I <3 Joe Arpaio

[GotZoom]

A posse of 100 volunteers and sheriff's deputies will patrol the Phoenix area and arrest any illegal immigrants, the county sheriff said.

The group likely will be deployed across parts of Maricopa County by the weekend, Sheriff Joe Arpaio said Wednesday.

Volunteers will be drawn from the department's 3,000-member posse, whose members are trained and are often former deputies.

"It's important to send the message out to stay in Mexico and don't come roaming around here hoping you're going to get amnesty," said Arpaio, who in years past gained notoriety for putting inmates on chain gangs and issuing them striped uniforms and pink underwear.

Arpaio's deputies have already arrested about 120 illegal immigrants using a new state smuggling law.

"We're going to arrest any illegal who violates this new law," he said. "I'm not going to turn these people over to federal authorities so they can have a free ride back to Mexico. I'll give them a free ride into the county jail."

Under the law _ as interpreted by the Maricopa County attorney _ illegal immigrants can be arrested and prosecuted for conspiracy to smuggle themselves into the country. The law's authors have said they intended it to be used to prosecute smugglers, not the immigrants being smuggled.

Lawyers for nearly 50 undocumented immigrants charged with conspiracy to commit human smuggling have filed motions to have the charges dismissed.

A Los Angeles attorney brought into the case last week by the Mexican Consul General's Office in Phoenix plans to file another motion claiming Maricopa County Attorney officials are violating state and federal law because it's the federal government's job to control illegal immigration.

Both motions are to be argued in county court on May 23.

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/05/04/D8HD34RO0.html

 

[Diuretic]

From a purely legal perspective this

Under the law _ as interpreted by the Maricopa County attorney _ illegal immigrants can be arrested and prosecuted for conspiracy to smuggle themselves into the country. The law's authors have said they intended it to be used to prosecute smugglers, not the immigrants being smuggled.

is interesting. I'm wondering how it bumps up against the rule against self-incrimination.

There's also the issue of jurisdiction re the conspiracy. If the conspiracy occurs in Mexico and is carried out in the operation which then terminates in Arizona, for example, does Arizona (or the US for that matter) have jurisdiction?

Interesting read, thanks GotZoom.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

From a purely legal perspective this



is interesting. I'm wondering how it bumps up against the rule against self-incrimination.

There's also the issue of jurisdiction re the conspiracy. If the conspiracy occurs in Mexico and is carried out in the operation which then terminates in Arizona, for example, does Arizona (or the US for that matter) have jurisdiction?

Interesting read, thanks GotZoom.

Absolutely. If an asassination is conspired in Los Angeles and carried out in Sydney, Australia, does the Australian Federal Police have jurisdiction? You bet your ass it does. Jurisdiction is determined by where the the crime is committed, not conspired.

 

[Diuretic]

Thanks OTF - that's a good point. It's certainly the rule in Australia. Even though each of our states and territories is, legally speaking, as independent as a sovereign country (we're a federation), that rule applies. So if someone was murdered in Sydney and the conspiracy took place in LA or in Melbourne, the process would be the same. The conspirators would be sought for extradition, to be tried in New South Wales for conspiracy to murder.

So, following that yes, it must be the case that Az can seek extradition for the conspirators. Having said that I have to say I'm ignorant of US law on that point but I think more jurisdictions are accepting that in today's world putting up artificial barriers to fighting crime is counter-productive for everyone.

 

[jillian]

I'm not sure if we really want our country of immigrants to be known for jailing people who come here to find a better life.

Enforce the immigration laws....deport them.

But a year and a half of jail time...not for the smugglers who get paid for this, but for human beings?? Is that what we think we should be?

 

[CrimsonWhite]

I'm not sure if we really want our country of immigrants to be known for jailing people who come here to find a better life.

Enforce the immigration laws....deport them.

But a year and a half of jail time...not for the smugglers who get paid for this, but for human beings?? Is that what we think we should be?

All they have to do is follow the procees that all other immigrants have followed. These people have not and should be deported. Jailed? No. Just deport them without due process.

 

[Stephanie]

I'm not sure if we really want our country of immigrants to be known for jailing people who come here to find a better life.

Enforce the immigration laws....deport them.

But a year and a half of jail time...not for the smugglers who get paid for this, but for human beings?? Is that what we think we should be?

Oh Jilley. We all wish we could live in Utopia. Peace on earth, love thy neighbor. Don't overrnun another country because we extend a loving hand towards you, then bite the hand that supports you......The land of butterflies and roses everywhere, where we all frolic together and love and peace is eteranl. I see that in my dreams.
But my goodness, the real world wakes me up and slaps me smack in the face. But I say, why can't I stay in this dream state forever? It brings tears too my eyes. I think if only.
It's gotta be us, we're doing something wrong. Why, why. we the free people should feel so quilty, it's us who thier country is driving them over here, so, WE should be ASHAMED. HOW DARE US. WE ARE THE BAD ONE'S, THEIR GOVERMENT'S ARE THE GOOD ONE'S.. SHAME ON US.




Reality Bites.

 

[jillian]

Oh Jilley. We all wish we could live in Utopia. Peace on earth, love thy neighbor. Don't overrnun another country because we extend a loving hand towards you, then bite the hand that supports you......The land of butterflies and roses everywhere, where we all frolic together and love and peace is eteranl. I see that in my dreams.
But my goodness, the real world wakes me up and slaps me smack in the face.




Reality Bites.

No, Steffie, fear and anger bite. As I said, enforce existing immigration laws. Civilized society doesn't imprison people just because they come to have a better life.

 

[Stephanie]

No, Steffie, fear and anger bite. As I said, enforce existing immigration laws. Civilized society doesn't imprison people just because they come to have a better life.

Where are the prisons, Jilly?
We are all for LEGAL IMMIGARTION dear, not your bleeding heart way about things. Laws are Laws, we all have to live by them in the United States of America. Except if you an illegal accourding too you and all the illegals.

 

[jillian]

All they have to do is follow the procees that all other immigrants have followed. These people have not and should be deported. Jailed? No. Just deport them without due process.

Well, there's a certain (very) minimal level of due process due someone when they actually get *in* to the country. But I think we agree on this one.

 

[jillian]

Where are the prisons, Jilly?
We are all for LEGAL IMMIGARTION dear, not your bleeding heart way about things. Laws are Laws, we all have to live by them. Except if you an illegial accourding too you and all the illegials.

I'm not the one who wants guest workers so business can have cheap labor, hon. Talk to your president about it...he's the one who raised the issue. Maybe he's the one with the bleeding heart and not me.

 

[Stephanie]

I'm not the one who wants guest workers so business can have cheap labor, hon. Talk to your president about it...he's the one who raised the issue. Maybe he's the one with the bleeding heart and not me.

Nah, I have spoken to him lot's lately on this matter.

And you see how it's talk with YOUR PRESIDENT, about it. Jill you'r so transparent it's showing. You need to hide it better.

 

[jillian]

Nah, I have spoken too him lot's lately on this matter. But you just said you agree with him. So you can't back out now. Jilly agrees with Bushie
. oh...knos...........................................................................................

And you see how it's talk with YOUR PRESIDENT, about it. Jill you so transparent it's showing. You need too hide it better.

Where ya getting that from, sweetie? I think we should enforce existing laws. I'm not a corporatist, remember? :teeth:

and next time you speak to the dude, tell him for me that the glass isn't half full...it's one third full. :teeth:

oh...and it's "you're so transparent"...not "you" so transparent. (As long as you're in a pedantic mood this a.m.)

 

[Stephanie]

Where ya getting that from, sweetie? I think we should enforce existing laws. I'm not a corporatist, remember? :teeth:

Oh...and next time you speak to the dude, tell him for me that the glass isn't half full...it's one third full. :teeth:

oh...and it's "you're so transparent"...not "you" so transparent. (As long as you're in a pedantic mood this a.m.)

Oh, I'm so ashamed, I stand corrected............. Not...

 

[William Joyce]

Mexico needs to stay the fuck out of our law enforcement. I think we should bring action against THEM for dumping their losers on us. Send 'em the bill for the 12 million illegals' use of our social services. Then, when they don't pay, file a lawsuit against them.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

Well, there's a certain (very) minimal level of due process due someone when they actually get *in* to the country. But I think we agree on this one.

No we don't. I don't believe that illegal aliens have the right to due process. The Mexican Police did not show my friend "due process" when we were in Cancun last year. Our Constitutional protections don't extend to those that are trying to hijack them. There is a process to get into this country. Those that don't follow that process are not entitled to due process. Round 'em up and ship their asses south.

 

[jillian]

No we don't. I don't believe that illegal aliens have the right to due process. The Mexican Police did not show my friend "due process" when we were in Cancun last year. Our Constitutional protections don't extend to those that are trying to hijack them. There is a process to get into this country. Those that don't follow that process are not entitled to due process. Round 'em up and ship their asses south.

I wasn't stating what I *think* the law should be. I was stating the standard. The law is that once someone is *in*, they get entitled to a certain (very, very minimal) level of due process...usually administrative, usually summary, but process nonetheless.

Mexican police aren't known for being particularly nice guys. My husband and I enjoyed Cancun, but it wasn't someplace we would ever have wanted to have any trouble. Good food out on the Yucatan Peninsula, though. And Senor Frog's is cool. :alco:

 

[CrimsonWhite]

I wasn't stating what I *think* the law should be. I was stating the standard. The law is that once someone is *in*, they get entitled to a certain (very, very minimal) level of due process...usually administrative, usually summary, but process nonetheless.

The law needs to be changed.

 

[Diuretic]

No due process for illegals. Is that the purpose behind making the act of illegal immigration a sort of regulatory offence rather than a criminal offence? As I understand it the turnaround is quite simple when they're caught they get locked up by the Border Patrol and then taken back. But if it was made a criminal offence - I mean the illegal not the smugglers which quite rightly should be criminal and harking back to the conspiracy angle, should be amenable to extradition and trial in the US - then the due process provisions of the Constitution would have to apply which would complicate getting rid of the illegals. And that, it seems to me, would defeat the purpose.

 

[jillian]

The law needs to be changed.

Well, its fair that you think that. I can understand why you would. But the law is pretty well-settled and it doesn't seem that anyone is really fussing about it.

Maybe when you become a lawyer (I saw that you said that;s what you want to do on the intro thread) you can go to work for INS and streamline the system.

And just to give you an idea about the standard...it's a real minimal right of review, but it's there.

http://supreme.lp.findlaw.com/supreme_court/briefs/01-1491/01-1491.pet.usa.rep.pdf