Zone1 If "Judeo-Christian" Is Actually TWO Distinct Religions..........

[PoliticalChic]

1. In a recent spirited (no pun) thread (Zone1 - Christian Zionism) a number of parosters claimed that these are two separate and distnct religions.


2. Today, an argument designed to prove that they are one religion based on values, hallmarks, and cannot be found to be other than that.


3. If Judaism and Christianity are different religions based on certain....even fundamental....disagreements, then certainly logical consistency demands that Catholicism and Protestantism are two separte and distinct religions.


4. I can name a number of differences that are meaningful and dramatic.....


5.Starting with Mary:

• Catholicism…Mary is mother of us all: from John, 7 last words Behold your mother. In Revelations, Mary is the new eve. “mary is the arc of the new covenant.”
• Protestanism….Mary simply a good woman, sinful like anyone

 

[PoliticalChic]

AI Overview



Protestants
honor Mary as the humble, chosen mother of Jesus, a model of faith and obedience, but generally reject Catholic doctrines like the Immaculate Conception, Assumption, and praying to her, emphasizing that Jesus is the sole mediator and salvation comes through Him alone, focusing on her biblical role rather than divine veneration. They view her as a blessed human instrument of God's plan, not divine, and often focus on her humility (Luke 1:38) and her human context as Christ's mother, while holding that she had other children after Jesus.

 

[Gabe Lackmann]

"I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you,"
Revelation 3:9

 

[PoliticalChic]

View attachment 1201461


"I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you,"
Revelation 3:9

And, in connection with the query about Catholicism and Protestantism, what point are your making?

 

[Gabe Lackmann]

And, in connection with the query about Catholicism and Protestantism, what point are your making?

My bad. Misread.

 

[Quantrill]

1. In a recent spirited (no pun) thread (Zone1 - Christian Zionism) a number of parosters claimed that these are two separate and distnct religions.


2. Today, an argument designed to prove that they are one religion based on values, hallmarks, and cannot be found to be other than that.


3. If Judaism and Christianity are different religions based on certain....even fundamental....disagreements, then certainly logical consistency demands that Catholicism and Protestantism are two separte and distinct religions.


4. I can name a number of differences that are meaningful and dramatic.....


5.Starting with Mary:

• Catholicism…Mary is mother of us all: from John, 7 last words Behold your mother. In Revelations, Mary is the new eve. “mary is the arc of the new covenant.”
• Protestanism….Mary simply a good woman, sinful like anyone

The Christian faith is born out of the true faith given in the Old Testament. It is not a product of 'Judaism' as is known today. Thus Christianity and Judaism are not the same.

Romanism and Protestantism are not one faith. They do represent the 'Catholic' or 'universal' faith represented in Christianity. But Romanism and Protestantism both have their errors in doctrine today. There are many Roman Catholics who are Christian, and many Protestants who are Christian. But also, many who are not.

Judaism today doesn't even believe it's own Bible. It denies Jesus Christ because it denies it's own Bible.

Quantrill

 

[Meriweather]

AI Overview



Protestants
honor Mary as the humble, chosen mother of Jesus, a model of faith and obedience, but generally reject Catholic doctrines like the Immaculate Conception, Assumption, and praying to her, emphasizing that Jesus is the sole mediator and salvation comes through Him alone, focusing on her biblical role rather than divine veneration. They view her as a blessed human instrument of God's plan, not divine, and often focus on her humility (Luke 1:38) and her human context as Christ's mother, while holding that she had other children after Jesus.

Catholic/Orthodox: For the first 150 years of Christianity no one questioned what was being taught and said about Mary. At the 150 year mark, when the question arose, it was confirmed that the traditions and teachings about Mary were true. Then in the 500s, and again in the 700s, this was confirmed. In the 1500s the Lutheran church and also another Protestant church (I believe in Switzerland) confirmed that teachings of Mary's virginity were correct. Two hundred years passed and liberal theology and the Enlightenment again began questioning teachings/beliefs about Mary. And there we have it. Early Christians of the first century believed and passed on the Apostolic tradition that Mary remained a virgin. Enlightenment Christians of the eighteenth century began teaching Mary had other children and did not remain a virgin.

 

[luiza]

If Mary is the claimed Mother ( tee hee hee ) , what action did Joseph take --a Master Builder ( not just a carpenter) who was cuckolded ?

Does Joseph of Arimathea actually fit into this absurd narrative --- Joseph's boss and the guy who bought Jesus from the cross before he died ?
Was he the real life Dad ?

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Christian faith is born out of the true faith given in the Old Testament. It is not a product of 'Judaism' as is known today. Thus Christianity and Judaism are not the same.

Romanism and Protestantism are not one faith. They do represent the 'Catholic' or 'universal' faith represented in Christianity. But Romanism and Protestantism both have their errors in doctrine today. There are many Roman Catholics who are Christian, and many Protestants who are Christian. But also, many who are not.

Judaism today doesn't even believe it's own Bible. It denies Jesus Christ because it denies it's own Bible.

Quantrill

"Thus Christianity and Judaism are not the same.

Romanism and Protestantism are not one faith"


So you are claiming that there are three.....distinct and separate faiths?

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Christian faith is born out of the true faith given in the Old Testament. It is not a product of 'Judaism' as is known today. Thus Christianity and Judaism are not the same.

Romanism and Protestantism are not one faith. They do represent the 'Catholic' or 'universal' faith represented in Christianity. But Romanism and Protestantism both have their errors in doctrine today. There are many Roman Catholics who are Christian, and many Protestants who are Christian. But also, many who are not.

Judaism today doesn't even believe it's own Bible. It denies Jesus Christ because it denies it's own Bible.

Quantrill

"Judaism today doesn't even believe it's own Bible. It denies Jesus Christ because it denies it's own Bible."

Let's check;


a. Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.
b. Jewish folk refer to the book of Isaiah which specifies what conditions will prevail when the Messiah comes:
AI Overview
Yes, Isaiah prophesies that when the Messiah comes,
nations will cease making war, famously stating they will "beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more," a vision of universal peace under divine rule. This transformative era, described in Isaiah 2:4, signifies the end of international conflict, military training, and weapons, replaced by peace, justice, and the knowledge of God's law.



So....Jesus states that the Old Testament is true and correct and Jews simply wait for the end of war.


And you say?????

 

[PoliticalChic]

Catholic/Orthodox: For the first 150 years of Christianity no one questioned what was being taught and said about Mary. At the 150 year mark, when the question arose, it was confirmed that the traditions and teachings about Mary were true. Then in the 500s, and again in the 700s, this was confirmed. In the 1500s the Lutheran church and also another Protestant church (I believe in Switzerland) confirmed that teachings of Mary's virginity were correct. Two hundred years passed and liberal theology and the Enlightenment again began questioning teachings/beliefs about Mary. And there we have it. Early Christians of the first century believed and passed on the Apostolic tradition that Mary remained a virgin. Enlightenment Christians of the eighteenth century began teaching Mary had other children and did not remain a virgin.

Catholic/Orthodox: For the first 150 years of Christianity no one questioned what was being taught and said about Mary. At the 150 year mark, when the question arose, it was confirmed that the traditions and teachings about Mary were true. Then in the 500s, and again in the 700s, this was confirmed. In the 1500s the Lutheran church and also another Protestant church (I believe in Switzerland) confirmed that teachings of Mary's virginity were correct. Two hundred years passed and liberal theology and the Enlightenment again began questioning teachings/beliefs about Mary. And there we have it. Early Christians of the first century believed and passed on the Apostolic tradition that Mary remained a virgin. Enlightenment Christians of the eighteenth century began teaching Mary had other children and did not remain a virgin.

Why bring up the year?


This is the question: the view of Mary by Jesus' words represent a distinct difference between Catholicism and Protestanism.....

Two different religions as are Christianitiy's view of the Messiah and Judaism's view????



AI Overview



Protestants
honor Mary as the humble, chosen mother of Jesus, a model of faith and obedience, but generally reject Catholic doctrines like the Immaculate Conception, Assumption, and praying to her, emphasizing that Jesus is the sole mediator and salvation comes through Him alone, focusing on her biblical role rather than divine veneration. They view her as a blessed human instrument of God's plan, not divine, and often focus on her humility (Luke 1:38) and her human context as Christ's mother, while holding that she had other children after Jesus.

 

[PoliticalChic]

If Mary is the claimed Mother ( tee hee hee ) , what action did Joseph take --a Master Builder ( not just a carpenter) who was cuckolded ?

Does Joseph of Arimathea actually fit into this absurd narrative --- Joseph's boss and the guy who bought Jesus from the cross before he died ?
Was he the real life Dad ?

How about you post elsewhere, m' kay?


Or, explain why you were brought up by folks who never taught your or treated you with respect>

 

[BS Filter]

The Judeo-Christian belief is the one true belief. There is one God and His Word is the Bible. Jesus is the fulfillment of Judaism. The Jews are still in God's plan, but they must believe in Jesus to be saved. By being the "Chosen People", they were chosen by God to bring salvation to the world. Otherwise, they're just like everyone who is a sinner and in need of a Savior.

 

[there4eyeM]

"Judeo-Christian" is a sociological term referring to the civilization arising from the common points of the two dominant religions in the West. The Hebrew and Christian religions both worship the same "God". They are distinctly different and separated by their approaches to this deity as well as in traditions, practices, customs and other important elements, including language.

 

[alang1216]

1. In a recent spirited (no pun) thread (Zone1 - Christian Zionism) a number of parosters claimed that these are two separate and distnct religions.


2. Today, an argument designed to prove that they are one religion based on values, hallmarks, and cannot be found to be other than that.


3. If Judaism and Christianity are different religions based on certain....even fundamental....disagreements, then certainly logical consistency demands that Catholicism and Protestantism are two separte and distinct religions.


4. I can name a number of differences that are meaningful and dramatic.....


5.Starting with Mary:

• Catholicism…Mary is mother of us all: from John, 7 last words Behold your mother. In Revelations, Mary is the new eve. “mary is the arc of the new covenant.”
• Protestanism….Mary simply a good woman, sinful like anyone

Actually they are 3 separate, distinct religions.

1. Pre-Babylonian Exile Judaism
   1. Polytheistic (Monolatry)
   2. No heaven or hell
2. Post-Babylonian Exile Judaism (Zoroastrian influence)
   1. Monotheistic
   2. Heaven and hell
3. Christianity
   1. Monotheistic
   2. Heaven and hell
   3. Jesus as messiah

 

[Meriweather]

Why bring up the year?

It tells when the difference began. Note, it did not begin with the Reformation, but the Enlightenment. Do some denominations want to be a different religion, or do they want to be known as being right about the original? In other words maybe it's about being right about the same religion.

 

[Quantrill]

"Thus Christianity and Judaism are not the same.

Romanism and Protestantism are not one faith"


So you are claiming that there are three.....distinct and separate faiths?

No. There is one faith. The one that God has given. The faith in Him.

Some of the Jews have that faith. Some in the Roman area of Christianity have that faith. Some in the Protestant arena, have that faith.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

"Judaism today doesn't even believe it's own Bible. It denies Jesus Christ because it denies it's own Bible."

Let's check;


a. Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.
b. Jewish folk refer to the book of Isaiah which specifies what conditions will prevail when the Messiah comes:
AI Overview
Yes, Isaiah prophesies that when the Messiah comes,
nations will cease making war, famously stating they will "beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more," a vision of universal peace under divine rule. This transformative era, described in Isaiah 2:4, signifies the end of international conflict, military training, and weapons, replaced by peace, justice, and the knowledge of God's law.



So....Jesus states that the Old Testament is true and correct and Jews simply wait for the end of war.


And you say?????

The Old Testament is true. But, the Old Testament is all about Jesus Christ.

(Luke 24:44) "And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me."

Quantrill

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Judeo-Christian belief is the one true belief. There is one God and His Word is the Bible. Jesus is the fulfillment of Judaism. The Jews are still in God's plan, but they must believe in Jesus to be saved. By being the "Chosen People", they were chosen by God to bring salvation to the world. Otherwise, they're just like everyone who is a sinner and in need of a Savior.

Thank you.

But if you adhere to Catholic view, Jesus took the Jews to Heaven


AI Overview



Yes, Christian theology, particularly Catholic and Orthodox traditions, teaches that
after His crucifixion, Jesus descended to the underworld (Hades/Sheol) to liberate the righteous souls, including faithful Jews (like Abraham, Moses, prophets) held in the "Limbo of the Fathers" or "Bosom of Abraham," bringing them into heaven, thereby opening the gates of heaven for all believers. This event, known as the "Harrowing of Hell," fulfilled the Old Testament expectation and allowed these souls to enter God's presence after His resurrection.



So is your view two religions or one?

 

[PoliticalChic]

"Judeo-Christian" is a sociological term referring to the civilization arising from the common points of the two dominant religions in the West. The Hebrew and Christian religions both worship the same "God". They are distinctly different and separated by their approaches to this deity as well as in traditions, practices, customs and other important elements, including language.

The Jewish vs Christian belief in Jesus is hardly different from the difference in views of Catholics and Protestants of Mary.....

• Catholicism…Mary is mother of us all: from John, 7 last words Behold your mother. In Revelations, Mary is the new eve. “mary is the arc of the new covenant.”
• Protestanism….Mary simply a good woman, sinful like anyone

"two dominant religions in the West. The Hebrew and Christian religions" So Catholics and Protestant are two dominant Christian religions?



Did you know that those two have different Bibles?
Catholic....73 books
Protestant......66 books.


"including language."
Don't be silly.....They are all in every language.