Zone1 Hebrews 1:8 says Jesus is God

[hobelim]

And shame on you - you may be better off having a millstone tied around your neck and thrown into the Abyss than to fool the innocent children of the world.

Sound familiar?

Sure It sounds like something Jesus was saying to you. You openly promote idolatry as good, what God has forbidden under penalty of death, effectively murdering the pure life in children by aborting the natural evolution of the human mind, indoctrinating them when they are young and malleable with threats of real and imaginary punishment effectively brainwashing them into adopting the superstitious and irrational belief that the way to eternal life is brazenly defying the Law of God and openly desecrating the teachings of Jesus. A ******* lie.

Then, going from bad to worse, you teach them that any rational objection that arises in their own mind to the vile and loathsome crap that you crammed down their throats is a Satanic assault against their "faith" which sets the mind against itself putting them into a state of cognitive dissonance, an artificially induced state of mind that resembles a very deep sleep. Then once possessed, they are ritually slaughtered every day of their abject lives.

Seriously. Whatever you profess to believe you are doing at Mass, what is actually happening is a demonic coven of the young and old, male and female, parents and children, friends and neighbors, all embroiled in an obscene and perverse orgy of sin displaying a deep seated and open hatred for the God of Jesus, worshiping a trinity, and desecrating the teachings of Christ by eating a matzo made by human hands and shitting it out of your funky ass.

Now try and think real hard.

You have allowed Satan to enter your mind to perpetuate obvious lies even infecting children with your deadly poison ******* up their minds and lives, many for life. I am speaking the irrefutable truth, showing where right and wrong and judgment lie, restoring sanity, life itself, to many dead murdered by your historically bloody Church.

Who do you think Jesus would be telling to find a millstone now?

 

[hobelim]

Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,and teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the world.”

You might not realize this but to Jesus, his disciples, followers, and the unknown authors of the gospels who witnessed the destruction of Judea, their way of life, and the enslavement exile and ruthless slaughter of hundreds of thousands of innocent Jewish men women and children "the nations" were the enemy....



"I have not come to bring peace but a sword"

"From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations"

"Take this cup of wine and drink it, all of you. This is a cup of my blood, the blood of the covenant"

"Take from my hand this cup of fiery wine and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. When they have drunk it they will vomit and go mad; such is the sword that I am sending among them"

“Then tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, says: Drink, get drunk and vomit, and fall to rise no more because of the sword I will send among you.’ But if they refuse to take the cup from your hand and drink, tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty says: You must drink it! See, I am beginning to bring disaster on the city that bears my Name, and will you indeed go unpunished? You will not go unpunished, for I am calling down a sword on all who live on the earth, declares the Lord Almighty.’

"Just art thou, in these thy judgments, thou Holy One who art and wast; for they shed the blood of thy people and of thy prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink."



The sword is clearly identified as a curse under the appearance of a cup of wine. Still works like a charm! Your vile and contaminating unclean words, obscene and degrading practices, and murderous deeds are the proof!

 

[hobelim]

The Apostle, Simon became Peter (Meaning rock) The First Pope of the Church.

Bullshit. There was no such thing as a Pope until 325ce. Do you dispute that your practice of seeking spiritual life on your knees from something made by human hands is expressly forbidden by God? Yes? Okey dokey.

Anyway I would like to extend my sincere thanks to you for helping me to openly reveal the wisdom of my God in giving the command to refrain from "the flesh" of anything that crawls on its belly by openly demonstrating for the world to see the terrifying and deeply disturbing death, a curse, for setting that clear and simple instruction aside.

Well done!

 

[Ace Nova]

Although this conversation has by far exceeded the amount of time or effort it is worth - out of respect, I will go against what Jesus taught:

Matthew 7:

Do Not Profane Sacred Things.“Do not give to dogs anything that is holy. And do not cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet and then proceed to tear you to pieces.

(Jesus stresses the point that teaching should be given in accordance with the spiritual capacity of the learners)

Read it carefully for I will not state this again:

There is no such thing as the "Mythras Cross" in Roman mythraism - if there ever was an isolated Mithras cult in Rome that used the cross then they borrowed it from Christianity or somehwere else.

Why?

BECAUSE MYTHRAS WAS NOT CRUCIFIED or suffered death because he was considered invincible the Roman cults. The major symbol of Roman Mithraism is the Tauroctomy. The two religions (cults) had nearly the OPPOSITE foundational beliefs - they could not have been more different.

One had a partially divine being who was a poor, humble, carpenter who gave the gift of divine wisdom to his followers - to the point of torture and crucifixion - so that his followers could understand the true meaning of life. THE TRUTH

The other had an invincibile super hero figure slice the neck of the "Bull of Heaven" so that the blood and body of the Bull could bring forth a new world.

One is based on a perfect human being becoming martyred so that his followers could overcome the ways of this world - exemplifying SELFLESSNESS, LOVE, MERCY, SACRIFICE and JUSTICE for the greater good.

The other is based on a demi-god rebelling against divine law by killing a divine being,so that a "new world" would form - exemplifying GREED, LUST, MURDER, REBELLION and WRATH.

This is the truth.

I have studied ancient Mithrasism in depth - both the Roman and Persian religions.

If what I stated above is not clear as day, you are beyond your spiritual capacity of understanding within this conversation.
I will not revisit this conversation again.

 

[hobelim]

There is no such thing as the "Mythras Cross" in Roman mythraism - if there ever was an isolated Mithras cult in Rome that used the cross then they borrowed it from Christianity or somehwere else.

"Mithra was said to have celebrated a Last Supper with followers, who represented the twelve signs of the zodiac. In memory of this, his worshippers partook of a sacramental meal of bread marked with the Mithran cross of light.

 

[hobelim]

I will not revisit this conversation again.

Promises promises. Consider yourself defrocked. You suck at acting. Maybe you should tap dance for nickels?

But don't get me wrong. I do not dispute that you are having a deep and profound spiritual experience every time you brazenly defy the Law of God at mass, its just not a very good one, dying every time you turn to a cracker for spiritual life, derp, never finding peace in death, descending deeper into hell week after week after week. Whee!

Enjoy!

 

[Ace Nova]

Sure It sounds like something Jesus was saying to you. You openly promote idolatry as good, what God has forbidden under penalty of death, effectively murdering the pure life in children by aborting the natural evolution of the human mind, indoctrinating them when they are young and malleable with threats of real and imaginary punishment effectively brainwashing them into adopting the superstitious and irrational belief that the way to eternal life is brazenly defying the Law of God and openly desecrating the teachings of Jesus. A ******* lie.

Then, going from bad to worse, you teach them that any rational objection that arises in their own mind to the vile and loathsome crap that you crammed down their throats is a Satanic assault against their "faith" which sets the mind against itself putting them into a state of cognitive dissonance, an artificially induced state of mind that resembles a very deep sleep. Then once possessed, they are ritually slaughtered every day of their abject lives.

Seriously. Whatever you profess to believe you are doing at Mass, what is actually happening is a demonic coven of the young and old, male and female, parents and children, friends and neighbors, all embroiled in an obscene and perverse orgy of sin displaying a deep seated and open hatred for the God of Jesus, worshiping a trinity, and desecrating the teachings of Christ by eating a matzo made by human hands and shitting it out of your funky ass.

Now try and think real hard.

You have allowed Satan to enter your mind to perpetuate obvious lies even infecting children with your deadly poison ******* up their minds and lives, many for life. I am speaking the irrefutable truth, showing where right and wrong and judgment lie, restoring sanity, life itself, to many dead murdered by your historically bloody Church.

Who do you think Jesus would be telling to find a millstone now?

You might not realize this but to Jesus, his disciples, followers, and the unknown authors of the gospels who witnessed the destruction of Judea, their way of life, and the enslavement exile and ruthless slaughter of hundreds of thousands of innocent Jewish men women and children "the nations" were the enemy....



"I have not come to bring peace but a sword"

"From his mouth there went a sharp sword with which to smite the nations"

"Take this cup of wine and drink it, all of you. This is a cup of my blood, the blood of the covenant"

"Take from my hand this cup of fiery wine and make all the nations to whom I send you drink it. When they have drunk it they will vomit and go mad; such is the sword that I am sending among them"

“Then tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, says: Drink, get drunk and vomit, and fall to rise no more because of the sword I will send among you.’ But if they refuse to take the cup from your hand and drink, tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty says: You must drink it! See, I am beginning to bring disaster on the city that bears my Name, and will you indeed go unpunished? You will not go unpunished, for I am calling down a sword on all who live on the earth, declares the Lord Almighty.’

"Just art thou, in these thy judgments, thou Holy One who art and wast; for they shed the blood of thy people and of thy prophets and thou hast given them blood to drink."



The sword is clearly identified as a curse under the appearance of a cup of wine. Still works like a charm! Your vile and contaminating unclean words, obscene and degrading practices, and murderous deeds are the proof!

THE LORD REBUKE YOU.

Bullshit. There was no such thing as a Pope until 325ce. Do you dispute that your practice of seeking spiritual life on your knees from something made by human hands is expressly forbidden by God? Yes? Okey dokey.

Anyway I would like to extend my sincere thanks to you for helping me to openly reveal the wisdom of my God in giving the command to refrain from "the flesh" of anything that crawls on its belly by openly demonstrating for the world to see the terrifying and deeply disturbing death, a curse, for setting that clear and simple instruction aside.

Well done!

The first Pope was Peter and the Church had Bishops in various areas between the first and second century.

As for the rest of your nonsense:

THE LORD REBUKE YOU.

 

[hobelim]

The first Pope was Peter and the Church had Bishops in various areas between the first and second century.

No. Peter was never called pope or father like the pope and all you pretentious priests by anyone ever. Peter never tried to deceive the gullible, even children, by pretending to stand in the place of God. Who does that?

"And do not call anyone on earth `father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven." Matthew 23:10

THE LORD REBUKE YOU.

Grrrrrr!

Now that's funny. What lord are you referring to? The lord of darkness, a trinity that doesn't exist, the antichrist? You are an idolator. You died decades ago in the very day you first got down on your knees to worship a matzo.

Now **** off.

I rebuke you.



"There is no darkness greater than the darkness in the soul of a dead person whose only light in life is a lie."

Hobelim 3:14

 

[Cougarbear]

One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. Although the Catholic Church cannot officially welcome non Catholic Christian Churches - they welcome all Christians who have been baptized in The Name of the Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit and consider themselves Christian.

You are welcomed in most Roman Catholic Churches around the world to practice your faith. As it is for Catholics who have strayed from the Church for an extended period of time, the Church asks that you do not perform the sacrament of Holy Communion - but many parishes welcome you to attend the line and to receive a blessing by crossing your arms.

The Catholic Church believes that all who believe in God and consider themselves Christian are part of the Church.

ONE Holy (Complete) Catholic (Universal) and Apostolic Church. So if you profess your faith as a Christian you are considered brothers and sisters in faith by most Catholics.

The Apostle, Simon became Peter (Meaning rock) The First Pope of the Church. Popes are considered to be like Peter - the leader of the Apostles and leader of the Church established by ministry of Jesus Christ. Then there are hundreds of Cardinals and Bishops worldwide who lead regional areas - with priests, brothers, monks and deacons leading parishes and schools.

You didn’t answer the question. Being like something isn’t the something. The Popes themselves say they aren’t prophets and apostles are prophets. This is why the Lord said many would say Lord, Lord look what I’ve done and been, let me in to heaven. And the Lord will say I never knew you. Being “like” an apostle or prophet is nothing more than a counterfeit. So, almost everything the RCC teaches in their doctrine and does in their ordinances have been changed and polluted because the change didn’t come from apostles and prophets, the foundation. Just where did the 2nd commandment go about worshipping idols? Just one thing.
But, I’m open again to you explaining how the RCC or any other Protestant, Eastern Orthodox Christian church can be the one true church without the foundation with apostles and prophets?

 

[Ace Nova]

"Mithra was said to have celebrated a Last Supper with followers, who represented the twelve signs of the zodiac. In memory of this, his worshippers partook of a sacramental meal of bread marked with the Mithran cross of light.


View attachment 1106192View attachment 1106193View attachment 1106194

The first symbol is a traditional symbol used within the Zodiac - denotes North - South - East and West. The image was likely created hundreds of years after the advent of Christianity.

When you post images from Zeitegist - a source known for a conspiracy theory documentary created by a bunch of late teenagers, which has been openly rebuked and debunked by every credible historian on the planet - this is the garbage that you get.

The second image is from a website that is describing THE EARLY CHRISTIAN CHURCH.

Be careful when posting images that state the opposite of what you are implying - it's not a good look and when you are as stubborn and as adamant as you are about your posts - you could be considered a Liar.

 

[hobelim]

when you are as stubborn and as adamant as you are about your posts - you could be considered a Liar.

Says the guy who claims that the way to eternal life is by doing what God has forbidden under penalty of death. You support the evil practice of murdering the minds of children only to rob them for life. You're a genuine ghoul.

Who do you think you are fooling?

 

[Ace Nova]

You didn’t answer the question. Being like something isn’t the something. The Popes themselves say they aren’t prophets and apostles are prophets. This is why the Lord said many would say Lord, Lord look what I’ve done and been, let me in to heaven. And the Lord will say I never knew you. Being “like” an apostle or prophet is nothing more than a counterfeit. So, almost everything the RCC teaches in their doctrine and does in their ordinances have been changed and polluted because the change didn’t come from apostles and prophets, the foundation. Just where did the 2nd commandment go about worshipping idols? Just one thing.
But, I’m open again to you explaining how the RCC or any other Protestant, Eastern Orthodox Christian church can be the one true church without the foundation with apostles and prophets?

The Apostles were not necessarily prophets in the traditional sense. (For the most part).

They gained their knowledge through the teachings of Jesus. (Other than maybe Paul, to an extent, since he communicated with and was announced an Apostle by a different version of Jesus after Jesus was resurrected.)

John of Patmos - credited for the Book of Revelation could have been considered a Prophet when he experienced what is written in the Book of Revelation BUT John of Patimos was considered a Disciple NOT an Apostle.

They gained their knowledge through the teachings of Jesus. Many of them questioned and even doubted Jesus at times - Thomas, Peter and Judas Iscariot betrayed him. They would repeatedly ask Jesus for clarification among many of his teachings and so forth.

Prophets are not only "Annointed" they have the additional ability to communicate directly with God through God's Messengers and through the power of The Holy Spirit as well as: thoughts, dreams, voices, feelings AND are given the ability to have the Holy Spirit speak directly through them at times.

Prophets are given prophetic information about specific future events, among many other teachings and warnings. Some prophets are also protected by an "invisible armor" of God (Daniel) and others by Angels of the LORD.

Unfortunately, the Apostles did not have most of these abilities - hence the reason they were required to carry the Cross that Jesus carried and many of them were persecuted, tortured and killed.

Matthew 16:17-19​

​

Then Jesus said to him in reply, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you but my heavenly Father. And I say to you: You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church and the gates of the netherworld will not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”


The reason The Church became known as "Catholic" - meaning Universal is because they United hundreds of Christian Cults and Churches throughout the Roman Empire. The same exact Churches written about in letters from Paul, Peter and other Apostles.


That said, whether or not you believe the Roman Catholic Church is "The One True Church" is up to your beliefs and your faith.

In the middle ages, Martin Luther did not agree with some of the teachings and rules of the Roman Catholic Church so he initiated the "Protestant Reformation".

Who is right? Who is wrong? Well at the time Luther decided to break away from the Church - there seemed to be corruption with some of the higher level clergy - including some Popes.

This "break off" was preceded by "The Great Schism" separating the Roman Catholic Church and the Eastern Orthodox Church. So the Catholic Church is not without fault and their fair share of controversy. (It's not too far fetched when you realize they are dealing with 2 Billion people within the Church across the world. ).

One must keep in mind that even the original 12 Apostles debated, argued and disagreed with each other often. Both Thomas and Peter doubted Jesus directly and Judas Iscariot betrayed him outright. So to answer your question - as long as there are human beings running the majority of Churches - NO CHURCH IS "PERFECT"

The "One True Church" is the Church that betters your life by leading you to salvation (The path of Jesus Christ), both physically on Earth and Spiritually.

 

[hobelim]

The reason The Church became known as "Catholic" - meaning Universal is because they United hundreds of Christian Cults and Churches throughout the Roman Empire

"You must go another road, if you wish to escape this savage place. This wild beast, before which you cower in fear, allows no man to cross her path, but obstructs him, to destroy him, and she has so vicious and perverse a nature, that her greedy appetites are never satisfied, the more she eats the more she hungers. Many are the creatures she mates with, and there will be many more, until the Greyhound comes, who will make her die in pain. He will not feed on land or money, but his wisdom, love and virtue shall sustain him. His birthplace will lie between Feltro and Feltro. He will come to save that FALLEN Italy for which the virgin Camilla died of wounds, and Euryalus, Turnus, and Nisus. He will chase the she-wolf through every city, until he has returned her to Hell, from which envy first unleashed her on mankind."

Dantes inferno, canto 1

 

[Ace Nova]

"You must go another road, if you wish to escape this savage place. This wild beast, before which you cower in fear, allows no man to cross her path, but obstructs him, to destroy him, and she has so vicious and perverse a nature, that her greedy appetites are never satisfied, the more she eats the more she hungers. Many are the creatures she mates with, and there will be many more, until the Greyhound comes, who will make her die in pain. He will not feed on land or money, but his wisdom, love and virtue shall sustain him. His birthplace will lie between Feltro and Feltro. He will come to save that FALLEN Italy for which the virgin Camilla died of wounds, and Euryalus, Turnus, and Nisus. He will chase the she-wolf through every city, until he has returned her to Hell, from which envy first unleashed her on mankind."

Dantes inferno, canto 1

Dante is your god now, eh?

Has Dante fulfilled the Law, in which you so vehemently defend everyday and go one to persecute those that do not?

If not - you are quoting a prophesy, in a religious, spiritual forum by an author (of the prophesy) who (likely) does not follow the Law in which you regard as "Holy and Sacred".

Is he exempt from your judgement, persecution and condemnation? If so, why?

 

[Ace Nova]

Sure It sounds like something Jesus was saying to you. You openly promote idolatry as good, what God has forbidden under penalty of death, effectively murdering the pure life in children by aborting the natural evolution of the human mind, indoctrinating them when they are young and malleable with threats of real and imaginary punishment effectively brainwashing them into adopting the superstitious and irrational belief that the way to eternal life is brazenly defying the Law of God and openly desecrating the teachings of Jesus. A ******* lie.

Then, going from bad to worse, you teach them that any rational objection that arises in their own mind to the vile and loathsome crap that you crammed down their throats is a Satanic assault against their "faith" which sets the mind against itself putting them into a state of cognitive dissonance, an artificially induced state of mind that resembles a very deep sleep. Then once possessed, they are ritually slaughtered every day of their abject lives.

Seriously. Whatever you profess to believe you are doing at Mass, what is actually happening is a demonic coven of the young and old, male and female, parents and children, friends and neighbors, all embroiled in an obscene and perverse orgy of sin displaying a deep seated and open hatred for the God of Jesus, worshiping a trinity, and desecrating the teachings of Christ by eating a matzo made by human hands and shitting it out of your funky ass.

Now try and think real hard.

You have allowed Satan to enter your mind to perpetuate obvious lies even infecting children with your deadly poison ******* up their minds and lives, many for life. I am speaking the irrefutable truth, showing where right and wrong and judgment lie, restoring sanity, life itself, to many dead murdered by your historically bloody Church.

Who do you think Jesus would be telling to find a millstone now?

Satan - the adversary of many - can enter people's minds everyday - it is about how they handle the adversarial Spirit and the actions they take accordingly. (If they are even aware of the situation they are in).

 

[hobelim]

Satan - the adversary of many - can enter people's minds everyday - it is about how they handle the adversarial Spirit and the actions they take accordingly. (If they are even aware of the situation they are in).

Satan is a metaphor for a despicable human archetype condemned by God as the lowest of all lower forms of life for promoting as good what God has forbidden under penalty of death and is only invisible to the dead and blind.

But my eyes see. That being said you bear a uncanny resemblance to that ever elusive talking serpent of old. So why not tell me what I must do to be saved according to your "beliefs"? Are you aware of the situation you're in?

Don't be afraid, here's a chance to testify to the truth! A chance to proclaim your faith for everyone to see!

In the name of the living God, what must I do to be saved?

 

[Cougarbear]

The Apostles were not necessarily prophets in the traditional sense. (For the most part).

They gained their knowledge through the teachings of Jesus. (Other than maybe Paul, to an extent, since he communicated with and was announced an Apostle by a different version of Jesus after Jesus was resurrected.)

John of Patmos - credited for the Book of Revelation could have been considered a Prophet when he experienced what is written in the Book of Revelation BUT John of Patimos was considered a Disciple NOT an Apostle.

They gained their knowledge through the teachings of Jesus. Many of them questioned and even doubted Jesus at times - Thomas, Peter and Judas Iscariot betrayed him. They would repeatedly ask Jesus for clarification among many of his teachings and so forth.

Prophets are not only "Annointed" they have the additional ability to communicate directly with God through God's Messengers and through the power of The Holy Spirit as well as: thoughts, dreams, voices, feelings AND are given the ability to have the Holy Spirit speak directly through them at times.

Prophets are given prophetic information about specific future events, among many other teachings and warnings. Some prophets are also protected by an "invisible armor" of God (Daniel) and others by Angels of the LORD.

Unfortunately, the Apostles did not have most of these abilities - hence the reason they were required to carry the Cross that Jesus carried and many of them were persecuted, tortured and killed.

Matthew 16:17-19​

​

Then Jesus said to him in reply, “Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah. For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you but my heavenly Father. And I say to you: You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church and the gates of the netherworld will not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”


The reason The Church became known as "Catholic" - meaning Universal is because they United hundreds of Christian Cults and Churches throughout the Roman Empire. The same exact Churches written about in letters from Paul, Peter and other Apostles.


That said, whether or not you believe the Roman Catholic Church is "The One True Church" is up to your beliefs and your faith.

In the middle ages, Martin Luther did not agree with some of the teachings and rules of the Roman Catholic Church so he initiated the "Protestant Reformation".

Who is right? Who is wrong? Well at the time Luther decided to break away from the Church - there seemed to be corruption with some of the higher level clergy - including some Popes.

This "break off" was preceded by "The Great Schism" separating the Roman Catholic Church and the Eastern Orthodox Church. So the Catholic Church is not without fault and their fair share of controversy. (It's not too far fetched when you realize they are dealing with 2 Billion people within the Church across the world. ).

One must keep in mind that even the original 12 Apostles debated, argued and disagreed with each other often. Both Thomas and Peter doubted Jesus directly and Judas Iscariot betrayed him outright. So to answer your question - as long as there are human beings running the majority of Churches - NO CHURCH IS "PERFECT"

The "One True Church" is the Church that betters your life by leading you to salvation (The path of Jesus Christ), both physically on Earth and Spiritually.

Before I respond, I appreciate your responses and in a cordial way. I hope I don't get too strong with you because I can tend to do that at times.

The "Rock" is the "Rock of Revelation." Not Peter. Peter is the prophet (apostle) whom the Lord (Rock) was going to reveal things to for leading the Church after his crucifixion. Petro in this case means small rock or Prophet. The one who would receive revelation from the big rock, Jesus Christ through the Holy Ghost. "The Rock" or Stone of Israel is Jehovah who is Jesus Christ. Hope that makes sense. Peter in deed built up the Church in the area and also orchestrated much of the spreading of the Gospel in other parts of the old world. There were Bishops, Priests, Deacons, Teachers and so on. It's hard to understand why Protestants don't think order in the Church would not need the Priesthood Offices of authority.

Once the general public and members of the RCC could read for themselves the "Bible" there were many obvious strange things that had entered into the RCC Church that Luther and others felt were false doctrines to the point that the entire Church had apostatized. I don't know if Luther ever pointed out that apostles and prophets were lost and not the foundation of the RCC.

John of, Peter, James and John, is the same John the Revelator. One of the original 12 apostles. The Book of Revelation was not the last book that he wrote. Protestants try to use the statement that nothing can be added or taken from "this" book" as meaning the entire Bible when it only meant the Book of Revelation. With that said, the only way that scripture could be added or changed would be through a prophet or apostle (which is a prophet). God is a God of order.

I would say that the Lord's Church is perfect. The people in it are not perfect. It's easy to say the Church did this and the Church did that, but if the tenants that would make the Church true are correct, then that Church is perfect. This is just my opinion that the RCC is not perfect because the doctrine has been changed and ordinances changed. The authority of the Priesthood has obviously changed. It used to be the Melchizedek Priesthood after the order of the Son of God. Then, there was also the lesser or Leviticus Priesthood or the Priesthood after the order of Aaron. Now, the RCC has Jesuits and Franciscans and other Priesthoods? Strange priesthoods that what Paul made known existed. The RCC lost that authority.

So, back to the question, where are the apostles and prophets, the foundation of the Church in the RCC? Popes, Cardinals, Arch Bishops are not Apostles or Prophets. Same is with Protestant churches as well. And, the Eastern Orthodox Church.

With respects to the apostles that we don't have writings from, that doesn't mean they didn't write. I'm not saying the Gnostic gospels are actual writings by the apostles and Mary. Since they really don't complement the writings of the apostles we do have, I would doubt they are truthful writings of the apostles and Mary. The point is, they were apostles and therefore, prophets as well.

 

[onefour1]

To add to the above, consider this verse and then ask yourself if God truly wanted to do away with apostles and prophets. The church fell into apostasy and that is the reason we no longer had apostles and prophets until the restoration of the church in 1830.

Ephesians 4:11-16
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

We were to have apostles and prophets until we ALL come to a unity of the faith. They were not to be done away with.

 

[Cougarbear]

To add to the above, consider this verse and then ask yourself if God truly wanted to do away with apostles and prophets. The church fell into apostasy and that is the reason we no longer had apostles and prophets until the restoration of the church in 1830.

Ephesians 4:11-16
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

We were to have apostles and prophets until we ALL come to a unity of the faith. They were not to be done away with.

 

[Alter2Ego]

The Father himself is speaking in Hebrews 1 and says in verse 8 that Jesus, His Son, is to be called God as well. Now, Colossians 2:9 makes sense. "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily." Verse 8 then says not to follow the philosophy and vain deceit after the traditions of men. This means to only follow prophets and apostles who teach through the spirit of God and not the secular non-prophets of the Unitarians like Jehovah Witnesses and their non-prophet so called scholars.

Cougarbear:

All of the angels are referred to as gods. And that's "god" with lower case g. So what's your point?


Alter2Ego