Expelled Oklahoma U fraternity to sue university, possibly President Boren

[PratchettFan]

Public speech isn't protected? I can say what I please so long as I don't let anyone hear me do it?

You are not protected from paying consequences once your racist rant goes viral, no.

Actually, you are. Despite the fact you would so happily throw that precious right away, the courts won't.

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

You know, Carla, I would think you, of all people, would get this. The thing that prevents public schools from requiring students to pray is the First Amendment. You are arguing the First Amendment doesn't apply to public schools. You're chasing a pretty butterfly right off a cliff.

In college, you have to sign a code of conduct. You must sign an agreement. What part of that don't you get?

The part where people think that trumps the Constitution.

 

[Carla_Danger]

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

Again, being a student is not a "job." And a public university is not a typical employer.

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Then let them take it to court. I think that's a stupid idea for several reasons. First, it's obvious that when you sing about "N's" hanging from a tree, it is going to create a hostile educational environment for others. Second, I think it will bring to light other racist activity going on in frat houses.

Fraternity: Investigations underway in Texas, Louisiana

Fraternity Investigations underway in Texas Louisiana - AOL.com

KFOR reports the Oklahoma State University fraternity has taken down the Confederate flag inside the student's room.

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

 

[martybegan]

Again, being a student is not a "job." And a public university is not a typical employer.

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Then let them take it to court. I think that's a stupid idea for several reasons. First, it's obvious that when you sing about "N's" hanging from a tree, it is going to create a hostile educational environment for others. Second, I think it will bring to light other racist activity going on in frat houses.

Fraternity: Investigations underway in Texas, Louisiana

Fraternity Investigations underway in Texas Louisiana - AOL.com

KFOR reports the Oklahoma State University fraternity has taken down the Confederate flag inside the student's room.

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

 

[Carla_Danger]

You are not protected from paying consequences once your racist rant goes viral, no.

Actually, you are. Despite the fact you would so happily throw that precious right away, the courts won't.

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

You know, Carla, I would think you, of all people, would get this. The thing that prevents public schools from requiring students to pray is the First Amendment. You are arguing the First Amendment doesn't apply to public schools. You're chasing a pretty butterfly right off a cliff.

In college, you have to sign a code of conduct. You must sign an agreement. What part of that don't you get?

The part where people think that trumps the Constitution.

Admission to a University is a Contract between the student and the school. The student pays tuition, in return he receives lessons, gets campus access priviledges, maybe room and board and various other services ( all itemized in the Contract).
It is not a 'right'.
It is a Contract.

 

[Carla_Danger]

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Then let them take it to court. I think that's a stupid idea for several reasons. First, it's obvious that when you sing about "N's" hanging from a tree, it is going to create a hostile educational environment for others. Second, I think it will bring to light other racist activity going on in frat houses.

Fraternity: Investigations underway in Texas, Louisiana

Fraternity Investigations underway in Texas Louisiana - AOL.com

KFOR reports the Oklahoma State University fraternity has taken down the Confederate flag inside the student's room.

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

 

[martybegan]

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Then let them take it to court. I think that's a stupid idea for several reasons. First, it's obvious that when you sing about "N's" hanging from a tree, it is going to create a hostile educational environment for others. Second, I think it will bring to light other racist activity going on in frat houses.

Fraternity: Investigations underway in Texas, Louisiana

Fraternity Investigations underway in Texas Louisiana - AOL.com

KFOR reports the Oklahoma State University fraternity has taken down the Confederate flag inside the student's room.

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

 

[Carla_Danger]

Actually, you are. Despite the fact you would so happily throw that precious right away, the courts won't.

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

Again, being a student is not a "job." And a public university is not a typical employer.

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Agree. You cannot sign away your rights, nor can a public entity require you to.

No more then it would apply when an employer terminates an employee for violating a code of conduct clause (or any clause) in the Employment Contract.

You are confusing Constitutional Law (which applies to actions by 'the state')...with Contract law.

The students signed a lot of papers which are a formal Contract when they were admitted to the University.

 

[martybegan]

Actually, you are. Despite the fact you would so happily throw that precious right away, the courts won't.

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

You know, Carla, I would think you, of all people, would get this. The thing that prevents public schools from requiring students to pray is the First Amendment. You are arguing the First Amendment doesn't apply to public schools. You're chasing a pretty butterfly right off a cliff.

In college, you have to sign a code of conduct. You must sign an agreement. What part of that don't you get?

The part where people think that trumps the Constitution.

Admission to a University is a Contract between the student and the school. The student pays tuition, in return he receives lessons, gets campus access priviledges, maybe room and board and various other services ( all itemized in the Contract).
It is not a 'right'.
It is a Contract.

Contracts cannot violate constitutional rights, especially when the government is involved in the contract (Military service being the one exception).

 

[Mac1958]

.

Perhaps everyone else here knows about the nature of the lawsuit, the laws and rules and regulations that govern various behaviors at OU, and all ancillary facts that will pertain to the case.

I must admit, I don't. Not yet.

It does seem to me that if rules were broken and if the punishment was appropriate to the rules that were broken, the university pretty much has an open and shut case.

If not, then I guess we'll see.

Everything else right now is just rhetoric.

.

 

[martybegan]

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

Again, being a student is not a "job." And a public university is not a typical employer.

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Agree. You cannot sign away your rights, nor can a public entity require you to.

No more then it would apply when an employer terminates an employee for violating a code of conduct clause (or any clause) in the Employment Contract.

You are confusing Constitutional Law (which applies to actions by 'the state')...with Contract law.

The students signed a lot of papers which are a formal Contract when they were admitted to the University.

The University is a public entity.

 

[Carla_Danger]

Then let them take it to court. I think that's a stupid idea for several reasons. First, it's obvious that when you sing about "N's" hanging from a tree, it is going to create a hostile educational environment for others. Second, I think it will bring to light other racist activity going on in frat houses.

Fraternity: Investigations underway in Texas, Louisiana

Fraternity Investigations underway in Texas Louisiana - AOL.com

KFOR reports the Oklahoma State University fraternity has taken down the Confederate flag inside the student's room.

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

If it's on school property, and it's creating a hostile educational environment for others, then yes, absolutely.

 

[martybegan]

They were not threatening any specific person, nor was there any person in direct contact with them when the song was sung to BE threatened.

Also, are you now implying students should be suspended for hanging a confederate flag? A flag that is part of several state flags?

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

If it's on school property, and it's creating a hostile educational environment for others, then yes, absolutely.

How is a flag creating a hostile education environment? Could a Bible on a desk do the same thing? What about a Rastafarian flag?

Oh, I forget, only people on YOUR side of the political spectrum have the right to be offended, and to be coddled by the State when their FEEWINGS are hurt.

You people are some of the most sissy-mary pansies on the planet. Get a fucking spine.

 

[Carla_Danger]

Again, being a student is not a "job." And a public university is not a typical employer.

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Agree. You cannot sign away your rights, nor can a public entity require you to.

No more then it would apply when an employer terminates an employee for violating a code of conduct clause (or any clause) in the Employment Contract.

You are confusing Constitutional Law (which applies to actions by 'the state')...with Contract law.

The students signed a lot of papers which are a formal Contract when they were admitted to the University.

The University is a public entity.

I think you need to do a little more research on this subject. You know schools can expel children for wearing inappropriate clothing.

 

[Carla_Danger]

No, I'm not saying they should be suspended for flying that "offensive" flag. I'm saying that the frat house might want to consider not shedding more negative light on the situation.

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

If it's on school property, and it's creating a hostile educational environment for others, then yes, absolutely.

How is a flag creating a hostile education environment? Could a Bible on a desk do the same thing? What about a Rastafarian flag?

Oh, I forget, only people on YOUR side of the political spectrum have the right to be offended, and to be coddled by the State when their FEEWINGS are hurt.

You people are some of the most sissy-mary pansies on the planet. Get a fucking spine.

Student Handbook

Student Conduct Office - Welcome

 

[martybegan]

They had to sign papers agreeing to the code of conduct.

Plenty of codes of conduct have been found unconstitutional, or have been modified when confronted by groups such as F.I.R.E.

Agree. You cannot sign away your rights, nor can a public entity require you to.

No more then it would apply when an employer terminates an employee for violating a code of conduct clause (or any clause) in the Employment Contract.

You are confusing Constitutional Law (which applies to actions by 'the state')...with Contract law.

The students signed a lot of papers which are a formal Contract when they were admitted to the University.

The University is a public entity.

I think you need to do a little more research on this subject. You know schools can expel children for wearing inappropriate clothing.

And those are often over-turned or rescinded when enough people complain about it. Those are also minors, which is not the case at a University.

 

[martybegan]

So the school should be able to force them to remove the flag?

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

If it's on school property, and it's creating a hostile educational environment for others, then yes, absolutely.

How is a flag creating a hostile education environment? Could a Bible on a desk do the same thing? What about a Rastafarian flag?

Oh, I forget, only people on YOUR side of the political spectrum have the right to be offended, and to be coddled by the State when their FEEWINGS are hurt.

You people are some of the most sissy-mary pansies on the planet. Get a fucking spine.

Student Handbook

Student Conduct Office - Welcome

Again, handbook rules cannot overrule constitutional rights. F.I.R.E has gotten many handbooks re-written due to unconstitutional issues.

 

[jknowgood]

The funny thing about this is, if a rapper said the same thing in a rap at an award show. Liberals would fall over each other praising him. Such hypocrites.

 

[PratchettFan]

Actually, you are. Despite the fact you would so happily throw that precious right away, the courts won't.

That's a bunch of BS. I can't say whatever I want and expect to keep my job.

The school has a code of conduct, and those students signed papers agreeing to the code of conduct before they started class.

You know, Carla, I would think you, of all people, would get this. The thing that prevents public schools from requiring students to pray is the First Amendment. You are arguing the First Amendment doesn't apply to public schools. You're chasing a pretty butterfly right off a cliff.

In college, you have to sign a code of conduct. You must sign an agreement. What part of that don't you get?

The part where people think that trumps the Constitution.

Admission to a University is a Contract between the student and the school. The student pays tuition, in return he receives lessons, gets campus access priviledges, maybe room and board and various other services ( all itemized in the Contract).
It is not a 'right'.
It is a Contract.

It is a public institution controlled by the government. They are going to get reamed in court because they took the easy way out.

 

[Carla_Danger]

Why don't you try reading the story.

“A brother who lives in our house displayed the Confederate flag in his personal room,” OSU SAE President Chris Bringaze told the O’Colly.“Sigma Alpha Epsilon does not endorse the Confederate flag nationally nor do we endorse it as a chapter. In addition, the flag has never been a symbol of our fraternity. My fellow chapter leaders and I have asked the brother to remove the flag from his room.”

OU s chapter of SAE isn t the only one under fire KFOR.com

The content is irrelevant. The relevance to this conversation is do YOU think the school has the right to ban the flag from being displayed inside a student's dorm room?

If it's on school property, and it's creating a hostile educational environment for others, then yes, absolutely.

How is a flag creating a hostile education environment? Could a Bible on a desk do the same thing? What about a Rastafarian flag?

Oh, I forget, only people on YOUR side of the political spectrum have the right to be offended, and to be coddled by the State when their FEEWINGS are hurt.

You people are some of the most sissy-mary pansies on the planet. Get a fucking spine.

Student Handbook

Student Conduct Office - Welcome

Again, handbook rules cannot overrule constitutional rights. F.I.R.E has gotten many handbooks re-written due to unconstitutional issues.

Attending the University is not a 'right', it is a privilege, for which they applied and pay tuition. That comes with responsibilities, such as 'I agree to follow the rules and code of conduct'.

Break the rules and you are subject to disciplinary action.

So let them take it to court. It's going to be a tough case, since everyone has already issued apologies, including the SAE.

OU SAE Board Racist chant has been going on for years issues apology KFOR.com

 

[Carla_Danger]

The funny thing about this is, if a rapper said the same thing in a rap at an award show. Liberals would fall over each other praising him. Such hypocrites.

Is the rap singer a student at OU? Sorry, you're lost in this conversation.