God... Is Time.

[Hollie]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Well, yes we can observe the present. I have no reason to accept that your invented version bossy physics / faith in gawds is a requirement for our perception of reality.

And yes, it is a simple matter for science to test and measure something that cannot be observed: gravity is one such example. Here's a bit of enlightenment for you: nothing about gravity proves your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

 

[Boss]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Our perception is literally the observation ****

We have faith that it is.

 

[edthecynic]

Again, something doesn't have to be visible to be observable. We observe the effects of gravity and that's what gravity is. Electromagnetism, same deal. You are ignorantly misinterpreting "vision" and "sight" to mean observation. There are many things that are not visible, that we cannot see, but we can still observe them.

Not according to Bossy's stupid Law of Observation. Any effect of gravity we try to observe takes time, due to physics, to reach our eyes and therefore does not exist in the present to be observed. For example, if we observe a falling body, due to physics we cannot know except by faith that the body is actually falling.

Wrong.

If you try to observe a falling body without time, does the body fall? No. The moment of present time is not a period of time, it is a specific point in time. Time doesn't pass during the present. You can't observe anything until physics happens. It doesn't matter that you can't observe gravity in the present, nothing can be observed in the present, there is no time for anything to be observed. The present is a point in time, not a period of time.

Wrong.

According to the ignorant BOOB Bossy, you cannot observe a falling body, you only have faith that it is falling because, due to physics, during the time it takes the light from the falling body to reach your eye and then for your brain to process the perception, the body could be rising or even disappear along with the rest of the universe.

 

[MaryL]

I just read something on relativity, physicists believe time is another dimension like the X, Y, or Z axis in space. And time is like the groves on a record player, it exist in it's entity all at once. Time is an illusion, like the needle of a record player playing a grove, and humans are like the needles of that record player. That groove existed all the time, we just follow it. Not God, definitely not.

 

[Boss]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Well, yes we can observe the present. I have no reason to accept that your invented version bossy physics / faith in gawds is a requirement for our perception of reality.

And yes, it is a simple matter for science to test and measure something that cannot be observed: gravity is one such example. Here's a bit of enlightenment for you: nothing about gravity proves your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

No we can't observe the present. We can have a perception of the present which arrives after the fact and we can have faith this perception represents the present. You've presented nothing from science or physics to refute this and you can't.

Gravity doesn't come from the Magic Spaghetti Monster of Gravity in the sky, it is a physical force that we can observe, test and measure. The same applies to Electromagnetism. And again, if you've unlocked the formula for science to test and measure what cannot be observed, you have unlocked the greatest enigma of mankind.. a scientific formula for God. Oops!

 

[MaryL]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Well, yes we can observe the present. I have no reason to accept that your invented version bossy physics / faith in gawds is a requirement for our perception of reality.

And yes, it is a simple matter for science to test and measure something that cannot be observed: gravity is one such example. Here's a bit of enlightenment for you: nothing about gravity proves your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

No we can't observe the present. We can have a perception of the present which arrives after the fact and we can have faith this perception represents the present. You've presented nothing from science or physics to refute this and you can't.

Gravity doesn't come from the Magic Spaghetti Monster of Gravity in the sky, it is a physical force that we can observe, test and measure. The same applies to Electromagnetism. And again, if you've unlocked the formula for science to test and measure what cannot be observed, you have unlocked the greatest enigma of mankind.. a scientific formula for God. Oops!

There within lay the eternal question a three year old might ask in Sunday school: WHAT made GOD? Well, wise guy?

 

[Boss]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Our perception is literally the observation ****

We have faith that it is.

No.

Its reality.

Comparing it to faith in god is nutter bullshit.

Your thread is retarded and ill continue to point it out until it dies. And youll continue to flail, change definitions, contradict yourself and be all around ignorant.

I've not changed or contradicted anything. My OP argument remains solid and irrefutable. You clearly understand that we can't physically observe the moment of present time, but that only puts you one small step ahead of Hollie Airbrains. You want to argue that our perception happening after-the-fact is just automatically confirmed to be accurate because, well just because you think it is. But if you cannot observe the present to confirm it, how do you know? You've still offered no explanation.

The answer is very simple. You have faith in your perception of the present. We all do, that's all we can have because we cannot observe the present. So you get that far and you want to start micromanaging faith, like it's some kind of commodity that varies. Faith is faith, you either have faith in something or you don't. If you want to play the odds game, I would say the odds of God existing is the same as the odds of present time existing as we perceive it.

 

[Hollie]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Well, yes we can observe the present. I have no reason to accept that your invented version bossy physics / faith in gawds is a requirement for our perception of reality.

And yes, it is a simple matter for science to test and measure something that cannot be observed: gravity is one such example. Here's a bit of enlightenment for you: nothing about gravity proves your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

No we can't observe the present. We can have a perception of the present which arrives after the fact and we can have faith this perception represents the present. You've presented nothing from science or physics to refute this and you can't.

Gravity doesn't come from the Magic Spaghetti Monster of Gravity in the sky, it is a physical force that we can observe, test and measure. The same applies to Electromagnetism. And again, if you've unlocked the formula for science to test and measure what cannot be observed, you have unlocked the greatest enigma of mankind.. a scientific formula for God. Oops!

Yes, we can observe the present. Your objection to that is your need to have a gap to squeeze your gawds into. You invent a scenario whereby your gawds are thus a requirement for existence.

The obvious flaw with your religious fundamentalist view of reality is that you have offered no evidence in support of your gawds.

 

[Boss]

There within lay the eternal question a three year old might ask in Sunday school: WHAT made GOD? Well, wise guy?

Well, this thread is not meant to be a theological argument on God. I made that clear in the OP and I've repeatedly tried to keep it out of the theology area because threads tend to get bogged down in the same old cliched arguments.

But because you asked in earnest, let me present MY OPINION... I believe in a spiritual God, not a physical one. When you say "made" it indicates to me something physical. I don't know that spiritual things require being "made" because they exist outside the scope of physics and don't require time. Spiritual God has always existed, it didn't require being created or "made."

 

[Boss]

Yes, we can observe the present.

No we can't and physics proves we can't. You're a goofball.

 

[MaryL]

Where DID God come from? Pulled himself out of his hat? Scary thing is, science doesn't know what caused the big bang, either. You can't get something out of nothing. Matter is like 99.99 percent nothing. Perhaps the multiverse doesn't need a God because perhaps, it just always existed.

 

[edthecynic]

The entire universe could simply disappear before another second passes because that's what happens to physical universes every 14.5 billion years and we didn't know that.

You could be "observing" a falling body, and poof!

 

[Boss]

I just read something on relativity, physicists believe time is another dimension like the X, Y, or Z axis in space. And time is like the groves on a record player, it exist in it's entity all at once. Time is an illusion, like the needle of a record player playing a grove, and humans are like the needles of that record player. That groove existed all the time, we just follow it. Not God, definitely not.

Not God, definitely not.

Not so fast... If our existence and universe is like a pre-recorded record, God is the greatest record producer in the history of history. What an amazing compilation! A masterpiece so beautiful it is beyond words.

 

[Boss]

Where DID God come from? Pulled himself out of his hat? Scary thing is, science doesn't know what caused the big bang, either. You can't get something out of nothing. Matter is like 99.99 percent nothing. Perhaps the multiverse doesn't need a God because perhaps, it just always existed.

God didn't "come from" anywhere because God is everywhere.

LOL.. Science currently doesn't even know if there WAS a big bang... that's all being revisited at this time due to new discoveries like the universe being 96% dark matter and dark energy, of which we know little about. The singularity was always problematic because it seemingly has to defy physics... this bugged the shit out of Stephen Hawking. He has spent the last 40 years disproving his own theory on singularity and the big bang.

Again... we're getting way off topic from the OP.

 

[Boss]

The entire universe could simply disappear before another second passes because that's what happens to physical universes every 14.5 billion years and we didn't know that.

You could be "observing" a falling body, and poof!

You could indeed. Our perception of it won't be until AFTER it happens.

 

[Hollie]

Of course we can observe the present.

Well... No we can't, Hollie. I've already explained why it's impossible and you seem to be the only person in the forum who doesn't understand it. We cannot observe the moment of present time. Physics has to give us a perception first, which takes time, which means the present is not observed.

We have a perception of the present and we have faith our perception is accurately depicting what the moment of present was. We can't confirm this because we cannot observe the present, we are bound by physics.

Again, for all you Einstein's in training out there... If you've found a way for Science or Physics to test and measure something that cannot be observed, you have unlocked the scientific formula for proving God. Let church bells ring, glory, glory, hallelujah!

I maintain that you have proven no such thing and you can't prove it.

Well, yes we can observe the present. I have no reason to accept that your invented version bossy physics / faith in gawds is a requirement for our perception of reality.

And yes, it is a simple matter for science to test and measure something that cannot be observed: gravity is one such example. Here's a bit of enlightenment for you: nothing about gravity proves your gawds or anyone else's gawds.

No we can't observe the present. We can have a perception of the present which arrives after the fact and we can have faith this perception represents the present. You've presented nothing from science or physics to refute this and you can't.

Gravity doesn't come from the Magic Spaghetti Monster of Gravity in the sky, it is a physical force that we can observe, test and measure. The same applies to Electromagnetism. And again, if you've unlocked the formula for science to test and measure what cannot be observed, you have unlocked the greatest enigma of mankind.. a scientific formula for God. Oops!

It's remarkable how bossy will completely confound and contradict his own fumbling attempts at argument. Give him enough time and he will eventually do a 180.

Earlier, bossy rattled on with his usual pontificating when he babbled:
"Science cannot evaluate that which cannot be observed."

He was repeatedly corrected and reminded that both gravity and electromagnetism are examples of things that can be evaluated but not observed. We now see bossy pontificating as he struggles to backstroke on his earlier pontificating as he now pontificates with pontification that refutes his earlier pontification:

"Gravity doesn't come from the Magic Spaghetti Monster of Gravity in the sky, it is a physical force that we can observe, test and measure."

Praise jeebus, bossy. Gravity actually does come from the gawds.

 

[Hollie]

The entire universe could simply disappear before another second passes because that's what happens to physical universes every 14.5 billion years and we didn't know that.

You could be "observing" a falling body, and poof!

You could indeed. Our perception of it won't be until AFTER it happens.

Except for our perception of the present time.

 

[MaryL]

I just read something on relativity, physicists believe time is another dimension like the X, Y, or Z axis in space. And time is like the groves on a record player, it exist in it's entity all at once. Time is an illusion, like the needle of a record player playing a grove, and humans are like the needles of that record player. That groove existed all the time, we just follow it. Not God, definitely not.

Not God, definitely not.

Not so fast... If our existence and universe is like a pre-recorded record, God is the greatest record producer in the history of history. What an amazing compilation! A masterpiece so beautiful it is beyond words.

That is Einstein talking about time, just paraphrasing a little. Time is an illusion caused by our senses. It is another dimension. That is all. I don't understand it well, either, times arrow is an trick of our senses, I will leave it there.