Gov. Rick Scott Rejects Funding for High Speed Rail.

[Sarah G]

I think high speed rail from Miami and Tampa with Orlando being the hub would do fine.
Then later make a line from Orlando to Atlanta.

and what about those communities in between?
the ones that will have the tracks and the noise, but the trains wont stop there, or if they DO stop, BOOM, there goes the "high speed"

What communities would those be? There is virtually nothing between Miami and Orlando once you get away from the coast.

Scott is a toad. I would certainly use this train as would a gazillion south American tourists.

Scott is a tool and he might be beginning to understand this right about now. Here is where we begin to create jobs, jobs, jobs AND millions would use it.

 

[DiveCon]

and what about those communities in between?
the ones that will have the tracks and the noise, but the trains wont stop there, or if they DO stop, BOOM, there goes the "high speed"

What communities would those be? There is virtually nothing between Miami and Orlando once you get away from the coast.

Scott is a toad. I would certainly use this train as would a gazillion south American tourists.

Scott is a tool and he might be beginning to understand this right about now. Here is where we begin to create jobs, jobs, jobs AND millions would use it.

typical, both you and ravi have no clue on the realities of this

 

[The T]

how would it be "beneficial" to add an additional cost to the tax base to run a train system that would fail otherwise?

I am not sure what your question has to do with my post

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

 

[DiveCon]

I am not sure what your question has to do with my post

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

hey, more government employees that could unionize

a double whammy

 

[The T]

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

hey, more government employees that could unionize

a double whammy

Exactly.

 

[Sarah G]

I am not sure what your question has to do with my post

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

 

[DiveCon]

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

sorry, that was the congress that got booted out on their ASS last election


btw, this story has ZERO to do with congress

 

[Sarah G]

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

sorry, that was the congress that got booted out on their ASS last election


btw, this story has ZERO to do with congress

You're right, jobs has zero to do with this congress.

 

[The T]

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

Ongoing Gubmint Susidized a-la AMTRAK you mean.

 

[DiveCon]

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

sorry, that was the congress that got booted out on their ASS last election


btw, this story has ZERO to do with congress

You're right, jobs has zero to do with this congress.

you cant understand the facts sarah, but thats nothing NEW for you, is it?

 

[Toro]

I'm not sure if a high-speed train makes sense. I don't know if there would be enough of a ridership for it.

Instead, if they were dying to spend the money, it might be better to beef up commuter rail service on the southeast coast from Miami to West Palm. It can be a bitch driving down there.

 

[Toro]

I really don't think this makes much sense, to be honest. The train works best when there is a high density of people and cities are condensed. You don't need a car to get around in NY, Boston or Washington for example. But the Florida cities really aren't like that. For the most part, Florida is spread out, with lots of wide roads and suburbs. You really don't have the infrastructure in Tampa and Orlando to ferry people around the cities because there extensive networks of highways, though it might work in Miami. FFS, driving the 50 miles north of St Petersburg along Hwy 19 is a bitch because it is all suburb after suburb. The drive from Tampa to Orlando can be a nightmare though.

 

[The T]

I really don't think this makes much sense, to be honest. The train works best when there is a high density of people and cities are condensed. You don't need a car to get around in NY, Boston or Washington for example. But the Florida cities really aren't like that. For the most part, Florida is spread out, with lots of wide roads and suburbs. You really don't have the infrastructure in Tampa and Orlando to ferry people around the cities because there extensive networks of highways, though it might work in Miami. FFS, driving the 50 miles north of St Petersburg along Hwy 19 is a bitch because it is all suburb after suburb. The drive from Tampa to Orlando can be a nightmare though.

Agreed. As to the large cities that have the need (and frankly forced into mass transit such as Amtrak's Acelea for congestion woes) I would have to agree. AMTRAK continues to lose money however...

 

[Immanuel]

What communities would those be? There is virtually nothing between Miami and Orlando once you get away from the coast.

Scott is a toad. I would certainly use this train as would a gazillion south American tourists.

ah, the "fly-over people"
they dont matter

You haven't driven from Tampa-Orlando-Miami before have you? A lot of Florida is just wilderness. For example if you were to drive from Tampa to Miami, you'd come accross a stretch of highway with literally no exits (1 gas station in the middle, maybe a couple rest stops every now and then), for about 85 miles or so.

It wouldn't bother nearly anybody if it were built from Tampa to Orlando to Miami-it would be relatively easy to build it where it wouldn't interfere with towns. Those people could also take full advantage of it. If you live in the middle of Tampa and Orlando for example-you would be half hour-absolute TOPS-away from the train station.

PS-How can I speak on behalf of "fly-over people"? Well I can't speak for all of them-but I can speak for one-myself.

I heard yesterday, they were considering a stop in Lakeland, probably one in Plant City as well. I have not heard this, but my guess is Brandon too. Brandon is a suburb of Tampa. Lakeland is roughly 25 miles from Tampa with Plant City in between the two. So three stops in 25 miles? There is not much between Lakeland and Orlando. From Orlando to Miami would depend upon the route taken. If it goes down the center of the state there are plenty of small towns such as Sebring and Avon Park. If it pushes out to the coast there would be dozens of places to stop.

My personal opinion is that HSR is a great idea, however, I am afraid that the federal government cannot afford to take this project on the right way which would be to take it all the way across the country. Tampa/Orlando/Miami won't do anything for the nation as a whole.

The U.S. simply does not need to add trillions more to its deficit for this project.

Immie

 

[The T]

ah, the "fly-over people"
they dont matter

You haven't driven from Tampa-Orlando-Miami before have you? A lot of Florida is just wilderness. For example if you were to drive from Tampa to Miami, you'd come accross a stretch of highway with literally no exits (1 gas station in the middle, maybe a couple rest stops every now and then), for about 85 miles or so.

It wouldn't bother nearly anybody if it were built from Tampa to Orlando to Miami-it would be relatively easy to build it where it wouldn't interfere with towns. Those people could also take full advantage of it. If you live in the middle of Tampa and Orlando for example-you would be half hour-absolute TOPS-away from the train station.

PS-How can I speak on behalf of "fly-over people"? Well I can't speak for all of them-but I can speak for one-myself.

I heard yesterday, they were considering a stop in Lakeland, probably one in Plant City as well. I have not heard this, but my guess is Brandon too. Brandon is a suburb of Tampa. Lakeland is roughly 25 miles from Tampa with Plant City in between the two. So three stops in 25 miles? There is not much between Lakeland and Orlando. From Orlando to Miami would depend upon the route taken. If it goes down the center of the state there are plenty of small towns such as Sebring and Avon Park. If it pushes out to the coast there would be dozens of places to stop.

My personal opinion is that HSR is a great idea, however, I am afraid that the federal government cannot afford to take this project on the right way which would be to take it all the way across the country. Tampa/Orlando/Miami won't do anything for the nation as a whole.

The U.S. simply does not need to add trillions more to its deficit for this project.

Immie

No it won't. It will probably interface with AMTRAK...or other modes...

 

[DiveCon]

You haven't driven from Tampa-Orlando-Miami before have you? A lot of Florida is just wilderness. For example if you were to drive from Tampa to Miami, you'd come accross a stretch of highway with literally no exits (1 gas station in the middle, maybe a couple rest stops every now and then), for about 85 miles or so.

It wouldn't bother nearly anybody if it were built from Tampa to Orlando to Miami-it would be relatively easy to build it where it wouldn't interfere with towns. Those people could also take full advantage of it. If you live in the middle of Tampa and Orlando for example-you would be half hour-absolute TOPS-away from the train station.

PS-How can I speak on behalf of "fly-over people"? Well I can't speak for all of them-but I can speak for one-myself.

I heard yesterday, they were considering a stop in Lakeland, probably one in Plant City as well. I have not heard this, but my guess is Brandon too. Brandon is a suburb of Tampa. Lakeland is roughly 25 miles from Tampa with Plant City in between the two. So three stops in 25 miles? There is not much between Lakeland and Orlando. From Orlando to Miami would depend upon the route taken. If it goes down the center of the state there are plenty of small towns such as Sebring and Avon Park. If it pushes out to the coast there would be dozens of places to stop.

My personal opinion is that HSR is a great idea, however, I am afraid that the federal government cannot afford to take this project on the right way which would be to take it all the way across the country. Tampa/Orlando/Miami won't do anything for the nation as a whole.

The U.S. simply does not need to add trillions more to its deficit for this project.

Immie

No it won't. It will probably interface with AMTRAK...or other modes...

Amtrak already services these exact areas

 

[asterism]

and what about those communities in between?
the ones that will have the tracks and the noise, but the trains wont stop there, or if they DO stop, BOOM, there goes the "high speed"

What communities would those be? There is virtually nothing between Miami and Orlando once you get away from the coast.

Scott is a toad. I would certainly use this train as would a gazillion south American tourists.

Scott is a tool and he might be beginning to understand this right about now. Here is where we begin to create jobs, jobs, jobs AND millions would use it.

$4 Billion to create 20,000 temporary jobs and then untold other millions in state and local government expense to create 10,000 maintenance jobs is not a sound policy.

 

[asterism]

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

hey, more government employees that could unionize

a double whammy

It's more sinister than that. It's a federal intrusion into a regional issue for nothing but political power. It's like MARTA in Atlanta. Too big to undo, too inefficient to pay for itself, and now too many people are dependent on it.

 

[asterism]

really?
you are saying that investors wouldnt build a train
if investors wouldnt build it, it would be because there is no profit potential
thus having the government build it would mean it would never be self sufficient and would require constant government funding
thus is become a burden on the tax base and NOT "Beneficial"

Exactly. If there is a market demand for these things private industry would have done it, or woud be seeking investors.

All this si is trying to spend our way out of debt for what? Temporary jobs? Another losing proposition as AMTRAK?

Temporary? This could take a generation and then be ongoing work for a lot of people.

If congress ever starts thinking about jobs rather than how big and hard they can screw working people, they might actually earn their own keep.

Instead of doing make-work, how about just pass out the money?

 

[asterism]

ah, the "fly-over people"
they dont matter

You haven't driven from Tampa-Orlando-Miami before have you? A lot of Florida is just wilderness. For example if you were to drive from Tampa to Miami, you'd come accross a stretch of highway with literally no exits (1 gas station in the middle, maybe a couple rest stops every now and then), for about 85 miles or so.

It wouldn't bother nearly anybody if it were built from Tampa to Orlando to Miami-it would be relatively easy to build it where it wouldn't interfere with towns. Those people could also take full advantage of it. If you live in the middle of Tampa and Orlando for example-you would be half hour-absolute TOPS-away from the train station.

PS-How can I speak on behalf of "fly-over people"? Well I can't speak for all of them-but I can speak for one-myself.

I heard yesterday, they were considering a stop in Lakeland, probably one in Plant City as well. I have not heard this, but my guess is Brandon too. Brandon is a suburb of Tampa. Lakeland is roughly 25 miles from Tampa with Plant City in between the two. So three stops in 25 miles? There is not much between Lakeland and Orlando. From Orlando to Miami would depend upon the route taken. If it goes down the center of the state there are plenty of small towns such as Sebring and Avon Park. If it pushes out to the coast there would be dozens of places to stop.

My personal opinion is that HSR is a great idea, however, I am afraid that the federal government cannot afford to take this project on the right way which would be to take it all the way across the country. Tampa/Orlando/Miami won't do anything for the nation as a whole.

The U.S. simply does not need to add trillions more to its deficit for this project.

Immie

And since there is no way to get anywhere from any of those stops without a car it won't be used for any local traffic. It's slower, more expensive, and one still needs a car.

The long term prospect of having high speed rail from Tampa International Airport, one stop in Lakeland at the new college and technology center being built, one stop at the Orlando Convention Center/Disney Megaplex, and one stop at Orlando International Airport does make sense. But it's going to take 30 years or more for the traffic trends to support that ridership and in the meantime it would be much cheaper to develop the right of way as a set of private lanes with limousines ferrying all that traffic.

But then again it would be more cost effective to replace most of the bus systems out here with town cars used on-demand in taxi queue. It's not done that way because it would remove an entire government department.