How much is a fair share?

[Wiseacre]

Reagan and the two Bushes created 93% of the National Debt by lowering taxes for the rich.

Go to ReaganBushDebt.org

This effectively transferred $10 trillion dollars from the middle class taxpayer to the wealthy.

This is also the reason we have such a great disparity of wealth in America.

Total bullshit. From the link, showing how they calculated it:

" Starting in 2003, George W. Bush destroyed the world economy by encouraging U.S. banks to make loans to those who could not afford them, through schemes such as the "American Dream Downpayment Initiative", and through the destruction of oversight, such as lawsuits to prevent state securities laws from being enforced on Bush's watch. Once Bush's policies led to their inevitable result of economic collapse, the United States found itself in a situation where it had to take on debt in order to restore the economy.

This means that all of the money spent to restore the economy, until it is restored, is also attributable to George W. Bush. "


So all of Obama's big spending is Bush's fault. I wonder sometimes if you really believe this nonsense or you're just posting it to provoke somebody. If it's the latter, congrats, I'm provoked. And BTW, eitherway you're a fuckin' idiot.

 

[Chris]

Reagan and the two Bushes created 93% of the National Debt by lowering taxes for the rich.

Go to ReaganBushDebt.org

This effectively transferred $10 trillion dollars from the middle class taxpayer to the wealthy.

This is also the reason we have such a great disparity of wealth in America.

Total bullshit. From the link, showing how they calculated it:

" Starting in 2003, George W. Bush destroyed the world economy by encouraging U.S. banks to make loans to those who could not afford them, through schemes such as the "American Dream Downpayment Initiative", and through the destruction of oversight, such as lawsuits to prevent state securities laws from being enforced on Bush's watch. Once Bush's policies led to their inevitable result of economic collapse, the United States found itself in a situation where it had to take on debt in order to restore the economy.

This means that all of the money spent to restore the economy, until it is restored, is also attributable to George W. Bush. "


So all of Obama's big spending is Bush's fault. I wonder sometimes if you really believe this nonsense or you're just posting it to provoke somebody. If it's the latter, congrats, I'm provoked. And BTW, eitherway you're a fuckin' idiot.

I want to thank you for your service, and thank you for voting Republican.

Bush defunded the government with his tax cuts, so you won't be receiving your retirement benefits.

And since I make 100K a year, my taxes were lowered.

So by voting for Bush, you sacrificed your retirement benefits for my lower taxes.

Thanks!

 

[Wiseacre]

Reagan and the two Bushes created 93% of the National Debt by lowering taxes for the rich.

Go to ReaganBushDebt.org

This effectively transferred $10 trillion dollars from the middle class taxpayer to the wealthy.

This is also the reason we have such a great disparity of wealth in America.

Total bullshit. From the link, showing how they calculated it:

" Starting in 2003, George W. Bush destroyed the world economy by encouraging U.S. banks to make loans to those who could not afford them, through schemes such as the "American Dream Downpayment Initiative", and through the destruction of oversight, such as lawsuits to prevent state securities laws from being enforced on Bush's watch. Once Bush's policies led to their inevitable result of economic collapse, the United States found itself in a situation where it had to take on debt in order to restore the economy.

This means that all of the money spent to restore the economy, until it is restored, is also attributable to George W. Bush. "


So all of Obama's big spending is Bush's fault. I wonder sometimes if you really believe this nonsense or you're just posting it to provoke somebody. If it's the latter, congrats, I'm provoked. And BTW, eitherway you're a fuckin' idiot.

I want to thank you for your service, and thank you for voting Republican.

Bush defunded the government with his tax cuts, so you won't be receiving your retirement benefits.

And since I make 100K a year, my taxes were lowered.

So by voting for Bush, you sacrificed your retirement benefits for my lower taxes.

Thanks!

I highly doubt my retirement benefits are being sacrificed. Glad to hear your taxes went down, no doubt you earned your income and deserve to keep as much of it as possible. It's hard for me to understand why a person making 6 figures or more would seriously want their taxes raised to fund a gov't that is so wasteful and inefficient. It'd be one thing if they were spending our money wisely, on programs and policies that benefit everybody rather than democrat constituents over republican ones.

But such is not the case, and I think everyone knows it. I don't understand how you cannot see that the democrat's true reason for raising taxes is not to reduce the debt/deficits, but instead is just more money they can spend.

Nor do I understand why you do not see that the Bush tax cuts may have played a part in the economic growth the US experienced from 2003 until the housing bubble popped in late 2007/2008. To me, to suggest that the tax cuts had anything to do with the recession is ludricrous. Yes, the tax cuts did increase the national debt, but the increase was more due to the 2 wars and the Medicare Part D program. Bush43 AND the Congresses in session during his terms in office bear some responsibility for that, as does Obama for his actions thus far.

But to claim that he had to spend the extra money on the stimulus is false, and to place the blame for Obama's prolifigate spending onto Bush is total bullshit.

 

[Listening]

I want to thank you for your service, and thank you for voting Republican.

Bush defunded the government with his tax cuts, so you won't be receiving your retirement benefits.

And since I make 100K a year, my taxes were lowered.

So by voting for Bush, you sacrificed your retirement benefits for my lower taxes.

Thanks!

Can we assume that because of your large concern over the deficit that you took that "extra" money from tax savings along with some of your "rich" income and donated it to the IRS for the express purpose of paying down the debt ?

In reading your posts, you "sound" as if you are willing to make those extra sacrafices that we banal republicans won't.

Or is it possible that you claim all the deductions you can and keep as much of your money as possible (kinda like us banal republicans) ?

 

[The Rabbi]

I want to thank you for your service, and thank you for voting Republican.

Bush defunded the government with his tax cuts, so you won't be receiving your retirement benefits.

And since I make 100K a year, my taxes were lowered.

So by voting for Bush, you sacrificed your retirement benefits for my lower taxes.

Thanks!

Can we assume that because of your large concern over the deficit that you took that "extra" money from tax savings along with some of your "rich" income and donated it to the IRS for the express purpose of paying down the debt ?

In reading your posts, you "sound" as if you are willing to make those extra sacrafices that we banal republicans won't.

Or is it possible that you claim all the deductions you can and keep as much of your money as possible (kinda like us banal republicans) ?

You'll have to excuse Chris. He is like the autistic child of USMB, simply repeating the same campaign lines over and over.

 

[Ame®icano]

If we don't know what "fair share" is, how we can talk about solving the problem.

Left keep saying that what we have now is not fair.

OK, let's say it's not. So, tell us what would be fair.

More than that, why not discuss the issue of "fair" ?

Fair is not the objective of the Constitution.

Fair is not a measure I can really define.

Where is it written anyone has to pay their "fair share" ?

In my mind, what is fair to you and what is fair to me and what is fair to everyone else is as unique as we are as individuals. The best we can hope for is to clear the path so that we all the best input into the system we want to live under and hope against hope that the system we chose provides the best opportunity for all.

When you try to measure systems in terms of fairness, you take the conversation to a place were it can't possibly succeed.

I worry more about getting the lies out off the airwaves and motivating voters to actually get engaged than I do about fair. When people look around them and see what is going on and decide to get involved, I have every confidence that equity and fairness will the least of our worries.

As long as we have the large zombie voterhood created by the likes of the DailyKos and Rush Limbaugh........we should know we have a lot of work to do.

I agree that nowhere is written that anyone has to pay "fair share".

But if our President Zero keep saying that everyone has to pay it's "fair share", under everyone he includes only those who already paying taxes. Those who do not contribute a single dollar to enjoy all the government services created especially for them do not belong to category "everyone".

This thread has over 300 posts and left still refuse to explain what the "fair share" is.

For them, it's basically this:

Rich = anyone making more than me
Fair Share = looting anyone making more than me.

 

[bripat9643]

Two weeks into this thread... Left is not answering.

Top 1% pays 38% bottom 50% pays virtually nothing. Left claims it's not fair.

If that is not fair tell us what would be?

Probably the top 10% pays 100% the rest ride free and make money off their backs like de good slaves dey is.

If you ask the left how much is fair for the rich to pay, their answer will always be "more." They will never be satisfied. A parasite will suck off its host until it dies. That's the nature of a leach.

 

[bripat9643]

Two weeks into this thread... Left is not answering.

Top 1% pays 38% bottom 50% pays virtually nothing. Left claims it's not fair.

If that is not fair tell us what would be?

Probably the top 10% pays 100% the rest ride free and make money off their backs like de good slaves dey is.

Not only 100%, but then the parasites will be demanding twice as much.

 

[The T]

Two weeks into this thread... Left is not answering.

Top 1% pays 38% bottom 50% pays virtually nothing. Left claims it's not fair.

If that is not fair tell us what would be?

Probably the top 10% pays 100% the rest ride free and make money off their backs like de good slaves dey is.

If you ask the left how much is fair for the rich to pay, their answer will always be "more." They will never be satisfied. A parasite will suck off its host until it dies. That's the nature of a leach.

Where do they go when it dries up?

 

[bripat9643]

If you ask the left how much is fair for the rich to pay, their answer will always be "more." They will never be satisfied. A parasite will suck off its host until it dies. That's the nature of a leach.

Where do they go when it dries up?

Nowhere. They die.

Is that stupid and self-destructive? Yep, but whoever said leaches or leftists were smart?

 

[The T]

If you ask the left how much is fair for the rich to pay, their answer will always be "more." They will never be satisfied. A parasite will suck off its host until it dies. That's the nature of a leach.

Where do they go when it dries up?

Nowhere. They die.

Is that stupid and self-destructive? Yep, but whoever said leaches or leftists were smart?

Yep. They never bothered to look at the other side of the coin and self reliance...but then that wouldn't exist would it, as they killed those of us who followed it...they chose to drag us down too by thier short-sightedness.

But hey? They gave it a good shot...eh?

 

[Listening]

I agree that nowhere is written that anyone has to pay "fair share".

But if our President Zero keep saying that everyone has to pay it's "fair share", under everyone he includes only those who already paying taxes. Those who do not contribute a single dollar to enjoy all the government services created especially for them do not belong to category "everyone".

This thread has over 300 posts and left still refuse to explain what the "fair share" is.

For them, it's basically this:

Rich = anyone making more than me
Fair Share = looting anyone making more than me.

Great post.

If you look at it that way, the rich should be screaming the loudest. The rich don't use all the services that the government provides (in fact there are so few of them, they probably use very few). But those who pay no federal income tax seem to have no problem using them.

That seems a little unfair to me.

If I ask someone to babysit my kids and then tell them I should not have to pay them because I don't make enough, I am sure that I won't get many to sign up.

If I go to my neighbor and tell them I need a babysitter but they have to pay for it, I am sure they will just open up their checkbooks.

Now, If my mother died and I needed some help babysitting to take care of arrangments, I am sure that my neighbors would help out.

But, I keep going to the well, sooner or later it runs dry (and my mother can only die once).

Yes, the more I think about it, the more I think it is the rich (of which I am not one) whou should be yelling the loudest.

Again...great post.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

If we don't know what "fair share" is, how we can talk about solving the problem.

Left keep saying that what we have now is not fair.

OK, let's say it's not. So, tell us what would be fair.

More than that, why not discuss the issue of "fair" ?

Fair is not the objective of the Constitution.

Fair is not a measure I can really define.

Where is it written anyone has to pay their "fair share" ?

In my mind, what is fair to you and what is fair to me and what is fair to everyone else is as unique as we are as individuals. The best we can hope for is to clear the path so that we all the best input into the system we want to live under and hope against hope that the system we chose provides the best opportunity for all.

When you try to measure systems in terms of fairness, you take the conversation to a place were it can't possibly succeed.

I worry more about getting the lies out off the airwaves and motivating voters to actually get engaged than I do about fair. When people look around them and see what is going on and decide to get involved, I have every confidence that equity and fairness will the least of our worries.

As long as we have the large zombie voterhood created by the likes of the DailyKos and Rush Limbaugh........we should know we have a lot of work to do.

I agree that nowhere is written that anyone has to pay "fair share".

But if our President Zero keep saying that everyone has to pay it's "fair share", under everyone he includes only those who already paying taxes. Those who do not contribute a single dollar to enjoy all the government services created especially for them do not belong to category "everyone".

This thread has over 300 posts and left still refuse to explain what the "fair share" is.

For them, it's basically this:

Rich = anyone making more than me
Fair Share = looting anyone making more than me.

After all, to use the Liberal argument I've seen, don't those 50% that enjoy not paying any taxes enjoy having access to a fire department, police protection from cases like domestic abuse, PUBLIC education, PUBLIC water and sewer . . . oh and let's not forget (for some) PUBLIC housing. Shouldn't this same 50% make the same reasonable contribution we expect others to be making, for all that the government provides for them?

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

Two weeks into this thread... Left is not answering.

Top 1% pays 38% bottom 50% pays virtually nothing. Left claims it's not fair.

If that is not fair tell us what would be?

Probably the top 10% pays 100% the rest ride free and make money off their backs like de good slaves dey is.

If you ask the left how much is fair for the rich to pay, their answer will always be "more." They will never be satisfied. A parasite will suck off its host until it dies. That's the nature of a leach.

You'll notice it's the same response to all the problems they face: Obamacare, Social Security in financial crisis, the National Debt, The American Jobs Act . . . . the rich will cover the cost. After all it's always easier for others to spend what you don't have, that way you never appreciate the COST it takes to obtain what it is you need. Liberals love to take what is not theirs to supply what they can't, or WON'T, get for themselves. Of course if THEY have to lose something and learn about sacrifice, like cutting benefits or entitlements, you won't see a more hostile group of individuals.

Liberals: like the "spoiled" selfish child of rich parents. Spend and give them lots of "entitlements", and they always look to you for more. Begin to take something away, and they throw an aggressive tantrum (as if THEY have to, all of a sudden, come up with a way to pay for this new "lifestyle" on their own). After all it's all about me. Why can't I have the entitlements that I want?

 

[Listening]

After all, to use the Liberal argument I've seen, don't those 50% that enjoy not paying any taxes enjoy having access to a fire department, police protection from cases like domestic abuse, PUBLIC education, PUBLIC water and sewer . . . oh and let's not forget (for some) PUBLIC housing. Shouldn't this same 50% make the same reasonable contribution we expect others to be making, for all that the government provides for them?

Well, we made them poor and paying higher taxes is like your rosary (I guess).

But this 50% is deserving of your money. And you are not deserving of their assistance in paying for services they likey will use more of than you will.

Unbelievable.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

After all, to use the Liberal argument I've seen, don't those 50% that enjoy not paying any taxes enjoy having access to a fire department, police protection from cases like domestic abuse, PUBLIC education, PUBLIC water and sewer . . . oh and let's not forget (for some) PUBLIC housing. Shouldn't this same 50% make the same reasonable contribution we expect others to be making, for all that the government provides for them?

Well, we made them poor and paying higher taxes is like your rosary (I guess).

But this 50% is deserving of your money. And you are not deserving of their assistance in paying for services they likey will use more of than you will.

Unbelievable.

Last I checked, public education was free. We did not make those who reject this free public education, to wander the streets, poor. Nor those who refuse the road of discipline, the labor of hard work, or seeking to achieve a better life for themselves. People can move past the road of poverty, only if they have a growing desire to do so. Government becomes the "enabler" of poverty, even ALLOWING IT to continue through unending Government assistance that requires no effort or any form of accountability in return. We can not "coddle" those who refuse to work, but would rather simply live off whatever they can "suckle / nurse" off the government. There is a certain word called "personal responsibility" that we must all accept.

 

[Listening]

Last I checked, public education was free. We did not make those who reject this free public education, to wander the streets, poor. Nor those who refuse the road of discipline, the labor of hard work, or seeking to achieve a better life for themselves. People can move past the road of poverty, only if they have a growing desire to do so. Government becomes the "enabler" of poverty, even ALLOWING IT to continue through unending Government assistance that requires no effort or any form of accountability in return. We can not "coddle" those who refuse to work, but would rather simply live off whatever they can "suckle / nurse" off the government. There is a certain word called "personal responsibility" that we must all accept.

Unfortunately, what you described is what takes away the motivation.

I am afraid that I might find myself struggling to stay working if money kept showing up when I wasn't.

 

[Money]

You've got some growing up to do if you expect "fairness" in the tax system. You should start by reading some grown-up books about how the economy works and the role that taxes play, altogether.

If you go out and chase down big boy money you realize that unfair runs in that territory. That's why you only see broke asses trippin' about tax fairness. Most wealthy people don't have much to complain about in that regard.

 

[Listening]

You've got some growing up to do if you expect "fairness" in the tax system. You should start by reading some grown-up books about how the economy works and the role that taxes play, altogether.

If you go out and chase down big boy money you realize that unfair runs in that territory. That's why you only see broke asses trippin' about tax fairness. Most wealthy people don't have much to complain about in that regard.

Who are you addressing here ?

And maybe you could provide a list of recommended books instead of just suggesting they exist.

 

[Money]

You've got some growing up to do if you expect "fairness" in the tax system. You should start by reading some grown-up books about how the economy works and the role that taxes play, altogether.

If you go out and chase down big boy money you realize that unfair runs in that territory. That's why you only see broke asses trippin' about tax fairness. Most wealthy people don't have much to complain about in that regard.

Who are you addressing here ?

And maybe you could provide a list of recommended books instead of just suggesting they exist.

This is addressed to adults who expect "fairness" in the tax system.

I would start with high school economics textbooks.