Green Cars? The Joke's On You!

[ima]

Good thing all you douchesacks weren't around when the Wright brothers started to fly airplanes, you all would have laughed at them: "Hey you morons, stop wasting your time flying 100 feet!!!"

The Wright brothers did it on their own with no money taken from the poor to subsidize the rich.

Thanks for playing but as usual your head is firmly planted in your ass.

So you at least agree that electric cars are a good idea? Or is it actually the car you're against? Because these days, everyone and his brother gets subsidies.

If there's any anal plunging going around, watch out for UNK and his dog!!!!

 

[westwall]

Good thing all you douchesacks weren't around when the Wright brothers started to fly airplanes, you all would have laughed at them: "Hey you morons, stop wasting your time flying 100 feet!!!"

The Wright brothers did it on their own with no money taken from the poor to subsidize the rich.

Thanks for playing but as usual your head is firmly planted in your ass.

So you at least agree that electric cars are a good idea? Or is it actually the car you're against? Because these days, everyone and his brother gets subsidies.

If there's any anal plunging going around, watch out for UNK and his dog!!!!

Electric vehicles as they currently stand are terrible for the environment and an economic boondoggle that benefit only the super wealthy, and the big Democrat donors who rack in taxpayer dollars by the hundreds of millions.

If we can develop Tesla's idea of powering the Earths magnetic field so that you can get your power from an antenna then EV's would be a huge benefit for the planet.

You see dear person. I care about the PLANET! I actually live a very environmentally friendly life and have for over 40 years. I gurantee you that my carbon footprint is tiny compared to yours.

However, CO2 is not the evil element that you all claim it to be. My families low footprint is because we don't pollute, so the low carbon footprint is an offshoot of that policy of not polluting.

If you really want to help the planet, buy a good turbo diesel powered vehicle, as the good ones are approaching 70 mpg and they are environmentally friendly compared to hybrids and electric vehicles.

On the other hand if you don't really care about the planet, and simply want a socialist shithole to live in, then by all means keep on keepin on.

 

[westwall]

The point that Chic is trying to make is that Electric Cars arent 100% environmentally friendly. But, who cares...I think the only thing that is 100% Environmentally friendly is a horse and carriage. Not even a bike uses some sort of energy and waste to manufacture.

But the Electric car movement isnt about being 100% environmentally friendly...Its about being environmentally friendlier...Dont let them move the goal posts on you

The problem is they are MORE environmentally damaging than an internal combustion engine powered vehicle to produce.

And by a long way.

To PRODUCE...after that tho its on the plus side

No they're not. Unless you don't care that it takes a month to recharge your EV from a solar source (and let's be real the production of solar panels is incredibly polluting) you have to get your power from the grid. The majority of that power comes from fossil fueled power plants and with line loss and other loss of efficiency issues the good ICE powered vehicles are still better. Especially when you consider what you do with them AFTER the batteries have gone flat for the last time.

You have to consider ALL aspects of vehicle ownership, not just the ones you like.

 

[polarbear]

The point that Chic is trying to make is that Electric Cars arent 100% environmentally friendly. But, who cares...I think the only thing that is 100% Environmentally friendly is a horse and carriage. Not even a bike uses some sort of energy and waste to manufacture.

But the Electric car movement isnt about being 100% environmentally friendly...Its about being environmentally friendlier...Dont let them move the goal posts on you

Not quite horses fart methane gas and the AGW wackos have already managed to tax sheep farmers in New Zealand to pay a "greenhouse gas tax" per head.
The EV enthusiasts keep forgetting that even a tiny 40 hp EV sucks back as much power every time it had to stop and go in rush hour traffic as one lane of houses on a city block....which has to be recharged later when they get back home.
If we get more and more EV`s wanting to recharge at home the entire power grid will have to be re-designed. Starting with the transformer nearest to your house and all the way back to the power generator source.
It makes a huge difference at the power plant end what kind of load factor the current load is. Most of these EV experts don`t even have a clue what a power factor is till they visit a power plant and get it explained what the difference between a resistive- , inductive- and a capacitive load is.
These f-ing battery chargers show up as capacitive and knock the generator phase angle out of whack.
And so do these solar home system when they want "to feed power" into the grid to get a "credit".
There is no way wind and solar can be adjusted like a conventional turbine can be modulated instantly to adjust for the load factor and any power demand surges.
When these idiotic wind farms come on-line so that they get their "credit quota" all the power plant crews across the country go into overtime and high alert trying to stabilize the grid with the conventional generators to prevent a cascading power failure.
The U.S has already trouble enough to do that with the current load. and sucks back all the power that Canada can spare for their grid during peak
power demands.
If you solar, wind and EV fanatics want another "cascading great blackout" this time Nation-wide that`s fine with us in Canada. We`ll simply trip all our HV line switches on all our lines running south till you get your mess sorted out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_blackout_of_2003

The Northeast blackout of 2003 was a widespread power outage that occurred throughout parts of the Northeastern and Midwestern United States and the Canadian province of Ontario on Thursday, August 14, 2003, j
The outage was the result of 23 distinct events that occurred on 5 separate power grids in a span of 11 minutes.[7] Federal, regional and local officials are investigating what happened and why the outage cascaded the way it did.[8] The Arizona Public Service (APS) North Gila Substation reported power loss at 3:27 pm PDT. Within seconds a portion of a Mexico power plant shut down, but there is no indication that Arizona impacted Mexico.[9] Units 2 and 3 at San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station automatically tripped offline due to a "grid disturbance" which initiated the plant's Emergency Feed Actuation System (EFAS).[1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Southwest_blackout

The initiating event was a procedural error made by a technician switching out a capacitor bank on a 500kV line at a APS substation in North Gila, AZ, causing the line to trip; it had been carrying 1,397 MW westward across California to Imperial and San Diego counties and CFE in Mexico. Electric utilities normally use advance planning and real-time computer monitoring and modeling to detect when such a single-point failure could trigger a cascading blackout, but none of the utilities detected that the system was vulnerable to the loss of this particular line. This began an 11-minute accelerating cascade of transformer, transmission line and generation trips culminating in the disconnection of the main transmission path carrying power southward into San Diego from the San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station and points north.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_blackout_of_1965

The Northeast blackout of 1965 was a significant disruption in the supply of electricity on November 9, 1965, affecting parts of Ontario in Canada and Connecticut, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Vermont, New York, and New Jersey in the United States. Over 30 million people and 80,000 square miles (207,000 km2) were left without electricity for up to 12 hours.
The cause of the failure was human error that happened days before the blackout. Maintenance personnel incorrectly set a protective relay on one of the transmission lines between the Niagara generating station Sir Adam Beck Station No. 2 in Queenston, Ontario. The safety relay, which was to trip if the current exceeded the capacity of the transmission line, was set too low.
As was common on a cold November evening, power for heating, lighting and cooking was pushing the electrical system to near its peak capacity. Transmission lines heading into Southern Ontario/Canada were heavily loaded. At 5:16 p.m. Eastern Time a small surge of power coming from the Robert Moses generating plant in Lewiston, New York caused the improperly set relay to trip at far below the line's rated capacity, disabling a main power line heading into Southern Ontario. Instantly, the power that was flowing on the tripped line transferred to the other lines, causing them to become overloaded. Their protective relays, which are designed to protect the line from overload, tripped, isolating Beck Station from all of Southern Ontario.

You should check out what happened in Russia when the load factor went out of whack:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Sayano-Shushenskaya_power_station_accident

During 16 August up to 20:30, the load of turbine 2 was 600 MW, then it was reduced to 100–200 MW. On 17 August 2009 at 3:00, the load was increased again to 600 MW; at 3:30, the load was decreased to 200 MW; and at 3:45, it was increased again to 600 MW.[4] During this time, the level of vibration was very high, and was also registered by seismic instruments in the plant. During attempts to shut it down, the rotor inside the turbine was pushed up, which in turn created pressure pushing up on the turbine cover. The cover was kept in place by 80 bolts of 8-centimetre (3.1 in) diameter.
On 17 August 2009 at 1:20AM (local time) there was a fire at the hydroelectric power station of Bratsk which broke both communications and the automatic driving systems of other power plants in the region, including Sayano-Shushenskaya. The situation was recovered on 17 August 2009 at 15:03. At 8:12AM local time, turbine 2's output power was reduced by the turbine regulator and it entered into the non-recommended powerband II. Shortly after this, the bolts keeping the turbine cover in place were broken, and under water pressure of about 20 bars (2,000 kPa), the spinning turbine with its cover, rotor, and upper parts started to move up, destroying machinery hall installations.

So we got bridges collapsing and a President that is too cheap to fix the International bridge on the Detroit side so it won`t collapse like the one in Minneapolis,...while he wants to put your tax money into Wind and Solar farms...and you are supposed to drive tax $ubsidized EV`s...
What kind of shape you think your existing power plants are in ?
Obama even promised while campaigning that he will drive coal fired power plants into bankruptcy !
Can America`s power plants handle a sudden power or load factor change without going super nova like Chernobyl or Sayano-Shushenskaya..or having to suck on the power lines coming from Canada and brown us out too...Yet AGAIN..?
And the ultimate irony is that Obama`s friend Warren Buffet makes a killing running rail tankers from the Alberta Oil sands on rotten railroad tracks deep into the US, while Obama stalls the Keystone Pipeline....
Man it takes a Democratic following, dumber than methane farting sheep to keep electing a "President" like that....because he wants to stop man-made CO2 that would otherwise toast the planet and also promised to shield your power grid from hackers in China....what a joke !!!
I wish he would take a tour in a power plant and they let him rack a breaker to phase in one of these stupid wind turbines to the main grid when the phase angles don`t match up exactly! I`ld even pump up that switch for him....and watch from a safe distance when he triggers it while he smiles from ear to ear one more time....that might make up for Benghazi and for some of the women and children that got killed from his drones..




I feel sorry for that worker but he did not feel a thing.

 

[ima]

The Wright brothers did it on their own with no money taken from the poor to subsidize the rich.

Thanks for playing but as usual your head is firmly planted in your ass.

So you at least agree that electric cars are a good idea? Or is it actually the car you're against? Because these days, everyone and his brother gets subsidies.

If there's any anal plunging going around, watch out for UNK and his dog!!!!

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.


Electric vehicles as they currently stand are terrible for the environment and an economic boondoggle that benefit only the super wealthy, and the big Democrat donors who rack in taxpayer dollars by the hundreds of millions.

If we can develop Tesla's idea of powering the Earths magnetic field so that you can get your power from an antenna then EV's would be a huge benefit for the planet.

You see dear person. I care about the PLANET! I actually live a very environmentally friendly life and have for over 40 years. I gurantee you that my carbon footprint is tiny compared to yours.

However, CO2 is not the evil element that you all claim it to be. My families low footprint is because we don't pollute, so the low carbon footprint is an offshoot of that policy of not polluting.

If you really want to help the planet, buy a good turbo diesel powered vehicle, as the good ones are approaching 70 mpg and they are environmentally friendly compared to hybrids and electric vehicles.

On the other hand if you don't really care about the planet, and simply want a socialist shithole to live in, then by all means keep on keepin on.

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

 

[polarbear]

So you at least agree that electric cars are a good idea? Or is it actually the car you're against? Because these days, everyone and his brother gets subsidies.

If there's any anal plunging going around, watch out for UNK and his dog!!!!

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.


Electric vehicles as they currently stand are terrible for the environment and an economic boondoggle that benefit only the super wealthy, and the big Democrat donors who rack in taxpayer dollars by the hundreds of millions.

If we can develop Tesla's idea of powering the Earths magnetic field so that you can get your power from an antenna then EV's would be a huge benefit for the planet.

You see dear person. I care about the PLANET! I actually live a very environmentally friendly life and have for over 40 years. I gurantee you that my carbon footprint is tiny compared to yours.

However, CO2 is not the evil element that you all claim it to be. My families low footprint is because we don't pollute, so the low carbon footprint is an offshoot of that policy of not polluting.

If you really want to help the planet, buy a good turbo diesel powered vehicle, as the good ones are approaching 70 mpg and they are environmentally friendly compared to hybrids and electric vehicles.

On the other hand if you don't really care about the planet, and simply want a socialist shithole to live in, then by all means keep on keepin on.

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

How would you know where your power comes from?
You are hooked up to the grid are you not?
Then you as a consumer would not even know how much of your power comes from which country.
The only way you could claim that all your power comes from hydro is if you had your own hydro plant.
Take another look how dumb your current administration is:
Obamas Präsidenten-Limousine in Israel falsch betankt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Obamas Limousine falsch betankt: Das Biest hat sich verschluckt



Jerusalem - Man nennt ihn "das Biest". Der Cadillac, in dem Barack Obama chauffiert wird, ist mit jedem erdenklichen Hochsicherheits-Schnickschnack ausgerüstet. Unter anderem ist der Wagen gegen Angriffe mit biochemischen Waffen gerüstet und verfügt über ein System zur unabhängigen Sauerstoffversorgung der Insassen. Gegen eines ist die rollende Festung aber offenbar nicht gewappnet: trottelige Fehler aus dem Autofahrer-Alltag.


Die Sicherheitslücke wurde jetzt in Jerusalem bekannt. Dort musste das Biest abgeschleppt werden. Der Grund: Statt mit Diesel war der Eine-Millionen-Dollar-Wagen mit Benzin betankt worden. Das berichten mehrere israelische Medien. Die Panne ereignete sich gleich am ersten Tag des Israel-Besuchs von Barack Obama. Der Secret Service, der den US-Präsidenten schützt, musste eilig einen neuen Präsidentenwagen aus Jordanien einfliegen. Dieser stand dort bereit, weil Obama auf seiner Nahost-Reise auch dieses Land besuchen wird.

Translation:
Obama`s beast had a hickup

His Cadillac is called "The beast" in diplomatic circles...it`s bullet proof and has every security device built in that you could think of. Including it`s own Oxygen supply. When Obama arrived in Israel with his entourage they filled up his diesel powered "beast" with gasoline and had to fly in a second backup "beast" from the US.
So why doesn`t he drive an electric beast?
The only mileage that limo ever clocks is from the airport to the reception area and back.
After he got his second diesel guzzler he finally made it to the reception and dug a hole in Shimon Peres` garden to plant a tree without checking with any body. It had to be removed again because Israel quarantines imported live plants just like the US does also.
That just goes to show what kind of bumbling idiots (presidential advisers ?) are in the White House Administration these days.
If I were an Israeli I`ld be worried too if a "President" like that guarantees to help out with my country`s security...his Administration can`t even secure his own embassies abroad or the car he is sitting in.
"Der Spiegel" also mentions in the same article that Obama`s entourage screwed another "beast" up during Obama`s visit to Ireland. They got that one stuck on a speed bump.
If that was Romney instead of Obama MSNBC`s Chris Mathew would rant about it 24/7

 

[ima]

I know for a fact that all my electricity comes from hydro. It helps to be informed. because as we all know, in the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

 

[polarbear]

I know for a fact that all my electricity comes from hydro. It helps to be informed. because as we all know, in the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

Let me get this straight ..
you are a vegetarian,live with a "partner", both of you have access to the internet, but between you and your (same sex?) partner you know as little as a head of lettuce in your garden how the U.S. power line distribution grid is tied together..
Or was that just a quickie green smoke screen to bury that as fast as possible with a 3 page long discussion how your same sex love nest in the woods is so high-tech that your power service entrance can sort out electrons that only came from hydro power?
I won`t let you bury that as easy as you buried all the other posts with your crap

Obama`s beast had a hickup

His Cadillac is called "The beast" in diplomatic circles...it`s bullet proof and has every security device built in that you could think of. Including it`s own Oxygen supply. When Obama arrived in Israel with his entourage they filled up his diesel powered "beast" with gasoline and had to fly in a second backup "beast" from the US.
So why doesn`t he drive an electric beast?
The only mileage that limo ever clocks is from the airport to the reception area and back.
After he got his second diesel guzzler he finally made it to the reception and dug a hole in Shimon Peres` garden to plant a tree without checking with any body. It had to be removed again because Israel quarantines imported live plants just like the US does also.
That just goes to show what kind of bumbling idiots (presidential advisers ?) are in the White House Administration these days.
If I were an Israeli I`ld be worried too if a "President" like that guarantees to help out with my country`s security...his Administration can`t even secure his own embassies abroad or the car he is sitting in.
"Der Spiegel" also mentions in the same article that Obama`s entourage screwed another "beast" up during Obama`s visit to Ireland. They got that one stuck on a speed bump.
If that was Romney instead of Obama MSNBC`s Chris Mathew would rant about it 24/7

 

[westwall]

So you at least agree that electric cars are a good idea? Or is it actually the car you're against? Because these days, everyone and his brother gets subsidies.

If there's any anal plunging going around, watch out for UNK and his dog!!!!

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.


Electric vehicles as they currently stand are terrible for the environment and an economic boondoggle that benefit only the super wealthy, and the big Democrat donors who rack in taxpayer dollars by the hundreds of millions.

If we can develop Tesla's idea of powering the Earths magnetic field so that you can get your power from an antenna then EV's would be a huge benefit for the planet.

You see dear person. I care about the PLANET! I actually live a very environmentally friendly life and have for over 40 years. I gurantee you that my carbon footprint is tiny compared to yours.

However, CO2 is not the evil element that you all claim it to be. My families low footprint is because we don't pollute, so the low carbon footprint is an offshoot of that policy of not polluting.

If you really want to help the planet, buy a good turbo diesel powered vehicle, as the good ones are approaching 70 mpg and they are environmentally friendly compared to hybrids and electric vehicles.

On the other hand if you don't really care about the planet, and simply want a socialist shithole to live in, then by all means keep on keepin on.

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

I sit on more acreage than you, hunt my own meat (no I'm not a vegetarian, the producing of said food is very CO2 intensive unless you are using livestock to plant and maintain it) and most of my power is from solar, geothermal, and a small water wheel. I also have a diesel generator for when I need to power my machinery.

 

[ima]

I know for a fact that all my electricity comes from hydro. It helps to be informed. because as we all know, in the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

Let me get this straight ..
you are a vegetarian,live with a "partner", both of you have access to the internet, but between you and your (same sex?) partner you know as little as a head of lettuce in your garden how the U.S. power line distribution grid is tied together..
Or was that just a quickie green smoke screen to bury that as fast as possible with a 3 page long discussion how your same sex love nest in the woods is so high-tech that your power service entrance can sort out electrons that only came from hydro power?
I won`t let you bury that as easy as you buried all the other posts with your crap

Obama`s beast had a hickup

His Cadillac is called "The beast" in diplomatic circles...it`s bullet proof and has every security device built in that you could think of. Including it`s own Oxygen supply. When Obama arrived in Israel with his entourage they filled up his diesel powered "beast" with gasoline and had to fly in a second backup "beast" from the US.
So why doesn`t he drive an electric beast?
The only mileage that limo ever clocks is from the airport to the reception area and back.
After he got his second diesel guzzler he finally made it to the reception and dug a hole in Shimon Peres` garden to plant a tree without checking with any body. It had to be removed again because Israel quarantines imported live plants just like the US does also.
That just goes to show what kind of bumbling idiots (presidential advisers ?) are in the White House Administration these days.
If I were an Israeli I`ld be worried too if a "President" like that guarantees to help out with my country`s security...his Administration can`t even secure his own embassies abroad or the car he is sitting in.
"Der Spiegel" also mentions in the same article that Obama`s entourage screwed another "beast" up during Obama`s visit to Ireland. They got that one stuck on a speed bump.
If that was Romney instead of Obama MSNBC`s Chris Mathew would rant about it 24/7

I live in an area that the power used comes solely from hydro power. Like I care if you accept that or not.
I also have a natural source for my water and it flows by gravity through my house!!!!!!

 

[ima]

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

Electric vehicles as they currently stand are terrible for the environment and an economic boondoggle that benefit only the super wealthy, and the big Democrat donors who rack in taxpayer dollars by the hundreds of millions.

If we can develop Tesla's idea of powering the Earths magnetic field so that you can get your power from an antenna then EV's would be a huge benefit for the planet.

You see dear person. I care about the PLANET! I actually live a very environmentally friendly life and have for over 40 years. I gurantee you that my carbon footprint is tiny compared to yours.

However, CO2 is not the evil element that you all claim it to be. My families low footprint is because we don't pollute, so the low carbon footprint is an offshoot of that policy of not polluting.

If you really want to help the planet, buy a good turbo diesel powered vehicle, as the good ones are approaching 70 mpg and they are environmentally friendly compared to hybrids and electric vehicles.

On the other hand if you don't really care about the planet, and simply want a socialist shithole to live in, then by all means keep on keepin on.

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

I sit on more acreage than you, hunt my own meat (no I'm not a vegetarian, the producing of said food is very CO2 intensive unless you are using livestock to plant and maintain it) and most of my power is from solar, geothermal, and a small water wheel. I also have a diesel generator for when I need to power my machinery.

You talking about the WHOLE trailer park?
Jus' kiddin'. Ok, so you're pretty green, that's cool. But so are cars that run on alternate fuels.

 

[polarbear]

I know for a fact that all my electricity comes from hydro. It helps to be informed. because as we all know, in the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

Let me get this straight ..
you are a vegetarian,live with a "partner", both of you have access to the internet, but between you and your (same sex?) partner you know as little as a head of lettuce in your garden how the U.S. power line distribution grid is tied together..
Or was that just a quickie green smoke screen to bury that as fast as possible with a 3 page long discussion how your same sex love nest in the woods is so high-tech that your power service entrance can sort out electrons that only came from hydro power?
I won`t let you bury that as easy as you buried all the other posts with your crap

Obama`s beast had a hickup

His Cadillac is called "The beast" in diplomatic circles...it`s bullet proof and has every security device built in that you could think of. Including it`s own Oxygen supply. When Obama arrived in Israel with his entourage they filled up his diesel powered "beast" with gasoline and had to fly in a second backup "beast" from the US.
So why doesn`t he drive an electric beast?
The only mileage that limo ever clocks is from the airport to the reception area and back.
After he got his second diesel guzzler he finally made it to the reception and dug a hole in Shimon Peres` garden to plant a tree without checking with any body. It had to be removed again because Israel quarantines imported live plants just like the US does also.
That just goes to show what kind of bumbling idiots (presidential advisers ?) are in the White House Administration these days.
If I were an Israeli I`ld be worried too if a "President" like that guarantees to help out with my country`s security...his Administration can`t even secure his own embassies abroad or the car he is sitting in.
"Der Spiegel" also mentions in the same article that Obama`s entourage screwed another "beast" up during Obama`s visit to Ireland. They got that one stuck on a speed bump.
If that was Romney instead of Obama MSNBC`s Chris Mathew would rant about it 24/7

I live in an area that the power used comes solely from hydro power. Like I care if you accept that or not.
I also have a natural source for my water and it flows by gravity through my house!!!!!!

Thank`s...you just revealed that you know absolutely nothing about the power grid your house is connected to. There is no such area on the U.S. mainland. Your power grid is being fed at any time with every turbine that is on-line...even with ours in Canada. They feed into their HV transformers from there it goes on the main grid from there it goes to your specific area transformers and from there into your neighborhood which has another transformer which drops it down to your household voltage...
Like I said the only way you could know that all of it came exclusively from hydro is if you live on a Island and they run a iddy-biddy Pelton turbine at an iddy-biddy little creek.
You don`t want to say which area that is, because with 3 mouse clicks I could get you a diagram how that area is connected
Quit trying to tell an engineer that you know better where your power comes from.

 

[ima]

Let me get this straight ..
you are a vegetarian,live with a "partner", both of you have access to the internet, but between you and your (same sex?) partner you know as little as a head of lettuce in your garden how the U.S. power line distribution grid is tied together..
Or was that just a quickie green smoke screen to bury that as fast as possible with a 3 page long discussion how your same sex love nest in the woods is so high-tech that your power service entrance can sort out electrons that only came from hydro power?
I won`t let you bury that as easy as you buried all the other posts with your crap

I live in an area that the power used comes solely from hydro power. Like I care if you accept that or not.
I also have a natural source for my water and it flows by gravity through my house!!!!!!

Thank`s...you just revealed that you know absolutely nothing about the power grid your house is connected to. There is no such area on the U.S. mainland. Your power grid is being fed at any time with every turbine that is on-line...even with ours in Canada. They feed into their HV transformers from there it goes on the main grid from there it goes to your specific area transformers and from there into your neighborhood which has another transformer which drops it down to your household voltage...
Like I said the only way you could know that all of it came exclusively from hydro is if you live on a Island and they run a iddy-biddy Pelton turbine at an iddy-biddy little creek.
You don`t want to say which area that is, because with 3 mouse clicks I could get you a diagram how that area is connected
Quit trying to tell an engineer that you know better where your power comes from.

C'mon, you're such a smart Canadian and an engineer, figure it out: somewhere in North America that only uses hydro power (the lone nuclear plant is closing, and anyways, I'm way too far from it to ever have gotten any power from there).

 

[westwall]

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

Sure, electric cars aren't there yet, but it's still better than doing nothing.

I sit on more acreage than you, hunt my own meat (no I'm not a vegetarian, the producing of said food is very CO2 intensive unless you are using livestock to plant and maintain it) and most of my power is from solar, geothermal, and a small water wheel. I also have a diesel generator for when I need to power my machinery.

You talking about the WHOLE trailer park?
Jus' kiddin'. Ok, so you're pretty green, that's cool. But so are cars that run on alternate fuels.

Only if those fuels are as efficient and less damaging to produce than the fossil fuels they are replacing...which so far none are. Look past the perception dude...look at the reality of what you are talking about.

Take this bio jet fuel that obummer has mandated we use (no doubt getting some major kickbacks froms his pals who produce it) in our military aircraft. It costs 35 dollars a gallon as opposed to 4 dollars and it is more environmentally damaging to produce.

Does that make even the slightest sense to you?

 

[ima]

I sit on more acreage than you, hunt my own meat (no I'm not a vegetarian, the producing of said food is very CO2 intensive unless you are using livestock to plant and maintain it) and most of my power is from solar, geothermal, and a small water wheel. I also have a diesel generator for when I need to power my machinery.

You talking about the WHOLE trailer park?
Jus' kiddin'. Ok, so you're pretty green, that's cool. But so are cars that run on alternate fuels.

Only if those fuels are as efficient and less damaging to produce than the fossil fuels they are replacing...which so far none are. Look past the perception dude...look at the reality of what you are talking about.

Take this bio jet fuel that obummer has mandated we use (no doubt getting some major kickbacks froms his pals who produce it) in our military aircraft. It costs 35 dollars a gallon as opposed to 4 dollars and it is more environmentally damaging to produce.

Does that make even the slightest sense to you?

I think that the research... done today on alternate fuels will help down the line, like you say, today it doesn't seem to make sense yet, but it's just like we'll never get to fission power if we don't due the research...
If we can find a way to use farming waste like corn stalks and other plant materials that just get thrown away, we'll have something.

 

[westwall]

You talking about the WHOLE trailer park?
Jus' kiddin'. Ok, so you're pretty green, that's cool. But so are cars that run on alternate fuels.

Only if those fuels are as efficient and less damaging to produce than the fossil fuels they are replacing...which so far none are. Look past the perception dude...look at the reality of what you are talking about.

Take this bio jet fuel that obummer has mandated we use (no doubt getting some major kickbacks froms his pals who produce it) in our military aircraft. It costs 35 dollars a gallon as opposed to 4 dollars and it is more environmentally damaging to produce.

Does that make even the slightest sense to you?

I think that the research... done today on alternate fuels will help down the line, like you say, today it doesn't seem to make sense yet, but it's just like we'll never get to fission power if we don't due the research...
If we can find a way to use farming waste like corn stalks and other plant materials that just get thrown away, we'll have something.

Everything we use should be recycled. That I have no problem with at all, and my family has done so for the last 30ish years. The problems arise when attempts are made to scale those practices up for mass use. That's where governmental corruption rears its ugly head.

 

[polarbear]

You talking about the WHOLE trailer park?
Jus' kiddin'. Ok, so you're pretty green, that's cool. But so are cars that run on alternate fuels.

Only if those fuels are as efficient and less damaging to produce than the fossil fuels they are replacing...which so far none are. Look past the perception dude...look at the reality of what you are talking about.

Take this bio jet fuel that obummer has mandated we use (no doubt getting some major kickbacks froms his pals who produce it) in our military aircraft. It costs 35 dollars a gallon as opposed to 4 dollars and it is more environmentally damaging to produce.

Does that make even the slightest sense to you?

I think that the research... done today on alternate fuels will help down the line, like you say, today it doesn't seem to make sense yet, but it's just like we'll never get to fission power if we don't due the research...
If we can find a way to use farming waste like corn stalks and other plant materials that just get thrown away, we'll have something.

We got fission power ever since you were born. If you don`t know the difference between fission and fusion power you would also have no idea how much more energy is involved to make 1 liter of "bio-ethanol" than you get out of it.
That blunder was just as funny as:

C'mon, you're such a smart Canadian and an engineer, figure it out: somewhere in North America that only uses hydro power (the lone nuclear plant is closing, and anyways, I'm way too far from it to ever have gotten any power from there).

North American electricity grid

The North American electricity grid is the world's largest and most complex system of power generation, transmission, and distribution. The grid delivers electricity to almost all the people in the U.S., Canada and a portion of Baja California Norte, Mexico. This market generates an electricity demand of about 830 gigawatts (GW) (830,000 megawatts). The North American grid has 211,000 miles (340,000 km) of high-voltage transmission line (230,000 volts and greater)
The U.S. operates about 10,000 power plants and another approximately 5,600 distributed energy facilities.
The high-voltage transmission system carries electricity from the power plants and transmits it up to hundreds of miles away. High voltage is used for transmission lines to minimize electrical losses.

In essence, the power from many power plants is "pooled" in the transmission system, and each distribution system draws from this pool.

the Eastern and Western Interconnects are strongly interconnected with Canada. All electric utilities in the mainland United States are connected with at least one other utility via these power grids. Within each interconnect, power flows through AC lines, so all generators are tightly synchronized to the same 60-Hz cycle.

The grid is managed by the North American Electric Reliability Corporation (NERC), a self-regulatory organization based in Princeton, New Jersey, whose stated mission is to "improve the reliability and security of the bulk power system in North America.
NERC works with eight Regional Reliability Councils that represent virtually all the electricity supplied in the United States, Canada, and a portion of Baja California Norte, Mexico

C'mon, you're such a smart Canadian and an engineer, figure it out: somewhere in North America that only uses hydro power (the lone nuclear plant is closing, and anyways, I'm way too far from it to ever have gotten any power from there).

So which location would that be, that`s too far to ever have gotten nuclear power ?

We got cottages right outside Winnipeg too, along the Lake that are not connected to the main grid and run their own generator...but you did say that you are on the power grid and that you get supplied only with hydro-power.

Also,...you don`t seem to realize that the fuel we do burn also came from bio-matter just like these bio-fuels that we should switch over to.
The only difference is that the conversion process happened in caverns a few 1000 meters below the surface with no additional energy input and not on the surface where it takes 4700 btu`s to make 1 liter of bio- ethanol fuel.

You might as well oppose the water that comes out of our faucets and demand we make synthetic water.

 

[ima]

Only if those fuels are as efficient and less damaging to produce than the fossil fuels they are replacing...which so far none are. Look past the perception dude...look at the reality of what you are talking about.

Take this bio jet fuel that obummer has mandated we use (no doubt getting some major kickbacks froms his pals who produce it) in our military aircraft. It costs 35 dollars a gallon as opposed to 4 dollars and it is more environmentally damaging to produce.

Does that make even the slightest sense to you?

I think that the research... done today on alternate fuels will help down the line, like you say, today it doesn't seem to make sense yet, but it's just like we'll never get to fission power if we don't due the research...
If we can find a way to use farming waste like corn stalks and other plant materials that just get thrown away, we'll have something.

We got fission power ever since you were born. If you don`t know the difference between fission and fusion power you would also have no idea how much more energy is involved to make 1 liter of "bio-ethanol" than you get out of it.
That blunder was just as funny as:

North American electricity grid

The North American electricity grid is the world's largest and most complex system of power generation, transmission, and distribution. The grid delivers electricity to almost all the people in the U.S., Canada and a portion of Baja California Norte, Mexico. This market generates an electricity demand of about 830 gigawatts (GW) (830,000 megawatts). The North American grid has 211,000 miles (340,000 km) of high-voltage transmission line (230,000 volts and greater)
The U.S. operates about 10,000 power plants and another approximately 5,600 distributed energy facilities.
The high-voltage transmission system carries electricity from the power plants and transmits it up to hundreds of miles away. High voltage is used for transmission lines to minimize electrical losses.

In essence, the power from many power plants is "pooled" in the transmission system, and each distribution system draws from this pool.

the Eastern and Western Interconnects are strongly interconnected with Canada. All electric utilities in the mainland United States are connected with at least one other utility via these power grids. Within each interconnect, power flows through AC lines, so all generators are tightly synchronized to the same 60-Hz cycle.

The grid is managed by the North American Electric Reliability Corporation (NERC), a self-regulatory organization based in Princeton, New Jersey, whose stated mission is to "improve the reliability and security of the bulk power system in North America.
NERC works with eight Regional Reliability Councils that represent virtually all the electricity supplied in the United States, Canada, and a portion of Baja California Norte, Mexico

C'mon, you're such a smart Canadian and an engineer, figure it out: somewhere in North America that only uses hydro power (the lone nuclear plant is closing, and anyways, I'm way too far from it to ever have gotten any power from there).

So which location would that be, that`s too far to ever have gotten nuclear power ?

We got cottages right outside Winnipeg too, along the Lake that are not connected to the main grid and run their own generator...but you did say that you are on the power grid and that you get supplied only with hydro-power.

Ok, I wrote the wrong word, it should have been fusion. EXCUUUUSSSEEE ME!

You assumed because I'm American that I live in the US. Hint: poutine!!!!!

 

[polarbear]

I think that the research... done today on alternate fuels will help down the line, like you say, today it doesn't seem to make sense yet, but it's just like we'll never get to fission power if we don't due the research...
If we can find a way to use farming waste like corn stalks and other plant materials that just get thrown away, we'll have something.

We got fission power ever since you were born. If you don`t know the difference between fission and fusion power you would also have no idea how much more energy is involved to make 1 liter of "bio-ethanol" than you get out of it.
That blunder was just as funny as:

C'mon, you're such a smart Canadian and an engineer, figure it out: somewhere in North America that only uses hydro power (the lone nuclear plant is closing, and anyways, I'm way too far from it to ever have gotten any power from there).

So which location would that be, that`s too far to ever have gotten nuclear power ?

We got cottages right outside Winnipeg too, along the Lake that are not connected to the main grid and run their own generator...but you did say that you are on the power grid and that you get supplied only with hydro-power.

Ok, I wrote the wrong word, it should have been fusion. EXCUUUUSSSEEE ME!

You assumed because I'm American that I live in the US. Hint: poutine!!!!!

Yes how silly of me to assume that you are living in a developed and industrial nation and had access to modern technology..
Now I know that I should have not given you the benefit of the doubt when you also said that..:

I also have a natural source for my water and it flows by gravity through my house!!!!!!

In North America we don`t have a creek flowing through our house.
We have pipes faucets, sinks , bath tubs and showers.
And we flush our toilets into different pipes when that water leaves.
From there it goes to a sewage treatment plant.
You`rs goes straight into that vegetable garden you mentioned, which supplies all your food?

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

 

[ima]

We got fission power ever since you were born. If you don`t know the difference between fission and fusion power you would also have no idea how much more energy is involved to make 1 liter of "bio-ethanol" than you get out of it.
That blunder was just as funny as:
So which location would that be, that`s too far to ever have gotten nuclear power ?

We got cottages right outside Winnipeg too, along the Lake that are not connected to the main grid and run their own generator...but you did say that you are on the power grid and that you get supplied only with hydro-power.

Ok, I wrote the wrong word, it should have been fusion. EXCUUUUSSSEEE ME!

You assumed because I'm American that I live in the US. Hint: poutine!!!!!

Yes how silly of me to assume that you are living in a developed and industrial nation and had access to modern technology..
Now I know that I should have not given you the benefit of the doubt when you also said that..:

I also have a natural source for my water and it flows by gravity through my house!!!!!!

In North America we don`t have a creek flowing through our house.
We have pipes faucets, sinks , bath tubs and showers.
And we flush our toilets into different pipes when that water leaves.
From there it goes to a sewage treatment plant.
You`rs goes straight into that vegetable garden you mentioned, which supplies all your food?

I doubt that your carbon footprint is smaller than mine, I own 55 acres of undisturbed forest, and my partner's family, about 200 acres. Plus, I'm a vegetarian, are you? Also, my electricity comes from hydro power, not coal... Can you say the same?

I have a natural source for my water that gathers in a pool above my house up the mountain and a pipe brings it down through gravity to my house, DUH! So if the power goes out I still have water. And then it goes out through my septic tank. We don't have city treated water in our town at all.
I also grow vegetables, but not all that I need, no.

And poutine is modern technology for sure!