Miracles are proof of SOMETHING!

[LittleNipper]

Miracles happen, and one must face the facts that terrible things happen in this world. And we don't know why. But good things happen too, and one could ask --------- why should they? I came across this movie, based on a true story. I must say I totally forgot that this event happened; however, I cannot even imagine that those who experienced it will ever forget. I believe that very often GOD allows Satan to have his way in order to reach someone. It might be only one person or an entire community but coincidence simply isn't a logical response. An atheist will often point his/her finger and accuse believers of using "GOD" to fill a gap of understanding. However, I have often witnessed atheists use "coincidence" in the very same way... This movie is well worth watching ----- It occurred in Cokeville.

 

[alang1216]

Miracles happen, and one must face the facts that terrible things happen in this world. And we don't know why. But good things happen too, and one could ask --------- why should they? I came across this movie, based on a true story. I must say I totally forgot that this event happened; however, I cannot even imagine that those who experienced it will ever forget. I believe that very often GOD allows Satan to have his way in order to reach someone. It might be only one person or an entire community but coincidence simply isn't a logical response. An atheist will often point his/her finger and accuse believers of using "GOD" to fill a gap of understanding. However, I have often witnessed atheists use "coincidence" in the very same way... This movie is well worth watching ----- It occurred in Cokeville.

I've been around a long time and I've never seen a miracle, or anything supernatural happen. The Bible is filled with miraculous events, what changed?

 

[LittleNipper]

Miracles happen, and one must face the facts that terrible things happen in this world. And we don't know why. But good things happen too, and one could ask --------- why should they? I came across this movie, based on a true story. I must say I totally forgot that this event happened; however, I cannot even imagine that those who experienced it will ever forget. I believe that very often GOD allows Satan to have his way in order to reach someone. It might be only one person or an entire community but coincidence simply isn't a logical response. An atheist will often point his/her finger and accuse believers of using "GOD" to fill a gap of understanding. However, I have often witnessed atheists use "coincidence" in the very same way... This movie is well worth watching ----- It occurred in Cokeville.

I've been around a long time and I've never seen a miracle, or anything supernatural happen. The Bible is filled with miraculous events, what changed?

My best guess is that either you forgot or you were oblivious or a little of both. Miracles happen more often than you think. The accident that could have happened, or the accident one survives. Opportunities that seem to come out of nowhere or choices made that should have turned out worse.

 

[Likkmee]

Miracles happen, and one must face the facts that terrible things happen in this world. And we don't know why. But good things happen too, and one could ask --------- why should they? I came across this movie, based on a true story. I must say I totally forgot that this event happened; however, I cannot even imagine that those who experienced it will ever forget. I believe that very often GOD allows Satan to have his way in order to reach someone. It might be only one person or an entire community but coincidence simply isn't a logical response. An atheist will often point his/her finger and accuse believers of using "GOD" to fill a gap of understanding. However, I have often witnessed atheists use "coincidence" in the very same way... This movie is well worth watching ----- It occurred in Cokeville.

I've been around a long time and I've never seen a miracle, or anything supernatural happen. The Bible is filled with miraculous events, what changed?

Rainbows.

 

[alang1216]

Miracles happen, and one must face the facts that terrible things happen in this world. And we don't know why. But good things happen too, and one could ask --------- why should they? I came across this movie, based on a true story. I must say I totally forgot that this event happened; however, I cannot even imagine that those who experienced it will ever forget. I believe that very often GOD allows Satan to have his way in order to reach someone. It might be only one person or an entire community but coincidence simply isn't a logical response. An atheist will often point his/her finger and accuse believers of using "GOD" to fill a gap of understanding. However, I have often witnessed atheists use "coincidence" in the very same way... This movie is well worth watching ----- It occurred in Cokeville.

I've been around a long time and I've never seen a miracle, or anything supernatural happen. The Bible is filled with miraculous events, what changed?

My best guess is that either you forgot or you were oblivious or a little of both. Miracles happen more often than you think. The accident that could have happened, or the accident one survives. Opportunities that seem to come out of nowhere or choices made that should have turned out worse.

Maybe so. If I flip a coin and get heads 10 out of 10 flips, is that a miracle or just a rare event. To me a miracle is something that has no other explanation.

 

[sealybobo]

I've been around a long time and I've never seen a miracle, or anything supernatural happen. The Bible is filled with miraculous events, what changed?

This baby was taken when someone stole this ladies car. The car was recovered but no baby. Then the baby was recovered safe and sound. The mom says they had a prayer vigil just 2 hours before the baby was found. She believes the prayers worked. That's utter nonsense. If not, everyone who's kid is ever abducted should just hold a prayer vigil. Let's see how many of them are answered. If most are not, what does that say?

Miracles prove god exists?​

Miracles have not been demonstrated to occur. The existence of a miracle would pose logical problems for belief in a god which can supposedly see the future and began the universe with a set of predefined laws. Even if a ‘miracle’ could be demonstrated it would not immediately imply the existence of a god, much less any particular one, as unknown natural processes or agents could still be at work.

Most alleged miracles can be explained as statistically unlikely occurrences. For example, one child surviving a plane crash that kills two hundred others is not a miracle, just as one person winning the lottery is not. In the absence of any empirical evidence, all other claims can be dismissed as the result of magical thinking, misattribution, credulity, hearsay and anecdote. Eye-witness testimony and anecdotal accounts are, by themselves, not reliable or definitive forms of proof for such extraordinary claims.

Divine intervention claims most often concern systems and events for which we have poor predictive capabilities, for example, weather, sports, health and social/economic interactions. Such claims are rarely made in relation to those things we can accurately predict and test e.g. the motion of celestial bodies, boiling point of water and pull of gravity. If a god is constantly intervening in the universe it supposedly created, then it is with such ambiguity as to appear completely indistinguishable from normal background chance.

Note: Theists often fail to adequately apportion blame when claims of their particular god’s ‘infinite mercy’ or ‘omnibenevolence’ involve sparing a few lives in a disaster, or recovery from a debilitating disease – all of which their god would ultimately be responsible for inflicting if it existed.

 

[ding]

This baby was taken when someone stole this ladies car. The car was recovered but no baby. Then the baby was recovered safe and sound. The mom says they had a prayer vigil just 2 hours before the baby was found. She believes the prayers worked. That's utter nonsense. If not, everyone who's kid is ever abducted should just hold a prayer vigil. Let's see how many of them are answered. If most are not, what does that say?

Miracles prove god exists?​

Miracles have not been demonstrated to occur. The existence of a miracle would pose logical problems for belief in a god which can supposedly see the future and began the universe with a set of predefined laws. Even if a ‘miracle’ could be demonstrated it would not immediately imply the existence of a god, much less any particular one, as unknown natural processes or agents could still be at work.

Most alleged miracles can be explained as statistically unlikely occurrences. For example, one child surviving a plane crash that kills two hundred others is not a miracle, just as one person winning the lottery is not. In the absence of any empirical evidence, all other claims can be dismissed as the result of magical thinking, misattribution, credulity, hearsay and anecdote. Eye-witness testimony and anecdotal accounts are, by themselves, not reliable or definitive forms of proof for such extraordinary claims.

Divine intervention claims most often concern systems and events for which we have poor predictive capabilities, for example, weather, sports, health and social/economic interactions. Such claims are rarely made in relation to those things we can accurately predict and test e.g. the motion of celestial bodies, boiling point of water and pull of gravity. If a god is constantly intervening in the universe it supposedly created, then it is with such ambiguity as to appear completely indistinguishable from normal background chance.

Note: Theists often fail to adequately apportion blame when claims of their particular god’s ‘infinite mercy’ or ‘omnibenevolence’ involve sparing a few lives in a disaster, or recovery from a debilitating disease – all of which their god would ultimately be responsible for inflicting if it existed.

I'd say the universe popping into existence from nothing being hardwired to produce life and intelligence qualifies as a miracle. Just as life emerging from inanimate matter is a miracle and Jesus rising from the dead.

 

[Blues Man]

My best guess is that either you forgot or you were oblivious or a little of both. Miracles happen more often than you think. The accident that could have happened, or the accident one survives. Opportunities that seem to come out of nowhere or choices made that should have turned out worse.

Random shit luck isn't a miracle

 

[surada]

I'd say the universe popping into existence from nothing being hardwired to produce life and intelligence qualifies as a miracle. Just as life emerging from inanimate matter is a miracle and Jesus rising from the dead.

Did it pop into existence?

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs | Nature ...

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs | Nature | Nature Portfolio

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs

www.natureasia.com

Aug 26, 2021 · Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs. The skull of a lizard-like reptile from the Triassic of Argentina, dated to be around 231 million years old, sheds light on the origins of the group that gave rise to snakes, lizards and tuataras. The fossil is described in this week’s Nature…

 

[ding]

Did it pop into existence?

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs | Nature ...

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs | Nature | Nature Portfolio

Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs

www.natureasia.com

Aug 26, 2021 · Palaeontology: The rise of the lepidosaurs. The skull of a lizard-like reptile from the Triassic of Argentina, dated to be around 231 million years old, sheds light on the origins of the group that gave rise to snakes, lizards and tuataras. The fossil is described in this week’s Nature…

100%

Maybe you have heard about it. Its called the Big Bang.

We know from science that space and time had a beginning. Specifically, red shift, cosmic background radiation, Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations, quantum mechanics, the First Law of Thermodynamics, the Second Law of Thermodynamics and Inflation Theory.

Red shift, cosmic background radiation and Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations tells us that all matter and energy in the universe once occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of an atom and then began to expand and cool. The the First Law of Thermodynamics (i.e. conservation of energy) tells us that since that time matter and energy has only changed form. Which means that the atoms in our bodies were created from nothing when space and and time were created from nothing.

Red shift, cosmic background radiation, Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations and the Second Law of Thermodynamics tells us that space and time did have a beginning. If the universe is expanding then it must have a beginning. If you follow it backwards in time, then any object must come to a boundary of space time. You cannot continue that history indefinitely. This is still true even if a universe has periods of contraction. It still has to have a beginning if expansion over weights the contraction. Physicists have been uncomfortable with the idea of a beginning since the work of Friedman which showed that the solutions of Einstein's equation showed that the universe had a beginning. The problem with a cyclical universe is with the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics. For every matter to energy or energy to matter exchange there is a loss of usable energy. So while the total energy of the universe does not decrease, the usable energy of the universe does decrease. If it is a periodic or cyclical universe then the entropy will increase with each cycle. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics is a fundamental law of nature which tells us that entropy can only increase or stay the same. Entropy can never decrease. Which means that in a finite amount of time, a finite system will reach a maximum state of disorder which is called thermal equilibrium and then it will stay in that state. A cyclical universe cannot avoid this problem. Since we do not see thermal equilibrium (good thing too because there would be no life) we know that the universe did have a beginning.

Inflation Theory, the First Law of Thermodynamics and quantum mechanics tells us that it is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics - out of nothing. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

 

[surada]

100%

Maybe you have heard about it. Its called the Big Bang.

We know from science that space and time had a beginning. Specifically, red shift, cosmic background radiation, Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations, quantum mechanics, the First Law of Thermodynamics, the Second Law of Thermodynamics and Inflation Theory.

Red shift, cosmic background radiation and Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations tells us that all matter and energy in the universe once occupied the space of 1 billionth of 1 trillionth the size of an atom and then began to expand and cool. The the First Law of Thermodynamics (i.e. conservation of energy) tells us that since that time matter and energy has only changed form. Which means that the atoms in our bodies were created from nothing when space and and time were created from nothing.

Red shift, cosmic background radiation, Friedmann's solutions to Einstein's field equations and the Second Law of Thermodynamics tells us that space and time did have a beginning. If the universe is expanding then it must have a beginning. If you follow it backwards in time, then any object must come to a boundary of space time. You cannot continue that history indefinitely. This is still true even if a universe has periods of contraction. It still has to have a beginning if expansion over weights the contraction. Physicists have been uncomfortable with the idea of a beginning since the work of Friedman which showed that the solutions of Einstein's equation showed that the universe had a beginning. The problem with a cyclical universe is with the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics. For every matter to energy or energy to matter exchange there is a loss of usable energy. So while the total energy of the universe does not decrease, the usable energy of the universe does decrease. If it is a periodic or cyclical universe then the entropy will increase with each cycle. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics is a fundamental law of nature which tells us that entropy can only increase or stay the same. Entropy can never decrease. Which means that in a finite amount of time, a finite system will reach a maximum state of disorder which is called thermal equilibrium and then it will stay in that state. A cyclical universe cannot avoid this problem. Since we do not see thermal equilibrium (good thing too because there would be no life) we know that the universe did have a beginning.

Inflation Theory, the First Law of Thermodynamics and quantum mechanics tells us that it is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics - out of nothing. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

Right ... 260 million years ago.

 

[sealybobo]

I'd say the universe popping into existence from nothing being hardwired to produce life and intelligence qualifies as a miracle. Just as life emerging from inanimate matter is a miracle and Jesus rising from the dead.

Nope. All scientifically explained.Just statistically unlikely occurrences.

I'd say the universe popping into existence from nothing being hardwired to produce life and intelligence qualifies as a miracle. Just as life emerging from inanimate matter is a miracle and Jesus rising from the dead.

Statistically unlikely occurrences.

And Jesus didn’t rise from the dead after being dead for three days. Now you’re talking crazy.

...all other claims can be dismissed as the result of magical thinking, misattribution, credulity, hearsay and anecdote. Eye-witness testimony and anecdotal accounts are, by themselves, not reliable or definitive forms of proof for such extraordinary claims.

 

[ding]

Nope. All scientifically explained.Just statistically unlikely occurrences.

Statistically unlikely occurrences.

And Jesus didn’t rise from the dead after being dead for three days. Now you’re talking crazy.

...all other claims can be dismissed as the result of magical thinking, misattribution, credulity, hearsay and anecdote. Eye-witness testimony and anecdotal accounts are, by themselves, not reliable or definitive forms of proof for such extraordinary claims.

OK, scientifically prove why the universe wasn't created with exactly the same amount of matter and anti-matter?

Then you can prove how exactly the right chains of organic compounds folded themselves in exactly the right sequence to producer life.

Then you can refute the 24,000 written manuscripts chronicled how Jesus did rise from the dead, Patrick.

 

[ding]

Right ... 260 million years ago.

The universe was created from nothing ~14 billion years ago, dear.

 

[Blues Man]

OK, scientifically prove why the universe wasn't created with exactly the same amount of matter and anti-matter?

Then you can prove how exactly the right chains of organic compounds folded themselves in exactly the right sequence to producer life.

Then you can refute the 24,000 written manuscripts chronicled how Jesus did rise from the dead, Patrick.

Matter and antimatter were produced in pairs.

We don't yet know exactly why the asymmetry happened but there is research that has shown that quarks and antiquarks have different decay rates.

What Happened to All of the Universe's Antimatter?

Differences between matter and antimatter could help explain why the cosmos mostly lacks the latter today, researchers say

www.scientificamerican.com

Scientists are holding out hope of finding much larger matter-antimatter differences elsewhere, such as in ghostly particles called neutrinos or reactions involving the Higgs boson—the particle that gives others mass—says LHCb team member Sheldon Stone of Syracuse University: “There are lots of different searches going on.”

 

[alang1216]

The universe was created from nothing ~14 billion years ago, dear.

This is based on the present state of our scientific knowledge, knowledge we KNOW is incomplete. Just because we don't know what preceded the Big Bang doesn't mean it was nothing. You are engaging in a 'God of the Gaps' argument.

 

[alang1216]

Then you can refute the 24,000 written manuscripts chronicled how Jesus did rise from the dead, Patrick.

Can you reconcile the 24,000 stories into a single, non-contradictory story?

 

[Blues Man]

This is based on the present state of our scientific knowledge, knowledge we KNOW is incomplete. Just because we don't know what preceded the Big Bang doesn't mean it was nothing. You are engaging in a 'God of the Gaps' argument.

And we only have an understanding of about 5% of all the mater and energy in the universe.

 

[jehanne1431]

Miracles have not been demonstrated to occur... Even if a ‘miracle’ could be demonstrated it would not immediately imply the existence of a god, much less any particular one, as unknown natural processes or agents could still be at work.

No. There comes a point where right reason and basic understanding of laws in the universe rule out your claim “unknown natural processes or agents could still be at work.” The reason we know God exists and that He is the Judeo-Christian God is because the preponderance of evidence is overwhelming throughout history. All of the great miracles are Christian, not Hindu, not Islam, not nobody. Man’s greatest sin is his choice to not want to know the truth. He feels more comfortable on the outside, hanging with his friends, having fun, and surmising we are all pretty good guys, if there is a God I doubt we will be punished severely. That is my take on it.

Explain to me how this did not happen? Explain to me how it did happen. >>>Fatima, Portugal 1917: 3 shepherd children no older than 9 keep having the Virgin Mary appear to them each month. On July 13th Mary says to the children to tell all the villagers that on October 13th the Lord will perform a sign so all present will know my words are from heaven. ---- On that EXACT DAY the children predicted it would occur, it does. 70,000 country folk slog through mud and rain to witness this prophecy. As soon as the children arrive Lucia points to the sky and the sun splits open the dark gray skies and begins to defy cosmic laws. It bounces, zig zags and twirls shooting multi-colored rays across the entire landscape changing the land and people’s faces from blue to red to yellow, etc. All can stare at the sun without any damage to their eyes. This lasts for 12 minutes when finally the suns turns blood red, grows into an enormous size and charges the earth terrifying the entire crowd. At the last moment it stops, recedes and all is peaceful. ------ Marxist journalists there to mock the event admit the truth in their Lisbon newspaper. Eye witnesses from atheists to skeptic scientists and doctors all testify to what was so incredible and factual. That being, something supernatural just gripped us all!

To sum:

Fact: 3 Portuguese shepherd children insist the Virgin Mary is visiting them on the 13th every month in 1917.

Fact: By July 13 hundreds of villagers witness the children in ecstasy. The children report that the Virgin Mary told them she will perform a miracle on October 13 so all those present will see the miracle and then know the words given to these children are from God.

Fact: By August these accounts have become so well known across Portugal that local govt officials kidnap the children and hold them in jail for three days and threaten with death in order to get them to recant their story. They do not recant the townspeople riot so the officials finally let them go.

Fact: On October 13th it is extremely rainy and muddy. Estimates center around 70,000 people who walk for many, many miles across Portugual to be witness to this prophecy.

Fact: Also present in this crowd are hundreds of atheists or unbelievers including scientists, doctors, lawyers and Marxist journalists for the Lison paper “O Seculo” there to mock this whole event.

Fact: It is both written testimonies and filmed interviews of scores of eye witnesses testifying to what they saw. And all those testimonies concur they saw the same thing. It includes an eyewitness account by Dr. José Maria de Almeida Garrett, professor at the Faculty of Sciences of Coimbra, Portugal and the communist reporter Avelino de Almeida for "O Seculo." Many others including eye witnesses 10 and 20 miles away from the site who testified to seeing the sun dance and change colors.

Fact: After about 12 minutes the sun recedes into its normal state and all of the people realized their soaked clothes and muddy, soaked ground were bone dry. According to science commentators, the people would have been burned up for soaked clothes and ground to be made dry that quickly.

Fact: The children said the Virgin Mary told them the two children, Francisco and Jacinta, would soon be taken to heaven, but Lucia would live for a long time. Fact: Both Francisco and Jacinta were dead within two years of that date and Lucia lived until she was 95.

Final Fact: On July 13 these Fatima children predicted a miracle would occur on October 13. And 90 days later, it does on that exact day! That fact alone is the deal breaker. Or is everyone a liar? Including those who witnessed it 20 miles away?

Everything I called a fact can easily be researched and verified as facts. A supernatural encounter happened with the Virgin Mary and everything Jesus. There is no other religion or belief that has ever produced miracles this giant and profound and prophesied in advance. Christianity and the one true God have manifested this way on countless other occasions. This the empirical evidence the skeptic demands. But when they are given it, then they want another example. Well there are many documented miracles. I really do not think they want another.

 

[ding]

Matter and antimatter were produced in pairs.

We don't yet know exactly why the asymmetry happened but there is research that has shown that quarks and antiquarks have different decay rates.

What Happened to All of the Universe's Antimatter?

Differences between matter and antimatter could help explain why the cosmos mostly lacks the latter today, researchers say

www.scientificamerican.com

Scientists are holding out hope of finding much larger matter-antimatter differences elsewhere, such as in ghostly particles called neutrinos or reactions involving the Higgs boson—the particle that gives others mass—says LHCb team member Sheldon Stone of Syracuse University: “There are lots of different searches going on.”

Exactly. That's my point. Matter and antimatter are produced in pairs. The miracle is that they weren't.