. You refuse to understand. It's very sad, and really, may God have mercy on your soul.
 
Max Power said:
Fortunately, we don't live in a democracy, we live in a constitutionally limited republic.
http://chezjacq.com/repubic.htm

Democracy amounts to little more than mob rule. Whatever the mob wants, the mob gets. To quote from the Illustrated World Encyclopedia (©1969 New York), under the title democracy, it says:

Since the people rule in a democracy, they can have the government run any way they please. If they wanted to, they could decide to take away all their freedoms. They could decide that everybody would have to go to the same church and read the same books and newspapers. They could decide that no one could criticize the government or travel from town to town without a passport or quit his job.

Pretty scary isn’t it? Sounds more like Nazi Germany than the United States. And yet you people claim you live in a democracy. Welcome to the cold hard reality of oppressive government.


Yes I know we are a republic, I learned that in the 6th grade. Thanks for trying to educate me Oh Elitest :)
 
dmp said:
You are unreachable. Really. Your mind is so clouded with hatred you cannot see truth or context.
I can see the bible for what it is, which contains both good and bad. You can't, and I'm sorry but it's VERY clearly there, so it isn't my mind which is clouded.
 
theHawk said:
Yes I know we are a republic, I learned that in the 6th grade. Thanks for trying to educate me Oh Elitest :)


Then why do you insist that it's okay to take away rights from others, so long as it's done democratically?

"God forbid you let a democracy choose which laws it wants, in a democratic manner"
 

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