IDF Commander Cleared Of Excessively Shooting Innocent Palestinian Child

[NATO AIR]

The poor little girl had 20 bullets strike her... she wasn't carrying a weapon or a bomb... she was trapped in the wrong place at the wrong time, and the IDF pumped her full of lead. more brave israeli resistance against the palestinian children....

i'm sure he SHOT THE GROUND (too bad he shot her body) in response to "alleged" gunfire from afar...

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/10/15/israel.shooting/index.html
Israeli cleared of shooting teen
Friday, October 15, 2004 Posted: 11:28 PM EDT (0328 GMT)

JERUSALEM (CNN) -- An Israeli army commander has been cleared in the killing of a 13-year-old Palestinian girl, the Israel Defense Forces said.

The man -- who was accused by his own soldiers of repeatedly shooting the girl's body to make sure she was dead -- was cleared of wrongdoing after an internal military investigation.

Israeli soldiers shot the girl at a checkpoint near Rafah, in southern Gaza on October 5.

According to the IDF, the soldiers believed at the time that she was trying to plant a bomb she was carrying in her schoolbag. h

The girl's mother insisted that she was on her way to school when she became frightened by shooting in the area and, in her panic, ran toward the soldiers.

After it was determined that the girl was shot as many as 20 times, the incident ignited a controversy in Israel.

Two soldiers in the company contacted Israel's largest newspaper, Yediot Ahrohnot, to allege that the commander continued shooting the girl while she was on the ground after she was dead.

The commander has accused the soldiers of launching a personal vendetta against him.

The investigation found that as he approached the girl, he noticed bullets striking at his side "and shot toward the ground as he moved back," rather than shooting at the girl, according to the statement.

Military police are continuing to investigate the incident, and the commander could be removed from his duties if new evidence emerges that challenges his story, the statement said.

Lt. Gen. Moshe Ya'lon, the army chief-of-staff, "accepts the company commander's version of events whereby he fired to the ground in response to fire opened in his direction," the statement said.

"Should the company commander's version prove otherwise, he will barred for any command position in the IDF."

Meanwhile, the commander has been suspended because of "failures" in his "ability to command and in his relations with his subordinates," the IDF statement said.

A decision on the commander's future in the IDF will be made within the next week, the statement said.

 

[dilloduck]

Hopefully this is a sign that Israeli troops have had enough of the slaughter. I know the rest of the world has. Self-defense can't excuse everything !

 

[supermarine]

how come nobody talks about how the palastinian terrorists are killing israeli children, how come nobody talks about how yasser arafat has made no effort for peace, but yet he gets a nobel peace prize. Yes i do think that the israelies have done wrong, but i feel as if the isrealis are barred from doing what they need to do to save their homeland. such as building a wall to keep out the terrorists. If the radical palastinians had their way, every jew would be dead in israel. I beleive there should be a palastinian state as well as an isrealie state, but not as long as the palastinians resort to murder to get what they want.

 

[NATO AIR]

how come nobody talks about how the palastinian terrorists are killing israeli children, how come nobody talks about how yasser arafat has made no effort for peace, but yet he gets a nobel peace prize. Yes i do think that the israelies have done wrong, but i feel as if the isrealis are barred from doing what they need to do to save their homeland. such as building a wall to keep out the terrorists. If the radical palastinians had their way, every jew would be dead in israel. I beleive there should be a palastinian state as well as an isrealie state, but not as long as the palastinians resort to murder to get what they want.

we do talk about that, a lot actually. i tend to post what others don't, the suffering of palestinians under the occupation, along with the crimes of the illegial settler movement.

terrorists are expected to slaughter and kill and should be destroyed for it.... IDF soldiers are expected to be humane and just, instead they are sloppy and careless, at the tragic cost of innocent children especially.

 

[ajwps]

we do talk about that, a lot actually. i tend to post what others don't, the suffering of palestinians under the occupation, along with the crimes of the illegial settler movement.

terrorists are expected to slaughter and kill and should be destroyed for it.... IDF soldiers are expected to be humane and just, instead they are sloppy and careless, at the tragic cost of innocent children especially.

Actually Palestinian Arabs are meant to suffer, die, be oppressed and live in poverty. If it would be otherwise, the billiions poured into the PLO and Arafat would be spent on food, medicine, homes, government agencies, courts of justice and all the other things necessary for human existence.

The Arabs (palestinians) are occupying another people's sovereign country no matter how hard others seem to think that aliens have a right to others property and homes.

Israel's army is neither careless, sloppy or lack humanity. They are fighting terrorists who hide behind their own children or who throw their children into the fire of bombs in order to kill innocents.

Take the shackles off Israel and its army and the Intifada would be over in a very short time.

If the Arabs (some call them palestinians) want to kill the Jewish people, they could be given 48 hours to evacuate their homes, businesses and mosques for other lands. If they chose to stay after the time limit has passed, they can be paved over with concrete as the bulldozers flatten out the pest infested squalor these pawns of Allah and Arafat live in.

Peace would return to Israel. But that would take a moral, ethical strong young leader to take the reins of government.

 

[NATO AIR]

you should run for office then AJ... all arguments aside temporarily, i think you might work something out.

 

[ajwps]

you should run for office then AJ... all arguments aside temporarily, i think you might work something out.

Actually John Kerry and me have a plan to make peace with the Arabs and Israel. But neither of us will reveal our plan until after Kerry is elected in November.

 

[wolvie20m]

AJ for office hmm....I dunno you sound like a easily corrupted person but I guess it's no better then now.....the case of this soldier being let off the hook even with two of his fellow soldiers being witness to him standing over her and dumping a full magazine into her. This is unacceptable when the car/bus bombers are found they are often tried, or killed on the spot. Yet when a Isreali soldier kills a innocent girl he is let off the hook. I hope you guys aren't sayin' a wrong is ok if wronged. A bit of a double standard there fellas.

 

[ajwps]

AJ for office hmm....I dunno you sound like a easily corrupted person but I guess it's no better then now.....the case of this soldier being let off the hook even with two of his fellow soldiers being witness to him standing over her and dumping a full magazine into her. This is unacceptable when the car/bus bombers are found they are often tried, or killed on the spot. Yet when a Isreali soldier kills a innocent girl he is let off the hook. I hope you guys aren't sayin' a wrong is ok if wronged. A bit of a double standard there fellas.

The case of the soldier shooting the Palestinian girl bomb carrier. The Israeli should have reloaded another clip and shot the suicide bomber girl again with a full clip.

This is acceptable in any war and in a civilized country.

When the Iraq insurgents cut off the heads of contracted men and women with dull knives that serves them right. The Arabs have Allah on their side and Allah said that it is high time to severe unbelievers heads.

Yeh a bit of double standard there don't you think?

 

[DaTroof]

My issue is that there really is a double standard. It starts with the fact that Israel even has a court system to deal with this. Do you think that the PA actually investigates allegations of terrorism against Israelis ?! when it does happen it's a Kagaroo court .. minimal sentences which the offenders don't serve. Israel actually has one of the most stringent and fair legal systems considering circumstances. In a poll, most Palestinians actually admitted that they would get a much fairer shake in an Israeli court than they ever would in the territories. Heaven forbid you are a non-Moslem in a Moslem court. May the Lord have mercy on your soul ... you'll need it. One question on this matter ... Why would Israel have such an open legal system if they are trying to hide attrocities ?

As for the young girl. My sincere condolences to the family. I am sure that she was on her way to school. Only problem is that the "palestinians" have decided that children are a good tool to use as homicide bombers. It's happened a few times so far. So now you have a situation where an innocent girl runs at armed Israelis because her bretheren decide to start shooting. Between the shooting and the girl running at me, I would empty a magazine too. I would even continue to shoot to ensure that she isn't playing possum with a finger on the switch. So yes ... self defense will have to be enough for you. I could easily argue that this is the "palestinian's" fault for using children as weapons, for shooting while children are in the area, for making an Israeli soldier have to decide between her and a possible USMC Barracks in Lebanon situation. Did this soldier go looking for as many "palestinians" children as he could find ?! Did he set off a bomb in a market ?! Did he dip his bullets in anti-cooagulate to ensure that all wounds would be life threatening ?! You know that I'm asking this because that's exactly what these Arabs do.

I have a gut feeling that you are either trying to equate what this soldier did with what the palestinian terrorists do, or show that the palestinians hate the Israelis because of these actions. Well, when that soldier opens fire in the middle of a kindergarten, we'll talk. You where in the Marines, and you know that if a guy comes running at your barracks in Lebanon, you would have opened fire. As for Israel's actions being the reason for these issues, that is simply obsurd. The day after the UN declaring Israel a sovreign nations, there where 3 Arab countries shelling Jews. This has nothing to do with Israeli actions. Islam simply will not allow Jews to be dominant in any country that a Moslem ever wiped his ass in. Moslems are excellent at remembering what they want and forgetting what doesn't suit them. They are great at forgetting that both Jews and Christians where on the land before Mohamed was an itch in his daddy's pants. They forget that the crusades where partially conducted becasue Moslems where molesting peaceful Christian pilgrims who wanted to visit Jesus' birthplace. It's all about the poor Arabs and the poor Moslems. Well, they are not poor, and they keep Palestinians poor and in harms way so that you can feel bad for them. Simple question ... If the Saudis etc feel so bad for these Arabs, why will they not integrate at least the "palestinian refugees" ?! It's because as long as you and the rest of the Arab masses feel badly and focus on the Israeli "injustices", it keeps the masses from asking why their leadrership is such a dismal failure. Why their religion has left them in the technological dust. Can't have those questions floating around ... they might actually lead somewhere.

 

[Merlin1047]

The poor little girl had 20 bullets strike her... she wasn't carrying a weapon or a bomb... she was trapped in the wrong place at the wrong time, and the IDF pumped her full of lead. more brave israeli resistance against the palestinian children....

i'm sure he SHOT THE GROUND (too bad he shot her body) in response to "alleged" gunfire from afar...

While certain aspects of this account appear to suggest an inappropriate reaction, I have to say, regretfully, that the overall actions of the IDF in shooting this child appear to have been correct.

Most moslem suicide bombers have been young people. Many have been female. The IDF troops were in a firefight and someone comes running toward them, they react in self-defense. They cannot afford to allow this person to get close to them. They have to assume that this girl was part of the attack. They cannot afford to do otherwise.

A characteristic of most armed conflicts is that they are often senseless, brutal and always tragic.

 

[Merlin1047]

The case of the soldier shooting the Palestinian girl bomb carrier. The Israeli should have reloaded another clip and shot the suicide bomber girl again with a full clip.

This is acceptable in any war and in a civilized country.

When the Iraq insurgents cut off the heads of contracted men and women with dull knives that serves them right. The Arabs have Allah on their side and Allah said that it is high time to severe unbelievers heads.

Yeh a bit of double standard there don't you think?

Oh, by all means. Let's feed those nasty Arabs into wood chippers - feet first. You're a raving idiot AJ. You and people like you are the reason that there is no peace for Israel.

Somehow any thread in which you participate quickly deteriorates. You are a foul, racist, sociopathic lunatic. Personally I hope that the fate you wish on these people is the very one that befalls you.

And let me point this out to you one more time - I don't understand why you delight in painting "Arabs" as sub-human since Jews are Arabs. Pisses you off to no end, doesn't it? Causes me to laugh my ass off. You're as big a contradiction as a black man trying to join the KKK. You're bigoted against your own race.

 

[NATO AIR]

While certain aspects of this account appear to suggest an inappropriate reaction, I have to say, regretfully, that the overall actions of the IDF in shooting this child appear to have been correct.

Most moslem suicide bombers have been young people. Many have been female. The IDF troops were in a firefight and someone comes running toward them, they react in self-defense. They cannot afford to allow this person to get close to them. They have to assume that this girl was part of the attack. They cannot afford to do otherwise.

A characteristic of most armed conflicts is that they are often senseless, brutal and always tragic.

that is sadly true. i do get worked up over these things. to be honest, i do appreciate the extensive training the IDF members usually recieve and that's perhaps why I hold them to a higher standard than say, a Chinese or Syrian soldier.

you are right about the young suicide bombers being increasingly female though.

 

[DaTroof]

Yo AJ. I'm a Jew as well. I understand fully where you are coming from. I've studied our history extensively and realize that you view Israel as I do, a safe haven for our people. I've lost family in Germany and I've lived in Israel and lost friends there as well. The one thing that has always kept us alive is being pragmatic and diplomatic. Yelling "death of all Arabs" makes you sound like an Arab, maybe Machiavelian pragmatic, but certainly not the later. More importantly, I hope that you don't really mean it. I hope that you just feel frustrated. I am not advocating the return to the '67 border either. I believe that there are reprocutions to attacking another sovreign land .. you don't get all your land back when it fails. Gotta be some loss factor, or else people will attack each other all day and claim "do-over" until they finally succeed. I say this also because in the greater geographical picture we are speaking of some square miles as opposed to the rolling oil drenched lands of the Arabs all around Israel. These square miles are necessary because without them Israel is Barbie thin in the middle. So I am not saying that we should commit suicide, but we should realize that these Arab neighbors of ours, that by now have at least 2 genrations on that land, are not going anywhere either. So lets build the wall and let these Palestinians take care of themselves. The only issue then is the fact that sooner or later these territories will burst at the seem if no population control is implemented. Once again, not Israel's problem. So let's not wish on others as we would not have them wish upon us. Let us be content in doing what is best for the security of our people, which is a Palestinian Nation clearly divided from us. No more Arab street rants Jewish style please. Trust me, you would not like to see an Israeli soldier really lining up Arabs and shooting them despite the fact that that is exactly what they would do to us. "Though I walk through the valley of death I shall fear no evil for I am the meenest mother in that valley".

 

[ajwps]

Oh, by all means. Let's feed those nasty Arabs into wood chippers - feet first. You're a raving idiot AJ. You and people like you are the reason that there is no peace for Israel.

Somehow any thread in which you participate quickly deteriorates. You are a foul, racist, sociopathic lunatic. Personally I hope that the fate you wish on these people is the very one that befalls you.

And let me point this out to you one more time - I don't understand why you delight in painting "Arabs" as sub-human since Jews are Arabs. Pisses you off to no end, doesn't it? Causes me to laugh my ass off. You're as big a contradiction as a black man trying to join the KKK. You're bigoted against your own race.

Merlin you really are mentally challanged. Now we see an American solider shoot an Iraqi insurgent pretending to be dead. The soldier had no way of knowing if that Arab had a gun under his body or a bomb strapped to his waist under his sheet.

The Israeli soldier who shot that girl had no way of knowing if she was a martyr for Allah. In war time, when children are used to kill Israeli soldiers or when Vietnamese children carried handgrenades into American bases, one doesn't wait until they are killed to determine the instant choice to save you and your fellow soldiers lives.

I have never advocated killing all the Arabs occupying Israel. And for your limited intellect, Arabs are not Jews no more than Chinese people are English folks.

You are confusing the homosapien family tree. The KKK have now pretty much been attenuated and any resemblence between Arabs and Jews is not even coincidental.

You do look funny laughing your rectum off.

 

[ajwps]

Yo AJ. I'm a Jew as well. I understand fully where you are coming from. I've studied our history extensively and realize that you view Israel as I do, a safe haven for our people. I've lost family in Germany and I've lived in Israel and lost friends there as well.

Very nice....

The one thing that has always kept us alive is being pragmatic and diplomatic. Yelling "death of all Arabs" makes you sound like an Arab, maybe Machiavelian pragmatic, but certainly not the later. More importantly, I hope that you don't really mean it.

I have never advocated killing the Arab people. Merlin has chose to read that into my posts. That girl could have been a walking bomb and in war time there are no children when they are used as weapons. You are definitely wrong when you say that the Jewish people have been kept alive by being pragmatic and diplomatic. Clinton and Rabin were diplomatic and pragmatic with Arafat and his occupying Arabs. Did that keep Israel alive or did they accept an independent country in Israel? If they had chosen that route and accepted the several generous offers of a land in Israel, the Arabs could have had only to drive the Jews a mile or so into the Mediterranian Sea. Arafat and his Arabs made a wonderful choice alright.

You just said that you lost family in Germany with the Nazis. Did being diplomatic and pragmatic keep six millions Jewish men, women and children alive? Jews are not Arabs and I do not call for or advocate 'death to all Arabs.' Like former Kinesset member Rabbi Kahane, I advocate transferring the Arabs out of Israel just as Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and just about every other Arab country. When you live in a room with vipers, you do not sign peace treaties with them.

I hope that you just feel frustrated. I am not advocating the return to the '67 border either. I believe that there are reprocutions to attacking another sovreign land .. you don't get all your land back when it fails. Gotta be some loss factor, or else people will attack each other all day and claim "do-over" until they finally succeed. I say this also because in the greater geographical picture we are speaking of some square miles as opposed to the rolling oil drenched lands of the Arabs all around Israel.

There is no sovereign Palestinian Israel and never has been. If you think differently, please give me specifics. If you think that there is no room in their borther countries for these Arabs then take a look at the following map comparison.

These square miles are necessary because without them Israel is Barbie thin in the middle. So I am not saying that we should commit suicide, but we should realize that these Arab neighbors of ours, that by now have at least 2 genrations on that land, are not going anywhere either.

Our friendly Arab neighbors have tried to destroy the Jewish people since there were Arabs. These Arabs are not interested in an independent country in Israel. Their only single stated goal is the total destruction of the Jewish people. If you don't believe that you are living with your head in the sand.

So lets build the wall and let these Palestinians take care of themselves. The only issue then is the fact that sooner or later these territories will burst at the seem if no population control is implemented. Once again, not Israel's problem. So let's not wish on others as we would not have them wish upon us. Let us be content in doing what is best for the security of our people, which is a Palestinian Nation clearly divided from us. No more Arab street rants Jewish style please. Trust me, you would not like to see an Israeli soldier really lining up Arabs and shooting them despite the fact that that is exactly what they would do to us. "Though I walk through the valley of death I shall fear no evil for I am the meenest mother in that valley".

I have been told by very reliable sources that there NEVER will be an Arab presence in Israel. So far my sources haven't missed one prediction of future events.

 

[DaTroof]

AJ .. I agree. Our neighbors want us dead. I am advocating building a wall with stipulations.

Full out Palestinian attack is cause for dismisal from the entire region. There will be millions more Arabs in the surrounding areas and no return period. Actions have consequences and a war would negate all peace and force Israel to clear out all the Arab Muslem population.

Rockets over the wall (more likely scenario) results in artilery taking out the city block from where the missle was launched.

I understand what you are saying AJ. But I don't believe that Israel could currently kick out millions of Arabs from the territories. Not that it couldn't physically, I just don't think it would be wise. They will kill each other until a a Hamas or Islamic Jihad guy raignes in the power. With one of these guys in, Israel should have about 100 square blocks shelled within the guy's first month. And more power to Israel to do so. I am not trying to appease, I am trying to give them just enough rope to hang themselves.

 

[dilloduck]

Very nice....



I have never advocated killing the Arab people. Merlin has chose to read that into my posts. That girl could have been a walking bomb and in war time there are no children when they are used as weapons. You are definitely wrong when you say that the Jewish people have been kept alive by being pragmatic and diplomatic. Clinton and Rabin were diplomatic and pragmatic with Arafat and his occupying Arabs. Did that keep Israel alive or did they accept an independent country in Israel? If they had chosen that route and accepted the several generous offers of a land in Israel, the Arabs could have had only to drive the Jews a mile or so into the Mediterranian Sea. Arafat and his Arabs made a wonderful choice alright.

You just said that you lost family in Germany with the Nazis. Did being diplomatic and pragmatic keep six millions Jewish men, women and children alive? Jews are not Arabs and I do not call for or advocate 'death to all Arabs.' Like former Kinesset member Rabbi Kahane, I advocate transferring the Arabs out of Israel just as Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and just about every other Arab country. When you live in a room with vipers, you do not sign peace treaties with them.



There is no sovereign Palestinian Israel and never has been. If you think differently, please give me specifics. If you think that there is no room in their borther countries for these Arabs then take a look at the following map comparison.

Our friendly Arab neighbors have tried to destroy the Jewish people since there were Arabs. These Arabs are not interested in an independent country in Israel. Their only single stated goal is the total destruction of the Jewish people. If you don't believe that you are living with your head in the sand.



I have been told by very reliable sources that there NEVER will be an Arab presence in Israel. So far my sources haven't missed one prediction of future events.

There are many Arabs in Israel right now! Better get another fortune teller.

Must you always post the map? We know you want us to feel sorry for that pitiful, small ,non-yellow country but it doesn't work.

 

[DaTroof]

You think that the non-yellow is to make you feel sorry. I don't need your pitty. Don't even need your permision. The point of the map is that Arabs/Muslems have huge lots but it's little Israel that is keeping these refugees from setteling. Arabs have plenty of land, but they want Israel too. They are greedy .. same thing that you are apparently saying that Israel is. I tell you that Israel is a tiny country surrounded by Arab countries and you tell me that Jews are the only people that live all over & get to have a country of their own. Like the US has no Saudi population that can always return to their kingdom. Your desire to blame Israel for all the world's woes is clear, it's your logic that eludes me. So let me ask you this. Are the Jews really the only people who have a country and live abroad but can go back to their ancestoral land ?! This smacks of "Jews control the media" or "Jews control the money" or in your case "Jews are the only nationality living abroad and having their own country" when it's so clearly not true. So that's why you get people telling you that you are insanely biased. Don't look so surprised when you utter stupidity. "I know nice Muslems" so it must be the Jews. Cram it.

 

[dilloduck]

You think that the non-yellow is to make you feel sorry. I don't need your pitty. Don't even need your permision. The point of the map is that Arabs/Muslems have huge lots but it's little Israel that is keeping these refugees from setteling. Arabs have plenty of land, but they want Israel too. They are greedy .. same thing that you are apparently saying that Israel is. I tell you that Israel is a tiny country surrounded by Arab countries and you tell me that Jews are the only people that live all over & get to have a country of their own. Like the US has no Saudi population that can always return to their kingdom. Your desire to blame Israel for all the world's woes is clear, it's your logic that eludes me. So let me ask you this. Are the Jews really the only people who have a country and live abroad but can go back to their ancestoral land ?! This smacks of "Jews control the media" or "Jews control the money" or in your case "Jews are the only nationality living abroad and having their own country" when it's so clearly not true. So that's why you get people telling you that you are insanely biased. Don't look so surprised when you utter stupidity. "I know nice Muslems" so it must be the Jews. Cram it.

I am not stupid and don't need to see this map for the umpteenth time to know that arabs occupy more suface land area than Israel does. I never said Israel was greedy. My observation regarding "a home away from home" was merely that--an observation. It smacked of nothing until you made your inferences. I have continually said that BOTH arabs and jews have to want peace before there will be any.