Landlords are required to deny reality and play along

[novasteve]

The article is just that. An article. An opinion. If the name on the lease agreement or rental agreement is Michael, and Michael has not legally changed his name in a court of law in the state where this takes place, then the landlord has every right to call the tenant the name given on the rental agreement. Yes, it is bullshit, and not Law. If Michael tries to sue because he is not being called Michelle, the judge will laugh him out of court.

This whole thread is not about that anyway. It is just novasteve having another hissy about transexuals.

Say if trannies get their way and you can be sued for not calling someone by the name they want to be called that isn't their legal changed name?

 

[Gracie]

How old are you, seriously???

 

[novasteve]

How old are you, seriously???

Are you prepared to answer any questions or prove any of your claims?

 

[Kooshdakhaa]

The article states that the landlord must start calling the transgender tenant "Michelle," even though the name on the rental agreement is "Michael." Otherwise, it is harrassment. Calling him by his legal name of "Michael" is harrassment. What a bunch of bullshit.

If Michael wants to be called Michelle, he should legally change his name. Unless he legally changes his name, his landlord nor anyone else should be legally required to call him by a different name just because he wants them to.

This is bullshit. I'm glad none of this matters to me that much or affects me that much. The only affect transgender people have on my life is to add a little entertainment to it. Yeah, that's right, I find them amusing. So put me in jail.

And they say the landlord isn't being forced to deny reality.

If you have kids, your child might be subjected to a tranny roommate in a college dorm.

Okay, I don't have kids and generally don't give a crap about other people's kids, but if I had a daughter going to college and she was required to room with a guy who was "a woman inside" I would have a fucking hissy fit.

Is that where this is going? If so, I shall watch it unfold with great amusement, but like I said, it doesn't affect me.

 

[Gracie]

How old are you, seriously???

Are you prepared to answer any questions or prove any of your claims?

Sorry..I don't debate or teach teenagers.

 

[Gracie]

The article states that the landlord must start calling the transgender tenant "Michelle," even though the name on the rental agreement is "Michael." Otherwise, it is harrassment. Calling him by his legal name of "Michael" is harrassment. What a bunch of bullshit.

If Michael wants to be called Michelle, he should legally change his name. Unless he legally changes his name, his landlord nor anyone else should be legally required to call him by a different name just because he wants them to.

This is bullshit. I'm glad none of this matters to me that much or affects me that much. The only affect transgender people have on my life is to add a little entertainment to it. Yeah, that's right, I find them amusing. So put me in jail.

And they say the landlord isn't being forced to deny reality.

If you have kids, your child might be subjected to a tranny roommate in a college dorm.

Okay, I don't have kids and generally don't give a crap about other people's kids, but if I had a daughter going to college and she was required to room with a guy who was "a woman inside" I would have a fucking hissy fit.

Is that where this is going? If so, I shall watch it unfold with great amusement, but like I said, it doesn't affect me.

I would too. Unless my daughter didn't have a problem with it AND the guy is already in the process of becoming a woman.

 

[Kooshdakhaa]

The article is just that. An article. An opinion. If the name on the lease agreement or rental agreement is Michael, and Michael has not legally changed his name in a court of law in the state where this takes place, then the landlord has every right to call the tenant the name given on the rental agreement. Yes, it is bullshit, and not Law. If Michael tries to sue because he is not being called Michelle, the judge will laugh him out of court.

This whole thread is not about that anyway. It is just novasteve having another hissy about transexuals.

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:

If you continuously and intentionally call her by the name and pronoun that does not correspond to her gender identity, you may be liable for gender discrimination and unlawful harassment.

"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

 

[Kooshdakhaa]

And they say the landlord isn't being forced to deny reality.

If you have kids, your child might be subjected to a tranny roommate in a college dorm.

Okay, I don't have kids and generally don't give a crap about other people's kids, but if I had a daughter going to college and she was required to room with a guy who was "a woman inside" I would have a fucking hissy fit.

Is that where this is going? If so, I shall watch it unfold with great amusement, but like I said, it doesn't affect me.

I would too. Unless my daughter didn't have a problem with it AND the guy is already in the process of becoming a woman.

Yeah, I know how that "process" goes. A lot of them never finish the process because of money. It costs a lot of money for the surgery. So they must tolerate living as a "woman" with a penis.

And I agree, if my college-age daughter didn't have a problem with it, I suppose I'd be okay with it. They could even bring their roommate home on spring break if they wanted. I tend to accept people as individuals, one on one, when it comes down to it.

The problem would be young women being forced to room with transgenders when they don't WANT a roommate who has a penis.

 

[Dugdale_Jukes]

Landlord must uphold transgender tenant's rights - latimes.com

All the landlord has to do is rent the place, meet legal standards for safety and amenities and take "reasonable man" standards to protect all tenants from one another. A landlord can call the tenant by their last name legally or not use any name at all except "hey you".

There is no enforceable legal obligation for the landlord to do anything for this tenant than is not required for other tenants. Harassment, for example, is illegal for any reason. As others suggested, the key is for landlords to avoid creating testimony against themselves by avoiding discriminatory behavior/comments and by meeting legal standards.

Further, if the tenant gets out of line provoking other tenants, the landlord can move against the tenant for provocative behavior. Given this is la la land, the landlord is basically in a bad spot. If property management was a walk in the park, more people would do it.

 

[novasteve]

The article is just that. An article. An opinion. If the name on the lease agreement or rental agreement is Michael, and Michael has not legally changed his name in a court of law in the state where this takes place, then the landlord has every right to call the tenant the name given on the rental agreement. Yes, it is bullshit, and not Law. If Michael tries to sue because he is not being called Michelle, the judge will laugh him out of court.

This whole thread is not about that anyway. It is just novasteve having another hissy about transexuals.

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:

If you continuously and intentionally call her by the name and pronoun that does not correspond to her gender identity, you may be liable for gender discrimination and unlawful harassment.

"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

 

[novasteve]

Okay, I don't have kids and generally don't give a crap about other people's kids, but if I had a daughter going to college and she was required to room with a guy who was "a woman inside" I would have a fucking hissy fit.

Is that where this is going? If so, I shall watch it unfold with great amusement, but like I said, it doesn't affect me.

I would too. Unless my daughter didn't have a problem with it AND the guy is already in the process of becoming a woman.

Yeah, I know how that "process" goes. A lot of them never finish the process because of money. It costs a lot of money for the surgery. So they must tolerate living as a "woman" with a penis.

And I agree, if my college-age daughter didn't have a problem with it, I suppose I'd be okay with it. They could even bring their roommate home on spring break if they wanted. I tend to accept people as individuals, one on one, when it comes down to it.

The problem would be young women being forced to room with transgenders when they don't WANT a roommate who has a penis.

If the reason is cost, then insurers will be forced to cover it, raising the insurance cost for others. Are you prepared to pay for medically unecessary surgeries and drugs that will raise your insurance price?

The real reason why so few have the surgery isn't cost, but that they will no longer have working sexual organs. They can't construct a working penis, nor a working vagina.

 

[Kooshdakhaa]

The article is just that. An article. An opinion. If the name on the lease agreement or rental agreement is Michael, and Michael has not legally changed his name in a court of law in the state where this takes place, then the landlord has every right to call the tenant the name given on the rental agreement. Yes, it is bullshit, and not Law. If Michael tries to sue because he is not being called Michelle, the judge will laugh him out of court.

This whole thread is not about that anyway. It is just novasteve having another hissy about transexuals.

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:

If you continuously and intentionally call her by the name and pronoun that does not correspond to her gender identity, you may be liable for gender discrimination and unlawful harassment.

"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

Michael could "say" it's harrassment but I don't think he'd have much of a legal leg to stand on. And I think it is unlikely that a lawyer would take on his lawsuit on such flimsy grounds. And if they do, just find yourself a lawyer who will take your case on a contingency basis and counter sue.

 

[Gracie]

I had a tenant that coughed a lot due to illness. The immediate neighbors complained. I said ok. Fine. Let's all go and tell him he cannot hack his lungs out any more just before dying because it was bothering the neighbors. They all declined.
I handled the situation by telling the guy to close his windows when he felt a bad spell coming on.

But that has nothing to do with transgenders. If I had a michael and wanted to be called michelle...no problem. LEGALLY though, if I had to give him some form of legal notice, it would be under the name he used when he filled out the rental agreement. If other tenants had a hissy about a transgender living on the premises...they can find another place to live. Same as if a black person moved in and some whites had a cow. I don't tolerate bigots much. Never have, never will. Even in property management.

Someday, remind me to tell y'all the tale about the two gay guys who also did female impersonation acts at the local gay bar and when they were dressed up as French Models and the guys upstairs had no clue they were wolf whistling two other guys. lol.

 

[novasteve]

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:



"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

Michael could "say" it's harrassment but I don't think he'd have much of a legal leg to stand on. And I think it is unlikely that a lawyer would take on his lawsuit on such flimsy grounds. And if they do, just find yourself a lawyer who will take your case on a contingency basis and counter sue.

It won't cost michael a penny because michael will use the human rights laws to have the taxpayer pay for the lawsuit. You, the landlord, will have to pay for your defense though.

 

[Gracie]

The article is just that. An article. An opinion. If the name on the lease agreement or rental agreement is Michael, and Michael has not legally changed his name in a court of law in the state where this takes place, then the landlord has every right to call the tenant the name given on the rental agreement. Yes, it is bullshit, and not Law. If Michael tries to sue because he is not being called Michelle, the judge will laugh him out of court.

This whole thread is not about that anyway. It is just novasteve having another hissy about transexuals.

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:

If you continuously and intentionally call her by the name and pronoun that does not correspond to her gender identity, you may be liable for gender discrimination and unlawful harassment.

"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

You are not very smart are you? That bigot brain of yours is in control.

 

[novasteve]

I had a tenant that coughed a lot due to illness. The immediate neighbors complained. I said ok. Fine. Let's all go and tell him he cannot hack his lungs out any more just before dying because it was bothering the neighbors. They all declined.
I handled the situation by telling the guy to close his windows when he felt a bad spell coming on.

But that has nothing to do with transgenders. If I had a michael and wanted to be called michelle...no problem. LEGALLY though, if I had to give him some form of legal notice, it would be under the name he used when he filled out the rental agreement. If other tenants had a hissy about a transgender living on the premises...they can find another place to live. Same as if a black person moved in and some whites had a cow. I don't tolerate bigots much. Never have, never will. Even in property management.

Someday, remind me to tell y'all the tale about the two gay guys who also did female impersonation acts at the local gay bar and when they were dressed up as French Models and the guys upstairs had no clue they were wolf whistling two other guys. lol.

it's bigotry to consider someone with a penis to be a male?

I am insulted you would compare that to racial bigotry.


You are shameless, and delusional.

 

[Gracie]

Yeah, I see your point. It is a question and answer column. The person supplying the answer wrote:



"You may be liable..." Kind of a threatening statement.

I would solve it easily. I wouldn't call the person by any name. I'd see them and just say, "Hi, how are you today?" No need to say "Hi, Michael" or "Hi, Michelle." That's how I'd get around it.

As for my other tenants who were upset I'd explain that the law was on Michael/Michelle's side and there was nothing I could do. Ask them to please stay and support me, and to let me know if Michael/Michelle did anything to violate the rules so I would have a legitimate basis to evict him/her.

Landlords aren't necessarily rich people, and having trouble renting out their apartments could cause them to be unable to pay their mortgage and end up losing their property.

This situation puts the landlord between a rock and a hard place. I can actually empathise with both sides in this dilemma. The landlord's also, not just the transgender person's side.

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

Michael could "say" it's harrassment but I don't think he'd have much of a legal leg to stand on. And I think it is unlikely that a lawyer would take on his lawsuit on such flimsy grounds. And if they do, just find yourself a lawyer who will take your case on a contingency basis and counter sue.

The landlord does not need a lawyer if sued. All the landlord has to do is show the rental agreement and the name on it. The judge will ask the tenant where the form is where he legally changed his name. Oh. Don't have one? Case dismissed. Oh, and Michael has to pay all court fees for filing something so stupid.

BANG BANG. Next case, please.

 

[Gracie]

I had a tenant that coughed a lot due to illness. The immediate neighbors complained. I said ok. Fine. Let's all go and tell him he cannot hack his lungs out any more just before dying because it was bothering the neighbors. They all declined.
I handled the situation by telling the guy to close his windows when he felt a bad spell coming on.

But that has nothing to do with transgenders. If I had a michael and wanted to be called michelle...no problem. LEGALLY though, if I had to give him some form of legal notice, it would be under the name he used when he filled out the rental agreement. If other tenants had a hissy about a transgender living on the premises...they can find another place to live. Same as if a black person moved in and some whites had a cow. I don't tolerate bigots much. Never have, never will. Even in property management.

Someday, remind me to tell y'all the tale about the two gay guys who also did female impersonation acts at the local gay bar and when they were dressed up as French Models and the guys upstairs had no clue they were wolf whistling two other guys. lol.

it's bigotry to consider someone with a penis to be a male?

I am insulted you would compare that to racial bigotry.


You are shameless, and delusional.

You're still an idiot.

 

[novasteve]

You not referring to them by "Michelle" but instead "you" could be considered "harassment" though.

If you referred to Michael as "you" or the "tenant in 212" then Michael could say that's harassment. You will get sued. Michael might not win, but it will cost you money. that's the point.

Michael could "say" it's harrassment but I don't think he'd have much of a legal leg to stand on. And I think it is unlikely that a lawyer would take on his lawsuit on such flimsy grounds. And if they do, just find yourself a lawyer who will take your case on a contingency basis and counter sue.

The landlord does not need a lawyer if sued. All the landlord has to do is show the rental agreement and the name on it. The judge will ask the tenant where the form is where he legally changed his name. Oh. Don't have one? Case dismissed. Oh, and Michael has to pay all court fees for filing something so stupid.

BANG BANG. Next case, please.

You are ignoring the antidiscrimination laws brought up in this topic. The tenant will argue harassment.

If you are being sued by the state under human rights violations, if you represent yourself without legal training, in fact, anyone who does so, you know the saying. He who represents himself has a fool for a client.

You clearly don't understand the laws that the author of the article is describing. Do you think you know more about california law than he does? he's a lawyer. Are you? His job is to be lawyer. is that your job? who knows more about california law?

 

[novasteve]

I had a tenant that coughed a lot due to illness. The immediate neighbors complained. I said ok. Fine. Let's all go and tell him he cannot hack his lungs out any more just before dying because it was bothering the neighbors. They all declined.
I handled the situation by telling the guy to close his windows when he felt a bad spell coming on.

But that has nothing to do with transgenders. If I had a michael and wanted to be called michelle...no problem. LEGALLY though, if I had to give him some form of legal notice, it would be under the name he used when he filled out the rental agreement. If other tenants had a hissy about a transgender living on the premises...they can find another place to live. Same as if a black person moved in and some whites had a cow. I don't tolerate bigots much. Never have, never will. Even in property management.

Someday, remind me to tell y'all the tale about the two gay guys who also did female impersonation acts at the local gay bar and when they were dressed up as French Models and the guys upstairs had no clue they were wolf whistling two other guys. lol.

it's bigotry to consider someone with a penis to be a male?

I am insulted you would compare that to racial bigotry.


You are shameless, and delusional.

S
You're still an idiot.

omeone with a COCK is a woman. got it.

You are delusional.

No wonder you live in california.

land of FRUITS, nuts and flakes.