Do any of you white so called Christians

[The Irish Ram]

You don't possess the power to curse a dandelion, d.
To the extent you judge another is the extent you will be judged.
My Christian walk is between me and the Lord. Unless you can see my heart then you do not have the ability to determine whether or not I am true to my faith or a hypocrite.

One of Christ's closest friends was the richest man in the world at the time. Making money is just fine. The love of it, is not.
The eye of the needle was a slit in the wall of the city that enabled people to enter after the city gates were closed. To traverse the eye, a man with many treasures on his camel, had to unload the camel, take it through the narrow opening, and then make trips back and forth to bring his belongings through the narrow opening. The more goods you had the harder it was to get in. Not impossible, but harder. Those are the facts behind the verse you referenced.

And the not entering Heaven part was just another metaphor?

No, because the Bible doesn't say that the wealthy cannot enter Heaven. To the contrary, God likes to see His children prosper on earth as well as in Heaven.
God's friend Abraham was extremely wealthy. The apple of His eye, David, was wealthy. Solomon was wealthy. Wealth is not a problem. Loving it more than God is the problem. Money tends to make people greedy. The more you have, the more you want. It can be a sort of trap that Christ warns about.

The wealth of the Earth belongs to God and he wants it shared...

It is and He does. And if you share it is counted as righteousness by our Father. Just as it was with Abraham and Lot. In fact, if you return a portion of it to God, He'll give your portion back and a whole lot more. It is the only promise God ever made where He said, "Test me on this.." .
A greedy person hordes his money for himself. He has a love of it that places money above God. And the sad part about that is the rich man really can't take it with him. It's temporary wealth, as opposed to the wealth waiting for us when we get home to Heaven. Christ isn't preparing bungalows for us, but mansions. And the treasure you store up in Heaven is eternal.

Dear The Irish Ram and Moonglow
And it isn't just with material wealth.
But wealth of knowledge, where this get "monopolized" to benefit some
while others suffer.

The legal system is the worst example I've seen of profiting off problems
instead of assisting people with solving them.

That's not just greed for material things, but for control and authority over decisions.

If we SHARE responsibility for making decisions together,
that's another way to equalize relations with neighbors instead of hording control.

Look what's happening with parties wanting to take full power to cut out the other!
Instead of sharing power and responsibility for managing our own resources
for our own constituents, there is this notion that the dominating party gets
to push their agenda for others? No, only for constituents who espouse those beliefs.

We should share and help all people of all interest and political groups
to represent, manage and develop their own programs that empower their members.

That is where I believe our country is heading.
Not this business of hording control to beat out the next person.
That isn't equal protection of the laws, so why do we let parties run govt this way????

Em, I just want to take a sec to tell you I think you have the sweetest disposition.

 

[emilynghiem]

You don't possess the power to curse a dandelion, d.
To the extent you judge another is the extent you will be judged.
My Christian walk is between me and the Lord. Unless you can see my heart then you do not have the ability to determine whether or not I am true to my faith or a hypocrite.

One of Christ's closest friends was the richest man in the world at the time. Making money is just fine. The love of it, is not.
The eye of the needle was a slit in the wall of the city that enabled people to enter after the city gates were closed. To traverse the eye, a man with many treasures on his camel, had to unload the camel, take it through the narrow opening, and then make trips back and forth to bring his belongings through the narrow opening. The more goods you had the harder it was to get in. Not impossible, but harder. Those are the facts behind the verse you referenced.

And the not entering Heaven part was just another metaphor?

No, because the Bible doesn't say that the wealthy cannot enter Heaven. To the contrary, God likes to see His children prosper on earth as well as in Heaven.
God's friend Abraham was extremely wealthy. The apple of His eye, David, was wealthy. Solomon was wealthy. Wealth is not a problem. Loving it more than God is the problem. Money tends to make people greedy. The more you have, the more you want. It can be a sort of trap that Christ warns about.

The wealth of the Earth belongs to God and he wants it shared...

Dear Moonglow
Isn't the issue a matter of sharing the responsibilities that come with resources?

If a company guts the forests and then donates all the money to charity, that's still destroying irreplaceable ecosystems and endangering wildlife.

It's not just about how much we share wealth. But also the HEALTH of our relationships with each other AND the planet.

 

[emilynghiem]

And the not entering Heaven part was just another metaphor?

No, because the Bible doesn't say that the wealthy cannot enter Heaven. To the contrary, God likes to see His children prosper on earth as well as in Heaven.
God's friend Abraham was extremely wealthy. The apple of His eye, David, was wealthy. Solomon was wealthy. Wealth is not a problem. Loving it more than God is the problem. Money tends to make people greedy. The more you have, the more you want. It can be a sort of trap that Christ warns about.

The wealth of the Earth belongs to God and he wants it shared...

It is and He does. And if you share it is counted as righteousness by our Father. Just as it was with Abraham and Lot. In fact, if you return a portion of it to God, He'll give your portion back and a whole lot more. It is the only promise God ever made where He said, "Test me on this.." .
A greedy person hordes his money for himself. He has a love of it that places money above God. And the sad part about that is the rich man really can't take it with him. It's temporary wealth, as opposed to the wealth waiting for us when we get home to Heaven. Christ isn't preparing bungalows for us, but mansions. And the treasure you store up in Heaven is eternal.

Dear The Irish Ram and Moonglow
And it isn't just with material wealth.
But wealth of knowledge, where this get "monopolized" to benefit some
while others suffer.

The legal system is the worst example I've seen of profiting off problems
instead of assisting people with solving them.

That's not just greed for material things, but for control and authority over decisions.

If we SHARE responsibility for making decisions together,
that's another way to equalize relations with neighbors instead of hording control.

Look what's happening with parties wanting to take full power to cut out the other!
Instead of sharing power and responsibility for managing our own resources
for our own constituents, there is this notion that the dominating party gets
to push their agenda for others? No, only for constituents who espouse those beliefs.

We should share and help all people of all interest and political groups
to represent, manage and develop their own programs that empower their members.

That is where I believe our country is heading.
Not this business of hording control to beat out the next person.
That isn't equal protection of the laws, so why do we let parties run govt this way????

Em, I just want to take a sec to tell you I think you have the sweetest disposition.

Thank you The Irish Ram
You make me smile for two reasons.
One is at your refreshing kindness and encouraging words at a time that is challenging and pushing everyone I know to the limits of what they can tolerate.

The other reason is smiling to myself knowing:
You haven't seen me go off on a public rant and meltdown in front of city officials. About Constitutional ethics and equal protection of laws being violated left and right.

I have to work at being diplomatic for all the times people have to put up and tolerate me. It takes a lot of work, on both sides dealing with these differences.

So thank you so much for taking the time to say that, and share a word of encouragement at a difficult time where I wish I could just give up.

That really helps!!
Hugs and thanks to you

Yours truly, Emily

 

[Moonglow]

You don't possess the power to curse a dandelion, d.
To the extent you judge another is the extent you will be judged.
My Christian walk is between me and the Lord. Unless you can see my heart then you do not have the ability to determine whether or not I am true to my faith or a hypocrite.

One of Christ's closest friends was the richest man in the world at the time. Making money is just fine. The love of it, is not.
The eye of the needle was a slit in the wall of the city that enabled people to enter after the city gates were closed. To traverse the eye, a man with many treasures on his camel, had to unload the camel, take it through the narrow opening, and then make trips back and forth to bring his belongings through the narrow opening. The more goods you had the harder it was to get in. Not impossible, but harder. Those are the facts behind the verse you referenced.

And the not entering Heaven part was just another metaphor?

No, because the Bible doesn't say that the wealthy cannot enter Heaven. To the contrary, God likes to see His children prosper on earth as well as in Heaven.
God's friend Abraham was extremely wealthy. The apple of His eye, David, was wealthy. Solomon was wealthy. Wealth is not a problem. Loving it more than God is the problem. Money tends to make people greedy. The more you have, the more you want. It can be a sort of trap that Christ warns about.

The wealth of the Earth belongs to God and he wants it shared...

Dear Moonglow
Isn't the issue a matter of sharing the responsibilities that come with resources?

If a company guts the forests and then donates all the money to charity, that's still destroying irreplaceable ecosystems and endangering wildlife.

It's not just about how much we share wealth. But also the HEALTH of our relationships with each other AND the planet.

The idea of good stewardship is still the basic tenet of the ideology..

 

[hadit]

OP wrote: when in fact Jesus said it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven?

He didn't say it was impossible...

... for with God all things are possible...

... he was just making the point it was difficult...

... to leave all that material wealth...

... for the spiritual kingdom of heaven.

The rich man did not boast about having money, he boasted about always following the law ever since he was a boy. Jesus was not telling the man to sell his material wealth. He was telling the man to sell off everything he had bought into about following the literal letter of the law and then follow his teaching about the figurative nature and hidden subjects in the law if he wanted to go all the way to be perfect and have life. It wasn't about giving up his money it was about him giving up everything he had been taught to believe in and hold dear ever since he was born.


His many possessions indicate that the man gained his wealth as a rabbi or head of a synagogue or large congregation that he would have to explain himself to and position that he would have to give up if he were to follow the revelation of Jesus.

Thats why the man walked away with a heavy heart.......


.

I do not agree with that.

20 “Teacher,” he declared, “all these I have kept since I was a boy.”

21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Jesus, knowing the hearts of men, was able to zero in on this man's idol, which was wealth. Since Jesus' command was to SELL and GIVE to the poor, obviously He was talking about physical wealth.

You haven't though about this very deeply have you?

Do you think Jesus told the man to become destitute and then follow Jesus wandering around the Judean countryside? Do you think this story was included in the gospels to teach people that they have to part with all of their material possessions to have treasure in heaven?

If so why do you own anything? Why aren't you wandering around the deserts of Israel ?


Makes no sense.


The rich mans question to Jesus about what he should do to be saved was incredulous. He thought he was already saved and assured a place in the world to come.


The man bragged about his assumed security in adhering to Mosaic law since childhood. Thats what constituted his wealth and what Jesus told the man to sell. By telling the man to follow him Jesus was telling him to follow his interpretation and application of Mosaic law. Thats what would give him rewards in heaven, access to the tree of life, the promise for the righteous compliance with the Law fulfilled whether he was materially rich or poor, Jew or Gentile.

Giving in charity to the poor would reflect instruction to enlighten his followers, or in other words, release the possessions in his captivity, the poor in spirit.


It would be like Jesus telling one of those preachers of a mega church to admit to his many followers that he was wrong and then free them from the captivity of following him in error. Can you name even one who would have the honesty or integrity required to do that? Even the much loved and admired Billy Graham who has made millions of dollars by misleading millions of people into idolatry for decades?


See?

It would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it would be for a TV preacher to enter the kingdom of heaven.

One cannot put anything into the cup of the person who is already full of themselves.

That makes sense.

Dude, of course the guy wouldn't be bragging about where he fell short. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, knew that this guy's idol was his wealth. And, of course, Jesus does NOT insist that everyone divest themselves of wealth. That is simply ludicrous. He was, though, telling this one guy to do so because He knew that would puncture his sense of self-righteousness. Every Christian knows this because God always goes straight to whatever it is they hold to be more important than Him.

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

 

[hobelim]

The rich man did not boast about having money, he boasted about always following the law ever since he was a boy. Jesus was not telling the man to sell his material wealth. He was telling the man to sell off everything he had bought into about following the literal letter of the law and then follow his teaching about the figurative nature and hidden subjects in the law if he wanted to go all the way to be perfect and have life. It wasn't about giving up his money it was about him giving up everything he had been taught to believe in and hold dear ever since he was born.


His many possessions indicate that the man gained his wealth as a rabbi or head of a synagogue or large congregation that he would have to explain himself to and position that he would have to give up if he were to follow the revelation of Jesus.

Thats why the man walked away with a heavy heart.......


.

I do not agree with that.

20 “Teacher,” he declared, “all these I have kept since I was a boy.”

21 Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Jesus, knowing the hearts of men, was able to zero in on this man's idol, which was wealth. Since Jesus' command was to SELL and GIVE to the poor, obviously He was talking about physical wealth.

You haven't though about this very deeply have you?

Do you think Jesus told the man to become destitute and then follow Jesus wandering around the Judean countryside? Do you think this story was included in the gospels to teach people that they have to part with all of their material possessions to have treasure in heaven?

If so why do you own anything? Why aren't you wandering around the deserts of Israel ?


Makes no sense.


The rich mans question to Jesus about what he should do to be saved was incredulous. He thought he was already saved and assured a place in the world to come.


The man bragged about his assumed security in adhering to Mosaic law since childhood. Thats what constituted his wealth and what Jesus told the man to sell. By telling the man to follow him Jesus was telling him to follow his interpretation and application of Mosaic law. Thats what would give him rewards in heaven, access to the tree of life, the promise for the righteous compliance with the Law fulfilled whether he was materially rich or poor, Jew or Gentile.

Giving in charity to the poor would reflect instruction to enlighten his followers, or in other words, release the possessions in his captivity, the poor in spirit.


It would be like Jesus telling one of those preachers of a mega church to admit to his many followers that he was wrong and then free them from the captivity of following him in error. Can you name even one who would have the honesty or integrity required to do that? Even the much loved and admired Billy Graham who has made millions of dollars by misleading millions of people into idolatry for decades?


See?

It would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it would be for a TV preacher to enter the kingdom of heaven.

One cannot put anything into the cup of the person who is already full of themselves.

That makes sense.

Dude, of course the guy wouldn't be bragging about where he fell short. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, knew that this guy's idol was his wealth. And, of course, Jesus does NOT insist that everyone divest themselves of wealth. That is simply ludicrous. He was, though, telling this one guy to do so because He knew that would puncture his sense of self-righteousness. Every Christian knows this because God always goes straight to whatever it is they hold to be more important than Him.

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication and reward for that righteousness.

 

[there4eyeM]

That would make the parable not worth telling.

 

[hadit]

I do not agree with that.

Jesus, knowing the hearts of men, was able to zero in on this man's idol, which was wealth. Since Jesus' command was to SELL and GIVE to the poor, obviously He was talking about physical wealth.

You haven't though about this very deeply have you?

Do you think Jesus told the man to become destitute and then follow Jesus wandering around the Judean countryside? Do you think this story was included in the gospels to teach people that they have to part with all of their material possessions to have treasure in heaven?

If so why do you own anything? Why aren't you wandering around the deserts of Israel ?


Makes no sense.


The rich mans question to Jesus about what he should do to be saved was incredulous. He thought he was already saved and assured a place in the world to come.


The man bragged about his assumed security in adhering to Mosaic law since childhood. Thats what constituted his wealth and what Jesus told the man to sell. By telling the man to follow him Jesus was telling him to follow his interpretation and application of Mosaic law. Thats what would give him rewards in heaven, access to the tree of life, the promise for the righteous compliance with the Law fulfilled whether he was materially rich or poor, Jew or Gentile.

Giving in charity to the poor would reflect instruction to enlighten his followers, or in other words, release the possessions in his captivity, the poor in spirit.


It would be like Jesus telling one of those preachers of a mega church to admit to his many followers that he was wrong and then free them from the captivity of following him in error. Can you name even one who would have the honesty or integrity required to do that? Even the much loved and admired Billy Graham who has made millions of dollars by misleading millions of people into idolatry for decades?


See?

It would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it would be for a TV preacher to enter the kingdom of heaven.

One cannot put anything into the cup of the person who is already full of themselves.

That makes sense.

Dude, of course the guy wouldn't be bragging about where he fell short. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, knew that this guy's idol was his wealth. And, of course, Jesus does NOT insist that everyone divest themselves of wealth. That is simply ludicrous. He was, though, telling this one guy to do so because He knew that would puncture his sense of self-righteousness. Every Christian knows this because God always goes straight to whatever it is they hold to be more important than Him.

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

 

[hobelim]

You haven't though about this very deeply have you?

Do you think Jesus told the man to become destitute and then follow Jesus wandering around the Judean countryside? Do you think this story was included in the gospels to teach people that they have to part with all of their material possessions to have treasure in heaven?

If so why do you own anything? Why aren't you wandering around the deserts of Israel ?


Makes no sense.


The rich mans question to Jesus about what he should do to be saved was incredulous. He thought he was already saved and assured a place in the world to come.


The man bragged about his assumed security in adhering to Mosaic law since childhood. Thats what constituted his wealth and what Jesus told the man to sell. By telling the man to follow him Jesus was telling him to follow his interpretation and application of Mosaic law. Thats what would give him rewards in heaven, access to the tree of life, the promise for the righteous compliance with the Law fulfilled whether he was materially rich or poor, Jew or Gentile.

Giving in charity to the poor would reflect instruction to enlighten his followers, or in other words, release the possessions in his captivity, the poor in spirit.


It would be like Jesus telling one of those preachers of a mega church to admit to his many followers that he was wrong and then free them from the captivity of following him in error. Can you name even one who would have the honesty or integrity required to do that? Even the much loved and admired Billy Graham who has made millions of dollars by misleading millions of people into idolatry for decades?


See?

It would be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it would be for a TV preacher to enter the kingdom of heaven.

One cannot put anything into the cup of the person who is already full of themselves.

That makes sense.

Dude, of course the guy wouldn't be bragging about where he fell short. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, knew that this guy's idol was his wealth. And, of course, Jesus does NOT insist that everyone divest themselves of wealth. That is simply ludicrous. He was, though, telling this one guy to do so because He knew that would puncture his sense of self-righteousness. Every Christian knows this because God always goes straight to whatever it is they hold to be more important than Him.

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

 

[hadit]

Dude, of course the guy wouldn't be bragging about where he fell short. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, knew that this guy's idol was his wealth. And, of course, Jesus does NOT insist that everyone divest themselves of wealth. That is simply ludicrous. He was, though, telling this one guy to do so because He knew that would puncture his sense of self-righteousness. Every Christian knows this because God always goes straight to whatever it is they hold to be more important than Him.

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

 

[there4eyeM]

Possessions are wealth. Money can be a form of wealth, but is not necessarily wealth of itself.

 

[Snouter]

...Jesus said it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven?...

You did not comprehend what the failed jewish messiah actually meant. A correct translation is "It's easier for a camel to pass through the Needle's Eye (a narrow mountain pass near Jerusalem) than for a capitalist to enter Allah's theocracy." In other words, a camel must give up its cargo in order to go through. So a rich man could become a loyal eunuch in Jesus neo-Essene cult if the potential subject gave his wealth to the communist-like Jesus, very similar to a TV evangelist!

 

[hobelim]

You are just wrong. The guy approached Jesus and dared him to show where he fell short. He was self assured because he had always followed the Law. This is what he boasted about, this was his wealth.

Jesus told him to sell off all of that and follow him. Sell off his self righteous assurance in the literal application of the law.

What did Jesus mean by telling the man to follow him if not to follow him in his teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects of the law, the only right way to follow the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of life? Do you think that Jesus wanted the guy to follow him around? Seriously?

How can you or anyone who reads this story sell off all of the false wealth of false teaching that they have accumulated over the years and follow Jesus if not by conforming to the way that Jesus taught to follow the law by word and deed?

Even if you sold everything you owned how could you or anyone follow Jesus any other way?

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

 

[miketx]

see any contradiction in your professed beliefs, and your actual actions, such as
-the rampant commercialism and money making of religion, when in fact Jesus said it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven? I don't see it anywhere in the Bible, "make billions of dollars selling stuff to people" If you do, let me know where it is
-the fact that American foreign policy is based around the idea that we can indiscriminately bomb anyone around the world, when Jesus spoke of love and forgiveness and blessed are the peacemakers?

Of course you don't. Because you as much as you may claim to be Christian, in reality you are all too human and the greed and power that is offered to you in America is too much to resist. So, in the end the moneymaking and the warmongering will win out, and you will do so even as you hypocritically pretend to be Christian.

A curse on all of you.

Yes, I support war, and prophets. Also, I support killing our enemies. So yes, I am really bad. What I am not, is a media fed imbecile.

 

[The VOR]

see any contradiction in your professed beliefs, and your actual actions, such as
-the rampant commercialism and money making of religion, when in fact Jesus said it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, than it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven? I don't see it anywhere in the Bible, "make billions of dollars selling stuff to people" If you do, let me know where it is
-the fact that American foreign policy is based around the idea that we can indiscriminately bomb anyone around the world, when Jesus spoke of love and forgiveness and blessed are the peacemakers?

Of course you don't. Because you as much as you may claim to be Christian, in reality you are all too human and the greed and power that is offered to you in America is too much to resist. So, in the end the moneymaking and the warmongering will win out, and you will do so even as you hypocritically pretend to be Christian.

A curse on all of you.

Yes, I support war, and prophets. Also, I support killing our enemies. So yes, I am really bad. What I am not, is a media fed imbecile.

No. You are just an imbecile that was born that way.

 

[hadit]

Jesus had more disciples than just the 12 that were with Him at all times, you do know that, right? So yes, He was telling him to sell what he had and give it to the poor. Jesus Himself had no money, literally no place to call home, so why do you have such a hard time with one of His disciples also having nothing?

The guy wanted to show off how righteous he was and Jesus zeroed in on the thing he placed before God, his wealth. Here's a hint for you. Look at and really understand the first of the 10 commandments.

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

And you are missing the point. Wealth is not evil and God sometimes uses it to bless His people. For this guy, however, it was more important than God, and that is what Jesus exposed. Sure, he was trying to follow the law and thought he was doing well, but Jesus revealed his true heart. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Following the law with a corrupted heart does no good whatsoever.

 

[hobelim]

Yes, the guy wanted to show how righteous he was and no his dedication to God through the literal application of the law was his first priority, not money. Thats why he dared Jesus to show him where he fell short. His material wealth would have in no way seemed to be anything but Gods approval of his dedication.

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

And you are missing the point. Wealth is not evil and God sometimes uses it to bless His people. For this guy, however, it was more important than God, and that is what Jesus exposed. Sure, he was trying to follow the law and thought he was doing well, but Jesus revealed his true heart. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Following the law with a corrupted heart does no good whatsoever.

No, obedience to the law, not a desire for wealth, was the mans priority and expression of love and devotion to God.

What he had to face and what gave him a heavy heart was not that he had to have a yard sale but he had to accept that everything he had invested in since childhood by conforming to the literal application of the law was in error.

 

[hadit]

You have to put things in the story that are not there in order to make that come about. There would be no reason, for example, for the incident to close with the note that the man had great material wealth.

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

And you are missing the point. Wealth is not evil and God sometimes uses it to bless His people. For this guy, however, it was more important than God, and that is what Jesus exposed. Sure, he was trying to follow the law and thought he was doing well, but Jesus revealed his true heart. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Following the law with a corrupted heart does no good whatsoever.

No, obedience to the law, not a desire for wealth, was the mans priority and expression of love and devotion to God.

What he had to face and what gave him a heavy heart was not that he had to have a yard sale but he had to accept that everything he had invested in since childhood by conforming to the literal application of the law was in error.

You're reading a whole lot into it that is not there. It is clear from the text that he wanted to know what Jesus would say he had to do to inherit eternal life, and probably thought he could impress Jesus and those around him with his righteousness. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, took him up on it and said "obey these laws". When the man claimed to have done so all his life, Jesus simply exposed the idol hidden in the man's heart, his wealth, and told him to get rid of it. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Don't you get it? Jesus effortlessly pointed out that the man was breaking the very first of the laws he claimed he had always followed.

Remember the first of the Ten Commandments.

 

[hobelim]

it did not say he had great material wealth, it said he had many possessions.

Take a minute to take another harder look and think more deeply about the implications that statement has with the subject of demonic possession. One person dominating and controlling many through mind control.

Jesus told the man that if he rejected the way he followed the law, released his possessions, and then followed Jesus in the way that he taught to follow the law that he would have treasure in heaven.

When Jesus said that "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44, do you think that he was talking about selling material possessions for and buying something else with money?

What version are you using?

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

And you are missing the point. Wealth is not evil and God sometimes uses it to bless His people. For this guy, however, it was more important than God, and that is what Jesus exposed. Sure, he was trying to follow the law and thought he was doing well, but Jesus revealed his true heart. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Following the law with a corrupted heart does no good whatsoever.

No, obedience to the law, not a desire for wealth, was the mans priority and expression of love and devotion to God.

What he had to face and what gave him a heavy heart was not that he had to have a yard sale but he had to accept that everything he had invested in since childhood by conforming to the literal application of the law was in error.

You're reading a whole lot into it that is not there. It is clear from the text that he wanted to know what Jesus would say he had to do to inherit eternal life, and probably thought he could impress Jesus and those around him with his righteousness. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, took him up on it and said "obey these laws". When the man claimed to have done so all his life, Jesus simply exposed the idol hidden in the man's heart, his wealth, and told him to get rid of it. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Don't you get it? Jesus effortlessly pointed out that the man was breaking the very first of the laws he claimed he had always followed.

Remember the first of the Ten Commandments.

The man was being sardonic.

He already knew that his lifelong dedication to holiness through obedience to the literal letter of law would assure him a place in the world to come.

There is no commandment against wealth, in fact prosperity would have been seen as a sign of Gods approval.

That was his wealth and security, thats what he had to give up and if he wanted to actually go all the way and receive the promise for obedience he would have to follow Jesus' teaching about the figurative nature of the words and hidden subjects in the law as revealed by his command to eat his flesh, a direct reference to the only right way to conform to kosher law that grants life..

 

[hadit]

What version are you using?

Again, you're indulging in word play and adding complexity when you don't have to. It's very clear what's going on here. Someone asked Jesus what he had to do to earn eternal life and Jesus identified the one area in which he would not be obedient, his wealth.

How does one become worthy of heaven, eternal life?

By conforming to the laws demands.

'The man said he followed the law since he was a child.

Jesus taught that the literal application of the law was wrong., that there is hidden teaching and hidden subjects.

For the man to follow Jesus to have 'riches in heaven', the reward of the righteous, he would have to abandon the way he had been following the law since childhood and follow the teaching of Jesus.


This is what the story is about. If you think that having wealth excludes people from the kingdom of God, you really don't know what you are talking about. Its a dangerous and false teaching that can screw up a persons life for good with confusion and senseless suffering.



"The kingdom of heaven is like treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it buried it again and for sheer joy went out and sold everything he had and bought that field.", Matthew 13:44


You have missed the point entirely. Having a yard sale is not the key to eternal life.

And you are missing the point. Wealth is not evil and God sometimes uses it to bless His people. For this guy, however, it was more important than God, and that is what Jesus exposed. Sure, he was trying to follow the law and thought he was doing well, but Jesus revealed his true heart. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Following the law with a corrupted heart does no good whatsoever.

No, obedience to the law, not a desire for wealth, was the mans priority and expression of love and devotion to God.

What he had to face and what gave him a heavy heart was not that he had to have a yard sale but he had to accept that everything he had invested in since childhood by conforming to the literal application of the law was in error.

You're reading a whole lot into it that is not there. It is clear from the text that he wanted to know what Jesus would say he had to do to inherit eternal life, and probably thought he could impress Jesus and those around him with his righteousness. Jesus, though, knowing the hearts of men, took him up on it and said "obey these laws". When the man claimed to have done so all his life, Jesus simply exposed the idol hidden in the man's heart, his wealth, and told him to get rid of it. Remember the first of the Ten Commandments. Don't you get it? Jesus effortlessly pointed out that the man was breaking the very first of the laws he claimed he had always followed.

Remember the first of the Ten Commandments.

The man was being sardonic.

He already knew that his lifelong dedication to holiness through obedience to the literal letter of law would assure him a place in the world to come.

No one short of Jesus Himself has managed to keep the entire law their entire life. If that man had seriously done it, he would never have had to make a sin offering. Do you seriously think he lived his entire life without making even one such offering?

There is no commandment against wealth, in fact prosperity would have been seen as a sign of Gods approval.

You keep acting like I'm saying there is such a law. I most clearly am not, so you can drop that particular line of argument. This man clearly broke the very first commandment, ie, to not have any other gods before God. His wealth was his idol, and Jesus exposed it.