How do you expand the middle class

[Nosmo King]

Entreprenuers, corporations, small businesses, etc. Not government. Government doesn't create jobs, they buy them with our money.

Folks in construction, engineering and transportation tend to disagree. New infrastructure means new jobs. Someone has to design and build it and once it's built, infrastructure plays a key role in development.

And if the very well capitalized private sector refuses to pump that money back into America, the government has to.

The question is: if the private sector is holding so much capital, why aren't they circulating in through our economy?

Remind me how refurbishing unused train stations and building airports no one uses play a key role in the economy.
The role of the private sector is not to "circulate money through the economy" (whatever the hell that means). It is to engage in profitable business. This isnt happening due to gov't policies of increased taxes and regulation.

Engaging in business is circulating money through the economy! When anyone buys something, there is an EXCHANGE OF CAPITAL which means that money is circulating. When the money is simply held or divvied up so the fattest chunk goes to a very small minority, or when that money is sent overseas, it no longer makes for economic growth. It only results in stagnation.

 

[editec]

If any of you (and it looks like there are many here) believe that the answer to expanding the middle class has to do with tinkering with the educational system. I'm here to tell you you are just flat out wrong.

While it is certainly true that more/better/different ED can change the fate for an individual, it cannot change the fate of our class.

Per usual many of you have difficulty understanding that micro economics and macro economics do not have the same laws, do not work the same and the solutions for individuals have little to nothing to do with the solutions to aggregate economic problems.

 

[zeke]

Yes, there were jobs created building the Interstate Highway System, Dams, federal buildings, etc., but they were all temporary jobs, and they were a drop in the bucket for jobs needed in the USA. The economic engine of America is the private sector. It is now, it has always been so, and it will always be so.

The best paying jobs in America, excluding sports and the entertainment industry, are provided by large evil corporations. The businesses you left wingers love to hate.

Government can spend Billions, and create a few jobs for a few people. The rest, even the ones paying for those few jobs for others, have to survive and prosper without aid from the government.

Oh come on. You mean that there are no truckers that use the Interstate System that have not made their living on those roads all their lives? You mean that the present companies that build computers and create software provide no jobs? After all, both got there start as government projects.

As for the rest of us having no aid from the government, where do you live, in Somolia? The food you eat, the water you drink, the air you breathe, all are regulated by the government because private companies proved they would poison you if it made them a profit.

You want no government? Move to another nation.

Those truckers were using the roads before the interstate system was ever dreamed of, and would be using the roads if the federal interstate system did not exist. The USA became the arsenal of democracy that fed and equiped the allied armies, and managed to do it without an interstate highway system. Imagine that!

Americans were drinking water, breathing air, and eating food, before any government regulations existed. How in the hell did they manage that without the paternal hand of government patting their little heads?

However, like any good little liberal stooge, you changed the subject from government providing jobs, to another false premise on the absolute need of government in every aspect of our lives. The concept of the ever shifting debate protects liberals from having to confront the obvious contradictions in their dumbass beliefs.

Yea. I like lead in my air, PCB's in my drinking water and please, leave the dangerous pathogens on my food. I like not knowing if I will get sick from what I eat.

You are a fuking idiot dude.

btw, you have ANY idea about why Eisenhower wanted to build the Interstate hwy system?

 

[zeke]

The only way we will increase the numbers called the "middle class" is if we reduce the income thresh hold that is used to define "middle class."

In case anyone missed it. Those good paying manufacturing jobs that made the middle class, are gone.
And they ain't coming back.

Accept the declining standard of living that is occurring. It ain't so bad. Just read a couple of threads about how good a welfare recipient has it. And of course, everyone now knows that the real rich have been kicking ass on income.

Be rich or be poor. But the middle is shrinking fast and will not be growing anytime soon. If ever.
It's hard enough just to hold your ground if you are already in the middle.

 

[Nosmo King]

If any of you (and it looks like there are many here) believe that the answer to expanding the middle class has to do with tinkering with the educational system. I'm here to tell you you are just flat out wrong.

While it is certainly true that more/better/different ED can change the fate for an individual, it cannot change the fate of our class.

Per usual many of you have difficulty understanding that micro economics and macro economics do not have the same laws, do not work the same and the solutions for individuals have little to nothing to do with the solutions to aggregate economic problems.

Gee! I wonder how the G.I. Bill impacted our economy? Putting thousands more through college did wonders as we faced a rapidly technological world after WW II. Certainly our knowledge base should be expanded in order to remain competitive. Why do Conservatives eschew smarts so much? Why would Conservatives dismiss education out of hand so easily? Certainly some Conservatives have benefitted from their educational opportunities. Unless Conservatives feel that dumbing down the American work place would result in higher incomes. But how on earth can that possibly be so?

 

[candycorn]

That wasn't what I said. That's irrelevant to what I said.
You are one stupid broad.

Here is what you said:

What has happened to the starting salaries of all college grads over the last 20 years?

The graph shows what has happened; they have remained superior to those with less education. I imagine as one who has less education that pisses you off, ***.

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

 

[candycorn]

If any of you (and it looks like there are many here) believe that the answer to expanding the middle class has to do with tinkering with the educational system. I'm here to tell you you are just flat out wrong.

While it is certainly true that more/better/different ED can change the fate for an individual, it cannot change the fate of our class.

Per usual many of you have difficulty understanding that micro economics and macro economics do not have the same laws, do not work the same and the solutions for individuals have little to nothing to do with the solutions to aggregate economic problems.

Gee! I wonder how the G.I. Bill impacted our economy? Putting thousands more through college did wonders as we faced a rapidly technological world after WW II. Certainly our knowledge base should be expanded in order to remain competitive. Why do Conservatives eschew smarts so much? Why would Conservatives dismiss education out of hand so easily? Certainly some Conservatives have benefitted from their educational opportunities. Unless Conservatives feel that dumbing down the American work place would result in higher incomes. But how on earth can that possibly be so?

Obviously the most profane posters on this board are the ones with the most limited vocabularies...LGS and Rabid are prime examples. It speaks to not only a lack of education but a lack of civility one doesn't necessarily learns through education but one understands through study.

 

[The Rabbi]

Here is what you said:


The graph shows what has happened; they have remained superior to those with less education. I imagine as one who has less education that pisses you off, ***.

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

OK so you were responding to some other post and just linked mine for some reason known only to yourself.
Obviously we have too many college grads because their unemployment rate is over 40%.

 

[The Rabbi]

If any of you (and it looks like there are many here) believe that the answer to expanding the middle class has to do with tinkering with the educational system. I'm here to tell you you are just flat out wrong.

While it is certainly true that more/better/different ED can change the fate for an individual, it cannot change the fate of our class.

Per usual many of you have difficulty understanding that micro economics and macro economics do not have the same laws, do not work the same and the solutions for individuals have little to nothing to do with the solutions to aggregate economic problems.

Gee! I wonder how the G.I. Bill impacted our economy? Putting thousands more through college did wonders as we faced a rapidly technological world after WW II. Certainly our knowledge base should be expanded in order to remain competitive. Why do Conservatives eschew smarts so much? Why would Conservatives dismiss education out of hand so easily? Certainly some Conservatives have benefitted from their educational opportunities. Unless Conservatives feel that dumbing down the American work place would result in higher incomes. But how on earth can that possibly be so?

Obviously the most profane posters on this board are the ones with the most limited vocabularies...LGS and Rabid are prime examples. It speaks to not only a lack of education but a lack of civility one doesn't necessarily learns through education but one understands through study.

I speak to people based on how they need to be spoken to.

And I have many years more of education than you ever dreamed about.

 

[Defiant1]

Here is what you said:


The graph shows what has happened; they have remained superior to those with less education. I imagine as one who has less education that pisses you off, ***.

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

Why do you insist on putting people into classes or labeling people? We don't do that in this country.

We need to forget about class or strata and just let people get on with their lives.

If you want more money or more expensive things, work for them. Make plans for your own future.

If you have already made some bad decisions that make attaining your dreams and goals difficult that's your problem not mine. Deal with it.

From most of your posts it seems you are doing ok in life. Why are you worried about others who are struggling because they have made choices believing everything would be handed to them?

 

[bendog]

I don't think the issue is college grads or non-grads. Though college grads have only about a 4% unemployment rate, but still a lot are working as waiters and baristas. Nor is it "hard work," because life is not fair and the hardest working are as often as not low wage ... as in yard man in summer.

Not all people are college material, or even tech school. We will always have lower skilled people because of this fact of life. However, the "plan" of the Fed, or the trilateralists, or the Elders of Zion, or whichever term one chooses to lable or blame for simple market economics in a global economy, is for the dollar to basically devalue. We are the only superpower, but nothing like that lasts forever. Nor, is it necessarily a good thing, e.g. BushII's disaster of hubris in Iraq.

With the dollar having less value against other currencies, it will be cheaper to build things here. The hope is manufacturing will increase. We'll not see the boom of the 50's and 60's in Detroit, because we won't have a situation whereby a WAR (in caps as opposed to Bushii's hubris) left us the only intact economy. But, there's reason to hope our kids will have as good, if not better, lives than we have.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Here is what you said:


The graph shows what has happened; they have remained superior to those with less education. I imagine as one who has less education that pisses you off, ***.

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

so just how many waiters with bachelor degrees do we need.....?

right now we have an overabundance of college grads looking for work....so it's obvious that education is not the only answer.....it is only a piece of the solution by helping to provide the innovation needed for a growing future....

the only way we are going to help the middle class is to get the damn government out of the way...

education - more government control is definitely not the answer
regulations - we are drowning in regulations - this prevents startups and expansion
taxes - too much especially for the smaller businesses
capital - will continue to sit on the sidelines or go elsewhere unless the above improve
leadership - Democrats are leading us into socialism...which by definition destroys the middle class and chokes the economy

 

[bendog]

Focusing on college decrees is not addressing the issue

44% of Young College Grads Are Underemployed (and That's Good News) - Jordan Weissmann - The Atlantic

 

[candycorn]

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

OK so you were responding to some other post and just linked mine for some reason known only to yourself.
Obviously we have too many college grads because their unemployment rate is over 40%.

The thread of the title is expanding the middle class; your diversions about "starting pay compared to 20 years ago" is a sideshow.

You're simply making up the 40% unemployment number.

 

[candycorn]

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

Why do you insist on putting people into classes or labeling people? We don't do that in this country.

We need to forget about class or strata and just let people get on with their lives.

If you want more money or more expensive things, work for them. Make plans for your own future.

If you have already made some bad decisions that make attaining your dreams and goals difficult that's your problem not mine. Deal with it.

From most of your posts it seems you are doing ok in life. Why are you worried about others who are struggling because they have made choices believing everything would be handed to them?

That was perhaps the saddest post ever.

 

[candycorn]

Damn are you playing dumb or are you the genuine article? I suspect you really are brain damaged in some way and unable to understand a logical argument.
I didnt ask about college grads vs non grads. I asked about college grads in the past vs college grads now. And I would bet money starting salaries have declined as the market is saturated with idiots holding BAs who are unable to read and understand a simple sentence. Like you.

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

so just how many waiters with bachelor degrees do we need.....?

right now we have an overabundance of college grads looking for work....so it's obvious that education is not the only answer.....it is only a piece of the solution by helping to provide the innovation needed for a growing future....

the only way we are going to help the middle class is to get the damn government out of the way...

education - more government control is definitely not the answer
regulations - we are drowning in regulations - this prevents startups and expansion
taxes - too much especially for the smaller businesses
capital - will continue to sit on the sidelines or go elsewhere unless the above improve
leadership - Democrats are leading us into socialism...which by definition destroys the middle class and chokes the economy

Politically speaking, educated persons seem to support Democrats far more than Republicans. Maybe "the smart ones" as you call them know something you don't?

 

[candycorn]

I don't think the issue is college grads or non-grads. Though college grads have only about a 4% unemployment rate, but still a lot are working as waiters and baristas. Nor is it "hard work," because life is not fair and the hardest working are as often as not low wage ... as in yard man in summer.

Not all people are college material, or even tech school. We will always have lower skilled people because of this fact of life. However, the "plan" of the Fed, or the trilateralists, or the Elders of Zion, or whichever term one chooses to lable or blame for simple market economics in a global economy, is for the dollar to basically devalue. We are the only superpower, but nothing like that lasts forever. Nor, is it necessarily a good thing, e.g. BushII's disaster of hubris in Iraq.

With the dollar having less value against other currencies, it will be cheaper to build things here. The hope is manufacturing will increase. We'll not see the boom of the 50's and 60's in Detroit, because we won't have a situation whereby a WAR (in caps as opposed to Bushii's hubris) left us the only intact economy. But, there's reason to hope our kids will have as good, if not better, lives than we have.

No question about it; we need to stress the skills and trades more than we've done. The idea about having the last 2 years of high school be available to technical education was a good one.

 

[candycorn]

Gee! I wonder how the G.I. Bill impacted our economy? Putting thousands more through college did wonders as we faced a rapidly technological world after WW II. Certainly our knowledge base should be expanded in order to remain competitive. Why do Conservatives eschew smarts so much? Why would Conservatives dismiss education out of hand so easily? Certainly some Conservatives have benefitted from their educational opportunities. Unless Conservatives feel that dumbing down the American work place would result in higher incomes. But how on earth can that possibly be so?

Obviously the most profane posters on this board are the ones with the most limited vocabularies...LGS and Rabid are prime examples. It speaks to not only a lack of education but a lack of civility one doesn't necessarily learns through education but one understands through study.

I speak to people based on how they need to be spoken to.

And I have many years more of education than you ever dreamed about.

You're a profane loser who spends all day on a message board following your betters around looking for a fight.

 

[bendog]

[


No question about it; we need to stress the skills and trades more than we've done. The idea about having the last 2 years of high school be available to technical education was a good one.

Both "liberal" and "conservatife" sites have had stories on how brick and morter colleges cannot survive, at least like we see now. Technology allows for lectures to be streamed, and social media will allow individual time with instructors like the old "office hours" and "after class." There is a larger opportunity to cheat by hiring ringers to write a paper or take a test, though. And, there will always be a hands on component. You can't teach how to pull a transmission out of a car or how to present a legal argumrne or sales presentation without some actual face time.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

The point of the thread being expanding the middle class...

It is better to have too much education than too little as common sense, logic, every study ever conducted, and the graph above points out.

A culture can't have too many college graduates.

so just how many waiters with bachelor degrees do we need.....?

right now we have an overabundance of college grads looking for work....so it's obvious that education is not the only answer.....it is only a piece of the solution by helping to provide the innovation needed for a growing future....

the only way we are going to help the middle class is to get the damn government out of the way...

education - more government control is definitely not the answer
regulations - we are drowning in regulations - this prevents startups and expansion
taxes - too much especially for the smaller businesses
capital - will continue to sit on the sidelines or go elsewhere unless the above improve
leadership - Democrats are leading us into socialism...which by definition destroys the middle class and chokes the economy

Politically speaking, educated persons seem to support Democrats far more than Republicans. Maybe "the smart ones" as you call them know something you don't?

bwahahaha....

your 'educated' liberal pinheads can come out of their ivory tower now....their stupid methods have been proven wrong....once again....

else why would we be having this discussion in the first place....?