Quantum Windbag
Gold Member
- May 9, 2010
- 58,308
- 5,102
- 245
Congress and the President are doing bad is one thing to say. "Government is bad" is a totally different thing to say.
Congress and the President work for We The People.
Government is a good thing.
We The People are failing because of monetary interests.
Let me see if I can explain this to you using small words.
The use of force to accomplish your goals is wrong. Using the government to accomplish your goals is using force. Forcing people to do things just because you can is evil. Ergo, government is evil.
You bring up a good topic. Using force to install rules.
When debating Liberty there is a question that always has to be asked.
"Necessity vs. Risk"
I'm sure you are mad right now because you probably think Liberty is Freedom and we need it no matter what!
There are HUNDREDS of examples but I always discuss Biker Helmets, because Bikers are generally Libertarians. Let's discuss the helmet "Liberty".
What does the Biker gain? Freedom of riding a motorcycle without a helmet. So tough!
What is the risk? The biker is very likely to lay the bike over when it hits an onslaught of things that aren't predictable.
So the gain may be Freedom but the risk is an entire family that has to visit you in the hospital when you are on the vent in critical condition driving up everyone's healthcare costs. You have now "infringed" the Liberty of your family members and the people in your healthcare network because you were too stupid to make a common sense decision.
Risk vs. Necessity.
Wow, that was almost an intelligent attempt to address the issues.
Almost.
Let's start this by looking at some definitions.
Liberty
1: the quality or state of being free:
a : the power to do as one pleases
b : freedom from physical restraint
c : freedom from arbitrary or despotic control
d : the positive enjoyment of various social, political, or economic rights and privileges
e : the power of choice
2a : a right or immunity enjoyed by prescription or by grant : privilege
b : permission especially to go freely within specified limits
3: an action going beyond normal limits: as
a : a breach of etiquette or propriety : familiarity
b : risk, chance <took foolish liberties with his health>
c : a violation of rules or a deviation from standard practice
d : a distortion of fact
4: a short authorized absence from naval duty usually for less than 48 hours
Gotta admit, I didn't see that one coming, liberty is the quality or state of being free, while freedom is the quality or state of being free. That means that you are wrong, liberty and freedom actually are the same thing.Freedom
1: the quality or state of being free: as
a : the absence of necessity, coercion, or constraint in choice or action
b : liberation from slavery or restraint or from the power of another : independence
c : the quality or state of being exempt or released usually from something onerous <freedom from care>
d : ease, facility <spoke the language with freedom>
e : the quality of being frank, open, or outspoken <answered with freedom>
f : improper familiarity
g : boldness of conception or execution
h : unrestricted use <gave him the freedom of their home>
2
a : a political right
As usual, you are asking the wrong question. The question is never what does the individual gain from government, it is what does he lose.
What does the biker lose? The right to legally exercise his inherent ability to make up his own mind. What does the biker gain? Ultimately, he gets a gun pointed at his head telling him what to do.
Is there a risk in not wearing a helmet? Of course there is, everyone knows that, but it is his choice, not yours. You do not have the right to tell any adult how to live their lives, the idea that you can is fundamentally evil. It is the same mindset that gave us Castro, Duvalier, Gaddafi, Ceausescu, Hitler, Hussein, Mussolini, Stalin, Tito, and all the other tyrants throughout history. It also gave us slavery, because everyone knows that those people cannot take care of themselves.
Last edited: