Minimum wage rate and labors’ market prices.

[basquebromance]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

 

[danielpalos]

Again only in left wing fantasy would people want to pay more for the same thing.

If you had been paying attention, you would know inflation happens regardless. The minimum wage would be around eighteen dollars an hour if it had kept up with inflation. Who are you helping with wages being relatively stagnant regardless of inflation? Increasing the cost of services but not increasing wages on helps employers bottom line, it does not help the people who are working.

 

[danielpalos]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

 

[Supposn]

it's the CBO's opinion,
Yes, a tiny percent of workers would get a tiny increase.
those effects would range from critical to substantial.
Yeah, $500-$600......yawn.

Toddsterpatriot, yours is an interesting point of view. You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration? Respectfully, Supposn

Toddsterpatriot, CBO’s study indicates that increasing the minimum rate to $15 per hour by 2025 would increase lowest wage rate employees’ purchasing powers by an ADDITIONAL 5.3%.

It’s CBO’s considered opinion that the federal minimum wage rate increases the purchasing power of all aggregate wage rates within what they consider to be within the lower rate bracket of wages. If the federal minimum wage rate is not increased, (i.e. if it remains at $7.25 per hour) in 2025, they consider less than $20 per hour will be the lower rate bracket in 2025.
Failure to increase the minimum rate by 2025 would detrimentally affect lower-rate bracket’s purchasing powers, and those effects would range from critical to substantial.
It is you that misunderstands CBO’s publications regarding the federal minimum wage rate. ...

 

[Wyatt earp]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

it's the CBO's opinion,
Yes, a tiny percent of workers would get a tiny increase.
those effects would range from critical to substantial.
Yeah, $500-$600......yawn.

Toddsterpatriot, yours is an interesting point of view. You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration? Respectfully, Supposn

Toddsterpatriot, CBO’s study indicates that increasing the minimum rate to $15 per hour by 2025 would increase lowest wage rate employees’ purchasing powers by an ADDITIONAL 5.3%.

It’s CBO’s considered opinion that the federal minimum wage rate increases the purchasing power of all aggregate wage rates within what they consider to be within the lower rate bracket of wages. If the federal minimum wage rate is not increased, (i.e. if it remains at $7.25 per hour) in 2025, they consider less than $20 per hour will be the lower rate bracket in 2025.
Failure to increase the minimum rate by 2025 would detrimentally affect lower-rate bracket’s purchasing powers, and those effects would range from critical to substantial.
It is you that misunderstands CBO’s publications regarding the federal minimum wage rate. ...

You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration?

Hardly. I consider your obsession with the bottom 1.5% of hourly earners.....amusing.

And your claim that an average $600 increase in real income is critical or substantial.....ridiculous.

 

[danielpalos]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy

That happens because the minimum wage was not adjusted for inflation. According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation. How many people would be in poverty and needing social services if the minimum wage were eighteen dollars an hour now?

According to one estimate the current minimum wage of 7.25 an hour generates approximately 194 dollars per year in federal income tax revenue.

At 15 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 1,852 dollars per year. More than nine times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

At 18 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 2,554 dollars per year. More than thirteen times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

Income Tax Calculator - USA - Salary After Taxes

neuvoo™ 【 Online Salary and Tax Calculator 】 provides your income after tax if you work in USA. We calculate how much your payroll will be after tax deductions in any region. Find your net pay for any salary. Our data is based on 2020 tax tables from USA

neuvoo.com

Anyone complaining the Poor do not pay enough in federal income tax should simply raise the minimum wage until they do.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy

That happens because the minimum wage was not adjusted for inflation. According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation. How many people would be in poverty and needing social services if the minimum wage were eighteen dollars an hour now?

According to one estimate the current minimum wage of 7.25 an hour generates approximately 194 dollars per year in federal income tax revenue.

At 15 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 1,852 dollars per year. More than nine times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

At 18 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 2,554 dollars per year. More than thirteen times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

Income Tax Calculator - USA - Salary After Taxes

neuvoo™ 【 Online Salary and Tax Calculator 】 provides your income after tax if you work in USA. We calculate how much your payroll will be after tax deductions in any region. Find your net pay for any salary. Our data is based on 2020 tax tables from USA

neuvoo.com

Anyone complaining the Poor do not pay enough in federal income tax should simply raise the minimum wage until they do.

According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation.

From what starting point in what year?

 

[Supposn]

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy.

Bear513, why do you consider world’s so radically different elsewhere, or at other times? Everyone in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics did not enjoy the similar incomes, their families did not accumulate similar wealth, and those that could afford the costs were able to obtain whatever they could afford. Why do you believe that great disparity of incomes and living standards are exclusive characteristics of more capitalistic economies? Respectfully, Supposn

 

[danielpalos]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy

That happens because the minimum wage was not adjusted for inflation. According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation. How many people would be in poverty and needing social services if the minimum wage were eighteen dollars an hour now?

According to one estimate the current minimum wage of 7.25 an hour generates approximately 194 dollars per year in federal income tax revenue.

At 15 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 1,852 dollars per year. More than nine times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

At 18 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 2,554 dollars per year. More than thirteen times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

Income Tax Calculator - USA - Salary After Taxes

neuvoo™ 【 Online Salary and Tax Calculator 】 provides your income after tax if you work in USA. We calculate how much your payroll will be after tax deductions in any region. Find your net pay for any salary. Our data is based on 2020 tax tables from USA

neuvoo.com

Anyone complaining the Poor do not pay enough in federal income tax should simply raise the minimum wage until they do.

According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation.

From what starting point in what year?

Here is some clarification for the minimum wage debate. I had a difficult time finding it again. The minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour by 2025.

The Raise the Wage Act passed by the House on July 18 would implement the latter strategy. But even though that represents the more aggressive indexing approach, the starting point for the new wage floor will have effectively fallen 20% since the debate began in earnest. By 2025, a $15-an-hour wage would be the equivalent of $11.93 in 2012, when the Fight for $15 movement started. To truly reflect the original demand for $15, the Raise the Wage Act would need to call for $18.87 in 2025.--https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2019-minimum-wage-increase-inflation/

 

[Supposn]

You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration?

Hardly. I consider your obsession with the bottom 1.5% of hourly earners.....amusing.
And your claim that an average $600 increase in real income is critical or substantial.....ridiculous.

Toddsterpatriot, your denial of CBO’s opinion, should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences upon 32% of USA’s work force would range from critically to substantially detrimental, is what’s ridiculous. Respectfully, Supposn

 

[Andylusion]

Minimum wage rate and labors’ market prices.

Products “Market prices” are affecting by various factors. Enforcement of government laws affecting regarding trade or contracts regarding a product, is often such a price affecting factor. Those using the term ‘market rates” applicable to a legally enforced minimum wage rate within a marketplace, are referring to a theoretical, indefinite, (i.e. not actually existing) price that excludes governments’ minimum wage laws as not existing.

Regardless of some persons preferences, governments’ minimum wage laws are existing factors applicable within marketplaces. Respectfully, Supposn

I'm not sure what your point is. Yes, the minimum wage is a factor in the market.

As I assume you are aware, we support a "free-market", which means not having controls on what voluntary exchanges people engage in, which would include the voluntary exchange of labor for pay.

Regardless, it is exactly because "Market prices" are affected by various factors including, but not limited to the minimum wage..... is exactly why we oppose the minimum wage.

If market prices were NOT affected by the minimum wage, then everyone would support a minimum wage. In fact, we would support a $100/hour minimum wage.

After all, why not?

But as you yourself just pointed out, people make contracts, and change their spending, and market choices, based on (among other things) the minimum wage.

That's the whole problem.

Years ago, on Huffington post, I came across this article written by a mother who was appalled by high babysitting prices. All she wants to do is go out with her husband, for a nice dinner, for barely 2 hours. And they wanted $200.

For what exactly? Sitting on the couch, while the kids watch netflix, and they text on their phone for 2 hours?

To heat up in a microwave, a meal she the mother had spent an time preparing?

Then she said something that is obvious to any free-market capitalist.

She said, with prices that high, it simply isn't worth it to hire a babysitter.

Instead, she will either simply not go out for the evening, or she will do kid swaps. A kids swap is where you make an agreement with another family, that you'll take their kids, so they can go out... .and then later they'll take your kids, so you can go out.

Yeah.... that's how it works. If the cost of the labor, simply don't make enough value to be worth it.... $200 for two hours away from home... Then you don't buy the labor.

If the minimum wage, is too expensive compared to the value of the labor, then you don't buy the labor.

That's the problem. The minimum wage doesn't increase the value of the labor. A burger flipper is not magically producing $50,000 a year in value, because you made the "living wage" $50,000 a year. (or whatever arbitrary number you make up).

And the result is, you cut off the bottom rung of the economic ladder. How do you get from being a burger flipper, to earning a decent wage? You have to work your way up.

I had a guy I knew who started off as a part time employee of an auto parts store. Part time at the store was $8/hour. Today, he is now a branch store manager, making $60,000 a year.

If you had made the minimum wage $15/hours, they likely would never have hired him, and he wouldn't be where he is today.

 

[Andylusion]

You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration?

Hardly. I consider your obsession with the bottom 1.5% of hourly earners.....amusing.
And your claim that an average $600 increase in real income is critical or substantial.....ridiculous.

Toddsterpatriot, your denial of CBO’s opinion, should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences upon 32% of USA’s work force would range from critically to substantially detrimental, is what’s ridiculous. Respectfully, Supposn

The CBO is wrong.

All you need to do is start looking at the world around you, and stop wasting your time with politically motivated crap.

First Example: Greece.

Before the crash, Greece had a minimum wage indexed to inflation. Every year the unemployment rate increased, until they cut the minimum wage in 2010. In 2011, the unemployment rate went down.

Why is that? Because the value of the labor was too low compared to the minimum wage, thus people were not employed. As soon as they cut the minimum wage, where employers could pay people less, for less value created... they employed people.

There are hundreds of examples.

By your logic, every single country and city that has super high minimum wages, should economic booms, and massive influxes of people.

Instead what do we see. NYC $15/hour minimum wage. Population is declining. Crisis in the commercial real estate market. Empty stores. And this was before Corona.

Why? Can't pay people $15/hour to ask if you want fries with that.

There is no such example anywhere, of any country, raising the minimum wage to prosperity. None.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You consider 32% percent if USA’s employees as beneath serious consideration?

Hardly. I consider your obsession with the bottom 1.5% of hourly earners.....amusing.
And your claim that an average $600 increase in real income is critical or substantial.....ridiculous.

Toddsterpatriot, your denial of CBO’s opinion, should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences upon 32% of USA’s work force would range from critically to substantially detrimental, is what’s ridiculous. Respectfully, Supposn

should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences upon 32% of USA’s work force would range from critically to substantially detrimental, is what’s ridiculous.

$600, not critical. At all.

Your hyperbole is hysterical.

 

[Supposn]

... Regardless of some persons preferences, governments’ minimum wage laws are existing factors applicable within marketplaces. ...

Andylusion, U.S. federal law prohibits paying less than the applicable federal minimum rate and although it does not determine wage differentials, (due to employer’s common practices) it does affect other wage rates, but it doesn’t affect them all equally. The extents of its effects are inversely related to the difference between the minimum and jobs’ rates; (i.e. it’s of greater benefit to lower, and of lesser benefit to higher wage rates).

All nation governments able to reasonably enforce their laws, have something similar to, and/or serving the purpose of our federal minimum wage rate. The alternative would too often be suffering the economic detriments of wage rates being driven down to drastically poor purchasing powers. Respectfully, Supposn

 

[Supposn]

Toddsterpatriot, your denial of CBO’s opinion, should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences [due to not increasing the minimum rate, would, upon 32% of USA’s work force], range from critically to substantially detrimental ...

Respectfully, Supposn

 

[Oldestyle]

The minimum wage should be zero , I was just reading an article no where in the USA can a person afford a one bedroom apartment on minimum wage..so the $12 dollar minimum wage in Seattle is useless.

The minimum wage should be higher than the cost of social services, around fourteen dollars an hour. It is a reason for a fifteen dollar an hour minimum wage. If the minimum wage had kept up with inflation it would be eighteen dollars an hour, according some literature I have read.

You're an idiot when it comes to economics, Daniel! If you actually read up on THAT instead of whatever liberal propaganda told you raising the minimum wage would be "good" for entry level workers you'd be far smarter than you are!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Toddsterpatriot, your denial of CBO’s opinion, should the federal minimum wage rate not be increased by 2025, the financial consequences [due to not increasing the minimum rate, would, upon 32% of USA’s work force], range from critically to substantially detrimental ...

Respectfully, Supposn

$600, not critical. At all.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Swiss city of Geneva to raise minimum wage to 4 thousand bucks a month, that's 25 bucks an hour

Swiss city Geneva to introduce a minimum wage of over $4,000 a month

The Swiss city of Geneva is to introduce a minimum wage of 23 Swiss francs ($25) an hour, equal to roughly 3,772 Swiss francs ($4,100) a month for a 41-hour work week.

www.cnbc.com

And guess what? They are still poor

But they are not in poverty and should need less social services which should mean less government. Smaller government, only right wingers complain about it on a for-profit basis.

People making minimum wage always was in poverty, always will be in poverty, look at your mother Russia when everyone was making the same wage no products on the shelf, nothing to buy

That happens because the minimum wage was not adjusted for inflation. According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation. How many people would be in poverty and needing social services if the minimum wage were eighteen dollars an hour now?

According to one estimate the current minimum wage of 7.25 an hour generates approximately 194 dollars per year in federal income tax revenue.

At 15 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 1,852 dollars per year. More than nine times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

At 18 dollars an hour the federal income tax generated would be approximately 2,554 dollars per year. More than thirteen times the amount generated by the current minimum wage.

Income Tax Calculator - USA - Salary After Taxes

neuvoo™ 【 Online Salary and Tax Calculator 】 provides your income after tax if you work in USA. We calculate how much your payroll will be after tax deductions in any region. Find your net pay for any salary. Our data is based on 2020 tax tables from USA

neuvoo.com

Anyone complaining the Poor do not pay enough in federal income tax should simply raise the minimum wage until they do.

According some current literature, the minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour if adjusted for inflation.

From what starting point in what year?

Here is some clarification for the minimum wage debate. I had a difficult time finding it again. The minimum wage should be around eighteen dollars an hour by 2025.

The Raise the Wage Act passed by the House on July 18 would implement the latter strategy. But even though that represents the more aggressive indexing approach, the starting point for the new wage floor will have effectively fallen 20% since the debate began in earnest. By 2025, a $15-an-hour wage would be the equivalent of $11.93 in 2012, when the Fight for $15 movement started. To truly reflect the original demand for $15, the Raise the Wage Act would need to call for $18.87 in 2025.--https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2019-minimum-wage-increase-inflation/

Democratic Rep. Keith Ellison claimed Tuesday that the federal minimum wage from 1968 would be nearly $12 an hour today if adjusted for inflation.


Verdict: True

The minimum wage had its strongest purchasing power in 1968, equivalent to $11.65 an hour in 2018 dollars. Some workers were only eligible for a second, lower minimum wage equal to $8.37 an hour today.

FACT CHECK: How Much Would The 1968 Minimum Wage Be Worth Today?

The minimum wage is currently $7.25 an hour

checkyourfact.com

Looks like you were way off.

 

[Supposn]

... I had a guy I knew who started off as a part time employee of an auto parts store. Part time at the store was $8/hour. Today, he is now a branch store manager, making $60,000 a year.

If you had made the minimum wage $15/hours, they likely would never have hired him, and he wouldn't be where he is today.

Andylusion, if the minimum wage were $15 per hour, and an employer would not choose to hire “your guy” because he was over-priced, who would have been hired to manage the store?

{A} One alternative would be to close-down that retail outlet, which brings up another alternative. Other higher retail volume outlets could afford to pay their manager’s higher wages, because their higher payroll costs are justified by their lesser overhead costs per sales dollars. They'll "capture" much of the closed store's lost sales.

The store owners reduces their store’s hours and overhead, when sales volume’s do not justify the ($15/Hr. overhead). In such a case, competitors such as that of alternative [A] will capture those lost sales volumes.

[C] other methods of goods distribution, such as internet sales and home delivery, or sales through larger 24-hour supermarkets may be tried.

Within competitive open markets, (even in those markets affected by the federal minimum wage rate), the economy adjusts, everything’s in flux and subject to changes. There’s little that remains unchanged forever. Respectfully, Supossn