Libertarianism Is A Joke

[buckeye45_73]

Beavis and Butt head are smarter than both those guys.

Social Security is as of right now is going to be bankrupt by 2034, but Medicare will be by 2026. How they will find Medicare I don't know one solution will probably be pull from SS which means it will be bankrupt before then.

The easiest argument against Social Security: where is it mentioned specifically in the Constitution?

What do we do with those who "lose": that's an individual state issue

Lots of things aren't mentioned specifically in the Constitution. So. what?

It's about what the government CAN'T do, not what they CAN. Isn't that the general rightwing trope?

trope? you don't believe that? Do tell

Why not address the message of my post...hmm!?!??

Well, you called it trope. We can't have a conversation if you don't state your belief. I do believe it's a list of things the govt can't do, you?

 

[MarcATL]

Right and according to the 10th amendment that means it is a state issue.

So libertarians would be OK with a State version of social security?

 

[MarcATL]

Nothing, it's a silly talk show call in video with a bunch of hamsters trying to create an infotainment piece to feed the confirmation bias of a target audience and given your reaction, it worked.

If you want to learn about libertarianism, read the works of serious libertarians, if you want to be an ignorant sheeple keep letting videos like this one formulate your opinions for you.

Address my entire OP.

Where has libertarianism worked in the world?

Point me to a country where it has.

 

[Mac1958]

I used to like having them around as an important and perfectly reasonable reminder that we have to be careful with the size, scope and cost of government.

But then, libertarian fiscal policy essentially took over one of the major parties and created this wave of binary, simplistic, Old West, anti-government, every-man-for-himself thinking that simply ignores the legitimate needs of too many people in the most prosperous country on the planet.

In small doses, it's an interesting study. As a large-scale philosophy for a civilized society, not so much.
.

Why is it the most prosperous country on the planet? Could it have something to do with, more than any other society in history, how people were in charge of their own destiny? The idea that individuals own the fruits of their own labor and can't have stolen from them for some collective good? The idea that you get to keep what you earn.

The answer is yes, it does. Those are libertarian principles. Anything has it's pros and it's cons and there's certainly side effects and cons to that kind of ideal where greed informs decisions that hurt people. No doubt. But the fact remains that the more you shackle individual right and opportunity, the poorer a society becomes. What people fail to realize is that the best check on big corporations is the freedom for people to get into a market to address where those big corporations either under serve or inadequately serve.

I actually don't disagree with any of that. Our prosperity is due in large part to the dynamic innovation that is the result of "free" markets, capitalism, less government interference and competition.

At the same time, capitalism is a system. And with any system, there will be people who simply have the capacity, the organic aptitude, to take far more advantage of it than others. So our task, then, is to find a point of equilibrium at which both dynamic innovation and protections and safety nets can exist.

There are two very good reasons why we'd want to find this point of equilibrium: First, those with this increased capacity were lucky enough to have been born here, and not in Haiti or Jordan. A civilized society owes it to itself to provide for the least of its citizens, out of sheer decency. But also, if wealth disparities become too grotesque, at some point there is going to be a reaction. So maintaining a decent safety net might be considered an insurance policy for maintaining what we want.
.

 

[MarcATL]

Legalizing the sale of marijuana.

And is that something, in your mind, that's contrary to libertarian principles?

 

[Some Guy]

I used to like having them around as an important and perfectly reasonable reminder that we have to be careful with the size, scope and cost of government.

But then, libertarian fiscal policy essentially took over one of the major parties and created this wave of binary, simplistic, Old West, anti-government, every-man-for-himself thinking that simply ignores the legitimate needs of too many people in the most prosperous country on the planet.

In small doses, it's an interesting study. As a large-scale philosophy for a civilized society, not so much.
.

Why is it the most prosperous country on the planet? Could it have something to do with, more than any other society in history, how people were in charge of their own destiny? The idea that individuals own the fruits of their own labor and can't have stolen from them for some collective good? The idea that you get to keep what you earn.

The answer is yes, it does. Those are libertarian principles. Anything has it's pros and it's cons and there's certainly side effects and cons to that kind of ideal where greed informs decisions that hurt people. No doubt. But the fact remains that the more you shackle individual right and opportunity, the poorer a society becomes. What people fail to realize is that the best check on big corporations is the freedom for people to get into a market to address where those big corporations either under serve or inadequately serve.

I actually don't disagree with any of that. Our prosperity is due in large part to the dynamic innovation that is the result of "free" markets, capitalism, less government interference and competition.

At the same time, capitalism is a system. And with any system, there will be people who simply have the capacity, the organic aptitude, to take far more advantage of it than others. So our task, then, is to find a point of equilibrium at which both dynamic innovation and protections and safety nets can exist.

There are two very good reasons why we'd want to find this point of equilibrium: First, those with this increased capacity were lucky enough to have been born here, and not in Haiti or Jordan. A civilized society owes it to itself to provide for the least of its citizens, out of sheer decency. But also, if wealth disparities become too grotesque, at some point there is going to be a reaction. So maintaining a decent safety net might be considered an insurance policy for maintaining what we want.
.

Luckily enough, capitalism has provided us with the best check to scrupulous capitalism: information sharing. With information so much more distributed to people rather than singular outlets like newpapers and broadcast companies, it's harder than ever to get away with doing something like dumping waste into a river or something like that. A populous that's aware of what's going is best informed to make buying decisions. The companies that aren't poisoning people, aren't polluting, aren't screwing people over in some form or fashion... those are the ones that'll do better so long as the public values that.

With regard to public value, that does have to do education which is another topic entirely, but it's illustrative that everything really comes down to individuals being the best individuals they can. If people take responsibility for themselves, they'll be better people, both in being informed and also in how to treat others. That self ownership and self responsibility is rather central to libertarianism. The only way you could be against self-ownership is if you're lazy or think people are too stupid to take care of themselves.

 

[buckeye45_73]

LOL, libertarianism isn't a form a government, it's a philosophy based on the non-aggression principle.

That's even worse!

It's a buncha school-boy academic mumbu-jumbo nonsense that's being peddled as serious policy.

Dayum!

says the guy that supports socialism with its dismal failure seen every day for decades.

What about corp tax abatements and farm subsidizes and bank socialism. What is ok for the capitalists is not ok for the working poor, disabled, or seniors.

What is bank socialism?
farm subsidies, I'm not for, but if we had more open markets (ie what Trump is trying to do) we should be able to lower or remove these subsidies.
and tax abatements are for property taxes correct? That's a local issue. Again, I'm for lower taxes.

 

[Penelope]

LOL, libertarianism isn't a form a government, it's a philosophy based on the non-aggression principle.

That's even worse!

It's a buncha school-boy academic mumbu-jumbo nonsense that's being peddled as serious policy.

Dayum!

says the guy that supports socialism with its dismal failure seen every day for decades.

What about corp tax abatements and farm subsidizes and bank socialism. What is ok for the capitalists is not ok for the working poor, disabled, or seniors.

What is bank socialism?
farm subsidies, I'm not for, but if we had more open markets (ie what Trump is trying to do) we should be able to lower or remove these subsidies.
and tax abatements are for property taxes correct? That's a local issue. Again, I'm for lower taxes.

The farmers have to receive subsidies forever and also corps , even Trump got tax abatements, and also the bank subsidies is what Bush Jr caused. 700 billion.
Bush signs $700 billion financial bailout bill

 

[Votto]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

Libertarians promote a limited government.

So how then do they gain power? What large group of people and money do they use to obtain power and then secure power? What large army do they raise and fund to overthrow a government?

Libertarians are the political conscience around the globe. They simply point to the abuses of those who are consumed with power and critique them, assuming they are not murdered for it.

 

[Norman]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

 

[Votto]

I never understood their anti abortion stance . I thought they were ANYTHING GOES !

Not all do. Those who view unborn babies as human naturally oppose abortion.

I don't know of any libertarian who wants to legalize murder.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

I believe I have watched at least 20 videos of Sam Seder embarrassing libertarians ...and whenever they get asked "why hasn't a libertarian form of government ever existed in history" -- they have a total hissy fit

"You can't say it will never work if you don't try it Sam!!!!!!"

 

[initforme]

It's no less legit than being an ultra left crybaby kook or an ultra right 1 percent lover. It's a philosophy is all. But one just had to take a stand right? Comical.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

the US was never libertarian --- but its ok if you want to make up that fantasy..

and if you think Sam is a moron, that is ok too --- I already know why you think that, which makes you more of the moron -- were you on the side of the "master race" caller?

 

[Norman]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

the US was never libertarian --- but its ok if you want to make up that fantasy..

and if you think Sam is a moron, that is ok too --- I already know why you think that, which makes you more of the moron -- were you on the side of the "master race" caller?

Yes it was. Tax rate at 5% constitutes minarchism.

Sam Seder made himself look like a moron in that discussion. "IQ tests only measures how well you do on the given test". Well yes Seder, and breathalyzer test also only measure how well you do on the test.

 

[Votto]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

the US was never libertarian --- but its ok if you want to make up that fantasy..

and if you think Sam is a moron, that is ok too --- I already know why you think that, which makes you more of the moron -- were you on the side of the "master race" caller?

I would say that the ancient Hebrew nation was the closest to a Libertarian government.

There was no king. All you had were judges throughout the community to try and maintain peace and order.

But in 1 Samuel 8, we see the people clamoring for a king. God responds that it is He who they are rejecting as their king, and tells the people he will grant their wish but will first warn them as to the abuses they will encounter with sinful man being put in charge of the roost.

The people would not listen and still demanded a king. After this happened, the nation quickly spiraled into nothingness until their nation was gone.

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

the US was never libertarian --- but its ok if you want to make up that fantasy..

and if you think Sam is a moron, that is ok too --- I already know why you think that, which makes you more of the moron -- were you on the side of the "master race" caller?

Yes it was. Tax rate at 5% constitutes minarchism.

A libertarian government has never existed in history, especially American history -- and did you say "5% tax rate" proves that the US was libertarian?

Libertarians are against paying ANY tax to a centralized government, remember?

Or is this when you pseudo-libertarians want to tell me about how there are 78,874 different versions of libertarianism

 

[Biff_Poindexter]

Has this form of government been successfully practiced anywhere? If so, where?

Here's a conversation featuring a Libertarian that shows why it's such a failure...



Once you've seen this, let's discuss.

USA used to be libertarian and got much ahead of Europe regardless of worse demographics.

Sam Seder is one of the biggest morons I have ever seen open his mouth. Just look at this embarrassment:



Even so, regardless whether we know about the quirks of libertariansim, we know that socialism fails every time.

the US was never libertarian --- but its ok if you want to make up that fantasy..

and if you think Sam is a moron, that is ok too --- I already know why you think that, which makes you more of the moron -- were you on the side of the "master race" caller?

I would say that the ancient Hebrew nation was the closest to a Libertarian government.

There was no king. All you had were judges throughout the community to try and maintain peace and order.

But in 1 Samuel 8, we see the people clamoring for a king. God responds that it is He who they are rejecting as their king, and tells the people he will grant their wish but will first warn them as to the abuses they will encounter with sinful man being put in charge of the roost.

The people would not listen and still demanded a king. After this happened, the nation quickly spiraled into nothingness until their nation was gone.

I will put you down in the libertarianism was not a success column

 

[g5000]

Trump is really a libertarian

Nope. Trump is a huckster. A plunderer. A liar.

A libertarian does not say the following things:

“As far as single payer, it works in Canada. It works incredibly well in Scotland." - Donald J. Trump, 2015.


Donald Trump in his book The America We Deserve:

We must have universal healthcare...I'm a conservative on most issues but a liberal on this one. We should not hear so many stories of families ruined by healthcare expenses...

Doctors might be paid less than they are now, as is the case in Canada, but they would be able to treat more patients because of the reduction in their paperwork..

The Canadian plan also helps Canadians live longer and healthier than Americans. There are fewer medical lawsuits, less loss of labor to sickness, and lower costs to companies paying for the medical care of their employees. If the program were in place in Massachusetts in 1999 it would have reduced administrative costs by $2.5 million. We need, as a nation, to reexamine the single-payer plan, as many individual states are doing.




Donald Trump on Larry King the first time he ran for President:

I'm quite liberal, and getting much more liberal, on health care and other things. What's the purpose of a country if you're not gonna have defense and health care? If you can’t take care of your sick in the country, forget it, it’s all over. So I'm very liberal when it comes to health care. I believe in universal healthcare.

 

[Penelope]

Trump is really a libertarian

Nope. Trump is a huckster. A plunderer. A liar.

A libertarian does not say the following things:

“As far as single payer, it works in Canada. It works incredibly well in Scotland." - Donald J. Trump, 2015.


Donald Trump in his book The America We Deserve:

We must have universal healthcare...I'm a conservative on most issues but a liberal on this one. We should not hear so many stories of families ruined by healthcare expenses...

Doctors might be paid less than they are now, as is the case in Canada, but they would be able to treat more patients because of the reduction in their paperwork..

The Canadian plan also helps Canadians live longer and healthier than Americans. There are fewer medical lawsuits, less loss of labor to sickness, and lower costs to companies paying for the medical care of their employees. If the program were in place in Massachusetts in 1999 it would have reduced administrative costs by $2.5 million. We need, as a nation, to reexamine the single-payer plan, as many individual states are doing.




Donald Trump on Larry King the first time he ran for President:

I'm quite liberal, and getting much more liberal, on health care and other things. What's the purpose of a country if you're not gonna have defense and health care? If you can’t take care of your sick in the country, forget it, it’s all over. So I'm very liberal when it comes to health care. I believe in universal healthcare.

He sure has changed his mind hey. Fly with the money.