Global warming is speeding up.

[elektra]

No I didn't. This is you propping up a little strawman for yourself because you see that you are about to fall right off a cliff with your silly denial.

The fact that solar panels raise the temperature of the air around them is a strawman?
The fact that cars are hotter than the air temperature and that they then radiate that heat is a strawman?
The fact that you make a stupid comment and I call you out on it is a strawman?

Metal, Glass, Cars, Solar Panels, they will be hotter than the air. That is a fact. A greenhouse is hotter inside, than the air outside? Why is that?

Which do you wish to deny? All of it?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

You kicking Michael Mann out of the consensus?

No Oscar for you.

What about a Nobel?

You pretending his degree or Nobel actually matters to you?

Yes. Yes you are.

Will you do this for hours, to get attention?

Yes. Yes you will.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The fact that solar panels raise the temperature of the air around them is a strawman?

Oops, you did it again. Dude, you don't need message boards or other posters at all. You seem perfectly capable of having a conversation with your little dollies all night. Enjoy.

 

[elektra]

Oops, you did it again. Dude, you don't need message boards or other posters at all. You seem perfectly capable of having a conversation with your little dollies all night. Enjoy.

yes, but it is fun showing everyone else, that fort fun indiana can not articulate anything more than a three worded talking point.

Again, does a car get hotter than the air around it? Do metal objects get real hot in the sun? Does glass get hot to the touch?

Fort Fun Indaina seems to think miles and miles of solar panels will not get hot and radiate that heat into the air. That is my original comment. What have you done in response? Well, we see that right here. Instead of actually offering a fact or two, fort fun can only troll troll and troll

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Again, does a car get hotter than the air around it?

Yes, due to the greenhouse effect.

Thanks for the softball.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Fort Fun Indaina seems to think miles and miles of solar panels will not get hot and radiate that heat into the air.

Of course, I never said that. Just another one of this little guy's dollies he loves so much.

So, professor... explain where that heat would be, if no solar panels. Be VERY specific. Because this is going to be hilarious.

 

[elektra]

Yes, due to the greenhouse effect.

Thanks for the softball.

And so do solar panels, heating the desert, creating heat islands. Raising the temperature around the solar panels. Thank you finally agreeing

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

And so do solar panels, heating the desert, creating heat islands. Raising the temperature around the solar panels. Thank you finally agreeing

So, where is all that heat then, if there are no solar panels?

Be VERY specific.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

And so do solar panels, heating the desert, creating heat islands. Raising the temperature around the solar panels. Thank you finally agreeing

By the way: did you know the heat island effect of a huge solar farm is MUCH less than that of a modest sized urban area?

However, we don't think urban areas are raising the global temperature in any significant way, because that is more a matter of thermal energy being locally trapped, when otherwise it would disburse. And, frankly, they just are not that big compared to the entire planet.

now, I am giving you a chance to get out from under the very idiotic argument you are trying to make (that solar panels will contribute to global warming, or even global cooling). use this information wisely.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You pretending his degree or Nobel actually matters to you?

Yes, his Nobel Prize is very important to me.

Is it important to you?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Yes, his Nobel Prize is very important to me.

Is it important to you?

So important, i hope you talk about it for at least a few more days.

 

[elektra]

Of course, I never said that. Just another one of this little guy's dollies he loves so much.

So, professor... explain where that heat would be, if no solar panels. Be VERY specific. Because this is going to be hilarious.

Okay, I will be very specific, Ivanpah creates temperatures between 199 degrees Fahrenheit to more than 1000 degrees Fahrenheit.

If Ivanpah did not exist, those temperatures across six square miles of desert would not exist. If those temps did not exist, than hummingbirds, hawks, sparrows, owls and falcons would not be dying at Ivanpah due to the high temperatures in the air. If those temps were not artificially created, the desert surrounding Ivanpah would be at least 1 degree cooler. Instead, it is hotter. A heat island that can kill turtles.

Solar Plants May Make Deserts Too Hot For Tortoises

Our attempts to cool the planet may make the desert too hot for tortoises, according to a leading biologist.

www.kcet.org

According to Sinervo's abstract, the heat island effect of large solar arrays can raise ambient temperatures by between .4° and .75° Celsius, which works out to one degree Fahrenheit give or take a quarter degree. Given the amount of warming already locked in for the deserts by 2080, well before even the most aggressive likely climate change programs will start to affect global temperatures, that extra degree or so of warming will likely be enough to do in the tortoise.

well, we can see that miles and miles of solar certainly will raise the air temperature in the desert

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So important, i hope you talk about it for at least a few more days.

He is a pretty impressive guy. Kind of a deadbeat.........

 

[elektra]

By the way: did you know the heat island effect of a huge solar farm is MUCH less than that of a modest sized urban area?

However, we don't think urban areas are raising the global temperature in any significant way, because that is more a matter of thermal energy being locally trapped, when otherwise it would disburse. And, frankly, they just are not that big compared to the entire planet.

now, I am giving you a chance to get out from under the very idiotic argument you are trying to make (that solar panels will contribute to global warming, or even global cooling). use this information wisely.

did you know that the remote desert, was a desert with life, and now the area covered with miles of solar is no longer a desert, but an industrial site.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

If Ivanpah did not exist, those temperatures across six square miles of desert would not exist.

Yes, but that does not mean that thermal energy would not exist in our climate. It would not instead all be reflected into space. It just happens that the mirroring effect of the array is warming a local patch of air. The Earth is a big place. No, we don't want to cover it in solar panels. But Solar is going to get a much bigger share than it has now. And the tech will just get better

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

did you know that the remote desert, was a desert with life, and now the area covered with miles of solar is no longer a desert, but an industrial site.

Yes, true. The big ones are industrial sites. Same for coal plants.

 

[elektra]

Yes, but that does not mean that thermal energy would not exist in our climate. It would not instead all be reflected into space. It just happens that the mirroring effect of the array is warming a local patch of air. The Earth is a big place. No, we don't want to cover it in solar panels. But Solar is going to get a much bigger share than it has now. And the tech will just get better

a local patch measured by the square mile that is now no longer desert but an industrial solar site.

And those hundreds of square miles of warmed air, are carried away and dispersed, by the wind, warming more than just a local patch, as you put it.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

And those hundreds of square miles of warmed air, are carried away and dispersed, by the wind, warming more than just a local patch, as you put it

That tiny bit of reflected light is not warming the climate. The same amount of sunlight is coming in as if the solar array is not there. Any amount the earth might have absorbed instead is just radiated back into the atmosphere. And if there is any lensing effect, that just means one area is hotter at the expense of other areas.

 

[elektra]

That tiny bit of reflected light is not warming the climate. The same amount of sunlight is coming in as if the solar array is not there. Any amount the earth might have absorbed instead is just radiated back into the atmosphere. And if there is any lensing effect, that just means one area is hotter at the expense of other areas.

Tiny bit? We are now talking about square miles, Not tiny bits? How many square miles currently? In an area that was once, pristine wild desert habitat, and is now industrial scale solar.

Tiny bit? Who is fabricating little dollies now? We are speaking of areas in the square mile. A square foot is a tiny bit. A square mile is huge. 50 square miles of desert destroyed and turned into an industrial solar site, does raise the temperature. All that heat across over 50 square miles is absorbed the air and dispersed by the wind.

And that is just the beginning, there are many more solar projects racing to industrialize the desert.

Either way, you are not arguing with me, you are arguing with the scientists and engineers who create these solar farms, they are the experts that are now stating that, yes, they are heat islands.

[PDF] The Photovoltaic Heat Island Effect: Larger solar power plants increase local temperatures | Semantic Scholar

Examining the underlying cause and scale of the PVHI effect and identifying mitigation strategies are key in supporting decision-making regarding PV development, particularly in semiarid landscapes, which are among the most likely for large-scale PV installations. While photovoltaic (PV)...

www.semanticscholar.org

We found temperatures over a PV plant were regularly 3–4 °C warmer than wildlands at night, which is in direct contrast to other studies based on models that suggested that PV systems should decrease ambient temperatures.

 

[ding]

I would be surprised if you knew fuck all compared to a lifetime geologist, who is in the professional Society of geologists, which endorses the consensus on climate change

I would likely agree with him on everything but his conclusion of man made climate change. That's a conclusion based upon emotion. The data overwhelmingly shows that the earth has been cooling for over 50 million years and that that cooling took a step change 2.7 million years ago when the planet transitioned from a greenhouse planet to an icehouse planet.