Idaho Republicans pass resolution urging Supreme Court to end marriage equality

[TheProgressivePatriot]

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Oh, well, if admin don't want me to use those buttons, they just shouldn't have put them there, or the rules for their use in TOS.





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Thank you for confirming that you actually don't have a brain

 

[80zephyr]

I feel just fine about myself Bud, Trying to make this about me is just another of your diversionary tactics to avoid a serious discussion of the issues -much like your parade of logical fallacies from appeals to hypocrisy to red herrings to non sequiturs .

On this thread-which was about same sex marriage and which you derailed by interjected the transsexual issue you have taken numerous idiotic, and bigoted positions

• You stubbornly maintained that gay couples should not be allowed to marry because they cant produce children which is so wrong a=on a number of levels
• You claimed that if gays are allowed to marry then polygamy should be legal while ignoring and denying the significant difference in terms of social and legal issues
• You stupidly and offensively claimed that liberals want to normalize pedophilia
• You continue to insist that gender dysphoria is a mental illness and that there is no biological basis for it- despite being presented with extensive evidence to the contrary
• You have compared transpeople -who you disparagingly call “trannies” -to anorexics because they both involve body image issues while ignoring the stark differences
• You suggested than trans people could be medically “cured” while ignoring and denying the fact that evidence shows would not be possible due to the fact there are immutable characteristic like genetic makeup and brain structure
• Your entire tone has been that of ridicule and marginalization towards the LGBT community and if you dare claim that you support equal rights for them you will be called out as a liar,
• Throughout you have repeatedly attempted to gaslight me by claiming that I am denying reality while it is you who is out of touch….or just playing some sick game.

One thing that you’re right about .Reality and facts are not bigotry. But you do not have the facts on your side and your reality is nothing short of bizarre.

My work is done here . You have been exposed for what you are. A bigot

Only in your mind. But, I'm OK with it. Because when I go down the "list" of the things you accuse me of, I smile.

I will give you one example. You wrote:

• You continue to insist that gender dysphoria is a mental illness and that there is no biological basis for it- despite being presented with extensive evidence to the contrary

You did not link to "extensive examples", and the ones that you did list kept using woulds like "could" of "may", which means ...nothing. Its the same thing with the gays. Science has claimed a genetic basis for being gay, yet no real evidence is shown.

You are simply a gullible fellow who will swallow any crackpot idea that comes down the highway. My guess is, is that you really do believe that people can also change their race. I mean, why not?

 

[80zephyr]

I have serious doubts about that stat, but let’s say its real. So what is your point exactly? What does it indicate for treatment, not knowing which ones with later decide that they are not trans? Here’s an idea. Just treat them all like they’re all crazy. Try to “cure” them and never suggest that maybe they are really transgender ? . Then wait and watch. The ones who kill themselves are the real trans kids. It’s kind of like throwing someone who is suspected of being a witch into a pond with a rock tied to her . If she drowns she is not a witch. Tell us how you would treat a child with gender dysphoria

The problem is, is that I can find studies that prove what you claim, and I can find them to prove what I claim. Both claims are backed by science. In reality, we really don't know much at all about whether one side or the other is correct.

Like this one: Correction of a Key Study: No Evidence of “Gender-Affirming” Surgeries Improving Mental Health

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Only in your mind. But, I'm OK with it. Because when I go down the "list" of the things you accuse me of, I smile.

I will give you one example. You wrote:

• You continue to insist that gender dysphoria is a mental illness and that there is no biological basis for it- despite being presented with extensive evidence to the contrary

You did not link to "extensive examples", and the ones that you did list kept using woulds like "could" of "may", which means ...nothing. Its the same thing with the gays. Science has claimed a genetic basis for being gay, yet no real evidence is shown.

You are simply a gullible fellow who will swallow any crackpot idea that comes down the highway. My guess is, is that you really do believe that people can also change their race. I mean, why not?

It’s apparent that you have no understanding of how such research is conducted or how to interpret results. They do not deal with absolutes . The findings are based on statistically significant data. From the Hudson study that I posted in #445:

A new study has uncovered a link between being transgender and changes in genes that process the sex hormones estrogen and androgen, revealing a possible biological basis for gender dysphoria.

Scientists at Hudson Institute of Medical Research, Melbourne analysed DNA from 380 transgender women (male-to-female transgender people) and found that certain ‘versions’ of 12 different genes were significantly overrepresented in transgender women, compared to non-transgender males.

“This is the world’s largest and most comprehensive study examining changes in genes that control sex hormone signalling in transgender women. It identifies several new genes or genetic variations never before looked at in gender dysphoria,” lead author, Professor Vincent Harley of Hudson Institute, said.

That is a hell of a lot more conclusive than you just bleating about how there is no biological basis for it without any such evidence,. And no, that crap that you posted about Correction of a Key Study: No Evidence of “Gender-Affirming” Surgeries Improving Mental Health does not qualify. I will get to that shortly.

Interesting how you have not been able to respond to any of the other charges in my indictment of you (post 457)

_____________________________________________________________________

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Science has claimed a genetic basis for being gay, yet no real evidence is shown.

That's bullshit also. Google" epigenetics" You really should read more

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

The problem is, is that I can find studies that prove what you claim, and I can find them to prove what I claim. Both claims are backed by science. In reality, we really don't know much at all about whether one side or the other is correct.

Like this one: Correction of a Key Study: No Evidence of “Gender-Affirming” Surgeries Improving Mental Health

Now to deal with this codswallop, I am absolutely flabbergasted that you would present this study as evidence to support your assertion that there is no biological basis for gender dysphoria. No where is there any mention of the etiology of gender dysphoria. This is another of your desperate logical fallacies- this time a non sequitur where your premise does not support the conclusion .

It also represents another example of how poorly you understand research. Yes, it states that trans people have greater mental heath needs than others. From that you seem to conclude that they are trans BECAUSE they have mental health issues, where as there is considerable evidence they have those issues because they are trans. In either case it does not rule out a biological basis for gender dysphoria . A basic principle of scientific research is to understand the difference between causality and correlation. You should read up on it

Likewise, the finding that surgical outcomes do not always produce the desired results do not rule out a biological basis for gender dysphoria. The study makes no such connection and it’s rather bizarre that you would take it upon yourself to do so. Transitioning is traumatic, patients do not always have adequate support, and are subjected to rejection by others.

The mental health issues experienced by trans people- regardless of treatment status is widely though to be the result of societal condemnation, discrimination, and ridicule. In other words people like you.

Lastly, I will remind you once again that regardless of why a person is trans, (or gay) they are still human beings and deserving of the respect and dignity that you take for granted. Even if being trans is purely psychological, persecuting them for it still makes you a bigot. Therefore the energy that you put into trying to prove that they are just crazy is really waisted,

Still waiting for you to respond to the rest of my indictment,

 

[80zephyr]

It’s apparent that you have no understanding of how such research is conducted or how to interpret results. They do not deal with absolutes . The findings are based on statistically significant data. From the Hudson study that I posted in #445:







That is a hell of a lot more conclusive than you just bleating about how there is no biological basis for it without any such evidence,. And no, that crap that you posted about Correction of a Key Study: No Evidence of “Gender-Affirming” Surgeries Improving Mental Health does not qualify. I will get to that shortly.

Interesting how you have not been able to respond to any of the other charges in my indictment of you (post 457)

_____________________________________________________________________

I have learned thru my long life that any controversial issue will constantly affirm a subject, one way or the other. You have to be able to sort thru the bullshit.

 

[80zephyr]

Now to deal with this codswallop, I am absolutely flabbergasted that you would present this study as evidence to support your assertion that there is no biological basis for gender dysphoria. No where is there any mention of the etiology of gender dysphoria. This is another of your desperate logical fallacies- this time a non sequitur where your premise does not support the conclusion .

It also represents another example of how poorly you understand research. Yes, it states that trans people have greater mental heath needs than others. From that you seem to conclude that they are trans BECAUSE they have mental health issues, where as there is considerable evidence they have those issues because they are trans. In either case it does not rule out a biological basis for gender dysphoria . A basic principle of scientific research is to understand the difference between causality and correlation. You should read up on it

Likewise, the finding that surgical outcomes do not always produce the desired results do not rule out a biological basis for gender dysphoria. The study makes no such connection and it’s rather bizarre that you would take it upon yourself to do so. Transitioning is traumatic, patients do not always have adequate support, and are subjected to rejection by others.

The mental health issues experienced by trans people- regardless of treatment status is widely though to be the result of societal condemnation, discrimination, and ridicule. In other words people like you.

Lastly, I will remind you once again that regardless of why a person is trans, (or gay) they are still human beings and deserving of the respect and dignity that you take for granted. Even if being trans is purely psychological, persecuting them for it still makes you a bigot. Therefore the energy that you put into trying to prove that they are just crazy is really waisted,

Still waiting for you to respond to the rest of my indictment,

I would suppose that there is a genetic condition for every human problem. A murderer, a thief...etc. And now the left is pushing pedophilia as a "person was born that way". And I don't understand why you are fixated on just the trans population. I have noted that there is such a thing as trans-racial and transabled. DO you believe they have a biological condition or are they just unbalanced?

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I have learned thru my long life that any controversial issue will constantly affirm a subject, one way or the other. You have to be able to sort thru the bullshit.

_____________________________________________________________---

Is this supposed to be a response to my extensive post? I find it interesting how you don’t even try to defend your bullshit, You just keep throwing more dung at the wall in the hope that something sticks

I don’t think that you have learned all that much in your life- however long it has been . You seem to have the knowledge base and emotional intelligence of an adolescent given the charges that I have leveled at you in my indictment- most of which you have not even attempted to refute .

Once again -for the record – when it comes to trans rights and public policy regarding trans people, the issue of whether or not it is biological ( I maintain that in most if not all cases it is) is irrelevant. They should be treated with respect, dignity and afforded proper gender affirming care. Do you agree or not? YES OR NO?

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I would suppose that there is a genetic condition for every human problem. A murderer, a thief...etc. And now the left is pushing pedophilia as a "person was born that way". And I don't understand why you are fixated on just the trans population. I have noted that there is such a thing as trans-racial and transabled. DO you believe they have a biological condition or are they just unbalanced?

Holy shit on a shingle! WHAT? More distractions! “And now the left is pushing pedophilia as a "person was born that way” ???? I don’t know what you think the “the left is pushing” or what you’re reading. My position is that it’s a mental illness and like all mental illness, there is probably a biological predisposition to it. It should be treated as such until they offend and then it becomes criminal. That all I am going to say about it here because once again you derailing the thread and getting way off topic. I’m not dealing with that trans-racial and transabled ( whatever the fuck that even is) crap either, Start a thread on it if you want to discuss it

And you don’t understand why I’m are “fixated” on just the trans population? I’m not. You and your ilk on the right are. The conservatives launched their campaign of hysteria and lies against trans people around the time that they lost the fight over gay marriage . The topic of the this thread incase you forgot. It is the right wing bigots who are fixated. I . as a life long civil rights advocate feel compelled to come to their defense.

Once again, regardless of why people are trans, they are treated like pariahs and you have done nothing to renounce that fact . Your fixation on the issue whether or not it is biological is just thinly veiled bigotry. As I said, what matters is not why they are trans but how they are treated and even if you could prove that it is “just a mental illness” it does not excuse your attitude. You claim that you are not a bigot? Let me ask you a question. Margery Taylor Green and Nancy Mace launched a cruel campaign against a new transgender congresswoman by trying to ban her from the women’s bathroom . Do you support that effort? Yes or no??

STILL waiting for you to answer the indictment against you ,

 

[80zephyr]

_____________________________________________________________---

Is this supposed to be a response to my extensive post? I find it interesting how you don’t even try to defend your bullshit, You just keep throwing more dung at the wall in the hope that something sticks

I don’t think that you have learned all that much in your life- however long it has been . You seem to have the knowledge base and emotional intelligence of an adolescent given the charges that I have leveled at you in my indictment- most of which you have not even attempted to refute .

Once again -for the record – when it comes to trans rights and public policy regarding trans people, the issue of whether or not it is biological ( I maintain that in most if not all cases it is) is irrelevant. They should be treated with respect, dignity and afforded proper gender affirming care. Do you agree or not? YES OR NO?

First, I want my question answered. Do you believe trans-racial and transabled people also have a genetic basis?

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

First, I want my question answered. Do you believe trans-racial and transabled people also have a genetic basis?

You're just trolling with this bullshit . They are complicated issues and I am not going to let you drag me down that rabbit hole so that you can avoid the relevant questions that I answered . What are you going to bring up next ? Furies? Once again:

1. Margery Taylor Green and Nancy Mace launched a cruel campaign against a new transgender congresswoman by trying to ban her from the women’s bathroom . Do you support that effort? Yes or No??

2. Should trans people be treated with respect, dignity and afforded proper gender affirming care. Do you agree or not? YES OR NO?

STILL waiting for you to answer the rest of the indictment against you ,

Stop being a coward and answer,.

 

[80zephyr]

You're just trolling with this bullshit . They are complicated issues and I am not going to let you drag me down that rabbit hole so that you can avoid the relevant questions that I answered . What are you going to bring up next ? Furies? Once again:

1. Margery Taylor Green and Nancy Mace launched a cruel campaign against a new transgender congresswoman by trying to ban her from the women’s bathroom . Do you support that effort? Yes or No??

2. Should trans people be treated with respect, dignity and afforded proper gender affirming care. Do you agree or not? YES OR NO?

STILL waiting for you to answer the rest of the indictment against you ,

Stop being a coward and answer,.

I'm not the coward, you are. You won't answer me because you know its a catch-22. Answer yes and I know you're a loon, and answer no and I know that you are being hypocritical.

You can't answer, can you? But, you know what? I'll play along.

To question number 1: I absolutely agree with them. No one gets to pick who they are, it doesn't work that way. Reality exists.

2: If by dignity and respect, you mean proper pronouns...no. If you think you are Abe Lincoln, I have no responsibility to call you Mr. President. They should be treated humanely like anybody else. If they want gender affirming care (as adults) go for it. The public should not have to pay for it.

Now, you will call me a bigot for using logic, facts and reality as a basis of my answer. Go ahead, it'll make you feel real good about yourself.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I'm not the coward, you are. You won't answer me because you know its a catch-22. Answer yes and I know you're a loon, and answer no and I know that you are being hypocritical.

You can't answer, can you? But, you know what? I'll play along.

To question number 1: I absolutely agree with them. No one gets to pick who they are, it doesn't work that way. Reality exists.

2: If by dignity and respect, you mean proper pronouns...no. If you think you are Abe Lincoln, I have no responsibility to call you Mr. President. They should be treated humanely like anybody else. If they want gender affirming care (as adults) go for it. The public should not have to pay for it.

Now, you will call me a bigot for using logic, facts and reality as a basis of my answer. Go ahead, it'll make you feel real good about yourself.

You think that you’re clever but you’re really a fool. Yes I knew that it was a trap, given the games that you play. Not answering does not make me a coward. It makes me smart to not play into your hands. I am still not going to answer the question and give you the opportunity to further derail this thread I said that it is complicated which seems to be something that you-like all bigots have trouble with,

And its apparent that you haven’t learned a damned thing about logical fallacies -even after I took you to school over that appeal to hypocrisy cramp and others. The bottom line is that when it comes to how we treat people , what kind of care we prove for them and issues of civil rights, biology vs. psychology does not matter. I pointed out earlier that during the court fights over gay marriage ,opponents were smart enough to not invoke the ability to procreate as an issue, They were also smart enough to avoid any reference to way people are gay- another loosing proposition .

And based on the answers to my questions. I am indeed going to call you a bigot. You did not use logic, facts and reality. You used logical fallacies, and denial of scientific facts to justify your disdain for LGBT people so that you can feel at home in the confines of your warped and hateful reality .

I have made my case, the full indictment against you ( Post 457) that you have not responded too stands and I am done with you. You have born the brunt of an epic take down but your too delusional to know it

 

[80zephyr]

You think that you’re clever but you’re really a fool. Yes I knew that it was a trap, given the games that you play. Not answering does not make me a coward. It makes me smart to not play into your hands. I am still not going to answer the question and give you the opportunity to further derail this thread I said that it is complicated which seems to be something that you-like all bigots have trouble with,

And its apparent that you haven’t learned a damned thing about logical fallacies -even after I took you to school over that appeal to hypocrisy cramp and others. The bottom line is that when it comes to how we treat people , what kind of care we prove for them and issues of civil rights, biology vs. psychology does not matter. I pointed out earlier that during the court fights over gay marriage ,opponents were smart enough to not invoke the ability to procreate as an issue, They were also smart enough to avoid any reference to way people are gay- another loosing proposition .

And based on the answers to my questions. I am indeed going to call you a bigot. You did not use logic, facts and reality. You used logical fallacies, and denial of scientific facts to justify your disdain for LGBT people so that you can feel at home in the confines of your warped and hateful reality .

I have made my case, the full indictment against you ( Post 457) that you have not responded too stands and I am done with you. You have born the brunt of an epic take down but your too delusional to know it

Your delusions are incredible. Again, you can't give me an answer because your cognitive dissonance would cause your head to explode. So be safe, and keep your mouth shut.

I will say that you at least go into "stark raving" mode during this debate. For that, I give you credit.

And lastly, I would bet you hate me more than I do any transsexual. Something to think about, since you are so righteous and all.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Your delusions are incredible. Again, you can't give me an answer because your cognitive dissonance would cause your head to explode. So be safe, and keep your mouth shut.

I will say that you at least go into "stark raving" mode during this debate. For that, I give you credit.

And lastly, I would bet you hate me more than I do any transsexual. Something to think about, since you are so righteous and all.

I dob't hate you . Hate is a useless emotion and never comes to any good . I am however sick of your bullshit and repeated attempts to gaslight me. I am sure that you actually believe your bullshit , and that is sad indeed. . I am not righteous . I am just right, Facts, logic and a command of reality are on my side. You are lost in a bubble of misinformation. But thank you for admitting that you hate transsexuals . Good by

 

[80zephyr]

I dob't hate you . Hate is a useless emotion and never comes to any good . I am however sick of your bullshit and repeated attempts to gaslight me. I am sure that you actually believe your bullshit , and that is sad indeed. . I am not righteous . I am just right, Facts, logic and a command of reality are on my side. You are lost in a bubble of misinformation. But thank you for admitting that you hate transsexuals . Good by

Lol. I could have written this post about you.

 

[HeyNorm]

If Marriage is not about procreation, then why does it exclude persons too closely related?

Hmmmmmm

 

[80zephyr]

I dob't hate you . Hate is a useless emotion and never comes to any good . I am however sick of your bullshit and repeated attempts to gaslight me. I am sure that you actually believe your bullshit , and that is sad indeed. . I am not righteous . I am just right, Facts, logic and a command of reality are on my side. You are lost in a bubble of misinformation. But thank you for admitting that you hate transsexuals . Good by

Hey, I just found this. I believe this is the real answer.

Autogynephilia: an underappreciated paraphilia - PubMed

Autogynephilia is defined as a male's propensity to be sexually aroused by the thought of himself as a female. It is the paraphilia that is theorized to underlie transvestism and some forms of male-to-female (MtF) transsexualism. Autogynephilia encompasses sexual arousal with cross-dressing and...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Hey, I just found this. I believe this is the real answer.

Autogynephilia: an underappreciated paraphilia - PubMed

Autogynephilia is defined as a male's propensity to be sexually aroused by the thought of himself as a female. It is the paraphilia that is theorized to underlie transvestism and some forms of male-to-female (MtF) transsexualism. Autogynephilia encompasses sexual arousal with cross-dressing and...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Is it biological?