Judge Cannon has blown it.

[CrusaderFrank]

What is he gonna get a writ from the circuit ordering her to do?

Change her jury instructions?? Case should be tossed

 

[SeaMajor7]

From someone that didn't even know you can appeal motions in limine prior to trial if the Judge makes an error in the application of the law.

WW

Keep flailing, Bob.
Smith is TOAST.

 

[struth]

Change her jury instructions?? Case should be tossed

He thinks he can have an appeals court order a judge to change her jury instructions? Haha

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's not an appeal of the case, it's called motion in limine, Latin meaning "at the threshold". It's an appeal of a specific aspect of the case. Such motions are pretrial or outside the presence of the jury.

And yes, a bad application of the law CAN be appealed pretrial in what is known as an interlocutory appeal where the party appealing will normally ask the appellate court to instruct the trial court Judge to correct an error in application of the law.

WW

Are you telling us, as Smith apparently is, that President Trump was NOT subject to the Presidential Records Act?

 

[CowboyTed]

Well, I guess you guys drew a f*ed up hand then didn’t you? She’s going to ram this down your throats, and there is little to nothing you can do about it…I guess Smith will get another loss notch in his worthless career belt….lol

I don't think you get how the appeals system works...

Cannon has way over the top... Conservative legal experts don't defend her....

She is very close to get thrown off or be on a very short leash...

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I don't think you get how the appeals system works...

Cannon has way over the top... Conservative legal experts don't defend her....

She is very close to get thrown off or be on a very short leash...

Are you saying the President Trump is not subject to the Presidential Records Act?

 

[DBA]

Your opinion about the judges ruling is based solely on politics.

As your yours.

 

[Marener]

As your yours.

Not really. Cannon is the only judge we see talking about that had to be reversed upon appeal. Epically too.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Are you telling us, as Smith apparently is, that President Trump was NOT subject to the Presidential Records Act?

Presidential Records (44 U.S.C. Chapter 22)

(44 U.S.C. Chapter 22) § 2201. Definitions § 2202. Ownership of Presidential records § 2203. Management and custody of Presidential records § 2204. Restrictions on access to Presidential records § 2205. Exceptions to restricted access § 2206. Regulations § 2207. Vice-Presidential records § Note...

www.archives.gov

Just the opposite, that the former President is subject to BOTH the PRA of 1978 as a function of civil law AND the Espionage Act (specifically 18 USC 793(e)) as a function of criminal law.

The PRA clearly defines what constitutes a "Presidential Record" and what constitutes a "Personal Record" and that Presidential Records are the property of the United States Government. Presidential Record can include classified and unclassified documents. Finally that Presidential Records MUST be transferred to the custody of the National Archivist at the end of a Presidents time in office.

That for former President violated the PRA when he failed to surrender at the end of his term Presidential Records as defined by the act. In addition has actions proceeded to criminal activity under 18 USC 793(e) when he refused to surrender classified documents to official agents of the United States Government when told to do so via verbally, via correspondence, and finally by failing to respond fully to a Federal Courts subpoena for such documents.

WW

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Presidential Records (44 U.S.C. Chapter 22)

(44 U.S.C. Chapter 22) § 2201. Definitions § 2202. Ownership of Presidential records § 2203. Management and custody of Presidential records § 2204. Restrictions on access to Presidential records § 2205. Exceptions to restricted access § 2206. Regulations § 2207. Vice-Presidential records § Note...

www.archives.gov

Just the opposite, that the former President is subject to BOTH the PRA of 1978 as a function of civil law AND the Espionage Act (specifically 18 USC 793(e)) as a function of criminal law.

The PRA clearly defines what constitutes a "Presidential Record" and what constitutes a "Personal Record" and that Presidential Records are the property of the United States Government. Presidential Record can include classified and unclassified documents. Finally that Presidential Records MUST be transferred to the custody of the National Archivist at the end of a Presidents time in office.

That for former President violated the PRA when he failed to surrender at the end of his term Presidential Records as defined by the act. In addition has actions proceeded to criminal activity under 18 USC 793(e) when he refused to surrender classified documents to official agents of the United States Government when told to do so via verbally, via correspondence, and finally by failing to respond fully to a Federal Courts subpoena for such documents.

WW

What happens if he transfers them electronically, but keeps a hard copy?

In any event,in the Clinton Socks case, Jackson wrote that “the President enjoys unconstrained authority to make decisions regarding the disposal of documents: ‘[a]lthough the President must notify the Archivist before disposing of records . . . neither the Archivist nor Congress has the authority to veto the President’s disposal decision.’”

 

[rampart]

Not if she gets kicked off the case...

This is a pretty open shut case at this stage...

A new judge will set a trail date and bang it is done...
Trump Defence team wouldn't get any more delays.

A smarter judge could have slow walked (if they wished) this far better... Cannon is really inexperienced.

If Cannon was smart, she would get a top class legal expert (which she could get easily), she would have found some point of law and run it up the ladder..

Personally, I think Smith knew this was screwed timewise as soon as she was appointed... She has slow walked this now for 9 months.. 7 months more to go...

a new judge restarts the entire process. 6-8 months or more for a trial date, motions .......

meanwhile the precedent that trump, and future treasonous presidents, can sell any secrets they want.

how can even republicans want to give this guy and his successors an unchecked unbalanced power to declassify with his mind?

 

[rampart]

Well, I guess you guys drew a f*ed up hand then didn’t you? She’s going to ram this down your throats, and there is little to nothing you can do about it…I guess Smith will get another loss notch in his worthless career belt….lol

just the way the founders planned it. powerful interests can ram injustice down our throats.

we do not seek such injustice, a fair chance to restore a few vital checks and balances.

is it fair to ask WHY you want to give such unchecked power to any human?

 

[bendog]

Most of you on the right probably haven't figured this out, judging from some of your comments which clearly indicate you do not understand the forces that are in play, i.e.,, what the actual dynamics are, (it's way in Smith's favor, FYI) because they right wing echo chamber isn't telling you, but Judge Cannon fucked up on the law, royally. Jack will file a motion in limine, and if she ignores it, he'll have grounds for a petition for writ of mandamus, and he'll either get the 11th circuit to straighten her out on the law (which she has turned on it's head), or get her ass off the case. She's bitten off far more than she can chew.

Let's see if I'm right. We'll know in a day or two. One thing is certain, Jack's not going to let the last 2 page order where she wrote 'unprecedented and unjust', he's not going to let that slide.

This is really an interesting case, particularly because we have an extremely wet behind the ears judge handling a case who is in way way way over her head. But, that's the system, whoever is next on the rotation, regardless of experience matching, is the one assigned, and she got it. Clearly, the system is ripe for reform.

links are generally a good idea.

 

[WorldWatcher]

What happens if he transfers them electronically, but keeps a hard copy?

Of non-classified documents?

The copies are also the property of the US Governmnent, but for unclassified documents it probably wouldn't be a big deal.

For copies of classified documents, the copies are treated the same as the original. The copies are classified and the copies are the property of the United States Government and in now way can they be viewed as "Personal Records" under the PRA definition.

In any event,in the Clinton Socks case, Jackson wrote that “the President enjoys unconstrained authority to make decisions regarding the disposal of documents: ‘[a]lthough the President must notify the Archivist before disposing of records . . . neither the Archivist nor Congress has the authority to veto the President’s disposal decision.’”

I'd say you are taking text out of context.

What that is talking about is if the President decides to dispose of records -- DURING THEIR TERM -- that (s)he feels are no longer required under the PRA. Even then the President is required by law to obtain permission - in writing - from the Archivist that the Archivists agrees with the President. Only then can they be disposed of.

WW

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Most of you on the right probably haven't figured this out, judging from some of your comments which clearly indicate you do not understand the forces that are in play, i.e.,, what the actual dynamics are, (it's way in Smith's favor, FYI) because they right wing echo chamber isn't telling you, but Judge Cannon fucked up on the law, royally. Jack will file a motion in limine, and if she ignores it, he'll have grounds for a petition for writ of mandamus, and he'll either get the 11th circuit to straighten her out on the law (which she has turned on it's head), or get her ass off the case. She's bitten off far more than she can chew.

Let's see if I'm right. We'll know in a day or two. One thing is certain, Jack's not going to let the last 2 page order where she wrote 'unprecedented and unjust', he's not going to let that slide.

This is really an interesting case, particularly because we have an extremely wet behind the ears judge handling a case who is in way way way over her head. But, that's the system, whoever is next on the rotation, regardless of experience matching, is the one assigned, and she got it. Clearly, the system is ripe for reform.

Its a bizarre system. Almost like a royal patronage.I would expect America to be more merocratic. But I suppose trump is inventing a new system to accomodate his larceny.

 

[BluesLegend]

Cry harder witch hunt Dem assholes

 

[Rumpole]

Cannon hands Smith his own ass…And the armchair prog legal beagles are melting down…I love it.

Sorry, Smith has a queen cornering her and she has only one two moves, and of those two moves, only one is correct. She blows it again, and Smith will, well, read it for yourself. Smith has the upper hand, but if he files a writ of mandamus and has her removed, it will delay the trial, but she's not going to let it go to trial before the election anyway. I don't think Smith will use the mandamus to have her removed, he will use it to force her to comply with the law, which she has thus far failed to do (ostensibly in move that would ultimately result in the dismissal of the case, her objective, apparently).

'The nuclear button': Special counsel could seek removal of judge in Trump classified docs case, attorneys warn

Special counsel Jack Smith and Judge Aileen Cannon traded terse words in filings this week.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[Rumpole]

And no funny business going on in Trump’s NYC trial? We all told you libs that having activists judges is dangerous. Liberal judges willing to rule against high profile defendants based solely on politics are dime a dozen. I find it quite ironic that Democrats are complaining about a partisan judge.

If that were true, you'd have a point.

But, since it is not, you don't.

 

[Rumpole]

Change her jury instructions?? Case should be tossed

There are no jury instructions at this juncture. Moot point. She should be tossed, and probably will be, or commanded to get the law right.

 

[Oddball]

Sorry, Smith has a queen cornering her and she has only one two moves, and of those two moves, only one is correct. She blows it again, and Smith will, well, read it for yourself. Smith has the upper hand, but if he files a writ of mandamus and has her removed, it will delay the trial, but she's not going to let it go to trial before the election anyway. I don't think Smith will use the mandamus to have her removed, he will use it to force her to comply with the law, which she has thus far failed to do (ostensibly in move that would ultimately result in the dismissal of the case, her objective, apparently).

'The nuclear button': Special counsel could seek removal of judge in Trump classified docs case, attorneys warn

Special counsel Jack Smith and Judge Aileen Cannon traded terse words in filings this week.

www.nbcnews.com