Handguns vs. AR-15s

g5000

Diamond Member
Nov 26, 2011
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There are voices saying maybe it is time to show the photos of the dead kids who are killed by mass shooters so the public can see just how horrific AR-15s are. Example: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/06/01/uvalde-mass-shootings-graphic-images/

This was very effective when Emmett Till's mother insisted her son's funeral be an open casket and that his body be shown in the papers so everyone could see what the racist assholes who murdered him had done. The photo of Till's body shocked the public and sentiment began turning against the segregationist South.

I have mixed feelings about showing the bodies of these small children. At the very least, it would have to be done with the permission of the parents.

But I think it would be helpful for the public to understand just how horrific these so-called "weapons of war" really are.

Routine handgun injuries leave entry and exit wounds and linear tracks through the victim’s body that are roughly the size of the bullet. If the bullet does not directly hit something crucial like the heart or the aorta, and the victim does not bleed to death before being transported to our care at the trauma center, chances are that we can save him. The bullets fired by an AR-15 are different: They travel at a higher velocity and are far more lethal than routine bullets fired from a handgun. The damage they cause is a function of the energy they impart as they pass through the body. A typical AR-15 bullet leaves the barrel traveling almost three times faster than—and imparting more than three times the energy of—a typical 9mm bullet from a handgun. An AR-15 rifle outfitted with a magazine with 50 rounds allows many more lethal bullets to be delivered quickly without reloading.

I have seen a handful of AR-15 injuries in my career. Years ago I saw one from a man shot in the back by a swat team. The injury along the path of the bullet from an AR-15 is vastly different from a low-velocity handgun injury. The bullet from an AR-15 passes through the body like a cigarette boat traveling at maximum speed through a tiny canal. The tissue next to the bullet is elastic—moving away from the bullet like waves of water displaced by the boat—and then returns and settles back. This process is called cavitation; it leaves the displaced tissue damaged or killed. The high-velocity bullet causes a swath of tissue damage that extends several inches from its path. It does not have to actually hit an artery to damage it and cause catastrophic bleeding. Exit wounds can be the size of an orange.

With an AR-15, the shooter does not have to be particularly accurate. The victim does not have to be unlucky. If a victim takes a direct hit to the liver from an AR-15, the damage is far graver than that of a simple handgun-shot injury. Handgun injuries to the liver are generally survivable unless the bullet hits the main blood supply to the liver. An AR-15 bullet wound to the middle of the liver would cause so much bleeding that the patient would likely never make it to the trauma center to receive our care.

 
In a typical handgun injury, which I diagnose almost daily, a bullet leaves a laceration through an organ such as the liver. To a radiologist, it appears as a linear, thin, gray bullet track through the organ. There may be bleeding and some bullet fragments.

I was looking at a CT scan of one of the mass-shooting victims from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, who had been brought to the trauma center during my call shift. The organ looked like an overripe melon smashed by a sledgehammer, and was bleeding extensively. How could a gunshot wound have caused this much damage?

The reaction in the emergency room was the same. One of the trauma surgeons opened a young victim in the operating room, and found only shreds of the organ that had been hit by a bullet from an AR-15, a semiautomatic rifle that delivers a devastatingly lethal, high-velocity bullet to the victim.
Nothing was left to repair—and utterly, devastatingly, nothing could be done to fix the problem. The injury was fatal.

 
Compare the damage an AR-15 and a 9mm handgun can do to the human body: “One looks like a grenade went off in there,” says Peter Rhee, a trauma surgeon at the University of Arizona. “The other looks like a bad knife cut.”

[snip]

The bullet from an AR-15 does an entirely different kind of violence to the human body. It’s relatively small, but it leaves the muzzle at three times the speed of a handgun bullet. It has so much energy that it can disintegrate three inches of leg bone. “It would just turn it to dust,” says Donald Jenkins, a trauma surgeon at University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio. If it hits the liver, “the liver looks like a jello mold that’s been dropped on the floor.”



 
Sadly and alas .. respect for others lives ended with abortion, the undermining of faith, legalization of certain drugs, the closing of mental hospitals
, the rise of the Me ME ME generations and .... etc. etc. etc.

I'm pretty sure it's only going to get worse if Democratic Party fascists' continue to have their way..
.
 
Compare the damage an AR-15 and a 9mm handgun can do to the human body: “One looks like a grenade went off in there,” says Peter Rhee, a trauma surgeon at the University of Arizona. “The other looks like a bad knife cut.”

[snip]

The bullet from an AR-15 does an entirely different kind of violence to the human body. It’s relatively small, but it leaves the muzzle at three times the speed of a handgun bullet. It has so much energy that it can disintegrate three inches of leg bone. “It would just turn it to dust,” says Donald Jenkins, a trauma surgeon at University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio. If it hits the liver, “the liver looks like a jello mold that’s been dropped on the floor.”



I dont know a person that doesnt already know the damage it causes
 
Is there a point to all of this?
Yes. Even though long guns writ large (not just the AR platform but all rifles combined) account for less than 3 percent of all murders committed via firearm it's worse somehow because of how it looks. I guess that fits in with "assault weapons" are bad because they look scary mantra. Im pretty sure the dead could care less if they were shot with an AR, 9mm or bashed over the head with a 2x4.
 
Even though long guns writ large (not just the AR platform but all rifles combined) account for less than 3 percent of all murders committed via firearm it's worse somehow because of how it looks.
That's not what was said at all. In fact, the OP made long posts about the actual, physical effects on the human body.

Then you pinch off this pile of shit? You people have a disorder. Worms in your brains.
 
I dont know a person that doesnt already know the damage it causes
it's a stupid comparison. Comparing the terminal ballistics of a rifle round to a hand gun round is just dumb. Most of the time the rifle round will have better terminal ballistics than the hand gun. Most of that has to do with what each platform was designed to do.
 
Compare the damage an AR-15 and a 9mm handgun can do to the human body: “One looks like a grenade went off in there,” says Peter Rhee, a trauma surgeon at the University of Arizona. “The other looks like a bad knife cut.”

[snip]

The bullet from an AR-15 does an entirely different kind of violence to the human body. It’s relatively small, but it leaves the muzzle at three times the speed of a handgun bullet. It has so much energy that it can disintegrate three inches of leg bone. “It would just turn it to dust,” says Donald Jenkins, a trauma surgeon at University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio. If it hits the liver, “the liver looks like a jello mold that’s been dropped on the floor.”



There are voices saying maybe it is time to show the photos of the dead kids who are killed by mass shooters so the public can see just how horrific AR-15s are. Example: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/06/01/uvalde-mass-shootings-graphic-images/

This was very effective when Emmett Till's mother insisted her son's funeral be an open casket and that his body be shown in the papers so everyone could see what the racist assholes who murdered him had done. The photo of Till's body shocked the public and sentiment began turning against the segregationist South.

I have mixed feelings about showing the bodies of these small children. At the very least, it would have to be done with the permission of the parents.

But I think it would be helpful for the public to understand just how horrific these so-called "weapons of war" really are.

Routine handgun injuries leave entry and exit wounds and linear tracks through the victim’s body that are roughly the size of the bullet. If the bullet does not directly hit something crucial like the heart or the aorta, and the victim does not bleed to death before being transported to our care at the trauma center, chances are that we can save him. The bullets fired by an AR-15 are different: They travel at a higher velocity and are far more lethal than routine bullets fired from a handgun. The damage they cause is a function of the energy they impart as they pass through the body. A typical AR-15 bullet leaves the barrel traveling almost three times faster than—and imparting more than three times the energy of—a typical 9mm bullet from a handgun. An AR-15 rifle outfitted with a magazine with 50 rounds allows many more lethal bullets to be delivered quickly without reloading.

I have seen a handful of AR-15 injuries in my career. Years ago I saw one from a man shot in the back by a swat team. The injury along the path of the bullet from an AR-15 is vastly different from a low-velocity handgun injury. The bullet from an AR-15 passes through the body like a cigarette boat traveling at maximum speed through a tiny canal. The tissue next to the bullet is elastic—moving away from the bullet like waves of water displaced by the boat—and then returns and settles back. This process is called cavitation; it leaves the displaced tissue damaged or killed. The high-velocity bullet causes a swath of tissue damage that extends several inches from its path. It does not have to actually hit an artery to damage it and cause catastrophic bleeding. Exit wounds can be the size of an orange.

With an AR-15, the shooter does not have to be particularly accurate. The victim does not have to be unlucky. If a victim takes a direct hit to the liver from an AR-15, the damage is far graver than that of a simple handgun-shot injury. Handgun injuries to the liver are generally survivable unless the bullet hits the main blood supply to the liver. An AR-15 bullet wound to the middle of the liver would cause so much bleeding that the patient would likely never make it to the trauma center to receive our care.


In a typical handgun injury, which I diagnose almost daily, a bullet leaves a laceration through an organ such as the liver. To a radiologist, it appears as a linear, thin, gray bullet track through the organ. There may be bleeding and some bullet fragments.

I was looking at a CT scan of one of the mass-shooting victims from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, who had been brought to the trauma center during my call shift. The organ looked like an overripe melon smashed by a sledgehammer, and was bleeding extensively. How could a gunshot wound have caused this much damage?

The reaction in the emergency room was the same. One of the trauma surgeons opened a young victim in the operating room, and found only shreds of the organ that had been hit by a bullet from an AR-15, a semiautomatic rifle that delivers a devastatingly lethal, high-velocity bullet to the victim.
Nothing was left to repair—and utterly, devastatingly, nothing could be done to fix the problem. The injury was fatal.

Shrugs end game is gun confiscation if you really gave a shit there were be demands to arm teachers and have armed security in all schools other than that I don't give a shit about your fack feelings.
 
There are voices saying maybe it is time to show the photos of the dead kids who are killed by mass shooters so the public can see just how horrific AR-15s are. Example: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/06/01/uvalde-mass-shootings-graphic-images/

This was very effective when Emmett Till's mother insisted her son's funeral be an open casket and that his body be shown in the papers so everyone could see what the racist assholes who murdered him had done. The photo of Till's body shocked the public and sentiment began turning against the segregationist South.

I have mixed feelings about showing the bodies of these small children. At the very least, it would have to be done with the permission of the parents.

But I think it would be helpful for the public to understand just how horrific these so-called "weapons of war" really are.

Routine handgun injuries leave entry and exit wounds and linear tracks through the victim’s body that are roughly the size of the bullet. If the bullet does not directly hit something crucial like the heart or the aorta, and the victim does not bleed to death before being transported to our care at the trauma center, chances are that we can save him. The bullets fired by an AR-15 are different: They travel at a higher velocity and are far more lethal than routine bullets fired from a handgun. The damage they cause is a function of the energy they impart as they pass through the body. A typical AR-15 bullet leaves the barrel traveling almost three times faster than—and imparting more than three times the energy of—a typical 9mm bullet from a handgun. An AR-15 rifle outfitted with a magazine with 50 rounds allows many more lethal bullets to be delivered quickly without reloading.

I have seen a handful of AR-15 injuries in my career. Years ago I saw one from a man shot in the back by a swat team. The injury along the path of the bullet from an AR-15 is vastly different from a low-velocity handgun injury. The bullet from an AR-15 passes through the body like a cigarette boat traveling at maximum speed through a tiny canal. The tissue next to the bullet is elastic—moving away from the bullet like waves of water displaced by the boat—and then returns and settles back. This process is called cavitation; it leaves the displaced tissue damaged or killed. The high-velocity bullet causes a swath of tissue damage that extends several inches from its path. It does not have to actually hit an artery to damage it and cause catastrophic bleeding. Exit wounds can be the size of an orange.

With an AR-15, the shooter does not have to be particularly accurate. The victim does not have to be unlucky. If a victim takes a direct hit to the liver from an AR-15, the damage is far graver than that of a simple handgun-shot injury. Handgun injuries to the liver are generally survivable unless the bullet hits the main blood supply to the liver. An AR-15 bullet wound to the middle of the liver would cause so much bleeding that the patient would likely never make it to the trauma center to receive our care.

So, what are you saying g5000? We should ban the 5.56/.223?

What is your point?

Do you have one?
 
When I was a youngster, Lib Control Freaks lost their minds about the "Saturday Night Special" handguns.

No handgun manufacturer ever advertised their weapons as "Saturday Night Specials" of course, just like they don't advertise "military style assault weapons" either.

But now no lib today gives a shit about popularly priced handguns. What gives?
 
Shrugs end game is gun confiscation if you really gave a shit there were be demands to arm teachers and have armed security in all schools other than that I don't give a shit about your fack feelings.
Was that a sentence?

As for "all we need to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun", that theory has been completely blown out of the water. The police at Parkland and in Uvalde completely failed to stop the bad guys with guns.

Only an idiot would continue to subscribe to this idiotic bullshit disastrous idea.
 

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