Insight: GM's Volt: The ugly math of low sales, high costs

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Pretty soon there will be so many Plug-in Hybrid models for sale people will forget who thought of it first. We Volt drivers will know the answer to that.

electric cars are as old as cars so GM won't get much credit.

All the manufacturers are trying to move down several learning curves ASAP with slightly different approaches. Whoever gets there fastest (which means cheaper than regular cars) will get the credit and the money but only if they get there significantly ahead of the competition. It's doubtful anyone will claim the title

The part in bold is exactly my point. Some folks are so focused on espousing what they've heard far-right critics say about a friggin' car that they fail to realize that most of the car industry is currently heading down the same path.

they realize it and know it but would hate to see the left guess right because it would boost the left which is the enemy of basic American principles.

You want to talk cars while they want to talk philosophy!!
Also, your idea that Volt owners thought of it first is silly self promotion

 

[martinjlm]

Pretty soon there will be so many Plug-in Hybrid models for sale people will forget who thought of it first. We Volt drivers will know the answer to that.

electric cars are as old as cars so GM won't get much credit.

All the manufacturers are trying to move down several learning curves ASAP with slightly different approaches. Whoever gets there fastest (which means cheaper than regular cars) will get the credit and the money but only if they get there significantly ahead of the competition. It's doubtful anyone will claim the title

The part in bold is exactly my point. Some folks are so focused on espousing what they've heard far-right critics say about a friggin' car that they fail to realize that most of the car industry is currently heading down the same path.

they realize it and know it but would hate to see the left guess right because it would boost the left which is the enemy of basic American principles.

You want to talk cars while they want to talk philosophy!!
Also, your idea that Volt owners thought of it first is silly self promotion

If you re-read what I wrote you will notice that what I said is Volt owners will KNOW who thought of it first. GM pioneered the Extended Range Electric Vehicle (EREV). A Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle (PHEV) is very similar to an EREV, except it typically operates in gas-using mode more than an EREV because, unlike the Volt, a PHEV's gas engine does power the driving wheels.

 

[martinjlm]

Automobile Car of the Year 2011: Chevrolet Volt
Automobile Car of the Year 2012: Audi A7
Automobile Car of the Year 2013: Tesla S sedan

Apparently the world is not ready for electric vehicles yet.

The A7 is not an electric car......yet. VW has already stated plans to produce a PHEV version of it. Probably 2014 or 15.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

If you re-read what I wrote you will notice that what I said is Volt owners will KNOW who thought of it first.

1) The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car!

2) Volt owners are usually silly pious liberals who think they can change the world with bold strokes even while China is putting 20 million new gas cars a year on the road and one new coal plant a week! China alone creates as much new CO2 a week as England produces in a year from all sources.

 

[martinjlm]

If you re-read what I wrote you will notice that what I said is Volt owners will KNOW who thought of it first.

1) The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car!
.....

one more try then I give......

The Plug-in Hybrid Electric was pioneered by.........
The Extended Range Electric Vehicle was pioneered by......

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

If you re-read what I wrote you will notice that what I said is Volt owners will KNOW who thought of it first.

1) The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car!
.....

one more try then I give......

The Plug-in Hybrid Electric was pioneered by.........
The Extended Range Electric Vehicle was pioneered by......

The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car not bu socialist fools who bailed out GM!

 

[Papageorgio]

If they could improve the range and less need for recharge, then we can move forward but somedays these vehicles would inhibit my travel.

 

[martinjlm]

1) The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car!
.....

one more try then I give......

The Plug-in Hybrid Electric was pioneered by.........
The Extended Range Electric Vehicle was pioneered by......

The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car not bu socialist fools who bailed out GM!

So it's official.....EdwardBaiamonte for the win!

Back on topic......Volt sales for October are in......6th straight month of increasing sales. Total sold this year now at 19,309 in US and Canada. Not sure how many Volts and Amperas sold in the rest of the world. That makes it look like about 25,000 US and Cananda by the end of the year, plus whatever is sold overseas. Still probably below the (pick one) 30-35,000 originally planned or the 60,000 as stated by CEO, later revised back to the original projections.

Electric vehicles as a whole (including EREVs and PHEVs) are growing at a faster than 200% year-to-year rate. A lot of this is due to Volt sales increasing, a lot of it is due to new entrants into the marketplace (Prius PHEV, Ford Focus EV, Ford C-Max Energi,Tesla Model S, Toyota Rav4EV). None are big volume sellers yet, but a couple of them have potential. As it stands, though, Volt outsells all other electric vehicles and even outsells all hybrids EXCEPT Prius, Prius C, Ford C-Max Hybrid, and Toyota Camry.

Still showing signs of being a very successful vehicle.

 

[Freemason9]

The GM Volt and similar cars will absolutely succeed, and they will be dominating automobile sales within 5 years. This is--by FAR--the most effective means of driving down gasoline prices. You reduce demand, and I believe this is why oil Republicans oppose these cars.

Regarding profitability, there are two VERY IMPORTANT WORDS:

Marginal Costs.

They significantly drop as sales increase.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Still showing signs of being a very successful vehicle.

yes and war with Iran could make a huge difference in helping out the 100 year old idea for an electric car.

 

[Rshermr]

one more try then I give......

The Plug-in Hybrid Electric was pioneered by.........
The Extended Range Electric Vehicle was pioneered by......

The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car not bu socialist fools who bailed out GM!

So it's official.....EdwardBaiamonte for the win!

Back on topic......Volt sales for October are in......6th straight month of increasing sales. Total sold this year now at 19,309 in US and Canada. Not sure how many Volts and Amperas sold in the rest of the world. That makes it look like about 25,000 US and Cananda by the end of the year, plus whatever is sold overseas. Still probably below the (pick one) 30-35,000 originally planned or the 60,000 as stated by CEO, later revised back to the original projections.

Electric vehicles as a whole (including EREVs and PHEVs) are growing at a faster than 200% year-to-year rate. A lot of this is due to Volt sales increasing, a lot of it is due to new entrants into the marketplace (Prius PHEV, Ford Focus EV, Ford C-Max Energi,Tesla Model S, Toyota Rav4EV). None are big volume sellers yet, but a couple of them have potential. As it stands, though, Volt outsells all other electric vehicles and even outsells all hybrids EXCEPT Prius, Prius C, Ford C-Max Hybrid, and Toyota Camry.

Still showing signs of being a very successful vehicle.

Never, ever get into a discussion with ed. He is a congenital idiot, and a con tool (yes, I know that is redundant). Poor guy does not know what he is saying, just posts dogma. Not really his fault. He should be institutionalized, but they have no institutions catering to cases like ed's. Because they do not institutionalize heads of lettuce, which is the nearest one can get to ed's intelligence.
You see, martinjlm, you are stating facts, which can be proven. Ed does not understand that concept. He just posts dogma that he believes will make dems look bad. Poor guy.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

The electric car was thought of first by the first inventors of the car not bu socialist fools who bailed out GM!

So it's official.....EdwardBaiamonte for the win!

Back on topic......Volt sales for October are in......6th straight month of increasing sales. Total sold this year now at 19,309 in US and Canada. Not sure how many Volts and Amperas sold in the rest of the world. That makes it look like about 25,000 US and Cananda by the end of the year, plus whatever is sold overseas. Still probably below the (pick one) 30-35,000 originally planned or the 60,000 as stated by CEO, later revised back to the original projections.

Electric vehicles as a whole (including EREVs and PHEVs) are growing at a faster than 200% year-to-year rate. A lot of this is due to Volt sales increasing, a lot of it is due to new entrants into the marketplace (Prius PHEV, Ford Focus EV, Ford C-Max Energi,Tesla Model S, Toyota Rav4EV). None are big volume sellers yet, but a couple of them have potential. As it stands, though, Volt outsells all other electric vehicles and even outsells all hybrids EXCEPT Prius, Prius C, Ford C-Max Hybrid, and Toyota Camry.

Still showing signs of being a very successful vehicle.

Never, ever get into a discussion with ed. He is a congenital idiot, and a con tool (yes, I know that is redundant). Poor guy does not know what he is saying, just posts dogma. Not really his fault. He should be institutionalized, but they have no institutions catering to cases like ed's. Because they do not institutionalize heads of lettuce, which is the nearest one can get to ed's intelligence.
You see, martinjlm, you are stating facts, which can be proven. Ed does not understand that concept. He just posts dogma that he believes will make dems look bad. Poor guy.

inequality:

1) with no fault divorce, feminism, abortion, and welfare liberals have destroyed the American family and created millions of single mothers living on the liberal dole and also millions of young men with no need to work!!


2) at the same time you have liberal unions shipping 30 million jobs off shore with their high prices. We must make unions illegal again.

3) and at the same time you have huge liberal debt so the Chinese and others can buy that debt with their dollars rather than buy our products. We must make debt illegal!

4) oh and lets not forget that liberals let in 10 million illegals to take jobs that would have gone to Americans. We must control our borders again!

 

[Rshermr]

Ford would have loved to see GM close their doors,just like Nash,American motors,packard,cord,and countless others have.The world din't end,and the demand was absorbed by other manufactures.

If DC wanted to bail out people they should have gone to main street.

Chickenwing says:

Ford would have loved to see GM close their doors,just like Nash,American motors,packard,cord,and countless others have.

"

I don't think so:
"Mulally's comments weren't offered as a criticism of Romney. Rather, he was defending Ford's decision to go to Congress with GM and Chrysler in 2008 to call for a federal rescue."
Ford's CEO has no regrets about call for bailout - Los Angeles Times

That would be the chairman of ford making your statement look rather lame.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Why do you try to think at all??

ed, me boy. You should actually read the article. It will tell you why ford did not want gm and a host of other companies in the industry to go out of business. You can do it, ed. Really, you can think just a little. Poor congenital idiot.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Chickenwing says:
"

I don't think so:
"Mulally's comments weren't offered as a criticism of Romney. Rather, he was defending Ford's decision to go to Congress with GM and Chrysler in 2008 to call for a federal rescue."
Ford's CEO has no regrets about call for bailout - Los Angeles Times

That would be the chairman of ford making your statement look rather lame.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Why do you try to think at all??

ed, me boy. You should actually read the article. It will tell you why ford did not want gm and a host of other companies in the industry to go out of business. You can do it, ed. Really, you can think just a little. Poor congenital idiot.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

 

[Rshermr]

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Why do you try to think at all??

ed, me boy. You should actually read the article. It will tell you why ford did not want gm and a host of other companies in the industry to go out of business. You can do it, ed. Really, you can think just a little. Poor congenital idiot.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

No, ed. They just like the idea of staying in business. Again, you should really read what mullaly said. Which you will not. Because it makes no difference to you. Because, for the 100th time, ed, you are a con tool incapable of rational thought.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

ed, me boy. You should actually read the article. It will tell you why ford did not want gm and a host of other companies in the industry to go out of business. You can do it, ed. Really, you can think just a little. Poor congenital idiot.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

No, ed. They just like the idea of staying in business. Again, you should really read what mullaly said. Which you will not. Because it makes no difference to you. Because, for the 100th time, ed, you are a con tool incapable of rational thought.

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income???? Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

 

[Rshermr]

Ed, the delusional con, says this about fords CEO Mulally, statement about the aurto bailout and ford's support of it:

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income????

No.

Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Depends. Usually go bankrupt. But in some cases survive. Generally never thrive.
So, neither question has anything to do with what I said, which is that Ford supported the auto bailout. And ed is link challenged. He has had a couple chances to se what Mulally, the ceo of ford, actually said and did. So, here, ed. This is a quote from another article. It includes quotes by Mulally. Who was and is the CEO of ford. Now ed, when you get done reading this quote, and possibly following the link to read the article, you will be forced to admit that ford did indeed support the auto bailout. Here you go:
"If GM and Chrysler would've gone into free-fall they could've taken the entire supply base into free-fall also, and taken the U.S. from a recession into a depression," Mulally says in the accompanying video, taped Friday at Ford's world headquarters in Dearborn, MI. "That's why we testified on behalf of our competitors even though we clearly did not need precious taxpayer money."
Referring to his testimony before the Senate Banking Committee on Nov. 4, 2008, "today looking back I think we'd absolutely make the same decision," Mulally says.
Bailouts of GM, Chrysler Were Good for Ford Too: Alan Mulally | Daily Ticker - Yahoo! Finance

Should be an interesting sociological exercise to see what ed will do next. Either he will vacate this thread, or he will be back to say something else totally stupid.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Ed, the delusional con, says this about fords CEO Mulally, statement about the aurto bailout and ford's support of it:

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income????

No.

Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Depends. Usually go bankrupt. But in some cases survive. Generally never thrive.
So, neither question has anything to do with what I said, which is that Ford supported the auto bailout. And ed is link challenged. He has had a couple chances to se what Mulally, the ceo of ford, actually said and did. So, here, ed. This is a quote from another article. It includes quotes by Mulally. Who was and is the CEO of ford. Now ed, when you get done reading this quote, and possibly following the link to read the article, you will be forced to admit that ford did indeed support the auto bailout. Here you go:
"If GM and Chrysler would've gone into free-fall they could've taken the entire supply base into free-fall also, and taken the U.S. from a recession into a depression," Mulally says in the accompanying video, taped Friday at Ford's world headquarters in Dearborn, MI. "That's why we testified on behalf of our competitors even though we clearly did not need precious taxpayer money."
Referring to his testimony before the Senate Banking Committee on Nov. 4, 2008, "today looking back I think we'd absolutely make the same decision," Mulally says.
Bailouts of GM, Chrysler Were Good for Ford Too: Alan Mulally | Daily Ticker - Yahoo! Finance

Should be an interesting sociological exercise to see what ed will do next. Either he will vacate this thread, or he will be back to say something else totally stupid.

Why not cut the trivia pursuit BS and tell us if you're liberal or conservative and why? You will communicate only about trivia or rely on personal attack spam because you know you lack the IQ for substance.

 

[Rshermr]

Ed, the delusional con, says this about fords CEO Mulally, statement about the aurto bailout and ford's support of it:

lame?? You mean Ford shareholders actually like competition that limits their income????

No.

Do most companies want to see their competition thrive or go bankrupt?

Depends. Usually go bankrupt. But in some cases survive. Generally never thrive.
So, neither question has anything to do with what I said, which is that Ford supported the auto bailout. And ed is link challenged. He has had a couple chances to se what Mulally, the ceo of ford, actually said and did. So, here, ed. This is a quote from another article. It includes quotes by Mulally. Who was and is the CEO of ford. Now ed, when you get done reading this quote, and possibly following the link to read the article, you will be forced to admit that ford did indeed support the auto bailout. Here you go:
"If GM and Chrysler would've gone into free-fall they could've taken the entire supply base into free-fall also, and taken the U.S. from a recession into a depression," Mulally says in the accompanying video, taped Friday at Ford's world headquarters in Dearborn, MI. "That's why we testified on behalf of our competitors even though we clearly did not need precious taxpayer money."
Referring to his testimony before the Senate Banking Committee on Nov. 4, 2008, "today looking back I think we'd absolutely make the same decision," Mulally says.
Bailouts of GM, Chrysler Were Good for Ford Too: Alan Mulally | Daily Ticker - Yahoo! Finance

Should be an interesting sociological exercise to see what ed will do next. Either he will vacate this thread, or he will be back to say something else totally stupid.

Why not cut the trivia pursuit BS and tell us if you're liberal or conservative and why? You will communicate only about trivia or rely on personal attack spam because you know you lack the IQ for substance.

Sorry to all trying to follow this thread. Responding to Ed in a rational way was stupid on my part. I know better. I know he is incapable or rational discussion. And when cornered, he simply blurts out insults along with drivel.
So he was cornered. While I could explain to a 8 year old why they should read the Mulallay link, I should have remembered that it would be beyond ed.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Ed, the delusional con, says this about fords CEO Mulally, statement about the aurto bailout and ford's support of it:
No.

Depends. Usually go bankrupt. But in some cases survive. Generally never thrive.
So, neither question has anything to do with what I said, which is that Ford supported the auto bailout. And ed is link challenged. He has had a couple chances to se what Mulally, the ceo of ford, actually said and did. So, here, ed. This is a quote from another article. It includes quotes by Mulally. Who was and is the CEO of ford. Now ed, when you get done reading this quote, and possibly following the link to read the article, you will be forced to admit that ford did indeed support the auto bailout. Here you go:
"If GM and Chrysler would've gone into free-fall they could've taken the entire supply base into free-fall also, and taken the U.S. from a recession into a depression," Mulally says in the accompanying video, taped Friday at Ford's world headquarters in Dearborn, MI. "That's why we testified on behalf of our competitors even though we clearly did not need precious taxpayer money."
Referring to his testimony before the Senate Banking Committee on Nov. 4, 2008, "today looking back I think we'd absolutely make the same decision," Mulally says.
Bailouts of GM, Chrysler Were Good for Ford Too: Alan Mulally | Daily Ticker - Yahoo! Finance

Should be an interesting sociological exercise to see what ed will do next. Either he will vacate this thread, or he will be back to say something else totally stupid.

Why not cut the trivia pursuit BS and tell us if you're liberal or conservative and why? You will communicate only about trivia or rely on personal attack spam because you know you lack the IQ for substance.

Sorry to all trying to follow this thread. Responding to Ed in a rational way was stupid on my part. I know better. I know he is incapable or rational discussion. And when cornered, he simply blurts out insults along with drivel.
So he was cornered. While I could explain to a 8 year old why they should read the Mulallay link, I should have remembered that it would be beyond ed.

Why not cut the trivia pursuit BS and tell us if you're liberal or conservative and why? You will communicate only about trivia or rely on personal attack spam because you know you lack the IQ for substance.