Zone1 If God were real, you wouldn’t need a book

[ding]

that answer, the one you have no answer for and are willing to jeopardize the everlasting for than to make the heavenly correction and remove the vial commandments from all three desert religions.

what in fact those sinners deserve to never be admitted to the everlasting.

This is pretty simple, if you love God you will do the right things or make it right when you don't. You won't need laws because you will do the right thing because of your love for God.

Clearly, you need laws. I don't.

 

[Crepitus]

Sure it is. You're just looking for excuses to be a putz.

Then quote it.

 

[Clyde 154]

In Judaism it's known as the yetzer ha-ra which is that humans are born with an evil inclination. Pretty much the same difference.

Peter states it plain. "He (Paul/Saul) as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction." 2 Peter 3:16.

Again.........the scriptures themselves demonstrate the fatal flaw with this false doctrine...........especially for any organization that declare themselves as a Christian organization. The scriptures are the very source of calibrating true Christian doctrine. The scriptures are the sword of the Holy Spirit........(Eph. 6:10-18)

One must conclude that Jesus was born guilty of sin if one endorses the false doctrine of Original Sin........so was Mary (the supposed mother of God).

If you insist upon ignoring the word of God.......It indeed points out that life is not fair while adding to or subtracting from the Word of God. You have cursed yourself. (Gal. 1:8-9, Rev. 22:18-19)

 

[BreezeWood]

One must conclude that Jesus was born guilty of sin if one endorses the false doctrine of Original Sin........so was Mary (the supposed mother of God).

not born rather committed sin from ignorance early in life if so is by the heavenly goal to triumph good vs evil before they perish they will be granted by their accomplishment judgement for admission to the heavens.

for jesus and mary to have never sinned from the beginning if true may not really be any better than those who did transgress and were able to triumph with enough time left to help others as may be the case of jesus.

mary joseph jesus mary m - did not fear judaism, moses their false commandments et al is the true heart of the 1st century events being made exemplars by the heavens that eventually lead to its tragic conclusion.

 

[Clyde 154]

not born rather committed sin from ignorance early in life if so is by the heavenly goal to triumph good vs evil before they perish they will be granted by their accomplishment judgement for admission to the heavens.

for jesus and mary to have never sinned from the beginning if true may not really be any better than those who did transgress and were able to triumph with enough time left to help others as may be the case of jesus.

mary joseph jesus mary m - did not fear judaism, moses their false commandments et al is the true heart of the 1st century events being made exemplars by the heavens that eventually lead to its tragic conclusion.

Clear.....unambiguous, Jesus was with God, was God before His birth. "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus, WHO BEING IN THE FORM OF GOD, THOUGHT IT NOT ROBBERY TO BE EQUAL WITH GOD (Phil. 2:5-8)


What? Are you suggesting that God sinned against His own laws of righteousness? The way you must twist logic in order to make such a statement is much like a hump back attempting to hide in a hail storm. Fatal flaw in your conclusions; A child is incapable of sinning. Jesus compared children......."....such is like the Kingdom of Heaven". (Matt. 18:3, There is no sin possible in the Kingdom of Heaven, as the blood of Christ saves those who reside within. (Heb. 9:14) Children are born protected by the blood of the Christ.....they reside in the Kingdom of God.......until they possess the ability of reason and logic and actively engage in sin.

Adam did not reach out from the grave and make all children sin.......just like himself, a soul must sin itself. The only original sin Adam passed along his lineage is the fact that Sin, once committed leads all men unto death. All men engage in sin (not all children), all men are responsible for their own sin (Deut.24:16).......thus all men physically die, just like Adam did once sin was committed. ( Rom. 5:12)

To suggest that children need to obtain salvation 2x is more than absurd (as the Catholics suggest by sprinkling an innocent soul while calling it baptism, which literally requires total submergence, a symbolism of burial and resurrection -- Col. 2:12)

 

[BreezeWood]

A child is incapable of sinning ... To suggest that children need to obtain salvation 2x is more than absurd -

the child is not immune to sin and their first if made is theirs to remediate the sooner the better and must do so to triumph good vs evil the heavenly goal to receive judgement and affirmation for admission to the everlasting after their physiological death.

they were not spared, the great flood parable of noah as parent sibling relationship easily begins that process. mary may never have sinned would be a great omen for jesus he grew to realize.

 

[DennisPTate]

Not just the christian god, any god.

If they were real it would be self evident.

From a guy who spend decades as a preacher:

“Christians go in with their god as an assumption rather than a conclusion. When in fact, after close examination, the virgin birth falls apart, the resurrection falls apart, the basis of morality falls apart, the promise of afterlife fizzles into fear based marketing.”

“The gods of Islam, of Judaism, of Christianity only exist in scripture. If they actually existed, we wouldn’t need the books to claim they did. Once the book fails, the god goes with it.”



Feel free to explain why he is wrong or right.

A near death experiencer was shown that as Messiah Yeshua - Jesus was reading the scriptures, [such as Psalms 16], He figured out the role that He must play.

The full extent of the role He would play was probably given to Him as He fasted for forty days and was near death.

5Therefore, when He came into the world, He said:
“Sacrifice and offering You did not desire,
But a body You have prepared for Me.
6In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin
You had no pleasure.
7Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come—
In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’ ”
8Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the law), 9then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second. 10By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
Christ’s Death Perfects the Sanctified
11And every priest stands ministering daily and offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12But this Man, after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down at the right hand of God, 13from that time waiting till His enemies are made His footstool. 14For by one offering He has perfected forever those who are being sanctified.
15But the Holy Spirit also witnesses to us; for after He had said before,
16“This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,” 17then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” 18Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.
Hold Fast Your Confession
19Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, 20by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh, 21and having a High Priest over the house of God, 22let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. 24And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, 25not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching.

Hebrews 10 | NKJV Bible | YouVersion

Animal Sacrifices InsufficientFor the law, having a #Heb. 8:5shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, #Heb. 7:19; 9:9can never with these same sacrifices, which they of

www.bible.com

 

[Clyde 154]

the child is not immune to sin and their first if made is theirs to remediate the sooner the better and must do so to triumph good vs evil the heavenly goal to receive judgement and affirmation for admission to the everlasting after their physiological death.

they were not spared, the great flood parable of noah as parent sibling relationship easily begins that process. mary may never have sinned would be a great omen for jesus he grew to realize.

What's your neck size so God can fit you for your "MILLSTONE"? Who do I believe? Your opinion that you can't back by the Word of God (in your pretension of being some SECULAR PROPHET)......or Jesus Christ?

I choose door number one, The Word of God, as that is where my faith from foundation to death resides. (Romans 10:17). My faith is not based upon your "ignorance", as God speaks to us today through Jesus Christ. (Hebrews 1:1-2)

Jesus stated; That sin, once a child reaches the age of reason........is not generated from the Child, but rather from the child's guardian, instructor, teacher.....their parent figure. "It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and were cast into the sea than that he should cause one of these little one's to sin." -- Luke 17:2 Sin is not "inherited" by birth.....sin is instructed, taught from one generation to the next.

Jesus also stated, That children belong to the Kingdom of Heaven (there is no sin in the Kingdom of Heaven) -- Matt. 19:14

This is the reason that God ordered the total destruction/death of those who were teaching their children to worship the false god Baal (Amelekites/Canaanites)., That worship included making human child sacrifices at their alters. Its better for the innocent children to go directly into the kingdom of Heaven because of their innocence than be taught to follow the abominations of human sacrifice by burning...etc., the Amelekites were stealing children from Israel (Judges 3:13, 1 Sam 15:2-3).

 

[Clipper]

Nobody "programmed" DNA. It's the end result of several billion years of randomness.

You're trying to reason with someone who believes the earth is only 2000 years old.

 

[BreezeWood]

Jesus also stated ...

you have no idea - the appeal of christianity for some is all they have.

nothing you claim is in the first hand of jesus himself which you have no way of knowing whether authentic or not written by the crucifiers using jesus for their own purposes ...

the tragedy is the crucifixion prevented a publication by jesus written by himself that would have at least been their authentic beliefs whether appealing to desert dwellers or not.

or were written and destroyed by those same as moses and their claimed commandments they destroyed before being witnessed by anyone.

 

[Crepitus]

You're trying to reason with someone who believes the earth is only 2000 years old.

I am aware, but I can't help trying.

 

[Clyde 154]

you have no idea - the appeal of christianity for some is all they have.

nothing you claim is in the first hand of jesus himself which you have no way of knowing whether authentic or not written by the crucifiers using jesus for their own purposes ...

the tragedy is the crucifixion prevented a publication by jesus written by himself that would have at least been their authentic beliefs whether appealing to desert dwellers or not.

or were written and destroyed by those same as moses and their claimed commandments they destroyed before being witnessed by anyone.

Here we go again as Mr. Reagan stated.........more circular ad hominem BS by Millstone.



All they (Christians) have is the Word of God that documents the prima facie evidence. If it walks, like a duck, talks like a duck, swims like a duck.......ITS A DUCK. God keeps His promises. While the fool goes through life in the darkness of being blinded because he can't see the forest for the trees. (Eccl. 2:14) Translation? The fool exposes his own foolishness.

"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My Words shall not pass away". (Matt.24:35) In spite of ignorant fools attacking the Word of God 24/7. The Scriptures remain UNBROKEN. God declared that the followers of the Real God would become Judges of the World, just as God judges via use of His Word, "If He called them gods (with a small "g"), unto whom the Word of God came, AND THE SCRIPTURE CANNOT BE BROKEN......" -- John 10:34-35

Compared compared to your Ad hominem Rhetoric The Word of God has performed well, still the world's best selling work of literature. Christianity has grown from 13 to 2.6 BILLION. How many atheists exist in the world? About 400 million. Your facts are inverted.

Indeed there is a "way of knowing"......its called Prima Facie truth based upon the physical facts that are in evidence. Prima Facie Truth: Used in every courtroom across the U.S.A. Prima facie - Wikipedia

Not one word in the Holy Bible has ever been proven to be false...while the prophecies recorded within have been historically documented as facts of history. ".......and these things took place that the Scripture might be fulfilled......" -- John 19:36

 

[Clyde 154]

You're trying to reason with someone who believes the earth is only 2000 years old.

Point to ONE example of nature adding unto DNA. Mutations? When something has MUTATED......the original has been corrupted not added unto.....there is less of the naturally perfect. Don't confuse dormant DNA with new DNA. A Horse is a horse regardless of size..........hair length, etc.........all examples of that life are within the same species, all from donkey's to show horses are within the family of Equidae. Same for all species of life........the only way to reproduce that life is WITHIN the same species. As proven in the 18th century. (Louis Pasteur) But here.......2 centuries later, the false doctrine of vertical evolution is still taught as truth.....without any facts in evidence, not one example of evolution outside of species.

Example: Prompt Wikipedia about Evolution........real scientific words such as "MORE LIKELY, POSSIBLY, CAN BE, etc., Science? No ........philosophy dressed up like science. Show me one document about evolution that does not include such wording as CAN BE, COULD BE, SUGGESTS, APPEARS.......etc., These are not terms of Applied Science, they are descriptive human idea's (theories, hypothesis, PHILOSOPHY).

One more point. Show us ONE NEW STAR that has appeared in the sky over the course of human history.......just one. What you can see are stars dying/decaying, but not one new star........and some lame ass idea there exists star nurseries, but........ we don't have enough time to witness an actual birth of a new star.

 

[BreezeWood]

All they (Christians) have is the Word of God that documents the prima facie evidence. If it walks, like a duck, talks like a duck, swims like a duck.......ITS A DUCK. God keeps His promises. While the fool goes through life in the darkness of being blinded because he can't see the forest for the trees. (Eccl. 2:14) Translation? The fool exposes his own foolishness.

"Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My Words shall not pass away".

those words endure by being spoken not as a passage for a 10,000 page 4th century christian bible - same for the spoken heavenly religion of antiquity, goal for judgement and remission to the everlasting - the triumph of good vs evil. all that is necessary

Not one word in the Holy Bible has ever been proven to be false...

nothing you claim is in the first hand of jesus himself which you have no way of knowing whether authentic or not written by the crucifiers using jesus for their own purposes ...

provide the tablets claimed by the liar moses etched in the heavens w/ 10 commandments they destroyed before ever being witnessed by anyone.

 

[Clipper]

Point to ONE example of nature adding unto DNA. Mutations? When something has MUTATED......the original has been corrupted not added unto.....there is less of the naturally perfect. Don't confuse dormant DNA with new DNA. A Horse is a horse regardless of size..........hair length, etc.........all examples of that life are within the same species, all from donkey's to show horses are within the family of Equidae. Same for all species of life........the only way to reproduce that life is WITHIN the same species. As proven in the 18th century. (Louis Pasteur) But here.......2 centuries later, the false doctrine of vertical evolution is still taught as truth.....without any facts in evidence, not one example of evolution outside of species.

Example: Prompt Wikipedia about Evolution........real scientific words such as "MORE LIKELY, POSSIBLY, CAN BE, etc., Science? No ........philosophy dressed up like science. Show me one document about evolution that does not include such wording as CAN BE, COULD BE, SUGGESTS, APPEARS.......etc., These are not terms of Applied Science, they are descriptive human idea's (theories, hypothesis, PHILOSOPHY).

One more point. Show us ONE NEW STAR that has appeared in the sky over the course of human history.......just one. What you can see are stars dying/decaying, but not one new star........and some lame ass idea there exists star nurseries, but........ we don't have enough time to witness an actual birth of a new star.

If humans witnessed 2000 years ago the sight in the heavens of a star being born do ya think they would have known what they were witnessing?

 

[ding]

Then quote it.

Matthew 22:34-40
The Greatest Commandment.
34 When the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together,
35and one of them [a scholar of the law] tested him by asking,
36“Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?”
37 He said to him,* “You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.
38 This is the greatest and the first commandment.
39 The second is like it:* You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
40 The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments.”

Do you need to see some examples of how he taught them it wasn't about rule following?

You think you know everything there is to know about Christianity, but you don't. I'm glad you're not a Christian.

 

[ding]

One must conclude that Jesus was born guilty of sin if one endorses the false doctrine of Original Sin........so was Mary (the supposed mother of God).

That's not true at all. Quite the opposite. Jesus was fully God always. He did not become fully man until he was born. As for Mary, she is the Covenant of the Ark that housed the Word of God, so she had to be pure too and remained so. These are the beliefs of the very first Christians and why tradition is integral to understanding scripture.

 

[Crepitus]

Matthew 22:34-40
The Greatest Commandment.
34 When the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together,
35and one of them [a scholar of the law] tested him by asking,
36“Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?”
37 He said to him,* “You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.
38 This is the greatest and the first commandment.
39 The second is like it:* You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
40 The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments.”

Do you need to see some examples of how he taught them it wasn't about rule following?

You think you know everything there is to know about Christianity, but you don't. I'm glad you're not a Christian.

That doesn't say "rules don't matter".

 

[ding]

That doesn't say "rules don't matter".

Oh, brother. Just like I said.