Farmers Got Billions From Taxpayers In 2019, And Hardly Anyone Objected

LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

Show me. Post the government document, showing which bank simply "got money" from the government. There is none.

Because the way Quantitative Easing works, is that it moves assets and credits around.

If you sell me a car, did you get the money for nothing? No, we trade asset for value.

Let me put it another way.

Screenshot_2020-07-16 China_M2_money_supply_vs_USA_money_supply png (PNG Image, 3273 × 2562 pi...png


I'm not sure why they put China on there in red.... .whatever. It makes my point.

See the blue line? That's from 1980 to 2018. There is not particularly significant increase in the total money supply.

There certainly is no dramatic change in the money supply from quantitative easing.

Now I'm against Quantitative Easing, because it places the government into buying assets with uncertain value. It's simply not a wise move, that could pose future problems.

But your dumb as crap ignorant claims about how companies are only in business because the Fed is printing money... you are dumb fool, saying utterly ignorant crap.
 
Indeed, a few weeks later, the USDA announced another $16 billion in trade-related aid to farmers. It came on top of the previous year's $12 billion package, for a grand total of $28 billion in two years. About $19 billion of that money had been paid out by the end of 2019, and the rest will be paid in 2020.
---------------------------------
and the 28 billion came from us the taxpayers and with no action by congress, for a trade war he started!!

...and yet you are all for reparations. Trump collected extra money from tarriffs. Trump gave it to farmers to make up for lost revenue. Farmers good. They feed us. Case closed.

No, bad plan. Not in favor.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.
 
It hasn't? Middle class has not disappeared. In fact, if anything, more people from the middle class moved into the upper classes. I don't see this as bad, that more people are more wealthy, than in the past.
I suppose we're calculating a different set of numbers, but the illusion of a middle class is what you see in the top 19.9 %....most of the wealth is concentrated at the top.1 % , so you have about 50 million people doing well. The other 250 million of us are out of sight, out of mind largely thanks to media ownership....a whole other subject.
 
Indeed, a few weeks later, the USDA announced another $16 billion in trade-related aid to farmers. It came on top of the previous year's $12 billion package, for a grand total of $28 billion in two years. About $19 billion of that money had been paid out by the end of 2019, and the rest will be paid in 2020.
---------------------------------
and the 28 billion came from us the taxpayers and with no action by congress, for a trade war he started!!


If you are against farmers getting subsidies then join me in advocating that we do away with all government...

...Welfare
...Subsidies
...Grants
...Entitlements
...Bailouts
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.
 
It hasn't? Middle class has not disappeared. In fact, if anything, more people from the middle class moved into the upper classes. I don't see this as bad, that more people are more wealthy, than in the past.
I suppose we're calculating a different set of numbers, but the illusion of a middle class is what you see in the top 19.9 %....most of the wealth is concentrated at the top.1 % , so you have about 50 million people doing well. The other 250 million of us are out of sight, out of mind largely thanks to media ownership....a whole other subject.

Where the wealth is concentrated doesn't matter to me. And shouldn't matter to anyone.

If I'm doing better economically, than I was 20 years ago, or 10 years ago (which I am by far), then what differences does that make?

The bottom line is, people are largely better off today, than they were in the 1970s, and by wide margin.

Regardless of where wealth is concentrated, more people have moved from the lower class to the middle class, and more have moved from the middle class to the upper-middle and the upper class, than ever before.

People are better off. That's not opinion. That's statistical fact.

Moreover, if Bill Gates lost half his net worth tomorrow.... would you be better off?

During the 2008 crash, Bill Gates lost about 1/3 of his net worth. Were you better off?

From 1999 to 2003, Bill Gates lost half his net worth. Were you better off?

No. Other people having less wealth, does nothing for you, or me, or anyone.

So why do you care? Because you are envious, and greedy.

It's an established fact, that other people doing worse, doesn't result in you doing better.

So the only possible reason you would care how much wealth is concentrated in the 1%, when you know for a fact it will make no difference to anyone if the 1% has less, is because you are greedy, evil, and selfish.

Grow up. Stop being evil.
 
Capitalism!!! Aint it great?


Said the man who's money comes from dog fight video.


Have you stopped making those videos yet?

Is this really true? It takes a terrible human to make sport of dog fights. It Tales a truly sick bastard.


No, it's not true, but I am making a point for pknopp about how sometimes "questions" are not really questions, but propaganda attacks.


Would you like to join in? To really make a good analog of the way the libs operate, I need a pack of slack jawed morons, (or people will to play that role for a little) to dog pile him, to shout down any denials and to generally be complete pricks.


Ironically, the more he ignores me, the more he validates my point.


Because he is afraid to answer a "simple question".
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown
 
Capitalism!!! Aint it great?


Said the man who's money comes from dog fight video.


Have you stopped making those videos yet?

Is this really true? It takes a terrible human to make sport of dog fights. It Tales a truly sick bastard.


No, it's not true, but I am making a point for pknopp about how sometimes "questions" are not really questions, but propaganda attacks.


Would you like to join in? To really make a good analog of the way the libs operate, I need a pack of slack jawed morons, (or people will to play that role for a little) to dog pile him, to shout down any denials and to generally be complete pricks.


Ironically, the more he ignores me, the more he validates my point.


Because he is afraid to answer a "simple question".

Just like you admit you lied here you are lying again. You simply didn't want to read and address the links I posted.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.

No, all of it was real. Are you seriously suggesting that drops in value of say the airlines, when clearly there was a massive drop in travelers, is not a real decline in share prices on the market?

All of it was real. I don't even understand your statement, since it is isn't even intuitive.

Are you saying that if you own an acre of land, and you heard that the government might put in a sewer treatment facility near it, that you wouldn't sell it?

Yes you would. Because you would know that this could lower the land value.

Just like if you were looking for land to buy, and you heard a rumor that they were going to put in a water treatment plant, that you may still buy the land, but only at a huge discount.

And of course if the project was canceled, you would try and sell the land at full price.

Well... if there's a policy of a lock down, and you don't know exactly how that is going to effect business.... would you buy stock at full price? No. If you had stock, would you try and sell it quickly? Yes.

That's the market changing value. It's not fake. It's a real change in value, like any change in value.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.

No, all of it was real. Are you seriously suggesting that drops in value of say the airlines, when clearly there was a massive drop in travelers, is not a real decline in share prices on the market?

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

All of it was real. I don't even understand your statement, since it is isn't even intuitive.

Are you saying that if you own an acre of land, and you heard that the government might put in a sewer treatment facility near it, that you wouldn't sell it?

Yes you would. Because you would know that this could lower the land value.

Just like if you were looking for land to buy, and you heard a rumor that they were going to put in a water treatment plant, that you may still buy the land, but only at a huge discount.

And of course if the project was canceled, you would try and sell the land at full price.

Well... if there's a policy of a lock down, and you don't know exactly how that is going to effect business.... would you buy stock at full price? No. If you had stock, would you try and sell it quickly? Yes.

That's the market changing value. It's not fake. It's a real change in value, like any change in value.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.

No, all of it was real. Are you seriously suggesting that drops in value of say the airlines, when clearly there was a massive drop in travelers, is not a real decline in share prices on the market?

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

All of it was real. I don't even understand your statement, since it is isn't even intuitive.

Are you saying that if you own an acre of land, and you heard that the government might put in a sewer treatment facility near it, that you wouldn't sell it?

Yes you would. Because you would know that this could lower the land value.

Just like if you were looking for land to buy, and you heard a rumor that they were going to put in a water treatment plant, that you may still buy the land, but only at a huge discount.

And of course if the project was canceled, you would try and sell the land at full price.

Well... if there's a policy of a lock down, and you don't know exactly how that is going to effect business.... would you buy stock at full price? No. If you had stock, would you try and sell it quickly? Yes.

That's the market changing value. It's not fake. It's a real change in value, like any change in value.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

Zero if they go bankrupt. That's my point.

If you are asking why the stock has value right now, when they have not made a profit, it's the same reason Amazon's stock had value, before it made a profit.

Amazon's IPO was 1997, and their first recorded profitable quarter, was 2004 I believe. Seven years without a profit.

So what was the value? The value was that people could see Amazon was growing, expanding, and that sales were increasing. So they knew that at some point it was likely to turn profitable.

So what about Tesla?

Screenshot_2020-07-16 tot_0 png (PNG Image, 857 × 483 pixels).png


That indicates the product is still selling, and rather strongly.

Now it could crash. But that's how investment works with new companies.

By the way, this is true of virtually every single investment in all human history. If you decide to open a business for yourself, I guarantee you that you will have some investment that needs made, before you make one penny of profit. That's normal.

So the market is seeing the increasing value of the company from the market, in terms of sales.

If I implied that the value of stock were exclusively based on profit alone, then that was not intended. It was merely an example, that share prices are dependent on market factors, not government QE or something. Government QE does nothing. Unless you have a company like Apple, getting QE directly, where you can point to an SEC report saying they got QE money, and recorded a profit or used it to invest in a new research center.... QE does nothing.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Agreed. That would be my point. QE has almost no long term effect whatsoever. The current market prices, are due to market factors. Not QE.

QE is an extremely short term "hopes and dreams" as you put it.

The fact the market has recovered (largely), is proof... the market has recovered. QE had nothing to do with it.

The stocks that have not recovered, have not because of market factors.

The stocks that have recovered, have because of market factors.

QE is nothing. Which again, is why I oppose QE. It does nothing, except screw with Fed, and places them in a market position they shouldn't be in. It's risky for the Government to own assets, because it gives incentives to people in government to crony with political supporters on assets. We see this all over the world.

I'm very much opposed to it. No upside. Plenty of downside.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.

No, all of it was real. Are you seriously suggesting that drops in value of say the airlines, when clearly there was a massive drop in travelers, is not a real decline in share prices on the market?

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

All of it was real. I don't even understand your statement, since it is isn't even intuitive.

Are you saying that if you own an acre of land, and you heard that the government might put in a sewer treatment facility near it, that you wouldn't sell it?

Yes you would. Because you would know that this could lower the land value.

Just like if you were looking for land to buy, and you heard a rumor that they were going to put in a water treatment plant, that you may still buy the land, but only at a huge discount.

And of course if the project was canceled, you would try and sell the land at full price.

Well... if there's a policy of a lock down, and you don't know exactly how that is going to effect business.... would you buy stock at full price? No. If you had stock, would you try and sell it quickly? Yes.

That's the market changing value. It's not fake. It's a real change in value, like any change in value.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

Zero if they go bankrupt. That's my point.

If you are asking why the stock has value right now, when they have not made a profit, it's the same reason Amazon's stock had value, before it made a profit.

Amazon's IPO was 1997, and their first recorded profitable quarter, was 2004 I believe. Seven years without a profit.

So what was the value? The value was that people could see Amazon was growing, expanding, and that sales were increasing. So they knew that at some point it was likely to turn profitable.

So what about Tesla?

View attachment 364031

That indicates the product is still selling, and rather strongly.

Now it could crash. But that's how investment works with new companies.

By the way, this is true of virtually every single investment in all human history. If you decide to open a business for yourself, I guarantee you that you will have some investment that needs made, before you make one penny of profit. That's normal.

So the market is seeing the increasing value of the company from the market, in terms of sales.

If I implied that the value of stock were exclusively based on profit alone, then that was not intended. It was merely an example, that share prices are dependent on market factors, not government QE or something. Government QE does nothing. Unless you have a company like Apple, getting QE directly, where you can point to an SEC report saying they got QE money, and recorded a profit or used it to invest in a new research center.... QE does nothing.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Agreed. That would be my point. QE has almost no long term effect whatsoever. The current market prices, are due to market factors. Not QE.

QE is an extremely short term "hopes and dreams" as you put it.

The fact the market has recovered (largely), is proof... the market has recovered. QE had nothing to do with it.

The stocks that have not recovered, have not because of market factors.

The stocks that have recovered, have because of market factors.

QE is nothing. Which again, is why I oppose QE. It does nothing, except screw with Fed, and places them in a market position they shouldn't be in. It's risky for the Government to own assets, because it gives incentives to people in government to crony with political supporters on assets. We see this all over the world.

I'm very much opposed to it. No upside. Plenty of downside.

Amazons profit is coming from huge government contracts. All paid with money it does not have.
 
LMFAO from the link, he never said anything about the land feeding people..



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

The government paying farmers is capitalism? Where do I find this so I can learn more?


You can't comprehend what I posted?

This fuck head bitches about climate change and the like but never mentions the land being used to grow food.

Can you show where I have even mentioned climate change?


Once again from the link...



What farmers do with their land has a huge impact on water quality, wildlife and climate change, Kling says. The USDA has programs that pay farmers to help the environment, doing things like restoring wetlands.

OK, now once again, where in Capitalism do we find the government paying business to do anything?

Why do you pretend to support things you aren't even able to defend?
The government gets the money through capitalism

Is that right? LOL

The Fed doesn't just create it?

All the same even if true (which it isn't) again, how is taking from those who created it to give to others capitalism?
For one we have to pay interest on it for two yes it's true the government gets the money through capitalism..

We didn't "borrow" the money that was used to create years and years of Quantitative Easing.

Name one bank that has the money? There is none. You can't show a single bank that has money directly from the Fed, or the Government, from Quantitative Easing.

It's in the markets. It's all that keeps it inflated. It's not even real.

No it's not. That's a ridiculous claim.

The market is made up of assets. The value of assets, does not magically change because of anything the Fed does.

Take buying a used car.

You find a car you want for $10,000.

If the Fed cancels QE, does that change how much you pay for the car? Is that guy who is selling it, going to say "Oh the Fed isn't printing money! I better sell this $10K car for $5K!"

No. Of course not.

Equally, if the Fed announces QE, are you going to pay $15K for a $10K car?

Of course not.

The value of the car, is what the value is. What Fed or government does, doesn't change the value of the car.

Same is true of assets. My stock in Amazon doesn't change, because of the Fed.

Why would it change? What do you think is going to happen?

The value of Amazon stock is tied to the success and profitability of Amazon.

Do you think if the Fed cancels QE, that people are going to wake up tomorrow and think "nah... not using amazon anymore... QE is over so...."?

Seriously what do you think is going to happen?

Do you think if the Fed announces more QE, that people are going to be sitting around "Hey I better buy that Air Fryer from Amazon, because.... QE!"?

Is that what you think happens?

So the profitability Amazon, has nothing to do with the Fed. And thus the value of Amazon stock, has nothing to do with the Fed.

The only thing the Fed does, is an extremely temporary lift or dip in the market, because people want to believe "Government is doing something!".

But at the end of the day, values will always return to whatever value is justified by the success of the company.

At the end of the day, if the company isn't making a profit, then the shares go down in value, no matter what government does. At the end of the day, if the company is rolling in the cash, then shares will go up in value, no matter what the government does.

Assets don't lose billions in value in a day.

World's Richest Lose $117 Billion in One-Day Market Meltdown

Sure they do. Nothing in life has intrinsic value. Nothing does. Gold does not even have intrinsic value.

Everything that exists, only has value in as much as people are willing to trade for that thing.

Let's say you have a Tesla Model S Performance. Car costs $80,000.

If Tesla the following day, is declared bankrupt. How much could you sell your Model S for? Would anyone buy it, knowing they will have no warranty, or might not be able to even service the car?

It would be horrific. It could lose half it's value in one day. Maybe even more.

Well, that's true of nearly everything. Absolutely everything in society, changes value, and sometimes very quickly.

When the lock downs hit, and everyone had no idea how badly the economy would be affected... investors moved their money out of stocks. The price went down.

When investors saw that many companies were doing fine, many values returned. Obviously airlines have taken a hit to their profits, and thus their stocks have not returned.

But grocery stores with drastically increased business, their profits have increase, and thus their stock values have recovered dramatically.

People were freaking out because they were concerned about Apple Computers connection to China, and the stock went down. But now we know their profits have remained strong, and Apple stock is valued higher than it was before the crash.

Nothing in all that... has anything to do with the Fed. It has to do with idiotic government policy, but nothing to do with printing money or any other nonsense.

Yes, values can change very quickly.

Bankrupt is an apt comparison perhaps. All the same, the drops are not because of bankruptcies. Very little of it is real.

No, all of it was real. Are you seriously suggesting that drops in value of say the airlines, when clearly there was a massive drop in travelers, is not a real decline in share prices on the market?

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

All of it was real. I don't even understand your statement, since it is isn't even intuitive.

Are you saying that if you own an acre of land, and you heard that the government might put in a sewer treatment facility near it, that you wouldn't sell it?

Yes you would. Because you would know that this could lower the land value.

Just like if you were looking for land to buy, and you heard a rumor that they were going to put in a water treatment plant, that you may still buy the land, but only at a huge discount.

And of course if the project was canceled, you would try and sell the land at full price.

Well... if there's a policy of a lock down, and you don't know exactly how that is going to effect business.... would you buy stock at full price? No. If you had stock, would you try and sell it quickly? Yes.

That's the market changing value. It's not fake. It's a real change in value, like any change in value.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Sure. But while I like Tesla let's use it as an example. I do not believe it has made a single profit yet but what is it worth?

Zero if they go bankrupt. That's my point.

If you are asking why the stock has value right now, when they have not made a profit, it's the same reason Amazon's stock had value, before it made a profit.

Amazon's IPO was 1997, and their first recorded profitable quarter, was 2004 I believe. Seven years without a profit.

So what was the value? The value was that people could see Amazon was growing, expanding, and that sales were increasing. So they knew that at some point it was likely to turn profitable.

So what about Tesla?

View attachment 364031

That indicates the product is still selling, and rather strongly.

Now it could crash. But that's how investment works with new companies.

By the way, this is true of virtually every single investment in all human history. If you decide to open a business for yourself, I guarantee you that you will have some investment that needs made, before you make one penny of profit. That's normal.

So the market is seeing the increasing value of the company from the market, in terms of sales.

If I implied that the value of stock were exclusively based on profit alone, then that was not intended. It was merely an example, that share prices are dependent on market factors, not government QE or something. Government QE does nothing. Unless you have a company like Apple, getting QE directly, where you can point to an SEC report saying they got QE money, and recorded a profit or used it to invest in a new research center.... QE does nothing.

QE was not interjecting anything other than hopes and dreams into the markets.

Agreed. That would be my point. QE has almost no long term effect whatsoever. The current market prices, are due to market factors. Not QE.

QE is an extremely short term "hopes and dreams" as you put it.

The fact the market has recovered (largely), is proof... the market has recovered. QE had nothing to do with it.

The stocks that have not recovered, have not because of market factors.

The stocks that have recovered, have because of market factors.

QE is nothing. Which again, is why I oppose QE. It does nothing, except screw with Fed, and places them in a market position they shouldn't be in. It's risky for the Government to own assets, because it gives incentives to people in government to crony with political supporters on assets. We see this all over the world.

I'm very much opposed to it. No upside. Plenty of downside.

Amazons profit is coming from huge government contracts. All paid with money it does not have.

So.... no? That's not true at all.

At least not to my knowledge.

As an Amazon shareholder, nearly all of their profits are from retail sales, and their services industry.

At best, I assume you are talking about the recent bidding for the $10 Billion dollar military contract.


So, Amazon didn't get the contract. Which doesn't really matter anyway, since their profits posted thus far, wouldn't include a contract not yet fulfilled.

I am not aware of any other significant government contracts.

Beyond that, QE does not actually print any money. So if the government pays out a contract, it has to be with money that exists. QE does not create any money. I already posted the graph that the money supply has not increased at any different rate than is standard.

So the money to pay government contracts.... thus far.... things could change, and we could end up like Zimbabwe, but thus far, if the government is paying out a contract, it is coming from either taxes, or borrowing.

QE has nothing to do with it.
 
Indeed, a few weeks later, the USDA announced another $16 billion in trade-related aid to farmers. It came on top of the previous year's $12 billion package, for a grand total of $28 billion in two years. About $19 billion of that money had been paid out by the end of 2019, and the rest will be paid in 2020.
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and the 28 billion came from us the taxpayers and with no action by congress, for a trade war he started!!
I do. I strongly object to any kind of subsidy paid to anyone for anything whatsoever. No exceptions.
 
Penelope, I’m intrigued by Truman’s idea for reducing the federal cost of agricultural commodities’ price supports, but I can only speculate as to how he supposed that could be accomplished.

If we paid those federal subsidies only to enterprises owning or operating U.S. farms, and enterprises’ whose incomes are now legally passed through to their taxpaying owners and shareholders, and we additionally require their ownership be 90% U.S. legal residents, it would somewhat reduce the cost of federal agricultural commodity price support programs, and more of that money would be pumped back into those rural farming counties. Smaller, “S” corporations’ incomes are, and larger “C” corporations’ incomes are not directly passed through to the enterprises’ shareholders.

Can any of you farmers or accountants give us some input in regard to this?

Respectfully, Supposn
Can a group member please explain or link me to an explanation of the current method for federal price supports of agricultural commodities?



I've been browsing through the 1946 – 1952 volume of Truman's autobiographies and I read his too brief explanation of the then Secretary of Agriculture Charles Brannan's proposed price support method. I understood his reasoning for pegging all other of farm those commodities to the price of corn. I currently don't wish to discuss that reasoning.



I'm interested in his goal to provide payments sufficient for smaller sized farms rather than providing for large-scale agricultural “factories”.

How could the federal government administer those payments to prevent large landowners from sub-dividing their acreage in manners as to qualify each sub-division to its full extent of federal benefits? Isn't in comparatively simple to conceal commercial association between individual landowners or individual enterprises leasing or owning farmland? …
 

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