Zone1 Freedoms and Liberties

[Blues Man]

It's OK, CremeBrulee understood and answered the question for me.

Now you can carry on with your silly little rant.

I did answer it, sheep.

You're just too dense to see that.

Maybe you should read more of the books your government allows you to read like the children's stories that are approved for the herd

 

[CremeBrulee]

You voluntarily subject yourself to being treated like children because you all obviously can't make even the most trivial decisions for yourself.

That needs to be reiterated. Just gonna leave it there again.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Without the criteria of the aspects that went into compiling this chart on wikipedia the conclusions are suspect at best

The fact is you people in the UK have fewer freedoms than an American.

You voluntarily subject yourself to being treated like children because you all obviously can't make even the most trivial decisions for yourself.

And it wasn't anecdotal your government routinely polices thought and speech on your little island

All countries impose laws in response to localised issues. In America Mr Assange is going on trial for exposing atrocities by American servicemen. Alex Jones will shortly be bankrupted for telling lies about mass shooting victims and on this board you cant use the N word.

In Germany you cannnot deny the holocaust.

In America a woman cannot get an abortion no matter her circumstances and the courts are looking to abolish Gay marriage.

I dont think you can set yourself u as champions of freedom any more.

 

[Blues Man]

All countries impose laws in response to localised issues. In America Mr Assange is going on trial for exposing atrocities by American servicemen. Alex Jones will shortly be bankrupted for telling lies about mass shooting victims and on this board you cant use the N word.

In Germany you cannnot deny the holocaust.

In America a woman cannot get an abortion no matter her circumstances and the courts are looking to abolish Gay marriage.

I dont think you can set yourself u as champions of freedom any more.

Military secrets are not the issue.

Alex Jones is getting sued civilly again not the issue

But in your country the people accusing libel do not have to prove the statements were false but rather the accused has to prove they are true. Which is ass backwards.

and I have never heard of any American getting years in prison for simple possessing a book

and FYI abortion will not be illegal in all states it will never be a federal law

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Military secrets are not the issue.

Alex Jones is getting sued civilly again not the issue

But in your country the people accusing libel do not have to prove the statements were false but rather the accused has to prove they are true. Which is ass backwards.

and I have never heard of any American getting years in prison for simple possessing a book

and FYI abortion will not be illegal in all states it will never be a federal law

"How to build a bomb" is not a book that people need to read.

In a libel case the plaintif is accusing the defendent of telling lies about them. They make their case and the defendent makes an opposing case.
the mechanics of it are not the problem. The costs are the problem.

 

[Blues Man]

"How to build a bomb" is not a book that people need to read.

In a libel case the plaintif is accusing the defendent of telling lies about them. They make their case and the defendent makes an opposing case.
the mechanics of it are not the problem. The costs are the problem.

That's your opinion. Like I said you all love being treated like children. It's not up to the government to tell you what books you "need" to read

And the UK reverses the burden of proof where the defendant must prove he did not lie.

In the US the accuser has to prove the defendant did lie.

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

www.huffpost.com

 

[Captain Caveman]

That's your opinion. Like I said you all love being treated like children. It's not up to the government to tell you what books you "need" to read

And the UK reverses the burden of proof where the defendant must prove he did not lie.

In the US the accuser has to prove the defendant did lie.

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

www.huffpost.com

It's obvious you don't have one iota of knowledge on Article 10 of the Human Rights Act 1998

 

[Tommy Tainant]

That's your opinion. Like I said you all love being treated like children. It's not up to the government to tell you what books you "need" to read

And the UK reverses the burden of proof where the defendant must prove he did not lie.

In the US the accuser has to prove the defendant did lie.

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

The U.S. and U.K. Have Some Surprising Differences in Their Laws

www.huffpost.com

Well, I have lived here all of my life and have said what I wanted and read what I wanted.


As far as I know Lady Chatterleys Lover was the last book that the government tried to ban. It went to trial and the government lost, and looked stupid into the bargain.That was in the 60s.

Perhaps you could give me a list of stuff I cant read ?

 

[alexa]

But in your country the people accusing libel do not have to prove the statements were false but rather the accused has to prove they are true. Which is ass backwards.

[/QUOTE]

Of course it is not. If you accuse someone of something, you have to be able to prove it. This is often more true if it is an attack on the person's character. This is libel so it is written and cannot be denied. Hence the person must prove it or pay £100,00 or whatever. Don't put it in writing if you want to abuse someone when it is not true.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

That women are now below men, that's not freedom.

Why bring up swimming events, anyway?

 

[Captain Caveman]

Of course it is not. If you accuse someone of something, you have to be able to prove it. This is often more true if it is an attack on the person's character. This is libel so it is written and cannot be denied. Hence the person must prove it or pay £100,00 or whatever. Don't put it in writing if you want to abuse someone when it is not true

Yup, and Article 10 of the Human Rights Act 1998 covers freedom of expression that certainly all countries in Europe enjoy. But it does come with responsibilities, and those that are not responsible can and do end up in court trying to defend their libel/slanderous comments.

 

[Blues Man]

Well, I have lived here all of my life and have said what I wanted and read what I wanted.


As far as I know Lady Chatterleys Lover was the last book that the government tried to ban. It went to trial and the government lost, and looked stupid into the bargain.That was in the 60s.

Perhaps you could give me a list of stuff I cant read ?

Sure just don't read any books deemed by the government as illegal

You have been conditioned to "want" what your government tells you to want.

You yourself said no one "needs" to read the Anarchist's Cookbook.

In the US we understand that rights are not about needs

 

[Blues Man]

Of course it is not. If you accuse someone of something, you have to be able to prove it. This is often more true if it is an attack on the person's character. This is libel so it is written and cannot be denied. Hence the person must prove it or pay £100,00 or whatever. Don't put it in writing if you want to abuse someone when it is not true.
[/QUOTE]
The accuser needs to prove the charges.

But there is no presumption of innocence in the UK

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Sure just don't read any books deemed by the government as illegal

You have been conditioned to "want" what your government tells you to want.

You yourself said no one "needs" to read the Anarchist's Cookbook.

In the US we understand that rights are not about needs

Why do you need to learn how to build a bomb ?
Doesnt this enable the crazy guy to kill a lot of people ?

 

[alexa]

Of course it is not. If you accuse someone of something, you have to be able to prove it. This is often more true if it is an attack on the person's character. This is libel so it is written and cannot be denied. Hence the person must prove it or pay £100,00 or whatever. Don't put it in writing if you want to abuse someone when it is not true.

The accuser needs to prove the charges.

But there is no presumption of innocence in the UK
[/QUOTE]
The assumption of innocence clearly goes with the person accused. You have attacked his character which might cause him all kinds of problems. People might not trust him, He might not get that promotion and so on. You just have to be honest and things should work out ok unless of course you were saying it out of spite to try and stop him getting that promotion. Then they may want a bob or two from you.

 

[Open Bolt]

PS - Guns doesn't trump freedoms, please don't try that, same with free speech, please research the indices. The whole picture is not made up from only two silly areas, there's hundreds taken into account.

Pointing out the historical reality that keeping and bearing arms is a key right of free people is not "trumping" freedom.

Neither is pointing out the historical reality that free speech is a key right of free people.

Unfortunately Blues Man , the planet doesn't revolve around one or two silly premise's as to what constitutes Freedom.

I do not share the opinion that facts and reality are silly premises.

Most of the planet is not actually free.

I know it's funny, but, some on the planet believe that you're only free if you have the Right to Bear Arms.

That has been a key right of free people for thousands of years now.

So there it is, freedoms and liberties in countries, and when you look at the full picture, it gives you a true ranking.

Those rankings are bogus on account of their not being based on reality.

And where's all your buddies? The pro gun "In Group" debating the "Reality" of freedom on this thread? The one and only 2aguy, M14 Shooter et. al.? I know I know, they don't want one of their pro gun 10 Commandments spoilt.

I only learned about this thread just now, and only because you mentioned it in a post in a thread that I was reading.

 

[Open Bolt]

"How to build a bomb" is not a book that people need to read.

Why do you need to learn how to build a bomb ?

Free people are not serfs and you aren't their lord. You don't get to tell free people what they can read or not. They will read whatever they want to read whether you like it or not.

 

[miketx]

Why do so many ghouls think freedom is murdering a baby?

 

[Open Bolt]

Why do so many ghouls think freedom is murdering a baby?

???

I have no idea what you are referring to.

 

[miketx]

???

I have no idea what you are referring to.

Lol, of course not.