I will not Bow!

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You are 180 Degrees out of alignment here.

Israel violated several major parts of the resolution before it claimed independence

Link ?? And how could they violate it if you even said yourself it wasn't implemented

Israel played the resolution 181 card in an attempt at obtaining legitimacy but never had any intention of complying with it.

(COMMENT)

You need to read the background on the Letter dated 25 March 1999 from the Permanent Observer of Palestine to the United Nations addressed to the Secretary-General. You will find that it was the Israelis that tried to dissolve the UN GA Resolution 181(II), and it was the Palestinians that fought for recognition of the resolution.

Fact is sometimes stranger than fiction.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

 

[P F Tinmore]

You should also note that there was a hand-off to the Successor Government (UNPC): Very IMPORTANT!

What did this so called government do to protect the citizens from Israel driving them off their land and destroying their villages?

Did Israel win its land from the UN?

 

[Synthaholic]

I will not Bow!

...oh, wait.

 

[aris2chat]

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

Israel won her independence despite resolution 181. You can't go back to the prepossessed borders. West bank and Gaza were also won, but Israel gave up the gaza for the sake of peace, and has gotten no peace from gaza.
Israel and the PA are in negotiations for what will be a palestinian state.
Arabs did not want to give the palestinians a state, but Israel does.
Amazing how palestinians reject 181 but want a state based on ceasefire lines after they lost the war, and tinman wants to go back to 181 lines.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You are intentionally trying to obscure the truth.

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

(COMMENT)

You know as well as I do, that the UNPC (Successor Government) implemented that part of the UNGA/RES/181(II) that was accepted by the Jewish Agency. Section "A" (the Arab State) and Section "C" (Internationalization of Jerusalem) were not fully implemented because of the Immediate intervention of the 5 Foreign Arab Armies.

You know as well as I do that the External Interference of the 5 Arab Armies created immediate military engagements that pushed zones of control in all different directions and changed territorial controls.

Today, what you call the West Bank of the State of Palestine was once Occupied and Annex sovereign territory of the Hashemite Kingdom.

Nothing in dispute today, is over the 1948 borders. They are over territorial controls put in place to contain Hostile Arab Palestinians the promote Jihad and terrorism.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

The entire purpose of the invasion by the 5 Arab Armies was to carry out the threats made by the Arab Higher Committee and "genocide" (see A/AC.21/10 of 16 February 1948).

10. The Arab Higher Committee Delegation wishes to reaffirm here that the Arabs of Palestine cannot recognize the Balfour Declaration, the Mandate of Palestine or any situation arising or derived therefrom. They consider that imposing international alien immigrants on their country by force is nothing but an act of aggression and invasion, whether made by Jews themselves, through Great Britain, or by the United Nations. The Arab Higher Committee Delegation therefore expects that the duty of the United Nations is to remove the said aggression and stop that invasion. The creation of any Jewish state in an Arab territory is more than invasion or aggression, it is something with no precedent in history. It is en act of wiping out the existence of an Arab country, violating its integrity, subjecting its land and people to foreign Jewish domination. “

I don't think so.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You are intentionally trying to obscure the truth.

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

(COMMENT)

You know as well as I do, that the UNPC (Successor Government) implemented that part of the UNGA/RES/181(II) that was accepted by the Jewish Agency. Section "A" (the Arab State) and Section "C" (Internationalization of Jerusalem) were not fully implemented because of the Immediate intervention of the 5 Foreign Arab Armies.

You know as well as I do that the External Interference of the 5 Arab Armies created immediate military engagements that pushed zones of control in all different directions and changed territorial controls.

Today, what you call the West Bank of the State of Palestine was once Occupied and Annex sovereign territory of the Hashemite Kingdom.

Nothing in dispute today, is over the 1948 borders. They are over territorial controls put in place to contain Hostile Arab Palestinians the promote Jihad and terrorism.

Most Respectfully,
R

Your post stated that resolution 181 was implemented.

All excuses aside, what was implemented? I don't see anything.

 

[RoccoR]

aris2chat, et al,

Yes, this was a major concern back in the days of the Oslo Accords.

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

Israel won her independence despite resolution 181. You can't go back to the prepossessed borders. West bank and Gaza were also won, but Israel gave up the gaza for the sake of peace, and has gotten no peace from gaza.
Israel and the PA are in negotiations for what will be a palestinian state.
Arabs did not want to give the palestinians a state, but Israel does.
Amazing how palestinians reject 181 but want a state based on ceasefire lines after they lost the war, and tinman wants to go back to 181 lines.

(COMMENT)

If the GA/RES/181(II) Partition was still viable, the Hostile Arab-Palestinians would actually have a claim to more than just the West Bank and Gaza Strip; quite a bit more, plus some very key port facilities.

But, given the conflict and its dimensions, the West Bank and Gaza Strip are about most (and maybe not even that) they could hope for today. They may even be required to give-up some repatriation and war restitution; while Israel will probably have to give more in terms of civil settlements.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

Israel won her independence despite resolution 181. You can't go back to the prepossessed borders. West bank and Gaza were also won, but Israel gave up the gaza for the sake of peace, and has gotten no peace from gaza.
Israel and the PA are in negotiations for what will be a palestinian state.
Arabs did not want to give the palestinians a state, but Israel does.
Amazing how palestinians reject 181 but want a state based on ceasefire lines after they lost the war, and tinman wants to go back to 181 lines.

It is illegal to acquire land through the threat or use of force.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Of course you don't.

P F Tinmore, et al,

You are intentionally trying to obscure the truth.

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

(COMMENT)

You know as well as I do, that the UNPC (Successor Government) implemented that part of the UNGA/RES/181(II) that was accepted by the Jewish Agency. Section "A" (the Arab State) and Section "C" (Internationalization of Jerusalem) were not fully implemented because of the Immediate intervention of the 5 Foreign Arab Armies.

You know as well as I do that the External Interference of the 5 Arab Armies created immediate military engagements that pushed zones of control in all different directions and changed territorial controls.

Today, what you call the West Bank of the State of Palestine was once Occupied and Annex sovereign territory of the Hashemite Kingdom.

Nothing in dispute today, is over the 1948 borders. They are over territorial controls put in place to contain Hostile Arab Palestinians the promote Jihad and terrorism.

Most Respectfully,
R

Your post stated that resolution 181 was implemented.

All excuses aside, what was implemented? I don't see anything.

(COMMENT)

I know that it is very hard to see Israel. It is a relatively small piece of the former Mandate Territory.

• Part I, Sections A and B relative to the Jewish State.
• Part II - Boundaries - Relative to Section B and the Jewish State.

The Arab State was rejected, so no implementation was required. And the UNPC had offices in Jerusalem and were driven out due to the conflict to defy implementation.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[toastman]

There are a few reasons why this statement is not true.

There was no resolution 181. Britain (the mandate) would not implement it without Palestinian approval. Neither would the Security Council. The US withdrew its support and was offering an alternate proposal. Then the 1948 war broke out making the whole proposal moot.

Israel violated several major parts of the resolution before it claimed independence.

Israel never claimed or recognize the resolution's proposed borders. Nobody else recognized them either.


The "5 Arab Armies" entered Palestine to assist the Palestinians. Assistance is not illegal. Interference is.


What border arrangements?


Are you saying that so called reality trumps international law?


Hogwash.

The "5 Arab Armies" entered Palestine to assist the Palestinians. Assistance is not illegal. Interference is.

Why did you put the 5 Arab armies in quotation marks?? They came to assist the Palestinians by destroying a newly founded state. That's what you call assistance ?? And yes that was interference. Who invited them ? You always complain about foreign intervention, but when the Arabs do it, it's fine. Your interpretation of the 1948 war is massive hogwash. You need to stop changing history if you want to be taken seriously. Also, where did you read about the 1948 war?? Show me a link.


Hogwash

Yes, that seems to be your answer to Roccos comments when you know hes right and you have no argument. I challenge you to tell me what he said that was wrong (what you called hogwash)

Why did you put the 5 Arab armies in quotation marks??

You need to read up on the conflict.

I did, many times. It is YOU who need to read up on it.

and you STILL, after all my requests, have not provided the link that talks about the 1948 war that you base your claims on . It's as if you don't want me to read something

 

[toastman]

You should also note that there was a hand-off to the Successor Government (UNPC): Very IMPORTANT!

What did this so called government do to protect the citizens from Israel driving them off their land and destroying their villages?

Did Israel win its land from the UN?

Why do you ask stupid questions likes this instead of addressing what Rocco says ?

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Again, you are 180 degrees out of alignment.

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

Israel won her independence despite resolution 181. You can't go back to the prepossessed borders. West bank and Gaza were also won, but Israel gave up the gaza for the sake of peace, and has gotten no peace from gaza.
Israel and the PA are in negotiations for what will be a palestinian state.
Arabs did not want to give the palestinians a state, but Israel does.
Amazing how palestinians reject 181 but want a state based on ceasefire lines after they lost the war, and tinman wants to go back to 181 lines.

It is illegal to acquire land through the threat or use of force.

(COMMENT)

You are absolutely right. "It is illegal to acquire land through the threat or use of force." The successor government was designated as the UNPC. And it was the Arab Higher Committee and the Armies of the Arab League that first threatened to use force, and then openly attacked the Successor Government and the Implemented Partition by the UNPC that formed the State of Israel.

Yes you are right in that:

It is illegal for the "Arab Higher Committee and the Armies of the Arab League" acquire land through the threat "against the UN, UNPC, the UNPC Partition" and the use of force by the ""Arab Higher Committee and the Armies of the Arab League" to defy the judgement and implementation of the General Assembly as implemented through the Security Council by the UNPC.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[toastman]

The entire purpose of the invasion by the 5 Arab Armies was to carry out the threats made by the Arab Higher Committee and "genocide" (see A/AC.21/10 of 16 February 1948).

10. The Arab Higher Committee Delegation wishes to reaffirm here that the Arabs of Palestine cannot recognize the Balfour Declaration, the Mandate of Palestine or any situation arising or derived therefrom. They consider that imposing international alien immigrants on their country by force is nothing but an act of aggression and invasion, whether made by Jews themselves, through Great Britain, or by the United Nations. The Arab Higher Committee Delegation therefore expects that the duty of the United Nations is to remove the said aggression and stop that invasion. The creation of any Jewish state in an Arab territory is more than invasion or aggression, it is something with no precedent in history. It is en act of wiping out the existence of an Arab country, violating its integrity, subjecting its land and people to foreign Jewish domination. “

I don't think so.

Doesn't matter what you think. The link you posted is also irrelevant. What is relevant is what ACTUALLY TOOK PLACE

Then there were the open threats to Israel of course.

 

[Phoenall]

israel violated several major parts of the resolution before it claimed independence

link ?? And how could they violate it if you even said yourself it wasn't implemented

israel played the resolution 181 card in an attempt at obtaining legitimacy but never had any intention of complying with it.

link ?

 

[Phoenall]

You know this is not true. The UN even published the formal implementation notice for public consumption.

Quote: Originally Posted by Excerpt: PALESTINE COMMISSION ADJOURNS SINE DIE
During today's brief meeting, Dr. Eduardo Morgan (Panama) said that this resolution of the Assembly merely "relieves responsibility. The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

SOURCE: PAL/169 17 May 1948

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

How can you implement something that does not exist, 181 was not a command but a suggestion of intent. The UN was never formed to issue commands only to inform and suggest, which is what it has done since its inception. It suggests that UN member states combine forces and implement its suggestions as in the attacks on Iraq and afgahnistan. The muslims know this and have played on it many times in the past when they have asked UN forces to leave their country or face armed attack.

 

[Phoenall]

You should also note that there was a hand-off to the Successor Government (UNPC): Very IMPORTANT!

What did this so called government do to protect the citizens from Israel driving them off their land and destroying their villages?

Did Israel win its land from the UN?

Did the filistans for that matter ?

 

[Phoenall]

So, where were those proposed borders? Where were the rights of the non Jewish population? Where was the international city of Jerusalem? Where was that economic union?...

What parts of resolution 181 were implemented?

Israel won her independence despite resolution 181. You can't go back to the prepossessed borders. West bank and Gaza were also won, but Israel gave up the gaza for the sake of peace, and has gotten no peace from gaza.
Israel and the PA are in negotiations for what will be a palestinian state.
Arabs did not want to give the palestinians a state, but Israel does.
Amazing how palestinians reject 181 but want a state based on ceasefire lines after they lost the war, and tinman wants to go back to 181 lines.

It is illegal to acquire land through the threat or use of force.

Yet you support the filistans in their endeavours along those lines, they publicly proclaim that they will not stop until Israel is destroyed and the Jews killed.

 

[Urbanguerrilla]

Perhaps, Pbel, you should have your good friend Abbas take a look at Edwin Black and what he has to say.

EDWIN BLACK ON C-SPAN: THE FARHUD: THE ROOTS OF THE ARAB-NAZI ALLIANCE DURING WWII??. |

Cooperation with the Nazi Intelligence Services

During the first days of fascist domination in Germany, the Zionists held a direct line to the fascist repression apparatus which developed into loose collaboration between the Zionist leadership and the terror organizations of the Nazi Reich (the Gestapo, SS, etc). Before 1933, the Zionist official, Leo Plaut, already "had a connection" with the political police and with the police official Oberregierungsrat Rudolf Diels (supposedly a schoolfriend of Plaut). When Diels was first appointed chief of the secret police in 1933, he retained his connection with Plaut. "Indeed Plaut even had the secret telephone number of Diels and could call him anytime."58 One can only speculate about the details of these contacts because the documents regarding them are kept under lock and key at the Yad-Vashem archives in Jerusalem. However, it is to be supposed that it was through these contacts that a meeting was arranged between the then Prussian Prime Minister Hermann Goering (later sentenced to death by the Nuremberg International Tribunal as a war criminal) and the leaders of German Jewish organizations. The meeting took place on March 26, 1933. Among the representatives of the Zionists taking part was the official, Kurt Blumenfeld, but he was silent about this episode in his memoirs.59

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