Let's Talk About The Choke Hold

[Missouri_Mike]

Another black guy was killed this past weekend.

The dude was drunk and passed out in his car in a Wendy's parking lot, blocking the drive-thru.

When the cops showed up, they spent 40 minutes dealing with him.

40 minutes. That's a long time to tie up two policemen.

The cops were very patient with this guy. And the guy was cooperative during that 40 minutes.

But the second a pair of handcuffs touched his wrists, the dude went crazy. The two cops spent the next several minutes struggling with this guy.

The cops were fit. And yet they could not get this guy under control. He got the better of them despite being drunk.

This is not a reflection on the cops. A maniac can take up to 5 people to subdue him. Especially if you don't allow them to use a choke hold.

If you watch the video of the fight, the cops refrained from using a choke hold on the dude, and he was able to not only get away, he was able to disarm them of their taser. It's just luck that is what they had in their hands for him to take and not a gun.

As I watched, I said to my son, "If they used a choke hold on him, that dude would be alive today."

My son hates the cops. He's had some run-ins with them.

But he saw my point.

I've never had an opinion of the choke hold. I know some people have been hurt by choke holds, and I know the rare person has been killed by the choke hold.

But that fight would have been over in seconds if those cops used it. And the dude would be alive.

He would be alive if he didn't put up a fight, too, but that's another discussion.

I worked as security in bars for thirty years and never had any trouble controlling a drunk.

Every try to cuff one who didn't want to be cuffed?

No , but I did use the full Nelson to take control.

A risky move that results in broken necks. Just think. You were that close to being in prison for murder. All for trying to control a drunk guy that you thought was a danger. Funny how you can’t quite come to terms with that when cops are involved.

 

[Unkotare]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

 

[Indeependent]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

 

[pknopp]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

Arms length.

 

[Unkotare]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

How far can one push their luck?

 

[Indeependent]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

Arms length.

I saw the video...The officers were nowhere near that close.
The officer who shot must have been freaking out for some reason or simply pissed off.

 

[blackhawk]

The choke hold can be used to simply subdue someone or to kill someone it depends on the intent of the person using it.

 

[Indeependent]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

How far can one push their luck?

Living in Nassau County I am super pro-police but this shooting was not warranted.

 

[Likkmee]

A long time "choke holding" is a piss poor technique. When I was a young buck I could take the fight right out of someone with direct pressure to the carotid. 15-45 seconds..depending on how wound up they were.A slam to the windpipe gives plenty of time

 

[Muhammed]

Drunk drivers kill people.

So do sober drivers.

The #1 cause of deadly traffic accidents is distracted drivers. And the #1 driver distraction is not a beer can or a cell phone or even some hot girl with a really nice ass walking on the side of the road. It's passengers.

 

[Indeependent]

Drunk drivers kill people.

So do sober drivers.

Death penalty for texting.
Both problems will be solved when 5G allows for automated-driving.

 

[FA_Q2]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

I keep seeing called a taser but it looks like a stun gun from the video. Those have a reach of 15 feet or so. Not exactly sure what specific piece of equipment this was.

 

[Unkotare]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

How far can one push their luck?

Living in Nassau County I am super pro-police but this shooting was not warranted.

The guy brought this on himself. The police were nothing but considerate and courteous throughout (to be fair, so was he until he snapped) until HE changed the situation. These were not raging, racist police officers looking to put a black man in his place. They didn't put him in any dangerous position or situation. HE did that. If the guy who was sitting on a man's neck for ten minutes is found guilty, throw away the key. But this officer was not the reason why things went bad in Atlanta.

 

[FA_Q2]

Drunk drivers kill people.

This one was passed out in a parking lot at Wendy's.

But yes, they kill people. However, this guy had not. He did not deserve to die.


What gets me is that some fuckwit asshole decided to firebomb the Wendy's over this.

He did not deserve to die unless they couldn't tell if it was the taser or a gun but I don't see him grabbing for a gun but using the taser he was already holding.

What do you think would have happened had he tazed the cop? You just think he was going to walk away after that?

After taking one weapon from the cop had he managed to actually disabled one of them then it is likely he would have tried to kill them. And that time with their service weapon.

As Unkotare said, you remove a weapon from a cop and try and use it against him you are going to die - end of story. The cops are justified in that situation.

 

[pknopp]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

I keep seeing called a taser but it looks like a stun gun from the video. Those have a reach of 15 feet or so. Not exactly sure what specific piece of equipment this was.

Those aren't multi-use.

Drunk drivers kill people.

This one was passed out in a parking lot at Wendy's.

But yes, they kill people. However, this guy had not. He did not deserve to die.


What gets me is that some fuckwit asshole decided to firebomb the Wendy's over this.

He did not deserve to die unless they couldn't tell if it was the taser or a gun but I don't see him grabbing for a gun but using the taser he was already holding.

What do you think would have happened had he tazed the cop? You just think he was going to walk away after that?

After taking one weapon from the cop had he managed to actually disabled one of them then it is likely he would have tried to kill them. And that time with their service weapon.

As Unkotare said, you remove a weapon from a cop and try and use it against him you are going to die - end of story. The cops are justified in that situation.

What if he had a tank? Or yet a bomber or a suit of invisibility?

 

[FA_Q2]

I do not know if a choke hold would have done anything or not but I do think the cops need to be better trained in general not just for combative situations like this but to have better overall procedures so this king of situation does not happen in the first place. The fact the guy was cooperative makes this very difficult though - it is not as though the cops should approach a cooperative suspect as though they are taking down a highly dangerous person - that is part of what creates the animosity to begin with. It takes 12 months of training before this nation will trust you with the massive responsibility of cutting someones hair. It takes an average of 21 weeks to become a cop.

That would tell you how truly ass backward our police system is.

 

[Dekster]

Another black guy was killed this past weekend.

The dude was drunk and passed out in his car in a Wendy's parking lot, blocking the drive-thru.

When the cops showed up, they spent 40 minutes dealing with him.

40 minutes. That's a long time to tie up two policemen.

The cops were very patient with this guy. And the guy was cooperative during that 40 minutes.

But the second a pair of handcuffs touched his wrists, the dude went crazy. The two cops spent the next several minutes struggling with this guy.

The cops were fit. And yet they could not get this guy under control. He got the better of them despite being drunk.

This is not a reflection on the cops. A maniac can take up to 5 people to subdue him. Especially if you don't allow them to use a choke hold.

If you watch the video of the fight, the cops refrained from using a choke hold on the dude, and he was able to not only get away, he was able to disarm them of their taser. It's just luck that is what they had in their hands for him to take and not a gun.

As I watched, I said to my son, "If they used a choke hold on him, that dude would be alive today."

My son hates the cops. He's had some run-ins with them.

But he saw my point.

I've never had an opinion of the choke hold. I know some people have been hurt by choke holds, and I know the rare person has been killed by the choke hold.

But that fight would have been over in seconds if those cops used it. And the dude would be alive.

He would be alive if he didn't put up a fight, too, but that's another discussion.

I don't think your opinion is without merit. All this will cost more lives than it will save over the long term.

I don't think so. The choke hold has not killed that many people.

2 in California, I think. I don't know about the rest of the country.

I think that if using it becomes taboo, the standard for use of lethal force will shift down and therefore officers will be more likely to use lethal force.

 

[FA_Q2]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

I keep seeing called a taser but it looks like a stun gun from the video. Those have a reach of 15 feet or so. Not exactly sure what specific piece of equipment this was.

Those aren't multi-use.

No, they are not. However, there was very little time between the officer firing his weapon and being fired at. In all likelihood it was an instantaneous reaction to having a weapon both pointed at him and then discharged. A perfectly reasonable action on the part of the officer.

Drunk drivers kill people.

This one was passed out in a parking lot at Wendy's.

But yes, they kill people. However, this guy had not. He did not deserve to die.


What gets me is that some fuckwit asshole decided to firebomb the Wendy's over this.

He did not deserve to die unless they couldn't tell if it was the taser or a gun but I don't see him grabbing for a gun but using the taser he was already holding.

What do you think would have happened had he tazed the cop? You just think he was going to walk away after that?

After taking one weapon from the cop had he managed to actually disabled one of them then it is likely he would have tried to kill them. And that time with their service weapon.

As Unkotare said, you remove a weapon from a cop and try and use it against him you are going to die - end of story. The cops are justified in that situation.

What if he had a tank? Or yet a bomber or a suit of invisibility?

.....

What if he was mighty mouse? I fail to see the point of any of those silly questions.

 

[pknopp]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

I keep seeing called a taser but it looks like a stun gun from the video. Those have a reach of 15 feet or so. Not exactly sure what specific piece of equipment this was.

Those aren't multi-use.

No, they are not. However, there was very little time between the officer firing his weapon and being fired at. In all likelihood it was an instantaneous reaction to having a weapon both pointed at him and then discharged. A perfectly reasonable action on the part of the officer.

Drunk drivers kill people.

This one was passed out in a parking lot at Wendy's.

But yes, they kill people. However, this guy had not. He did not deserve to die.


What gets me is that some fuckwit asshole decided to firebomb the Wendy's over this.

He did not deserve to die unless they couldn't tell if it was the taser or a gun but I don't see him grabbing for a gun but using the taser he was already holding.

What do you think would have happened had he tazed the cop? You just think he was going to walk away after that?

After taking one weapon from the cop had he managed to actually disabled one of them then it is likely he would have tried to kill them. And that time with their service weapon.

As Unkotare said, you remove a weapon from a cop and try and use it against him you are going to die - end of story. The cops are justified in that situation.

What if he had a tank? Or yet a bomber or a suit of invisibility?

.....

What if he was mighty mouse? I fail to see the point of any of those silly questions.

If you are going to ask what if's, we can go down that road many times. We are dealing with what is.

The police officer was in no danger but yet he shot a man twice in the back as he was running away.

 

[Unkotare]

...
He did not deserve to die unless ....

If you resist arrest, take a weapon from a police officer and fire it at him, you cannot reasonably expect any other outcome.

How far can a taser reach?

I keep seeing called a taser but it looks like a stun gun from the video. Those have a reach of 15 feet or so. Not exactly sure what specific piece of equipment this was.

Those aren't multi-use.

No, they are not. However, there was very little time between the officer firing his weapon and being fired at. In all likelihood it was an instantaneous reaction to having a weapon both pointed at him and then discharged. A perfectly reasonable action on the part of the officer.

Drunk drivers kill people.

This one was passed out in a parking lot at Wendy's.

But yes, they kill people. However, this guy had not. He did not deserve to die.


What gets me is that some fuckwit asshole decided to firebomb the Wendy's over this.

He did not deserve to die unless they couldn't tell if it was the taser or a gun but I don't see him grabbing for a gun but using the taser he was already holding.

What do you think would have happened had he tazed the cop? You just think he was going to walk away after that?

After taking one weapon from the cop had he managed to actually disabled one of them then it is likely he would have tried to kill them. And that time with their service weapon.

As Unkotare said, you remove a weapon from a cop and try and use it against him you are going to die - end of story. The cops are justified in that situation.

What if he had a tank? Or yet a bomber or a suit of invisibility?

.....

What if he was mighty mouse? I fail to see the point of any of those silly questions.

If you are going to ask what if's, we can go down that road many times. We are dealing with what is.

The police officer was in no danger but yet he shot a man twice in the back as he was running away.

Put your ass in his shoes in that moment and then say that. You're full of shit. The outcome of this situation was tragically unnecessary, but that's on him, not the police officer in this case.