It isn't your grandfather's LEFT anymore

[ElmerMudd]

BULLSHIT.

You're a lying little leftard asswipe just like all the rest.

I am so impressed how articulate the Trump braindead cult members are. Their command of the english language allows them to express their feelings in, such, an intellectual way.

 

[Oddball]

I am so impressed how articulate the Trump braindead cult members are. Their command of the english language allows them to express their feelings in, such, an intellectual way.

PROVE HIM WRONG!

 

[sparky]

The governments of such countries put various labels on their governments, but all are totalitarian in reality with total control and all will punish, imprison, or execute any of their citizens who serious oppose them in any meaningful way, even to the point of turning their military on them

Yes they evolve to all those things Fox

Unfortunately , so is America by degree.....

~S~

 

[ElmerMudd]

PROVE HIM WRONG!

You are asking me to prove I am not an asswipe or leftard. That is a question from an illogical, brainwashed individual.

 

[Coyote]

I didn't say I was addressing the anomalies. I said the exact opposite of that.

And I'm sorry, but in policy again and again and again, from the rhetoric coming from the House and Senate floor, in the media, from entertainers and sports figures, etc. etc. etc., the position of the left on the listed issues is consistently as I described them. For instance, there are zero Democrat policies either at the state or national level even recognizing, much less promoting or supporting the traditional mom, dad & kids. But the left holds up all the other kinds of families as somehow noble and brave and wonderful. The very situations that produce most of child hunger.

To say that the right doesn't care about kids after they are born is not only deeply dishonest but downright insulting. Again sorry.

Etc.

And thank you for finally addressing the men in sports issue. You are an island unto yourself on that one apparently as every state or local jurisdiction that has tried to legislate keeping biological males out of women's sports had been condemned by the left for being transphobic, denying rights, or worse. In fact in April the House of Representatives passed a bill barring biological males from competing in women's sports. The Democrat led Senate refused to bring it to a vote, the Democrats won't support it, Biden said he would veto it if they did.

Ok, first off I find insulting when you say the left doesn’t care about children when I gave plenty of examples on how they DO.

On the family stuff…I’m not sure what you think is wrong exactly. The government has no business promoting any sort of family structure, it is a highly individual choice and that should be respected. In promoting something, you are effectively telling those who live in a different arrangement that they are invalid and I don’t agree with that. Now I DO agree that marriage has benefits including stability, prosperity and commitment and that applies to both opposite and same sex unions. In that sense, it is better for a child, but does the government have a right to promote any of it? You say the left holds it up as wonderful etc, but I don’t think so. I think they are just putting it out as equal.

But I don’t see much promotes single parent families which is one factor that correlates to poverty. But that is one of many factors.

Another thing to point out is that normalizing (ie recognizing different family makeups) is not the same as promoting. Recognizing same sex marriage is no more promoting than recognizing traditional marriage.

On trans women in women’s sports, the left is far from unified, as I indicated more oppose than support. I think however, that this must come from the individual sports associations for adults and states for school children. I DO think the pressure is on them to find a solution that does not involve biological males competing with biological females.

 

[lennypartiv]

How did it happen? Why did it happen? How does it sustain itself and spread? Inquiring minds want to know.

Democrats used to hold the same values as us, but not anymore. Those days are long gone.

 

[Foxfyre]

Ok, first off I find insulting when you say the left doesn’t care about children when I gave plenty of examples on how they DO.

On the family stuff…I’m not sure what you think is wrong exactly. The government has no business promoting any sort of family structure, it is a highly individual choice and that should be respected. In promoting something, you are effectively telling those who live in a different arrangement that they are invalid and I don’t agree with that. Now I DO agree that marriage has benefits including stability, prosperity and commitment and that applies to both opposite and same sex unions. In that sense, it is better for a child, but does the government have a right to promote any of it? You say the left holds it up as wonderful etc, but I don’t think so. I think they are just putting it out as equal.

But I don’t see much promotes single parent families which is one factor that correlates to poverty. But that is one of many factors.

Another thing to point out is that normalizing (ie recognizing different family makeups) is not the same as promoting. Recognizing same sex marriage is no more promoting than recognizing traditional marriage.

On trans women in women’s sports, the left is far from unified, as I indicated more oppose than support. I think however, that this must come from the individual sports associations for adults and states for school children. I DO think the pressure is on them to find a solution that does not involve biological males competing with biological females.

I don't think I even implied the left doesn't care about children. I said the left doesn't care that their policies have been bad for children, i.e. refuse to even consider that as a possibility. They refuse to look at the consequences of what they promote and won't even discuss it. Almost every time they will turn the focus to criticize those who are looking at that.

When the focus is all on LGBTQX+, not only championing but applauding single motherhood and non traditional family and putting no effort into promoting and reinforcing marriage before having kids and responsible traditional nuclear families as the best situation for children, the left clearly signals that it doesn't consider that nuclear family important or even relevant to the discussion.

Single parenthood is the leading cause of child poverty in America.

Children with a responsible mother and father in the home, even in low income families, will overall do better in education, will be more emotionally and mentally healthy, will be far less likely to be truant or delinquent, will be far less likely to be physically or sexually abused, will be more likely to want that for themselves and their own children as adults.

And yes a good government in promoting the general welfare would never demand any particular lifestyle for its citizens, but it would recognize the measurable benefits to all when the nuclear mom and dad and kids family is the norm and would encourage and promote it.

To me a responsible left would put at least as much money, rhetoric, policy, effort into promoting that as they do in promoting and focusing on alternate lifestyles.

They don't.

 

[lennypartiv]

Way too long

Exactly. You'd have to do too much thinking.

 

[Foxfyre]

Democrats used to hold the same values as us, but not anymore. Those days are long gone.

Exactly which is the point of this thread. The American left and right has always disagreed on the role, scope, power, reach of government and has debated that endlessly. But as recently as a couple of generations ago, we all largely shared a common culture and basic traditional values.

I want to know what forces were at work that in a relatively short time, the left has pretty much reversed its focus and now disrespects or opposes that common culture and those basic traditional values.

 

[lennypartiv]

Exactly which is the point of this thread. The American left and right has always disagreed on the role, scope, power, reach of government and has debated that endlessly. But as recently as a couple of generations ago, we all largely shared a common culture and basic traditional values.

I want to know what forces were at work that in a relatively short time, the left has pretty much reversed its focus and now disrespects or opposes that common culture and those basic traditional values.

It started when our brave young men were in Vietnam. That's when they (liberal hippies) started to rebel against the government and our values. Then the pill came and they embraced free love. Gone were the days when we all said the Pledge of Allegiance when school started.

Yes, we were once a country with morals. Thanks to liberals Democrats, those days are long gone.

 

[Foxfyre]

It started when our brave young men were in Vietnam. That's when they (liberal hippies) started to rebel against the government and our values. Then the pill came and they embraced free love. Gone were the days when we all said the Pledge of Allegiance when school started.

Yes, we were once a country with morals. Thanks to liberals Democrats, those days are long gone.

But why? What forces are at play that have changed the American left to the point that instead of one cohesive culture in which we disagreed on this or that policy but did enjoy shared values of right and wrong, good and evil, we now have this huge divide and warring cultural factions?

I agree it began in the 60's, the Vietnam War did give it is significant push, but it has continued to escalate long after the fall of Saigon.

 

[lennypartiv]

But why? What forces are at play that have changed the American left to the point that instead of one cohesive culture in which we disagreed on this or that policy but did enjoy shared values of right and wrong, good and evil, we now have this huge divide and warring cultural factions?

I agree it began in the 60's, the Vietnam War did give it is significant push, but it has continued to escalate long after the fall of Saigon.

"Question authority" became the liberal mantra in the sixties. It still is their mantra. They don't respect authority.

 

[Foxfyre]

"Question authority" became the liberal mantra in the sixties. It still is their mantra. They don't respect authority.

Yes, that hippy generation of the 1960's was the first to rise up to oppose the government and reject the authority and values of their parents. But once they passed through their rebellion stage, most still embraced most traditional values re positive/negative, good/evil at that time. But, perhaps unintentionally, perhaps thoughtlessly, perhaps without understanding, they have since slowly and systematically dismantled institutions, traditions, values, history that has made America unique and greatest among nations.

And now they have the government, they have the authority. And they respect, defend, uphold as all that is good, honorable, just, righteous when they are the authority.

How did that happen?

 

[Rumpole]

Then we define generalization very differently.

I use the dictionary. You might want to give it a try, it will improve your ability to articulate with more precision.

 

[sparky]

"Question authority" became the liberal mantra in the sixties. It still is their mantra. They don't respect authority.

How did that happen?

Those 60's hippies grew up , and became the authority.

~S~

 

[Oddball]

"Question authority" became the liberal mantra in the sixties. It still is their mantra. They don't respect authority.

Nope....Now that they're in authority, you're a "terrorist" if you question them.

 

[Foxfyre]

Those 60's hippies grew up , and became the authority.

~S~

Yes they did. They honestly wanted to change the world for the better and so many many of them went into occupations of service and/or influence, i.e. education, government, media, science, entertainment, religion. There most maintained the basic American cultural values but always with that progressive mentality. And they mentored others who were like them so that all those institutions became increasingly left in sociopolitical philosophy.

But it has only been the recent generations that completely rejected most basic American values and instead push radical progressiveness that ignores those traditional American values and instills something very different and, in my opinion, mostly detrimental and harmful to all Americans. It is increasingly militant toward anyone who opposes it. It is that phenomenon that I am most interested in.

How did that happen. How can we stop/reverse it?

 

[Oddball]

Yes they did. They honestly wanted to change the world for the better and so many many of them went into occupations of service and/or influence, i.e. education, government, media, science, entertainment, religion. There most maintained the basic American cultural values but always with that progressive mentality. And they mentored others who were like them so that all those institutions became increasingly left in sociopolitical philosophy.

But it has only been the recent generations that completely rejected basic American values and instead push radical progressiveness that ignores those traditional American values and instills something very different and, in my opinion, mostly detrimental and harmful to all Americans. It is increasingly militant toward anyone who opposes it. It is that phenomenon that I am most interested in.

How did that happen.

The ones now in power infested the institutions and created this generation....The "never trust anyone over 30" generation turned 30, then said "hold my mocha latte", and proved their own maxim.

How can we stop/reverse it?

It's rapidly approaching the point where that won't be pretty.

 

[ElmerMudd]

"Question authority" became the liberal mantra in the sixties. It still is their mantra. They don't respect authority.

The irony of your statement is unbelievable. Your stupidity of not realizing the irony is unfathomable.
The far left of the 60's did not respect the US judicial system, the CIA, the FBI and law enforcement. They did not trust government.
The MAGA movemment does not respect the US judicial system, the CIA, the FBI and law enforcement. They do not trust government.

Thank you for pointing out the similarities between the far left of the 1960's and today's MAGA movement.

 

[Foxfyre]

The ones now in power infested the institutions and created this generation....The "never trust anyone over 30" generation turned 30, then said "hold my mocha latte", and proved their own maxim.


It's rapidly approaching the point where that won't be pretty.

Yes. I waver between the hope that Patriots whether left or right still outnumber the radicals and despair that we do not.