Good and evil

[Avatar4321]

If you need the fear of eternal damnation to teach that it's wrong to harm the innocent then I applaud you for resisting your urges and participating in organized religion.

If there is no good or evil then innocence doesn't exist.

 

[Avatar4321]

How do we define good and evil if there is no higher power? Been thinking about this today.

What is good if there is nothing absolute? One would need to accept at least some form of natural law in the universe for their to be even and idea of good or evil. And if they don't exist, then how can we claim any action is good or evil?

What's a higher power have to do with whether good and evil exist? By all accounts, God is the personification of evil and hypocrisy. Orders people to do his dirtywork throughout the Tanach, things which by modern standards would have you on trial at the Hague. Kill every inhabitant of a city if just 1 person in it worships any but God? That's not a 'good' deity.

In order for good and evil to exist there has to be a standard or a law to distinguish them. That standard, or law, would be a higher power. Something outside ourselves governing the universe.

 

[Avatar4321]

How do we define good and evil if there is no higher power? Been thinking about this today.

What is good if there is nothing absolute? One would need to accept at least some form of natural law in the universe for their to be even and idea of good or evil. And if they don't exist, then how can we claim any action is good or evil?

By human consensus. That's how "evil" has been defined.

"natural law in the universe" is called science and mathematics.

So if we take a vote and all determine rape and murder is no longer evil but is not good, it becomes so?

 

[Avatar4321]

It would be all relative.

Without a higher power .... everything is self-defined.

Realistically, evil is simply the absence of good..... just as dark is the absence of light.....

Bonzi,
however in physical light comes less gland activity thus less intuitive less knowledge and clearity of thought (spiritual darkness), while physical darkness brings more intuitive though knowledge and clear thought (spiritual light). Not everything is what it seems, discerning requires ability to recognize the subtle nuances and be able to rationalise what is truly good and evil not based on affiliation pride, human ego, or what seems good and what sems evil, which brings us back to my reply as to how we recognize right and wrong without twists, confusions, subjective opinions. Remember people twist death for life, Lucifer for Moshiach, so trusting their ability to comprehend absence of good still requires them non subjective comprehension of what is good. Otherwise affiliation pride can blind and twist even the simplest and obvious acts(actions).

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Im saying that i dont know if theres a god or not, and with that, my intellect can lead to imagining a circumstance where if god DOESNT exist, good and evil still do.

Then you're lying to yourself. Which is evil btw

 

[Mudda]

How do we define good and evil if there is no higher power? Been thinking about this today.

What is good if there is nothing absolute? One would need to accept at least some form of natural law in the universe for their to be even and idea of good or evil. And if they don't exist, then how can we claim any action is good or evil?

By human consensus. That's how "evil" has been defined.

"natural law in the universe" is called science and mathematics.

So if we take a vote and all determine rape and murder is no longer evil but is not good, it becomes so?

Go for it, you won't be able to get that to pass. Evil can only be determined by humans, since humans are all there is to determine such things. Pretty simple really.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

How do we define good and evil if there is no higher power? Been thinking about this today.

What is good if there is nothing absolute? One would need to accept at least some form of natural law in the universe for their to be even and idea of good or evil. And if they don't exist, then how can we claim any action is good or evil?

What's a higher power have to do with whether good and evil exist? By all accounts, God is the personification of evil and hypocrisy. Orders people to do his dirtywork throughout the Tanach, things which by modern standards would have you on trial at the Hague. Kill every inhabitant of a city if just 1 person in it worships any but God? That's not a 'good' deity.

In order for good and evil to exist there has to be a standard or a law to distinguish them. That standard, or law, would be a higher power. Something outside ourselves governing the universe.

Looking at the universe, there's nothing governing it in the sense of good or evil. If interstellar radiation doesn't kill you, hypervelocity impacts will, if not that an eruption of a nearby star will irradiate and kill you, if not that, a wandering black hole will suck you in, or supernova, gamma ray bursts, or you'll simply get lost in space and die from hopelessness.

There's no order or governance in the universe. It's a dangerous deadly place. That life can exist at all is remarkable, but the balance seems to be in how many ways life can be extinguished.

Good and evil are just words we've coined to describe events and actions. But they're highly dependent upon the observer's own point of view. An identical actions can be accurately described as either good or evil depending on who's describing it. As with a soldier killing his enemy vs a terrorist killing his. Identical actions, different motives, different sides, and thus different words to describe the act of killing your enemy. Yet to the opposite-side, the same act is the opposite term. To the terrorist, the soldier's 'good' killing of his terrorist buddy is evil, not good. Thus the subjectivity.

 

[Bonzi]

It would be all relative.

Without a higher power .... everything is self-defined.

Realistically, evil is simply the absence of good..... just as dark is the absence of light.....

Bonzi,
however in physical light comes less gland activity thus less intuitive less knowledge and clearity of thought (spiritual darkness), while physical darkness brings more intuitive though knowledge and clear thought (spiritual light). Not everything is what it seems, discerning requires ability to recognize the subtle nuances and be able to rationalise what is truly good and evil not based on affiliation pride, human ego, or what seems good and what sems evil, which brings us back to my reply as to how we recognize right and wrong without twists, confusions, subjective opinions. Remember people twist death for life, Lucifer for Moshiach, so trusting their ability to comprehend absence of good still requires them non subjective comprehension of what is good. Otherwise affiliation pride can blind and twist even the simplest and obvious acts(actions).

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

 

[TyroneSlothrop]

In eternal blackness, in the midst of the darkest night
Proteins and minerals, exist within specks of light
Solids liquids and gases, and sparks of light within
infinite lengths and widths and depths and heights
No beginning or ending, the seven dimensions
Enough space for more than a million words and inventions
To travel through time within enough room to be the womb
of the most high's great mind which he will soon make shine
With intelligent elements in sight that he will gather
In the realms of relativity electricity struck matter
Energies explode he below to keep releasin
Atoms by the millions, til the numbers increasin
Til it was burnin he kept returnin itself to the source
The hotter his thoughts it gave the center more force
He gave birth to the sun which would follow his laws
All caused by his mental intercourse, who is God?

 

[Mudda]

Bonzi,
however in physical light comes less gland activity thus less intuitive less knowledge and clearity of thought (spiritual darkness), while physical darkness brings more intuitive though knowledge and clear thought (spiritual light). Not everything is what it seems, discerning requires ability to recognize the subtle nuances and be able to rationalise what is truly good and evil not based on affiliation pride, human ego, or what seems good and what sems evil, which brings us back to my reply as to how we recognize right and wrong without twists, confusions, subjective opinions. Remember people twist death for life, Lucifer for Moshiach, so trusting their ability to comprehend absence of good still requires them non subjective comprehension of what is good. Otherwise affiliation pride can blind and twist even the simplest and obvious acts(actions).

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

 

[Bonzi]

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

Well either he has and you pushed him away
Or he has not yet, but will.....

 

[HaShev]

Bonzi,
however in physical light comes less gland activity thus less intuitive less knowledge and clearity of thought (spiritual darkness), while physical darkness brings more intuitive though knowledge and clear thought (spiritual light). Not everything is what it seems, discerning requires ability to recognize the subtle nuances and be able to rationalise what is truly good and evil not based on affiliation pride, human ego, or what seems good and what sems evil, which brings us back to my reply as to how we recognize right and wrong without twists, confusions, subjective opinions. Remember people twist death for life, Lucifer for Moshiach, so trusting their ability to comprehend absence of good still requires them non subjective comprehension of what is good. Otherwise affiliation pride can blind and twist even the simplest and obvious acts(actions).

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

Is that the same reality you just avoided and hid from?
I asked you a simple question, which means you are avoiding and hiding or you can't comprehend what you read to discern nor follow instructions. So which is your faulty nature that affects your ability to discern what is right or wrong without it being based on affiliation brainwashing?

 

[September]

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

One cannot expect to discover without searching
​

 

[Bonzi]

It is difficult for me to think "outside" a higher being (in my case, the Holy Trinity) because, without God, there is no possibility for any "good" -

Perhaps if there were never any God or creator, people would not even think of terms of good or bad..... it may be a life we simply can not even fathom.....

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

Is that the same reality you just avoided and hid from?
I asked you a simple question, which means you are avoiding and hiding or you can't comprehend what you read to discern nor follow instructions. So which is your faulty nature that affects your ability to discern what is right or wrong without it being based on affiliation brainwashing?

I could turn the tables and say the same about you.
But because people can't see (and therefore, can not comprehend) the truth creates a frustration.
It's easier to write someone off as ignorant or crazy.....

 

[Mudda]

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

Well either he has and you pushed him away
Or he has not yet, but will.....

Like I'd push an invisible alien away.

 

[HaShev]

I can walk you through how there is good without a god needing to exist, bonzi. Or you can youtube sam harris speaking on morals ... i kind if share his take except im not an atheist, im an "i dont knowist."

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

Is that the same reality you just avoided and hid from?
I asked you a simple question, which means you are avoiding and hiding or you can't comprehend what you read to discern nor follow instructions. So which is your faulty nature that affects your ability to discern what is right or wrong without it being based on affiliation brainwashing?

I could turn the tables and say the same about you.
But because people can't see (and therefore, can not comprehend) the truth creates a frustration.
It's easier to write someone off as ignorant or crazy.....

None of what you said pertains to the conversation, and yet it proves my point.
Your assertion is subjective, your enemies assertion is subjective, you both assume you're in the right, the other in the wrong and yet you are both wrong and you'll never admit it due to affiliation pride and your failed human ego. Once again you failed to read and answer the simple questions I asked.

 

[Mudda]

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

One cannot expect to discover without searching
​

It is like hide and seek? Do I count to ten?

 

[September]

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

One cannot expect to discover without searching​

It is like hide and seek? Do I count to ten?

YHWH is the ultimate power, the ultimate freedom, the ultimate life, the ultimate evolution, the ultimate Nature. The ultimate Force. Unrivaled powers of destruction, unrivaled powers of creation.

If you have no desire to reach out to that, than don't. The ability to connect is there, in all of us, but if it isn't your Will to experience God(s)... the link will never be forged.

​

 

[Mudda]

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

One cannot expect to discover without searching​

It is like hide and seek? Do I count to ten?

YHWH is the ultimate power, the ultimate freedom, the ultimate life, the ultimate evolution, the ultimate Nature. The ultimate Force. Unrivaled powers of destruction, unrivaled powers of creation.

If you have no desire to reach out to that, than don't. The ability to connect is there, in all of us, but if it isn't your Will to experience God(s)... the link will never be forged.

​

So if I don't reach out, I go to hell?

 

[Bonzi]

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

Is that the same reality you just avoided and hid from?
I asked you a simple question, which means you are avoiding and hiding or you can't comprehend what you read to discern nor follow instructions. So which is your faulty nature that affects your ability to discern what is right or wrong without it being based on affiliation brainwashing?

I could turn the tables and say the same about you.
But because people can't see (and therefore, can not comprehend) the truth creates a frustration.
It's easier to write someone off as ignorant or crazy.....

None of what you said pertains to the conversation, and yet it proves my point.
Your assertion is subjective, your enemies assertion is subjective, you both assume you're in the right, the other in the wrong and yet you are both wrong and you'll never admit it due to affiliation pride and your failed human ego. Once again you failed to read and answer the simple questions I asked.

Ask me one direct question in one sentence like I'm a 5 y/o and I'll answer.
Doesn't need to be complex and flowery....

 

[Bonzi]

It's impossible. If you are a believer (like I am) that none of this universe etc. is possible without God, it's incomprehensible how it could or WOULD be otherwise.

You're still basing it on knowledge of what we know NOW which, very directly involved God.
You can NOT remove Him from the equation.....

Unless you are a steadfast Athiest and then, you already have your answer....

Bonzi, however if you can't properly discern and define God (power & source of life) then your concept of right & wrong is based on affiliation into an error or can be evil without knowing it's evil, just as Radicals don't think they are doing evil.
Without comprehension to your positioning (path) blindfolded in a gyro you can point up assuming it's the sky, however if you don't know you're facing down (positioned opposite) you would be pointing to the ground. Therefore you need a mediator that defines that Essence power of life so you can reflect and manifest that Essence.
Your faith accidentally combines your imposter mediator with your god, neither which leads you to the proper path or understanding because "you receive from the wrong message & false messengers."
Which is why humanity has failed and why we suffer fallen off our purpose and course, still not complete nor whole far from the kingdom of Shalem and thus outside the walls of the kingdom & into Gehinom (trash heap of life).
In Judaism you have those who bestow and those always taking instead of giving, we call this "receiving" nature.
We try to sway society into the bestowing nature over the receiving nature.
The serving of an Icon has not changed our lopsided nature. Moshiach is a servant to humanity not served by it. Thus called messenger(malakh) and mediator(meditron). "You are programed to receive the message", but it's up to you to discern which side does that message come from. Is it towards Shalem or lead you away or in opposition to Shalem?

I'll give you an example, I've been trying to get people to tell me their favorite song to show how messages can be sent.
Nobody participated, I have no idea why.
I'll put a Shalem (evening star-Night-slayer of the beast) message in your Mom's favorite song for you, If Jesus is who he says he is he'll put his morning star-day message in your father's favorite song, and the imposter mediator the Pope will place his Baal message in your favorite song.
Now tell us their favorite songs and once and for all discern who is the messenger and who is the fraud.

The bottom line is the there IS a reality. A truth.
What man has taught you is fallible.
What God reveals to you, is inerrant.

God reveals himself (THE one true God) to everyone at some point in their lives.

God hasn't revealed himself to me yet. What now?

Well either he has and you pushed him away
Or he has not yet, but will.....

Like I'd push an invisible alien away.

Well you won't be open minded with me... you just want to be silly