Electric Cars as Toxic as Dirty Diesel!

[elektra]

In the continuing story, "We must destroy the World, to save the World" we find out that the heavier Electric Cars are burning through brakes and tires, which are toxic to the environment and humans in particular.

Study finds eco-friendly cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels

Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with as many toxins as dirty diesels say scientists

• Eco-friendly electric and hybrid cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels
• That was finding of a study looking at particles from tyre and brake wear
• Greener alternative produces more tiny particles because they are heavier
• Made heavier by batteries and parts meaning tyres and brakes wear faster

The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.

Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust emissions in all modern cars.

'These are more toxic than emissions from modern engines so they are likely to be key factors in the extra heart attacks, strokes and asthma attacks seen when air pollution levels surge.

 

[there4eyeM]

So, we should renounce any changes, or should we look for new solutions? Why are cars so heavy, for example?

 

[elektra]

I think building more cheap affordable housing close to where people work is the solution. In Los Angeles many people commute 45-80 miles one way to get to work from their homes.

 

[Crick]

In the continuing story, "We must destroy the World, to save the World" we find out that the heavier Electric Cars are burning through brakes and tires, which are toxic to the environment and humans in particular.

Study finds eco-friendly cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels

Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with as many toxins as dirty diesels say scientists

• Eco-friendly electric and hybrid cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels
• That was finding of a study looking at particles from tyre and brake wear
• Greener alternative produces more tiny particles because they are heavier
• Made heavier by batteries and parts meaning tyres and brakes wear faster

The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.

Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust emissions in all modern cars.

'These are more toxic than emissions from modern engines so they are likely to be key factors in the extra heart attacks, strokes and asthma attacks seen when air pollution levels surge.

"Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust
emissions in all modern cars."

Does this seem reasonable to you? In 200 miles of driving, a family's mini-van will consume 20 gallons or about 120 pounds of gasoline - a very volatile compound (makes lots of vapor when evaporated or burned). Have 120 pounds of the car's tires, brakes or the road been so consumed? No. This claim is specious on its face.

Additionally, do those "dirty diesels" not consume their tires, brakes and the road at an equivalent pace? Of course they do. Thus the electric cars still produce less emissions no matter what.

And try to keep in mind that the primary purpose of electric cars is to eliminate CO2 emissions, not protect asthmatics from road dust.

 

[Wuwei]

Hybrids and electric cars use don't use friction brakes nearly as much.

When the brake is pressed much of the slowing comes from switching to an electric motor that acts as a generator to turn the car's momentum into electricity that recharges the battery pack.

 

[Two Thumbs]

In the continuing story, "We must destroy the World, to save the World" we find out that the heavier Electric Cars are burning through brakes and tires, which are toxic to the environment and humans in particular.

Study finds eco-friendly cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels

Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with as many toxins as dirty diesels say scientists

• Eco-friendly electric and hybrid cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels
• That was finding of a study looking at particles from tyre and brake wear
• Greener alternative produces more tiny particles because they are heavier
• Made heavier by batteries and parts meaning tyres and brakes wear faster

The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.

Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust emissions in all modern cars.

'These are more toxic than emissions from modern engines so they are likely to be key factors in the extra heart attacks, strokes and asthma attacks seen when air pollution levels surge.

"Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust
emissions in all modern cars."

Does this seem reasonable to you? In 200 miles of driving, a family's mini-van will consume 20 gallons or about 120 pounds of gasoline - a very volatile compound (makes lots of vapor when evaporated or burned). Have 120 pounds of the car's tires, brakes or the road been so consumed? No. This claim is specious on its face.

Additionally, do those "dirty diesels" not consume their tires, brakes and the road at an equivalent pace? Of course they do. Thus the electric cars still produce less emissions no matter what.

And try to keep in mind that the primary purpose of electric cars is to eliminate CO2 emissions, not protect asthmatics from road dust.

so the person that demands we follow scientist around about warming, b/c they say so, disagrees with scientist based only on his opinion.

mmmm, double cheese hypocrassy.

oh, as an asthmatic, I hope your suffer horrible painful boils on your ass for being such a callous subhuman.

 

[elektra]

In the continuing story, "We must destroy the World, to save the World" we find out that the heavier Electric Cars are burning through brakes and tires, which are toxic to the environment and humans in particular.

Study finds eco-friendly cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels

Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with as many toxins as dirty diesels say scientists

• Eco-friendly electric and hybrid cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels
• That was finding of a study looking at particles from tyre and brake wear
• Greener alternative produces more tiny particles because they are heavier
• Made heavier by batteries and parts meaning tyres and brakes wear faster

The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.

Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust emissions in all modern cars.

'These are more toxic than emissions from modern engines so they are likely to be key factors in the extra heart attacks, strokes and asthma attacks seen when air pollution levels surge.

"Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust
emissions in all modern cars."

Does this seem reasonable to you? In 200 miles of driving, a family's mini-van will consume 20 gallons or about 120 pounds of gasoline - a very volatile compound (makes lots of vapor when evaporated or burned). Have 120 pounds of the car's tires, brakes or the road been so consumed? No. This claim is specious on its face.

Additionally, do those "dirty diesels" not consume their tires, brakes and the road at an equivalent pace? Of course they do. Thus the electric cars still produce less emissions no matter what.

And try to keep in mind that the primary purpose of electric cars is to eliminate CO2 emissions, not protect asthmatics from road dust.

Electric cars, weigh more than a regular car, that is the comparison, hence weighing more they burn up brakes and tires, releasing particulates and toxins into the atmosphere. Of course consuming tires at a faster rate means we must manufacture more tires, at a faster rate.

Heavier, more brakes, more wear on the tires, an equivalent sized diesel car, weighs less, 25% to 35% less. But hey, what does Science know, right?

 

[elektra]

Hybrids and electric cars use don't use friction brakes nearly as much.

When the brake is pressed much of the slowing comes from switching to an electric motor that acts as a generator to turn the car's momentum into electricity that recharges the battery pack.

Tell it to the Scientists, it is science they practice.

 

[Crick]

so the person that demands we follow scientist around about warming, b/c they say so, disagrees with scientist based only on his opinion.

mmmm, double cheese hypocrassy.

oh, as an asthmatic, I hope your suffer horrible painful boils on your ass for being such a callous subhuman.

Were you under the impression that people made electric cars to help your asthma?

HAVE ashthma sufferers NOT been aided by cars that produce less or no pollution?

What does the referenced study actually say. Hard to tell, since neither the Daily Mail article to which the OP links nor the Sunday Times article to which IT links, provide a link.

When I put "Atmospheric Environment, Peter Achten, Victor Timmers, Edinburgh University" into Google, I get the following:

Search Results
"Eco-vehicles fill air with deadly toxins" | Speak EV - Electric ...
speakev.com › General Electric Vehicle Discussion › General EV Discussion
May 8, 2016 - 20 posts - ‎15 authors
Achten, who runs a scientific consultancy in Holland, and his co-author Victor Timmers, ofEdinburgh University, ... Frank Kelly, professor of environmental health at King's College London, said one hope lay in changing the composition of tyres and road surfaces. ... Peter Galbavy and David Harvey like this.
Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with ... - Daily Mail
www.dailymail.co.uk/.../Electric-hybrid-eco-friendly-cars-air-toxins-dirty-die...
Daily Mail
May 8, 2016 - The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.
Study Finds Electric Vehicles Emit Huge Amounts Of Pollution | The ...
dailycaller.com/.../electric-vehicles-emit-more-pollutants-than-fossil-f...
The Daily Caller
6 days ago - A new study from the University of Edinburgh shows that overall ... The study, conducted by Victor Timmers and Peter Achten at the University of Edinburgh, and published by the journal Atmospheric Environment, found that ...
Eco-vehicles fill air with deadly toxins | Scottish Sceptic
scottishsceptic.co.uk/2016/05/09/eco-vehicles-fill-air-with-deadly-toxins/
May 9, 2016 - Achten, who runs a scientific consultancy in Holland, and his co-author Victor Timmers, of Edinburgh University, used technical data from the ... “Victor R.J.H. Timmers, PeterA.J. Achten (2016) “Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles,” Atmospheric Environment, Volume 134, Pages 10-17, doi:”
Electric Vehicles Emit More Pollutants Than Fossil Fuel-Burning Cars ...
www.redflagnews.com/.../electric-vehicles-emit-more-pollutants-than-fossil-fuel-burni...
5 days ago - A study from the University of Edinburgh shows that electric and hybrid ... The study, conducted by Victor Timmers and Peter Achten at the University of Edinburgh, and published by the journal Atmospheric Environment, found ...
Scientists: Electric Vehicles Produce As Many Toxins As Dirty Diesels ...
https://hardware.slashdot.org/.../scientists-electric-vehicles-produce-as-many-toxins-as...
May 9, 2016 - A study by Victor Timmers and Peter Achten published in. ... He holds a bachelor's degree in engineering from Trinity College, University of Cambridge ... it's report on a study published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.
Hybrid and Electric Cars Are Just as Bad for the Environment, Report ...
www.autoevolution.com › News › Industry
May 11, 2016 - Want to buy a hybrid car and save the environment? ... According to Peter Achten andVictor Timmers, both from Edinburgh University, the extra weight ... scientists were published in a journal called Atmospheric Environment.
Electric Vehicles Emit More Pollutants Than Fossil Fuel-Burning ...
Electric Vehicles Emit More Pollutants Than Fossil Fuel-Burning Cars, Says Study
5 posts - ‎1 author
The study, conducted by Victor Timmers and Peter Achten at the University of Edinburgh, and published by the journal Atmospheric Environment, found that ...
Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the ... - BlackListed News
www.blacklistednews.com/Electric,_hybrid_and...fill.../M.html
May 10, 2016 - The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.
No EV pollution at point of use? Think again | Automotive Industry ...
www.just-auto.com/news/no-ev-pollution-at-point-of-use-think-again_id169165.aspx
May 9, 2016 - ... research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, and published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.
**********************************************************************************************

Why do I get no reference to "Atmospheric Environment"?

I am searching their website.

 

[Crick]

Found it

Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles

Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles

• Victor R.J.H. Timmersa, , ,
• Peter A.J. Achtenb

Highlights


•
A positive relationship exists between vehicle weight and non-exhaust emissions.

•
Electric vehicles are 24% heavier than their conventional counterparts.

•
Electric vehicle PM emissions are comparable to those of conventional vehicles.

•
Non-exhaust sources account for 90% of PM10 and 85% of PM2.5 from traffic.

•
Future policy should focus on reducing vehicle weight.

Abstract
Particulate matter (PM) exposure has been linked to adverse health effects by numerous studies. Therefore, governments have been heavily incentivising the market to switch to electric passenger cars in order to reduce air pollution. However, this literature review suggests that , because of their relatively high weight. By analysing the existing literature on non-exhaust emissions of different vehicle categories, this review found that there is a positive relationship between weight and non-exhaust PM emission factors. In addition, electric vehicles (EVs) were found to be 24% heavier than equivalent internal combustion engine vehicles (ICEVs). As a result, total PM10 emissions from EVs were found to be equal to those of modern ICEVs. PM2.5 emissions were only 1–3% lower for EVs compared to modern ICEVs. Therefore, it could be concluded that the increased popularity of electric vehicles will likely not have a great effect on PM levels. Non-exhaust emissions already account for over 90% of PM10 and 85% of PM2.5 emissions from traffic. These proportions will continue to increase as exhaust standards improve and average vehicle weight increases. Future policy should consequently focus on setting standards for non-exhaust emissions and encouraging weight reduction of all vehicles to significantly reduce PM emissions from traffic.
************************************************************************************************************************
If you want to read the whole thing, go to the link above and shell out $35.95

So, this study deals solely with particulate matter (PM) and PM that comes off of vehicles IGNORING ENGINE EMISSIONS. That isn't really an issue with EVs since they have none, but ignoring the emissions of, say, "FILTHY DIESELS" could tend to give someone the wrong impression about their results, couldn't it ELEKTRA.

Additionally, quoting from the abstract above we find: "electric vehicles may not reduce levels of PM as much as expected". It does not say EVs are worse then ICEVs. It does not even say they are equivalent. It says that EVs "may not reduce levels of particulate matter as much as expected". They are still less, just not as much as expected. And, pray tell, whose fucking expectations are they addressing? Would any of us have any reason to believe that EV's tires would not wear out? Were we supposed to believe that EVs cause no wear and tear on the nation's roads and highways?

I got a neighbor on one side of me with a Ford Explorer with which he drives around his family of four. The neighbor on the other side drives his family of four about in a Prius. Which one is heavier?

If you want a fairer example:

5 pax Prius 3,045 lbs
5 pax Corolla 2,840 lbs

Weight increase: 7.2%

 

[Wuwei]

Tell it to the Scientists, it is science they practice.

I'm sure the scientists know about that. Electrics or hybrids used generator brakes for a long time. I don't know why they also have friction brakes unless it's for harder breaking or electric failure.

 

[Wuwei]

Found it

Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles

Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles

• Victor R.J.H. Timmersa, , ,
• Peter A.J. Achtenb

Highlights
................ etc

Actual science is much less entertaining than a news article. It seems that journalists have to exaggerate in order to make a headline that looks more newsworthy. In the end truth looses out.

 

[elektra]

Tell it to the Scientists, it is science they practice.

I'm sure the scientists know about that. Electrics or hybrids used generator brakes for a long time. I don't know why they also have friction brakes unless it's for harder breaking or electric failure.

Well, technically, all studies must be seen by us otherwise do we really know what is in them, even an abstract can be very misleading. I am not such a big jerk that I think this story is 100%, but it is something to consider, either way they will use more tire being heavier, and that has an impact. Electric motors in wheels, maybe they are not in all electrics? To save weight, and improve battery life. If the study was available, I would of posted it, I followed this story and searched until I found the abstract. This story is on a couple of websites. I took the most shocking headline. I make a couple of points like this, propaganda goes both ways, anybody can conduct a study and make it say whatever they like. My headline is out there, and that headline does have truth, how much? It is hard to say, but there are aspects of this we are not considering, like replacing tires more often, or using more fossil energy to charge the cars.

Either way, without seeing the actual study, it is simply what it is, a small part of a bigger story. The bigger story is the solution to save the World is not to manufacture more stuff.

At best, electric cars need extra charging stations, every home now needs a charging station, no more will we have 40,000 people sharing a gas station, each person gets there own gas station, or charging station.

Non-exhaust PM emissions from electric vehicles
Highlights


•
A positive relationship exists between vehicle weight and non-exhaust emissions.

•
Electric vehicles are 24% heavier than their conventional counterparts.

•
Electric vehicle PM emissions are comparable to those of conventional vehicles.

•
Non-exhaust sources account for 90% of PM10 and 85% of PM2.5 from traffic.

•
Future policy should focus on reducing vehicle weight.

 

[elektra]

If you want a fairer example:

5 pax Prius 3,045 lbs
5 pax Corolla 2,840 lbs

Weight increase: 7.2%

Once again, the he/she with no brain, posts? A Prius is not an electric car MORON!

But hey, when electric car makers get around to building a car in the same class as a Corolla, something with a 400 mile range we can actually compare the two. Until then it is easy to see Electric cars are 30-50% heavier.

Model X Specifications

• Curb weight
  90D 5271 lbs
  P90D 5381 lbs

Model S Specifications

• Curb weight 4,647.3 lbs

 

[elektra]

[
Actual science is much less entertaining than a news article. It seems that journalists have to exaggerate in order to make a headline that looks more newsworthy. In the end truth looses out.

The truth always loses in a post by crick, he lists the prius, a hybrid, as an electric car when he could of posted the weight of a Tesla!

 

[gipper]

So, we should renounce any changes, or should we look for new solutions? Why are cars so heavy, for example?

Because big unlimited government demands it.

 

[gipper]

I think building more cheap affordable housing close to where people work is the solution. In Los Angeles many people commute 45-80 miles one way to get to work from their homes.

...in many cities, development of housing is purposely limited by the local government. San Franfreako and Portland come to mind...both cities controlled by the left. Thus forcing up prices and pushing out people of lesser means resulting in long commutes. The consequences of leftism are ALWAYS bad.

H. L. Mencken quote
Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under.

 

[gipper]

In the continuing story, "We must destroy the World, to save the World" we find out that the heavier Electric Cars are burning through brakes and tires, which are toxic to the environment and humans in particular.

Study finds eco-friendly cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels

Electric, hybrid and other eco-friendly cars fill the air with as many toxins as dirty diesels say scientists

• Eco-friendly electric and hybrid cars fill air with as many toxins as diesels
• That was finding of a study looking at particles from tyre and brake wear
• Greener alternative produces more tiny particles because they are heavier
• Made heavier by batteries and parts meaning tyres and brakes wear faster

The research, led by Peter Achten and co-author Victor Timmers of Edinburgh University, is published in the journal Atmospheric Environment.

Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust emissions in all modern cars.

'These are more toxic than emissions from modern engines so they are likely to be key factors in the extra heart attacks, strokes and asthma attacks seen when air pollution levels surge.

"Achten said: 'We found that non-exhaust emissions, from brakes, tyres and the road, are far larger than exhaust
emissions in all modern cars."

Does this seem reasonable to you? In 200 miles of driving, a family's mini-van will consume 20 gallons or about 120 pounds of gasoline - a very volatile compound (makes lots of vapor when evaporated or burned). Have 120 pounds of the car's tires, brakes or the road been so consumed? No. This claim is specious on its face.

Additionally, do those "dirty diesels" not consume their tires, brakes and the road at an equivalent pace? Of course they do. Thus the electric cars still produce less emissions no matter what.

And try to keep in mind that the primary purpose of electric cars is to eliminate CO2 emissions, not protect asthmatics from road dust.

so the person that demands we follow scientist around about warming, b/c they say so, disagrees with scientist based only on his opinion.

mmmm, double cheese hypocrassy.

oh, as an asthmatic, I hope your suffer horrible painful boils on your ass for being such a callous subhuman.

Hey where is Old Crock (of shit)? Why has he not chimed in on this thread?

HL Mencken on stupid warmers...
No one ever heard of the truth being enforced by law.
Whenever the secular arm is called in to sustain an idea,
whether new or old, it is always a bad idea, and not
infrequently it is downright idiotic.

 

[Old Rocks]

2016 S550 Sedan | Mercedes-Benz

More Exterior Dimensions
Overall length
206.5 in
Overall height
58.7 in
Overall width
83.9 in (with mirrors)
Wheelbase
124.6 in
Coefficient of drag
0.27
Curb weight
4,630 lbs

So the curb weight of the S is 4647. That is 17 lbs heavier than the car the S goes head to head with, the S 550 Mercedes. Big fucking differance, Elektra, old girl.

 

[Crick]

MILEAGE - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -WEIGHT
2016 Prius: 53 / 58 Avg: 55.5 3,045 lbs
2016 Corolla 42 / 30 Avg: 36 2,840 lbs
2016 Explorer 28/19 Avg: 23.5 4,694 lbs

The Corollla gets 17.1% less mileage than the Prius with a weight advantage of 7.2%
The Explorer get 57.7% less mileage than the Prius at a weight disadvantage of 54.1%