How many years would it take to mine enough lithium to make enough batteries to replace all of the internal combustion engines in the world?

[Cardinal Carminative]

That's nice. Are you disputing the math that it takes 17 trillion kg of lithium to manufacture enough batteries to hold a charge of 110.7 tWh? Or are you disputing that the world consumes 65.1 million barrels of gasoline and diesel per day? Or are you disputing that you don't need enough battery storage to replace one day's of gasoline and diesel use? Or are you disputing that 110.7 tWh of electricity isn't the energy equivalent to 65.1 million barrels of oil?

Why do you expect me to answer any of your questions when you never answer any of mine?

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

The world needs more fossil fuels, not less.

You can be forgiven for being biased.

You are, of course, wrong.

I was on track to being where you are (fossil fuel) but I got diverted to the chemical industry. I understand that fascination with organics. I loved them. I find coal absolutely fascinating chemically.

But it's a horrible fuel.

Petroleum should be limited to a source of organic chemicals and/or polymers, but simply burning it to move cars around? That isn't a good fit anymore.

Some of us have kept up with the science and the view is changing from the days when you joined the world of petroleum.

You are not a chemist, you are not a toxicologist, you are not a climate scientist. You made your living drilling for the stuff. OF COURSE you see a need for more of it.

But you are a fossil. You are left behind by the advance of technology and science.

Sorry to break the news to you.

 

[ding]

Why do you expect me to answer any of your questions...

I don't because you have no answers for them.

The Utopian vision of replacing internal combustion engines with battery operated vehicles is not practical. I even showed you the math. You never even disputed the math.

Using 8 cubic miles of water to mine 17 trillion kg of lithium every 7 to 10 years is not practical. It's not going to happen.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Again... If the goal is to replace internal combustion engines which run on gasoline and diesel with battery operated vehicles, don't you need to have enough battery capacity to store one day's worth of gasoline and diesel use? And can't the storage medium requirement be easily calculated?

So it seems that you are the one who can't differentiate between a gas tank and gas.

Why don't you luddites step out of the way so that the world can advance? You seem to be really anti-development. Anti-R&D. I understand, the world has passed you by. You are no longer a viable part of the system. So you think the world should stop too.

Just enjoy your retirement and don't stand in the way of progress.

 

[ding]

You can be forgiven for being biased.

You are, of course, wrong.

I was on track to being where you are (fossil fuel) but I got diverted to the chemical industry. I understand that fascination with organics. I loved them. I find coal absolutely fascinating chemically.

But it's a horrible fuel.

Petroleum should be limited to a source of organic chemicals and/or polymers, but simply burning it to move cars around? That isn't a good fit anymore.

Some of us have kept up with the science and the view is changing from the days when you joined the world of petroleum.

You are not a chemist, you are not a toxicologist, you are not a climate scientist. You made your living drilling for the stuff. OF COURSE you see a need for more of it.

But you are a fossil. You are left behind by the advance of technology and science.

Sorry to break the news to you.

Spoken like a rich person who got their wealth in a society that used fossil fuels to build their wealth.

I guess the people in the African sub_Sahara can go fuck themselves as far as you are concerned.

 

[ding]

Why don't you luddites step out of the way so that the world can advance? You seem to be really anti-development. Anti-R&D. I understand, the world has passed you by. You are no longer a viable part of the system. So you think the world should stop too.

Just enjoy your retirement and don't stand in the way of progress.

I'd love to. Tell me what the plan is to produce 17 trillion kgs of lithium.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

I don't because you have no answers for them.

LOL.

The Utopian vision of replacing internal combustion engines with battery operated vehicles is not practical. I even showed you the math. You never even disputed the math.

Of course I haven't. Because I think your math is effectively meaningless to the actual discussion. It's the same thing people would have said in 1901 when cars were starting to replace more and more horses.

Using 8 cubic miles of water to mine 17 trillion kg of lithium every 7 to 10 years is not practical. It's not going to happen.

Not all Li is from evaporite deposits.

But if it offends you don't use any Li. Of course you can't, but you should. If you actually believe your concerns are real.

But more likely you're just hypocritically leveraging faux environmental concerns you don't even have. Remember: you drilled for OIL for a living. WHile it's a lot better than it used to be, it isn't great. And I suspect that for most of your career there was a big portion of that time where it was a lot worse.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Spoken like a rich person who got their wealth in a society that used fossil fuels to build their wealth.

Well, to be fair, unlike you, I actually live my beliefs. I've spent my money to try to do the right thing. You spend all your time counting your amazing bonuses and finding reasons to not take responsibility for what you did to make that money.

I guess the people in the African sub_Sahara can go fuck themselves as far as you are concerned.

Like you actually GIVE A FLYING F about them.

LOL.

This level of hypocrisy is the most sickening.

 

[ding]

Of course I haven't. Because I think your math is effectively meaningless to the actual discussion. It's the same thing people would have said in 1901 when cars were starting to replace more and more horses.

I'm glad you agree with my calculations.

Not all Li is from evaporite deposits.

But if it offends you don't use any Li. Of course you can't, but you should. If you actually believe your concerns are real.

But more likely you're just hypocritically leveraging faux environmental concerns you don't even have. Remember: you drilled for OIL for a living. WHile it's a lot better than it used to be, it isn't great. And I suspect that for most of your career there was a big portion of that time where it was a lot worse.

I think you need to look up how they mine lithium. And then multiply that times 177.

 

[ding]

Well, to be fair, unlike you, I actually live my beliefs. I've spent my money to try to do the right thing. You spend all your time counting your amazing bonuses and finding reasons to not take responsibility for what you did to make that money.

By arguing that poor regions shouldn't use fossil fuels to build wealth and raise their standard of living. You are an ogre.

Like you actually GIVE A FLYING F about them.

LOL.

This level of hypocrisy is the most sickening.

You are an ogre.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

I'm glad you agree with my calculations.

I think you are missing the point. Probably willfully because you have a serious troll streak. I am glad you took what little happiness you could find from completely missing my point.

I think you need to look up how they mine lithium. And then multiply that times 177.

Only SOME Li is mined from evaporite deposits.

Some come from hard rock mining.

I am getting so tired having to teach you basic mineralogy. I wish you had paid more attention in your earth science classes.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

By arguing that poor regions shouldn't use fossil fuels to build wealth and raise their standard of living. You are an ogre.

And by denying climate change you are damning them to a worse fate. So I guess that makes you a worse ogre.

You are an ogre.

At least I actually CARE ENOUGH ABOUT THIS TOPIC TO DO SOMETHING. Unlike you who simply wishes it would go away. And when it doesn't go away you fake like you care about the poor countries.

LOL.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

I'd love to. Tell me what the plan is to produce 17 trillion kgs of lithium.

Hmmm, how about you tell me how much oil has been pumped since Titusville. Then maybe we can have a conversation.

 

[ding]

I think you are missing the point. Probably willfully because you have a serious troll streak. I am glad you took what little happiness you could find from completely missing my point.

There is no point beyond the point that a Utopian vision of a fossil free world can't be done using battery technology.

I am getting so tired having to teach you basic mineralogy. I wish you had paid more attention in your earth science classes.

I'd actually prefer if you would teach me the plan for how your Utopian vision can become a reality.

Because pissing and moaning to the guy who did the math that shows it can't be done is not to blame for it not happening. Math is to blame,

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

There is no point beyond the point that a Utopian vision of a fossil free world can't be done using battery technology.

You are in the rearview mirror. Thanks for playing!

I'd actually prefer if you would teach me the plan for how your Utopian vision can become a reality.

I've tried but you don't understand how technology develops.

Because pissing and moaning to the guy who did the math that shows it can't be done is not to blame for it not happening. Math is to blame,

You can think you have a big point here. But like I said, you're the past. Nice to know you. Thanks for the gasoline. Now bye!

 

[ding]

And by denying climate change you are damning them to a worse fate. So I guess that makes you a worse ogre.

I'm pretty sure I'm not to blame for your failed Utopian vision. And I bet they would gladly change places with you. That way you can live their low carbon footprint life and they can lead your high carbon footprint life.

At least I actually CARE ENOUGH ABOUT THIS TOPIC TO DO SOMETHING. Unlike you who simply wishes it would go away. And when it doesn't go away you fake like you care about the poor countries.

Don't blame the guy who did the math proving to you that your Utopian vision won't be coming true. Blame the math.

 

[ding]

Hmmm, how about you tell me how much oil has been pumped since Titusville. Then maybe we can have a conversation.

Why? What does that have to do with needing 8 cubic miles of water and 17 trillion kg of lithium every 8 years or so for your Utopian vision to come true?

 

[Sunsettommy]

Sure ... as long as you think it's environmentally sound to burn as much coal as we have to in order to power these EVs ...

That's 8 cubic miles IF AND ONLY IF we make all these batteries all at once ... if we spread this out over ... say 80,000 years ... then we just need to shut down the Ballagio and we'll have all the water we need ... mathing ...

I am not a big fan of Coal either and humans waste a lot of energy from bad building plans overuse of streetlights inefficient heating units to poor housing plans and more.

Humans will NOT exist after 500 years.

 

[ding]

You are in the rearview mirror. Thanks for playing!

I can't believe it took me this long to run you off. I must be slipping.

I've tried but you don't understand how technology develops.

I've forgotten more technology in my 37 years as a practicing engineer than you ever knew.

You can think you have a big point here. But like I said, you're the past. Nice to know you. Thanks for the gasoline. Now bye!

I think my only point is that it takes 8 cubic miles of water and 17 trillion kg of lithium every 7 to 10 years to replace our present fossil fuel use in internal combustion engines which is 177 times more lithium than they mined in 2021.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Why? What does that have to do with needing 8 cubic miles of water and 17 trillion kg of lithium every 8 years or so for your Utopian vision to come true?

You wouldn't understand. I'll save my typing.