LGBT & ? vs Utah: Legal Arguments at 10th Circuit Begin April 10, 2014

[Silhouette]

I didn't have to. Everything was arranged through an agency. Of course, we got to know them before I agreed to carry their babies, but the agency matched us. They are very good at what they do.

Yes, having these men's children was a fantastic idea. It was certainly one of the most rewarding experiences of my life. They are an amazing family and we enjoy spending time with them when we can.

That will be the last response you get from me. I'm tired of your bullshit insinuations about gays and children.

That's fine, I understand. But remember, it was you who offered up to the board here without prompting your situation with being a baby-carrier for gay men. So I was just asking to satisfy my curiosity you had piqued.

I'm still curious about other things with that arrangement but I'll respect your wish to find relief in not talking about it anymore.

Just in general then to the board, I wonder if the gay men put "married' in their application to the agency Seawytch went through. Because if they did that in California of course, by law they are not legally married by the consensus rule that is still on the books defining marriage as only "between a man and a woman". One judge cannot eradicate a state's sovereignty.

So there's that. And all agencies involved with the welfare of children in surrogacy or adoption must be aware of their candidates and statistical issues surrounding their "state of being" as LGBTs like to argue that they "are" instead of "are doing". For instance, an agency might consider statistics that say that if gay men come from an epidemic of having been molested as children themselves, for that is what the CDC says, and that those people who have been molested as children show strong tendencies to display in adulthood a penchant or "orientation" to have those same types of sexual encounters with children, an agency must consider the hard data and the findings of the worlds most prestigious research centers like the CDC and Mayo Clinic that support these conclusions.

An agency is not to be envied. On the one hand they cannot discriminate. On the other hand they must ALWAYS default to the child's best interest. And that includes anticipation of potential problems, not just proven ones that already exist. Because the laws regarding child welfare are written such that a person not only has to witness a crime against a child to act, they must anticipate that a crime is potentially going to happen to that child even if it hasn't yet. If they have reasonable data that suggests a child might likely come to harm, they are supposed to act or they can be charged with a misdemeanor.

So a group interested might sue an adoption agency for placing children with gay men [in particular, according to the CDC and Mayo Clinic data] who were then later molested. I think that pro-traditional family groups should legally serve a data packet to each and every single surrogacy and adoption agency in the US with the CDC and Mayo Clinic data. Then that agency cannot plead ignorance about the prospective clientele looking to adopt babies. Particularly in this case baby boys. It's probably safe as hell to place baby girls with two gay men. But not baby boys. For all the reasons the CDC and Mayo Clinic stated.

I believe Seawytch said too that the infants handed over to the gay men were boys. I'll just have to be sure about that since she doesn't want to talk about it anymore now that I'm prying into the details of the transactions...

 

[Silhouette]

Speaking of lesbians and California raising kids that are adopted or born to one or the other....

Bear in mind this is not at all necessarily the case with Seawytch of course. Seawytch appears to be a completely reasonable person most of the time here. Only a couple of times has she resorted to abusive or nasty comments to people probing about her lifestyle. And this is undoubtedly normal defensiveness.

But this couple...wow...just off the charts...

Posting as Cristian Deanda-Craig on LinkedIn.com, Deanda wrote about her cactus nursery in New Mexico: "I am currently in a place that makes me happy both personally and professionally. I left me (sic) job to be home with my kids. I loved gardening and soon found myself selling flowers to neighbors. So my partner and I started our business -- the best decision ever! I enjoy watching my kids grow and my flowers!"

Under previous jobs, she lists work as an HIV prevention case manager at John XXIII AIDS Ministry in Salinas from 2001 to 2004, and later as a psychosocial therapy manager at Valencia Counseling Services in Estancia, N.M.

Deanda was also a program manager at a transitional housing facility for men in Gallup, N.M., according to the profile.

Craig, whose profile is listed under Eraca Craig-Deanda, earned a bachelor's degree in auto mechanics management from Hartnell College in 2013, according to the site.

Before that, she was a detention officer at the Navajo County Sheriff's Office in 2005-2006 and a corrections officer at a New Mexico corrections facility from 2006 to 2010.

More recently, her occupation was listed as auto mechanic.

Neither woman appears to have a criminal record in Monterey County. Children found starving, chained and abused in Monterey County home - San Jose Mercury News

A model lesbian couple to all eyes. The pillars of any gay community for sure. The lipstick one was into cactus horticulture. The man-one that she is inexplicably attracted to [isn't she supposed to be attracted to women?] was a past correctional officer and auto mechanic.

But then trouble in paradise was discovered. They focused their abuse for the girl. All three kids were starved but for some reason the girl was chained up. Usually when someone is restrained, it's not just to keep them from food...

Three children were rescued from a Monterey County home last week after deputies discovered that two women — one a former correctional officer — had starved, chained and abused the children, officials said Friday....

...Officers said they found signs the girl had been chained to the wall about 4 feet above the floor and said she may also have been held in a closet. It appeared she had been shackled at times at the ankle and at other times by a collar around her neck.
Miller said it appeared she had “hardly eaten for months.”
The girl and a 5-year-old boy were adopted, he said, while a 3-year-old boy is the biological son of one of the women, who are domestic partners.
The girl was immediately hospitalized for around five days, he said, and appeared to be “very traumatized.”
“It was a particularly heinous case,” Miller said, adding that it appeared the women were preparing to leave the area before they were discovered.
“It seems that the little girl was the major target of this abuse,” he said. . . . GIRL IN CHAINS: ?Domestic Partners? Charged in ?Particularly Heinous Case? : The Other McCain

If there was sexual abuse of the little girl, you will never hear about it. California wraps that crap up so tight when it comes to gays abusing children that you might as well be tapping on an abalone before you try to pry it off the rock.

 

[Seawytch]

Bean is also now on ignore due to his astounding ignorance where gays and children are concerned. Trolls be gone.

 

[bodecea]

What , pray tell , does Rush "Limpballs" or Newt Gingrich have to do with the fact that Faggots make bad parents ??? You're grasping at straws girl - and straws don't float under the weight of truth and science - so you're basically sinking .

[PS all balls are limp - that's not the part that's suppossed to hard ]

Gays don't make bad parents. As stated multiple times, and supported by links, the children of gays are at no disadvantage to those of straights. Gays are parents just like straights are parents. Some are good, some aren't so good.

You're the one that brought up longevity of relationships. Bean, when over 50% of straight marriages are ending in divorce, gays aren't your worry.

Gays don't make bad parents. As stated multiple times, and supported by links

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

Gays are parents just like straights are parents. Some are good, some aren't so good.

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

Interesting attack on both Seawytch and myself and our families....accusing us of child abuse.

 

[jillian]

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

only in rightwingnuthackworld

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

no doubt you know this from your *ahem* in-depth experience with the gay community?

 

[bodecea]

Bean is also now on ignore due to his astounding ignorance where gays and children are concerned. Trolls be gone.

He's definitely attacking your ability as a parent, attacking your family, and calling you a child abuser too.

 

[Seawytch]

Bean is also now on ignore due to his astounding ignorance where gays and children are concerned. Trolls be gone.

He's definitely attacking your ability as a parent, attacking your family, and calling you a child abuser too.

That's what trolls do.

 

[GreenBean]

I didn't have to. Everything was arranged through an agency. Of course, we got to know them before I agreed to carry their babies, but the agency matched us. They are very good at what they do.

Yes, having these men's children was a fantastic idea. It was certainly one of the most rewarding experiences of my life. They are an amazing family and we enjoy spending time with them when we can.

That will be the last response you get from me. I'm tired of your bullshit insinuations about gays and children.

That's fine, I understand. But remember, it was you who offered up to the board here without prompting your situation with being a baby-carrier for gay men. So I was just asking to satisfy my curiosity you had piqued.

I'm still curious about other things with that arrangement but I'll respect your wish to find relief in not talking about it anymore.

Just in general then to the board, I wonder if the gay men put "married' in their application to the agency Seawytch went through. Because if they did that in California of course, by law they are not legally married by the consensus rule that is still on the books defining marriage as only "between a man and a woman". One judge cannot eradicate a state's sovereignty.

So there's that. And all agencies involved with the welfare of children in surrogacy or adoption must be aware of their candidates and statistical issues surrounding their "state of being" as LGBTs like to argue that they "are" instead of "are doing". For instance, an agency might consider statistics that say that if gay men come from an epidemic of having been molested as children themselves, for that is what the CDC says, and that those people who have been molested as children show strong tendencies to display in adulthood a penchant or "orientation" to have those same types of sexual encounters with children, an agency must consider the hard data and the findings of the worlds most prestigious research centers like the CDC and Mayo Clinic that support these conclusions.

An agency is not to be envied. On the one hand they cannot discriminate. On the other hand they must ALWAYS default to the child's best interest. And that includes anticipation of potential problems, not just proven ones that already exist. Because the laws regarding child welfare are written such that a person not only has to witness a crime against a child to act, they must anticipate that a crime is potentially going to happen to that child even if it hasn't yet. If they have reasonable data that suggests a child might likely come to harm, they are supposed to act or they can be charged with a misdemeanor.

So a group interested might sue an adoption agency for placing children with gay men [in particular, according to the CDC and Mayo Clinic data] who were then later molested. I think that pro-traditional family groups should legally serve a data packet to each and every single surrogacy and adoption agency in the US with the CDC and Mayo Clinic data. Then that agency cannot plead ignorance about the prospective clientele looking to adopt babies. Particularly in this case baby boys. It's probably safe as hell to place baby girls with two gay men. But not baby boys. For all the reasons the CDC and Mayo Clinic stated.

I believe Seawytch said too that the infants handed over to the gay men were boys. I'll just have to be sure about that since she doesn't want to talk about it anymore now that I'm prying into the details of the transactions...

That will be the last response you get from me. I'm tired of your bullshit insinuations about gays and children.

Yet you are unable to disprove anything he says . It must hurt knowing just how wrong your are . Go away ...shooo..try to hide , stick your sick demented perverted head in the sand and cry like a blithering baby -just remember you can allways run ... but you can't hide !!

 

[GreenBean]

Bean is also now on ignore due to his astounding ignorance where gays and children are concerned. Trolls be gone.

OH Goodie , finally had your much anticipated meltdown
Truth Hurts doesn't it ?

 

[GreenBean]

Gays don't make bad parents. As stated multiple times, and supported by links, the children of gays are at no disadvantage to those of straights. Gays are parents just like straights are parents. Some are good, some aren't so good.

You're the one that brought up longevity of relationships. Bean, when over 50% of straight marriages are ending in divorce, gays aren't your worry.

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

Gays are parents just like straights are parents. Some are good, some aren't so good.

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

Interesting attack on both Seawytch and myself and our families....accusing us of child abuse.

Didn't know I was attacking you bodocea , I'm truly sorry - I would have twisted the kniife a tad further or perhaps ground some salt into the wound.

So far as the comment -

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will

In lew of twisting the knife or grinding salt into yor wounds , I'll simply post some true facts - they tend to hurt just as much when faggots like you are concerned ... the old addage "The Pen is Mightier than the Sword."

Homosexual Men are responsible for about 1/3 of child molestation against Boys
Homosexual Men represent 2 - 5 % of the General Population.
So this 2- 5% of the General Population is responsible for about 33 - 35% of Child Molestation.

And I use the term Homosexual Men loosely - because you are not Truly MEN , just subhuman Mongrels.

Are you seeing red yet, are you seething ? Are you bleeding ? and crying in agony ... Good glad to hear it, but fear not my faggy friend Consolation, First Aid and bandages are available - http://pfox.org/about_us.html

 

[Silhouette]

Bean is also now on ignore due to his astounding ignorance where gays and children are concerned. Trolls be gone.

He's definitely attacking your ability as a parent, attacking your family, and calling you a child abuser too.

That's what trolls do.

No one should be attacking anyone. I agree. And that goes for y'all's side of the fence as well. Yet you folks feel free to throw out "bigot" or "hater" anytime you find yourself in a pinch debating the topic. It's your standard default program. So if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

I notice that muslims not driving cabs with "gay games" ads on them only got a mild rebuke from the LGBT cult. And an "it's understandable". However, if christians were to refuse to drive those cabs for the same reason, all mighty hell would descend upon them. We would instantly hear that they were "bigots" "haters" "homophobes" and the cult would be lining the streets in protest ,throwing glitter bombs or what have you at the cabbies, dragging them into court and suing them into financial oblivion. But no, we have silence and "we understand" when it comes to islamics not wanting to promote the gay cult.

So in addition to fairness in your side not verbally abusing people who disagree with you, I guess I'm also asking for consistency in your vitrole for anyone opposed to what it is you do...

 

[JakeStarkey]

Someone writes foolishly, "What , pray tell , does Rush "Limpballs" or Newt Gingrich have to do with the fact that Faggots make bad parents ???"

They don't.

 

[GreenBean]

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

only in rightwingnuthackworld

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

no doubt you know this from your *ahem* in-depth experience with the gay community?

As a matter of fact - yes I do know this from my "in depth" experience . In depth being studies, literature, reading , writing, teaching, counseling . I keep a baseball bat as a memento of my counseling experiences .

 

[JakeStarkey]

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

only in rightwingnuthackworld

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

no doubt you know this from your *ahem* in-depth experience with the gay community?

As a matter of fact - yes I do know this from my "in depth" experience . In depth being studies, literature, reading , writing, teaching, counseling . I keep a baseball bat as a memento of my counseling experiences .

On this subject, "you know nothing, Greenbean Snow"

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Yet you folks feel free to throw out "bigot" or "hater"

Incorrect.

To seek to deny same-sex couples their equal protection rights is in fact motivated only by animus toward gay Americans.

Just as was the case with Colorado’s Amendment 2, Utah’s Amendment 3…

…is so discontinuous with the reasons offered for it that the amendment seems inexplicable by anything but animus toward the class that it affects; it lacks a rational relationship to legitimate state interests.

Romer, Governor of Colorado, et al. v. Evans et al., 517 U.S. 620 (1996).

Amendment 3 lacks a rational basis, it is supported by no objective, documented evidence, and it pursues no legitimate state interest, it therefore exists solely as a manifestation of hatred toward same-sex couples.

 

[Seawytch]

Yet you folks feel free to throw out "bigot" or "hater"

Incorrect.



To seek to deny same-sex couples their equal protection rights is in fact motivated only by animus toward gay Americans.



Just as was the case with Colorado’s Amendment 2, Utah’s Amendment 3…

And they call that motivated animus bigotry don't they?

Calling a bigot a bigot isn't anything like calling gays pedophiles, but they're out of bullets and throwing the gun at this point.

 

[bodecea]

All discredited links and poorly documented and opinionated.

only in rightwingnuthackworld

Gays are perverts first , parents second . The propensity for Gays to engage in child abuse has been clearly demonstrated . Gays, in general do not make good parents and never will.

no doubt you know this from your *ahem* in-depth experience with the gay community?

As a matter of fact - yes I do know this from my "in depth" experience . In depth being studies, literature, reading , writing, teaching, counseling . I keep a baseball bat as a memento of my counseling experiences .

Cool story, bro.

 

[bodecea]

Yet you folks feel free to throw out "bigot" or "hater"

Incorrect.



To seek to deny same-sex couples their equal protection rights is in fact motivated only by animus toward gay Americans.



Just as was the case with Colorado’s Amendment 2, Utah’s Amendment 3…

And they call that motivated animus bigotry don't they?

Calling a bigot a bigot isn't anything like calling gays pedophiles, but they're out of bullets and throwing the gun at this point.

I remember the day when that kind of bigotry and hatred was right out there within the first few posts....and echoed by many people. Glad to see that that kind of bigotry and hatred is winding down to a few and they are not echoed very much at all any more.

 

[Silhouette]

I remember the day when that kind of bigotry and hatred was right out there within the first few posts....and echoed by many people. Glad to see that that kind of bigotry and hatred is winding down to a few and they are not echoed very much at all any more.

Since the LGBT crowd defines "bigot" as someone who doesn't agree with all aspects of the gay lifestyle, including trying to steal the word "marriage", that statement isn't true.

If put to a common vote in each state, gay marraige would lose in all but 3 of them. Evidenced by the fact that every time they try in the most liberal state in the Union, California, it keeps getting defeated.

Hence their need for demonizing, blackmail and activist judges who keep trying to defy the sovereignty of states and are in defiance of Windsor. You don't need those 'tools" for a "popular cause"...

 

[GreenBean]

only in rightwingnuthackworld



no doubt you know this from your *ahem* in-depth experience with the gay community?

As a matter of fact - yes I do know this from my "in depth" experience . In depth being studies, literature, reading , writing, teaching, counseling . I keep a baseball bat as a memento of my counseling experiences .

Cool story, bro.

Don't Bro me if you don't know me - faggot