Is it fair to conflate immigration enforcement with xenophobia?

[Correll]

If you can't define it, then it begs the question. I wasn't under the impression that everyone who is considered "white" necessarily does the same thing.

Irrelevant.

You are trying "muddy the waters" by focusing on irrelevant details.

The fact remains. We have a culture, or a number of cultures that have value and that we care about.

You support policy that is hostile to those cultures and undemines them.


But you don't want to be honest about how much you hate us because you fear if people know what you are really about, they will resist you effectively.

 

[Correll]

I offer to you that they are the minority within the conservative base.
On the left - it is virtually all of them.
On this forum, you can find plenty of posts/threads from conservatives that are against a Republican - and absolutely - yes - against Trump. I am one of them.
I challenge you to find - ANY - post by a stated Democrat here that is against Democrats. Or one that ever admitted Joe Biden had serious cognitive decline. ANY.

ALSO, even of those that do that, if you managen to have a discussion with them and drilll down, most of them will happily admit to being aware of nuance and varitations but simply believing that they are irrelevant because the left moves as a loyal bloc.

ie differences without a distinction.

 

[Anomalism]

yeah, I'm going to have to stop you right there without reading the rest of your word salad.

If Trump was only against "illegal" immigration, he wouldn't be finding excuses to throw out legal immigrants, some of whom have been here since Childhood.

Like the Korean man who won a Purple Heart in Panama, but was denied citizenship because he didn't have enough time in service.

This is about racism. America isn't as white as it used to be, and that upsets people.

Let's see if we can find any common ground. You at least agree that that is his public position on the matter, yes?

 

[Correll]

Let's see if we can find any common ground. You at least agree that that is his public position on the matter, yes?

Trump's move to limit abuse of H-B visas is a sign of some oppostion even to LEGAL immigration. As well there should be.

 

[Anomalism]

Trump's move to limit abuse of H-B visas is a sign of some oppostion even to LEGAL immigration. As well there should be.

Wanting to limit abuse of the H-1B program isn’t opposition to legal immigration. It’s an effort to preserve its integrity. Every country has the right (and responsibility) to set reasonable, sustainable limits on immigration, even legal forms, to protect its labor markets, infrastructure, and social cohesion. Supporting legal immigration doesn't mean supporting unlimited immigration or abuse of the system. It means favoring a lawful, fair, and orderly process that protects our national interests. Fixing abuses within the system ensures that legal immigration continues to benefit both newcomers and citizens, which is something any serious immigration policy should strive for.

 

[Delldude]

Xenophobia exists for a reason. I am not saying this is a good or a bad thing, but when you have a large group of people taking advantage of the immigration system, getting unfair advantages, spreading drugs and crime, you are going to have a lot of resentment for it.

BOTOH, support for immigration polls near 75% in all three voting groups.
However, media tries to use that to make the public think deporting these people goes against the polling.
They just neglect to tell you the polling is about legal immigration.

 

[JanetTheGreat]

BOTOH, support for immigration polls near 75% in all three voting groups.
However, media tries to use that to make the public think deporting these people goes against the polling.
They just neglect to tell you the polling is about legal immigration.

My view is that we should go as far to limit legal immigration to some extent, from certain countries.

 

[Delldude]

My view is that we should go as far to limit legal immigration to some extent, from certain countries.

Pretty sure Trump recently did that.

 

[JoeB131]

Let's see if we can find any common ground. You at least agree that that is his public position on the matter, yes?

No, not really. Know them by their works. His whole speil was anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration.

And his followers didn't care.

 

[Anomalism]

No, not really. Know them by their works. His whole speil was anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration.

And his followers didn't care.

What I am saying is he publicly claims to have that position. Donald Trump has said he supports legal immigration, even if it's not true. Can we start there?

 

[Delldude]

What I am saying is he publicly claims to have that position. Donald Trump has said he supports legal immigration, even if it's not true. Can we start there?

No

 

[Anomalism]

No

That's true though. Lol

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/elon-musk-vows-war-over-h-1b-visa-program-amid-rift-with-some-trump-supporters-2024-12-28/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

"President-elect Donald Trump on Saturday sided with key supporter and billionaire tech CEO Elon Musk in a public dispute over the use of the H-1B visa, saying he fully backs the program for foreign tech workers opposed by some of his supporters."

Trump doesn't oppose all immigration, not publicly anyway.

 

[JoeB131]

What I am saying is he publicly claims to have that position. Donald Trump has said he supports legal immigration, even if it's not true. Can we start there?

Why? First, Trump has spoken many times about his desire to end legal immigration as well, especially from countries he doesn't like.

 

[JoeB131]

That's true though. Lol

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/elon-musk-vows-war-over-h-1b-visa-program-amid-rift-with-some-trump-supporters-2024-12-28/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

"President-elect Donald Trump on Saturday sided with key supporter and billionaire tech CEO Elon Musk in a public dispute over the use of the H-1B visa, saying he fully backs the program for foreign tech workers opposed by some of his supporters."

Trump doesn't oppose all immigration, not publicly anyway.

I'm wondering if he is still saying that now that Musk has accused him of being a pedophile.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

No, not really. Know them by their works. His whole speil was anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration.

And his followers didn't care.

No, it was not.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Oswald should be deported.

He is not ready to participate in true self-government.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

No the Progs in the Dems make up maybe 1 in 5.

No the great majority of Dems agree with some or nearly all Prog initiatives.

We do abhor racism, misogyny, ethnocentrism, white Christian nationalism, for starters, and Trump end all be all.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Cowardly dodge.

In no way shape or form.

You are MAGA and beyond the pale of true blue Americanism.

 

[Oddball]

Is it fair to conflate immigration enforcement with xenophobia?​

no

 

[Correll]

Wanting to limit abuse of the H-1B program isn’t opposition to legal immigration. It’s an effort to preserve its integrity. Every country has the right (and responsibility) to set reasonable, sustainable limits on immigration, even legal forms, to protect its labor markets, infrastructure, and social cohesion. Supporting legal immigration doesn't mean supporting unlimited immigration or abuse of the system. It means favoring a lawful, fair, and orderly process that protects our national interests. Fixing abuses within the system ensures that legal immigration continues to benefit both newcomers and citizens, which is something any serious immigration policy should strive for.

IF, those limits have been abused massively for decades, then it is reasonable for those limits to be set very low and very harshly, so that labor markets and social cohesion can recover over time.

This IS opposition to legal immigration.

I'm not sure how much Trump in on board with me, but I oppose legal immigration.

I want an effective BAN on immigration, for two or three generations.