I will not Bow!

[Phoenall]

No they were not as Palestine could not have any borders, what you are falling foul of is the borders of other countries set in stone are not the same thing as the borders of the area they surround.

Could you prove that statement like a link or something?

He cant because he just thunk it up

Do you mean like this............................

International law and the Arab?Israeli conflict - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


how legal borders should be decided between Israel and a Palestinian state;

http://anthonydamato.law.northwestern.edu/Adobefiles/israels-borders-under-international-law.pdf

On November 29, 1947, the General Assembly adopted the key "partition"
resolution, Resolution 181, ratifying the British proposals. It also provided for an
independent international mixed status for the city of Palestine. In my opinion, this
Resolution constitutes the first, last, and only legally authorized demarkation of the
Israeli-Palestine borders.

 

[Urbanguerrilla]

 

[toastman]

Link your so-called truths to a neutral source.

You need a link to show that 'Palestine' was a territory and not a country in 1948 where the 'Palestinian' Arabs had no sovereignty?

Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Late Ottoman and British Mandate periods

In the middle of the 1st century of the Ottoman rule, i.e. 1550 AD, Bernard Lewis in a study of Ottoman registers of the early Ottoman Rule of Palestine reports:[58]


From the mass of detail in the registers, it is possible to extract something like a general picture of the economic life of the country in that period. Out of a total population of about 300,000 souls, between a fifth and a quarter lived in the six towns of Jerusalem, Gaza, Safed, Nablus, Ramle, and Hebron. The remainder consisted mainly of peasants, living in villages of varying size, and engaged in agriculture. Their main food-crops were wheat and barley in that order, supplemented by leguminous pulses, olives, fruit, and vegetables. In and around most of the towns there was a considerable number of vineyards, orchards, and vegetable gardens.

According to Alexander Scholch, the population of Palestine in 1850 was about 350,000 inhabitants, 30% of whom lived in 13 towns; roughly 85% were Muslims, 11% were Christians and 4% Jews[59]

Common Pbel, don't lower yourself to Tinmore's standards. There is Zero proof there

 

[toastman]

Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A country is a region legally identified as a distinct entity in political geography. A country may be an independent sovereign state or one that is occupied by another state, as a non-sovereign or formerly sovereign political division, or a geographic region associated with sets of previously independent or differently associated peoples with distinct political characteristics

Exactly. But Palestine was not a State then.

For ***** sakes, if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state.

Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state.


BTW, I am in no way trying to de legitimize the inhabitants that have lived there, I am just giving you facts

 

[pbel]

Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A country is a region legally identified as a distinct entity in political geography. A country may be an independent sovereign state or one that is occupied by another state, as a non-sovereign or formerly sovereign political division, or a geographic region associated with sets of previously independent or differently associated peoples with distinct political characteristics

Exactly. But Palestine was not a State then.

For ***** sakes, if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state.

Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state.


BTW, I am in no way trying to de legitimize the inhabitants that have lived there, I am just giving you facts

State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

 

[Billo_Really]

Thankfully, that's not your decision to make.

Nor is it anyone elses but the Israelis and the muslims, and until the muslims wind their necks in they will lose

First off, this has nothing to do with muslims. This is a political and judicial issue, not a religious one. Second, eventually, if Israel doesn't decide, that "decision", will be made for them. And third, WTF does "wind their necks" mean?

It has everything to do with islam and the muslims when they are invoking their religion when they MASS MURDER. Who will make that decision and go against the fundamental right of the Israeli's to decide their own path. How would you feel if the UN decided to force the muslims into accepting something they don't want. Simply put it means stop being so aggressive and belligerent and getting in peoples faces.

That's not the issue. The issue is, "Who gave Israel the right to decide the Palestinian's path?"



What has Israel done to allow the Pals to live peacefully?

Take the withdrawal from Gaza in August 2005, what did the HoaAP do to prove they could be peaceful after that.

Israel did not withdraw from Gaza! You actually expect people to be peaceful, when you are constantly shooting at them, while they fish and farm; while you deliberately murder their children; while you shoot out the lamps at the top of their light poles, after they made street improvements; while you violate their air space on a weekly basis; and after you cut out the dead, un-born baby, from the belly of a Palestinian mother you just killed and left the body in the street for all to see? You expect peace after all that? You're lucky I'm not there. If you did that to me, I would **** your country up!

Israel withdrew from gaza completely in August 2005, and even the HoAP agree that is the case. The HoAP increased the rate of attack without any provocation and taunted the Israeli's. All that you spout is just Islamic blood libels with no corroborative evidence available. But then you never let a lie get in the way of your NAZI JEW HATRED AND ANTI SEMITIC LIES do you

You cannot "completely withdraw", yet control over 80% of what goes into (and out of) the area. It's either one or the other. How old are you? You've got the logic of a 15 year old.



Because that's what Israel wants.

Not Israel that is putting obstacles in the way is it, not Israel demanding pre conditions before even thinking about starting the peace talks. NOT ISREAL MAKING THE CLAIM THAT THEY WILL MASS MURDER ALL THE MUSLIMS .

You don't consider over 500 roadblocks and checkpoints in the West Bank, "obstacles"? You don't consider the illegal and immoral blockade of Gaza, an "obstacle"? You don't consider a 47 year occupation of land that isn't yours, an "obstacle"?

No as they are security measures to stop terrorist attacks on innocent Israeli civilians, but you don't see that do you all you see is JOOOOOOS. The blockade is there to stop gun running and has saved the lives if thousands of innocent people. The HoAP would rather spend $1 million on building a tunnel so they could murder one Israeli child than spend $1 on providing a meal for a starving child in gaza. No occupation at all if you look at the facts, the land was given back to its rightful owners and refused, Israel was told to do what they wanted as Egypt and Jordan no longer wanted the bother of HoAP terrorism.

You're FOS! The roadblocks are in the West Bank, not between the West Bank and Israel. The blockade is there to punish Gazan's because Israel didn't like who they voted for in a democratic election. Like it's any of Israel's ******* business who the Pals vote for. And the tunnels are built to bring in the goods necessary to support a population of that size. BTW, those are the goods Israel is preventing with their blockade.




Well the pro terrorist on this board seem to think the boycott of Israeli goods is a threat that cant be ignored

You consider choosing not to buy your products (made from OPT sweat shops), "terrorism"? You consider people trying to symbolically enforce the law, "terrorists"?

Would you rather buy your goods from a Chinese neo Marxist sweat shop, or a Pakistani muslim sweat shop. Then complain when they don't last a month. For the record what Israeli goods are made in a sweat shop, now this should be entertaining as you scour the internet for muslim blood libels

Personally, I'd rather buy American.

You can always tell when a pro terrorist is losing they resort to abusive profanity and outright lies.

Unfortunately, you haven't proven either, so don't change the subject!

 

[toastman]

Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A country is a region legally identified as a distinct entity in political geography. A country may be an independent sovereign state or one that is occupied by another state, as a non-sovereign or formerly sovereign political division, or a geographic region associated with sets of previously independent or differently associated peoples with distinct political characteristics

Exactly. But Palestine was not a State then.

For ***** sakes, if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state.

Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state.


BTW, I am in no way trying to de legitimize the inhabitants that have lived there, I am just giving you facts

State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

You STILL have not proved your point.

Take a look at this:

https://www.google.ca/#q=was+palestine+a+country

The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it

BULLSHIT. It is the anti - Zionists who's propaganda consists of distorting history (like you are doing right now), and you know it !

PALESTINE was NOT A COUNTRY, it was a territory, and that is not up for debate

 

[Kondor3]

"...if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state. Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state..."

 

[toastman]

Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A country is a region legally identified as a distinct entity in political geography. A country may be an independent sovereign state or one that is occupied by another state, as a non-sovereign or formerly sovereign political division, or a geographic region associated with sets of previously independent or differently associated peoples with distinct political characteristics

Exactly. But Palestine was not a State then.

For ***** sakes, if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state.

Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state.


BTW, I am in no way trying to de legitimize the inhabitants that have lived there, I am just giving you facts

State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

State of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Palestine, officially the State of Palestine (Arabic: دولة فلسطين* Dawlat Filasṭīn), is a de facto sovereign state[13][14] in the Levant that declared independence on 15 November 1988 by the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and its government-in-exile in Algiers

There you go

 

[Sally]

Thankfully, that's not your decision to make.

Nor is it anyone elses but the Israelis and the muslims, and until the muslims wind their necks in they will lose

First off, this has nothing to do with muslims. This is a political and judicial issue, not a religious one. Second, eventually, if Israel doesn't decide, that "decision", will be made for them. And third, WTF does "wind their necks" mean?

It has everything to do with islam and the muslims when they are invoking their religion when they MASS MURDER. Who will make that decision and go against the fundamental right of the Israeli's to decide their own path. How would you feel if the UN decided to force the muslims into accepting something they don't want. Simply put it means stop being so aggressive and belligerent and getting in peoples faces.

That's not the issue. The issue is, "Who gave Israel the right to decide the Palestinian's path?"



What has Israel done to allow the Pals to live peacefully?

Take the withdrawal from Gaza in August 2005, what did the HoaAP do to prove they could be peaceful after that.

Israel did not withdraw from Gaza! You actually expect people to be peaceful, when you are constantly shooting at them, while they fish and farm; while you deliberately murder their children; while you shoot out the lamps at the top of their light poles, after they made street improvements; while you violate their air space on a weekly basis; and after you cut out the dead, un-born baby, from the belly of a Palestinian mother you just killed and left the body in the street for all to see? You expect peace after all that? You're lucky I'm not there. If you did that to me, I would **** your country up!

Israel withdrew from gaza completely in August 2005, and even the HoAP agree that is the case. The HoAP increased the rate of attack without any provocation and taunted the Israeli's. All that you spout is just Islamic blood libels with no corroborative evidence available. But then you never let a lie get in the way of your NAZI JEW HATRED AND ANTI SEMITIC LIES do you

You cannot "completely withdraw", yet control over 80% of what goes into (and out of) the area. It's either one or the other. How old are you? You've got the logic of a 15 year old.



Because that's what Israel wants.

Not Israel that is putting obstacles in the way is it, not Israel demanding pre conditions before even thinking about starting the peace talks. NOT ISREAL MAKING THE CLAIM THAT THEY WILL MASS MURDER ALL THE MUSLIMS .

You don't consider over 500 roadblocks and checkpoints in the West Bank, "obstacles"? You don't consider the illegal and immoral blockade of Gaza, an "obstacle"? You don't consider a 47 year occupation of land that isn't yours, an "obstacle"?

No as they are security measures to stop terrorist attacks on innocent Israeli civilians, but you don't see that do you all you see is JOOOOOOS. The blockade is there to stop gun running and has saved the lives if thousands of innocent people. The HoAP would rather spend $1 million on building a tunnel so they could murder one Israeli child than spend $1 on providing a meal for a starving child in gaza. No occupation at all if you look at the facts, the land was given back to its rightful owners and refused, Israel was told to do what they wanted as Egypt and Jordan no longer wanted the bother of HoAP terrorism.

You're FOS! The roadblocks are in the West Bank, not between the West Bank and Israel. The blockade is there to punish Gazan's because Israel didn't like who they voted for in a democratic election. Like it's any of Israel's ******* business who the Pals vote for. And the tunnels are built to bring in the goods necessary to support a population of that size. BTW, those are the goods Israel is preventing with their blockade.




Well the pro terrorist on this board seem to think the boycott of Israeli goods is a threat that cant be ignored

You consider choosing not to buy your products (made from OPT sweat shops), "terrorism"? You consider people trying to symbolically enforce the law, "terrorists"?

Would you rather buy your goods from a Chinese neo Marxist sweat shop, or a Pakistani muslim sweat shop. Then complain when they don't last a month. For the record what Israeli goods are made in a sweat shop, now this should be entertaining as you scour the internet for muslim blood libels

Personally, I'd rather buy American.

You can always tell when a pro terrorist is losing they resort to abusive profanity and outright lies.

Unfortunately, you haven't proven either, so don't change the subject!

Billy, I think many of the Gazans drive better cars than you do. Some of them certainly live the higg life. I remember years ago some Palestinian men complaining in an interview that he doesn't like Hamas, and that the wives of Hamas leaders have maids from Sri Lanka. Surely you must remember the time years ago when someone in Hamas was asked how come his son doesn't become a suicide bomber, and he answered "He has better things to do." For all we know, they send their children out of the country to be schooled.

Tunnel Vision Of Gaza's Luxury Car Smugglers

 

[pbel]

Exactly. But Palestine was not a State then.

For ***** sakes, if Palestine was already a state. then what was the Partition plan for ??? It was to GIVE two peoples a state.

Please tell me then ,WHEN did Palestine' become a state.


BTW, I am in no way trying to de legitimize the inhabitants that have lived there, I am just giving you facts

State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

State of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Palestine, officially the State of Palestine (Arabic: دولة فلسطين* Dawlat Filasṭīn), is a de facto sovereign state[13][14] in the Levant that declared independence on 15 November 1988 by the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and its government-in-exile in Algiers

There you go

So they became a sovereign state in 1988...Sovereignty is not required to be a State, country or a nation as I posted earlier...Kosovo, American Indian nations are a good example.

 

[toastman]

State - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

State of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Palestine, officially the State of Palestine (Arabic: دولة فلسطين* Dawlat Filasṭīn), is a de facto sovereign state[13][14] in the Levant that declared independence on 15 November 1988 by the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and its government-in-exile in Algiers

There you go

So they became a sovereign state in 1988...Sovereignty is not required to be a State, country or a nation as I posted earlier...Kosovo, American Indian nations are a good example.

SO when DID Palestine become a country?
You failed to answer this questions among others that I have asked

 

[pbel]

State of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Palestine, officially the State of Palestine (Arabic: دولة فلسطين* Dawlat Filasṭīn), is a de facto sovereign state[13][14] in the Levant that declared independence on 15 November 1988 by the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and its government-in-exile in Algiers

There you go

So they became a sovereign state in 1988...Sovereignty is not required to be a State, country or a nation as I posted earlier...Kosovo, American Indian nations are a good example.

SO when DID Palestine become a country?
You failed to answer this questions among others that I have asked

When they congregated sometime after 67 AD...Genetic testing has shown that 82% of todays Palestinians have roots from that time and are very closely related to the ancient Jews of this region.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

So they became a sovereign state in 1988...Sovereignty is not required to be a State, country or a nation as I posted earlier...Kosovo, American Indian nations are a good example.

SO when DID Palestine become a country?
You failed to answer this questions among others that I have asked

When they congregated sometime after 67 AD...Genetic testing has shown that 82% of todays Palestinians have roots from that time and are very closely related to the ancient Jews of this region.

Link?

 

[pbel]

SO when DID Palestine become a country?
You failed to answer this questions among others that I have asked

When they congregated sometime after 67 AD...Genetic testing has shown that 82% of todays Palestinians have roots from that time and are very closely related to the ancient Jews of this region.

Link?

Palestinian people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Genetic analysis suggests that a majority of the Muslims of Palestine, inclusive of Arab citizens of Israel, are descendants of Christians, Jews and other earlier inhabitants of the southern Levant whose core may reach back to prehistoric times. A study of high-resolution haplotypes demonstrated that a substantial portion of Y chromosomes of Israeli Jews (70%) and of Palestinian Muslim Arabs (82%) belonged to the same chromosome pool.[31] Since the time of the Muslim conquests in the 7th century, religious conversions have resulted in Palestinians being predominantly Sunni Muslim by religious affiliation, though there is a significant Palestinian Christian minority of various Christian denominations

 

[toastman]

And nothing there said that Palestine became a country after 67 AD

 

[RoccoR]

pbel, et al,

In some respects I have to agree.

State commonly refers to either the present condition of a system or entity, or to a governed entity (such as a country) or sub-entity (such as an autonomous territory of a country).
You just don'6t get it...The fact that the Palestinians were a sub-set of Arab Culture made them a Nation or cultural group entitled to self determination...[/COLOR]The Zionist propaganda to confuse and distort the truth is despicable and everyone knows it.

Palestine, officially the State of Palestine (Arabic: دولة فلسطين* Dawlat Filasṭīn), is a de facto sovereign state[13][14] in the Levant that declared independence on 15 November 1988 by the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO) and its government-in-exile in Algiers

There you go

So they became a sovereign state in 1988...Sovereignty is not required to be a State, country or a nation as I posted earlier...Kosovo, American Indian nations are a good example.

(COMMENT)

In earlier times, this simplified idea was true. But in the context of the argument pertaining to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, this issue is over "sovereignty" as we understand it to be from the 19th Century onward.

In any event, the credibility of the Palestinian is tainted. They, as an example, claim the modern code that territory cannot be acquired through armed force, yet, it was the Arab-Palestinian and the Arab League that tried to take the territory by armed force.

And by "taking territory," we all understand that to mean, the establishment of "sovereignty" and not ownership (a civil real-estate issue).

As we discussed in Post #517, there were "nonviolent" and "non-Hostile" ways to adjudicate claims the Hostile Arab Palestinians (HoAP) attempted to solve through conventional and asymmetric means.

And as we discussed in Post #502, the overall character of the Palestinian culture is not one in which we can reasonably expect:

To be sympathetic or understand of the original plight of the Jewish people, as the Allied Powers assessed the situation in the very early 20th Century.

It is not such, that we could ever expect they would not fall under the cult-like teachings of men such as the Syrian born Izz ad-Dīn al-Qassām, who was a Muslim preacher (of Black Hand fame) who was a leader in the fight against British, French, and migrated to Palestine to become one of their most revered martyrs in their fight against the Zionist (1920s/1930s); or Muhammad Amin al-Husayni, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, who --- in 1948 attempted a grab for power by trying to establish an All Palestine Government, but did not have the full support of the Arab League, was reigned-in by them, and ultimately dissolved by the Arab League through President Nassar of Egypt; or Farhan al-Sa'di, a militant Sheik of the al-Qassam group, who led the 1936 Riots.

The Palestinian established their pattern of behavior early on in the struggle. Much of their argument is based on some form of justification for armed struggle; not on solutions through peaceful means.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[toastman]

Rocco, in 1948, was their a state/country/nation by the name of 'Palestine' ?

 

[Hossfly]

Rocco, in 1948, was their a state/country/nation by the name of 'Palestine' ?

You might check with Sherria. She has bible maps clear back to Alley Oop.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A country is a region legally identified as a distinct entity in political geography. A country may be an independent sovereign state or one that is occupied by another state, as a non-sovereign or formerly sovereign political division, or a geographic region associated with sets of previously independent or differently associated peoples with distinct political characteristics

Indeed.

A dispute regarding the status of the territories was settled by an Arbitrator appointed by the Council of the League of Nations. It was decided that Palestine and Transjordan were newly created states according to the terms of the applicable post-war treaties.

State of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In a broader international context, the “Nationality law… showed that the Palestinians formed a nation, and that Palestine was a State, though provisionally under guardianship.”90 The inclusion of Palestinian nationality in the text of the Palestine Mandate was the first step towards an international recognition of the Palestinian people as distinct from the Ottoman people and other peoples. Palestinian nationality, like any other nationality, constitutes the formula by which a certain group of individuals are being legally connected and enabled to form the people element of the state.91

The status of Palestine and the nationality of its inhabitants were finally settled by the Treaty of Lausanne from the perspective of public international law. In a report submitted to the League of Nations, the British government pointed out: “The ratification of the Treaty of Lausanne in Aug., 1924, finally regularised the international status of Palestine.”123 And, thereafter, “Palestine could, at last, obtain a separate nationality.”124

Genesis of Citizenship in Palestine and Israel